View Full Version : Your WWDC 2008 Predictions?
Fahrenheit
2008-05-16, 10:06
Less than a month to go now, and as Jobs has confirmed his keynote, are we predicting some serious Apple lovage, or perhaps a more pathetic drizzle of hyped stats and developer tools?
As a kind of memory jog:
2007 - complete beta of Leopard, Safari for Windows and iPhone Dev tools.
2006 - Mac Pro, early preview of Leopard features
2005 - Intel baby!
2004 - New ACDs (haha, actually they haven't changed since then!), Tiger preview distro.
2003 - Panther, PowerMac G5..err new iSight as well? Oh and I think iApps.
2008 - ?
Would make sense to have an early preview of the next OS, probably just features that we can expect it to have, like we had in 2006. Jobs isn't afraid to get his new hardware out at WWDC, but its normally more high end stuff. I personally don't see a new Mac Pro coming, but a MacBook Pro? There's a definite maybe there.
New displays? Please Steve.
Thoughts plz :)
pscates2.0
2008-05-16, 10:13
I've not heard a thing about displays. They look great (the design, anyway). Not sure what else they'd do. they look nice with the iMac (same leg/base), so part of me thinks that as long as the iMac looks the way it does, so will the displays (even though I realize they're not "connected" or used together much, if at all). But it just makes the line look cohesive, and designed by the same people.
Would like to see the prices come down, however.
I still think we won't hear a peep about 10.6. Way too early (and it's not even on anyone's mind, IMO).
It'll be major iPhone love and attention.
And there will be a new device of some sort, I believe.
Other than that, I'm not really sure...
I think it will be a very "touch"-oriented affair...the iPhone, the SDK, the new iPhone, a new Multi-Touch device :devil: and some new things in that area.
Some sort of Touchy-Feely device that is essentially an Apple TV remote when it's in your living room, and/or an internet tablet when it's not.
OR
An Apple written app that turns your iPhone into a Touchy-Feely device to remotely control your Apple TV. Apple TV would then be upgraded to include Safari for Apple TV. All navigation/pinching/double taps all carried out on the iPhone (essentially making the iPhone a glorified mousepad but with more graphical/haptic feedback).
In fact the iPhone/Apple TV combo almost seems a no-brainer :)
Hopefully a redesigned Macbook.....I feel like a crack fiend waiting for this new thing. I'm starting to itch.
veryamusing
2008-05-16, 11:40
Hopefully a redesigned Macbook.....I feel like a crack fiend waiting for this new thing. I'm starting to itch.
You might have to find a hit somewhere else...
Mac Rumors is reporting, "Apple's Next MacBook Due in Q3 2008? (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/05/15/apples-next-macbook-due-in-q3-2008/)"
The shipment target for this new MacBook is said to be in the 3rd quarter of 2008 for up to 3 million units.
I've not heard a thing about displays. They look great (the design, anyway). Not sure what else they'd do. they look nice with the iMac (same leg/base), so part of me thinks that as long as the iMac looks the way it does, so will the displays (even though I realize they're not "connected" or used together much, if at all). But it just makes the line look cohesive, and designed by the same people.
Would like to see the prices come down, however.
Here's how they could upgrade the Cinema Displays:
1. Higher resolutions. HD across the board - 1200 lines on the 20-inch, etc. Especially important if we see Blu-ray or RI.
2. DisplayPort.
3. iSight.
4. IR reciever.
5. LED backlighting.
6. New case, to match anything else Apple introduces. Thinner, 'cause it's weird that the Displays are thicker than the iMacs.
7. FireWire 800, maybe?
8. I think it's probable that they'll change the 23-inch model to a 24-inch, just so they can use the same display in their iMacs.
9. Lower prices. Seriously.
0. Maybe take the 20" iMac's TN panel and sell it as a consumer "Cinema (non-HD) Display" for supercheap Apple-cheap?
Something like this:
20" Cinema Display (1050 lines, TN) - $299, bundled with $499-again Mac mini for $799 (with a free keyboard and mouse)
20" Cinema HD Display (1200 lines, S-IPS) - $499
24" Cinema HD Display - $799
30" Cinema HD Display - $1,499
I'm not sure if Apple wants to get into the (historically low-margin) low-end monitor game, but it'd be nice if one could once again get a complete Mac system for $799.
I still think we won't hear a peep about 10.6. Way too early (and it's not even on anyone's mind, IMO).
I'm inclined to disagree, but we already have a thread about that. If you go by the original release date of Leopard (last summer), and take the low end of Jobs' 12-18 month figure, we could see the release of 10.6 at WWDC. :D Now, I don't think that's going to happen - I'm just saying that it's not too soon to announce it. I agree that MWSF '09 will probably be the big 10.6 show, though.
It'll be major iPhone love and attention.
And there will be a new device of some sort, I believe.
Other than that, I'm not really sure...
I think it will be a very "touch"-oriented affair...the iPhone, the SDK, the new iPhone, a new Multi-Touch device :devil: and some new things in that area.
I just hope Apple doesn't forget that some people actually need keyboards, too.
Here's my dream WWDC:
3G iPhone (duh), iPhone OS 2.0, App Store, yada yada
New Mac minis, for the love of god
New black MacBook Pro with Blu-ray
Matching black Cinema Displays
10.6 announced for an April-June 2009 release
hmurchison
2008-05-16, 12:16
iPhone 3G with some very cool apps from Apple and others.
Leopard 10.5.3 with new iPhone integration
Revamped .Mac
Brief 10.6 discussion. 3 new areas of focus are discussed at a high level. 10.6 is going to be 64-bit only.
New Cinema Displays- DisplayPort/DVI interfaces
Best list I've seen yet, murch.
Add to that an announcement of a &*(%@ mini upgrade, and I'd be thrilled.
pscates2.0
2008-05-16, 12:28
Yeah, hmurchison lists the most reasonable, plausible stuff. Sounds very WWDC-y. :)
Still not sure about 10.6 mentions, but if you guys think so...
Yeah, I keep thinking that 10.5.3 is going to have some real tightness with the iPhone 2.0 software, in some sort of way we've not seen or thought of yet.
I can totally imagine something new/different on the .Mac front as well.
And updated displays and Mac mini, both of which have sat neglected and unchanged for quite some time, to round things out?
Good list...
I smell a big-assed iPhone update, or something unexpected...
Okay, so every year there are a couple of TBA sessions, to go over new technologies unveiled at WWDC. The more TBA sessions in the schedule, the bigger the surprises.
Here's a quick breakdown of the sessions counts by category at http://developer.apple.com/wwdc/schedules/#day=friday&time=afternoon&tab=session
Mac: 51
iPhone: 23
Mac & iPhone: 27
IT: 27
TBA: 19
*Nineteen* sessions are still unlisted. Considering that things like GPS will be under the Location Services for iPhone session, and that most of the 3rd party dev stuff is already announced...
What big push could they have that would unveil enough new tech for *19* sessions? FIgure one, maybe two for enterprise iPhone security, one for enterprise iPhone integration... maybe the rumored .Mac upgrades have significant impact on both iPhone and Leopard?
That's a lotta sessions to fill. Until I saw that, I expected pretty much murch's list, but... um... whaaaaaaaaaaaa?
pscates2.0
2008-05-16, 16:47
Definitely. I've been saying for a while that this is going to be a huge iPhone orgy. And any talk of Leopard, .Mac, 10.6, etc. is going to be through the iPhone filter. The iPhone is the iPod of 2008...and with good reason, because between enterprise, v2.0 and the SDK/third-party access, this is probably going to be the Device To Rule Them All.
:)
Yeah, other phones will have more buzzwords and specific features. But let an average schmo try to use any of them with ease and see what happens...
That's the one area constantly trumps others on. They're not always first to the party with some feature or technology, and they don't always pack their stuff to the gills with every obscure format support or minority-requested capability. But they mop the floor with slick, fun ease-of-use and connectivity to everything else we use (our Macs, music, photos, etc.). And, frankly, that's how most of us live and work and that's why Apple is where they are (and why they're the 8,000lb. monkey) and that's why everyone else has spent the past 5-8 years playing catch-up, copycat, coattail rider and "oh, us too!"
So when this new iPhone comes out - just the 3G, third-party support and enterprise stuff alone is going to make it the most desirable thing ever. Tack onto that possible lower pricing, a sexy-ass design (it's Apple, is there even any doubt?) and whatever surprises or whiz-bang tech/feature they've kept under wraps, and WWDC 08 (and June/July in general) spells "iPhone owns your very soul...you won't be able to resist".
:p
Hitting that 10 million mark should be cake...
apple007
2008-05-16, 17:13
You might have to find a hit somewhere else...
Mac Rumors is reporting, "Apple's Next MacBook Due in Q3 2008? (http://www.macrumors.com/2008/05/15/apples-next-macbook-due-in-q3-2008/)"
Well, Q3 starts less than 3 weeks after WWDC, so it wouldn't necessarily be a long wait.
I'm inclined to disagree, but we already have a thread about that. If you go by the original release date of Leopard (last summer), and take the low end of Jobs' 12-18 month figure, we could see the release of 10.6 at WWDC. :D Now, I don't think that's going to happen - I'm just saying that it's not too soon to announce it. I agree that MWSF '09 will probably be the big 10.6 show, though.
Between Leopard being so new and the 3G iPhone and related news (2.0, etc.), I can't imagine Jobs will even mention 10.6. In fact, some of the mainstream articles I've read claim Jobs will spend a lot of time highlighting Leopard.
After the delayed Leopard release and then the fiasco that was 10.5 (and 10.5.1), I have to believe Apple will be a lot more conservative when it comes to announcements of anything 10.6.
Here's my dream WWDC:
... 10.6 announced for an April-June 2009 release
This last item on your list baffled me. What, exactly, about Leopard has you feeling like it could even remotely be described as less than a year away from being replaced/obsolete?
nikstar101
2008-05-16, 17:23
Well i think it is mostly going to be about the iPhone 2.0 (both software and hardware). Maybe adding Blu-Ray to the Mac Pros with a graphics card to match. But Apple must update their Cinema Displays. It is driving me mad. I am in need of a new display but keep holding out for the update.
This last item on your list baffled me. What, exactly, about Leopard has you feeling like it could even remotely be described as less than a year away from being replaced/obsolete?
Because Jobs himself said, after Leopard's release, that he was planning on continuing to release a new version of OS X every twelve to eighteen months? And the fact that, other than Leopard (which was delayed at the last minute because of the iPhone), every release of OS X has followed this pattern?
I don't find my logic "baffling" at all, really.
You act like Apple has to wait until Leopard is totally "obsolete" for Apple to release 10.6. This has *never* been the way Jobs has done things. It's not like Tiger was "obsolete"...until Leopard came out. What else could make Leopard obsolete, anyway? Is Apple going to wait until Windows "obsoletes" it?
Just because Leopard isn't "obsolete" doesn't mean Apple shouldn't make it better.
My prediction: snoring will be heard at random point throughout the keynote. Everything will revolve around the phone platform pretty much and unless you're a mobile nerd / gadget freak, that's about as boring a topic as you could ask for. Don't get me wrong; I'm glad Apple has had such success with the iPhone but frankly cell phones are something that only fascinate the teen and 20s generation and corporate managers.
PS - MS isn't capable of "obsoleting" anything at this point unless they come up with a brand new computing paradigm, on the level of moving from command lines to a GUI and mouse. Which, the odds of that are roughly 586,000:1.
pscates2.0
2008-05-17, 08:40
You're way too generous with those odds. :p
It's more like eleventy-bazillion to one.
You're right... I should fix that. How many zeros in a bazillion again? :D
feidhlim1986
2008-05-17, 10:58
I think it'll have iPhone 2.0, 3G iPhone as the main focus. Maybe Blu-ray in Mac Pros but not in macbook pros.
I think the reason we havent seen blu-ray yet is because Apple wants us the get our HD movies from the iTunes Store via AppleTV
Brave Ulysses
2008-05-17, 11:46
This last item on your list baffled me. What, exactly, about Leopard has you feeling like it could even remotely be described as less than a year away from being replaced/obsolete?
Well, if a CPU only lasts about 3 years, then clearly Apple wants to at least be on a 1-1.5 year OS cycle to milk that short CPU life for some more revenue:lol:
apple007
2008-05-17, 15:09
Because Jobs himself said, after Leopard's release, that he was planning on continuing to release a new version of OS X every twelve to eighteen months? And the fact that, other than Leopard (which was delayed at the last minute because of the iPhone), every release of OS X has followed this pattern?
Right, but for all intents and purposes, Leopard was released when 10.5.2 rolled out a couple months ago, and quite a few people still aren't happy with it (e.g., the people whose CPUs won't wake from sleep without a hard restart).
If you want to go strictly by Jobs' quote, then sure, Mac OS X 10.6 could be released anytime between November 2008 and April 2009, but as I said above, after the delays and bug-ridden Leopard release, do you really believe Apple will be overly aggressive about updating an OS that no one has remotely deemed to be past its shelf life?
You act like Apple has to wait until Leopard is totally "obsolete" for Apple to release 10.6. This has *never* been the way Jobs has done things. It's not like Tiger was "obsolete"...until Leopard came out. What else could make Leopard obsolete, anyway? Is Apple going to wait until Windows "obsoletes" it?
Just because Leopard isn't "obsolete" doesn't mean Apple shouldn't make it better.
That's what 10.5.3, 10.5.4, etc., will be for.
Well, if a CPU only lasts about 3 years, then clearly Apple wants to at least be on a 1-1.5 year OS cycle to milk that short CPU life for some more revenue:lol:
Makes perfect sense to me. :D
Right, but for all intents and purposes, Leopard was released when 10.5.2 rolled out a couple months ago, and quite a few people still aren't happy with it (e.g., the people whose CPUs won't wake from sleep without a hard restart).
Developers use a programming strategy called "branching" which allows them to work in parallel on multiple versions. As it has in the past, Apple will continue to develop bugfix patches for the current major release version while simultaneously developing the next major release version. A fix for a bug in one development branch can likely be integrated to the other branch with relative ease, assuming it doesn't involve some major architectural changes.
If you want to go strictly by Jobs' quote, then sure, Mac OS X 10.6 could be released anytime between November 2008 and April 2009, but as I said above, after the delays and bug-ridden Leopard release, do you really believe Apple will be overly aggressive about updating an OS that no one has remotely deemed to be past its shelf life?
And what of the 10.1, 10.2, 10.3, and 10.4 releases of Mac OS X? Al of their predecessors were arguably bug-ridden for various different reasons, but that didn't stop Apple from marching forward with development of the future release while releasing minor bugfix updates to the current release. I believe none of the major Mac OS X versions were "past their shelf life" before Apple started work on or even demoed functionality for the next version.
That's what 10.5.3, 10.5.4, etc., will be for.
Again, there's nothing from stopping Apple from releasing minor patches while simultaneously preparing the next major release. Virtually all software development shops, big and small, do this. Also, keep in mind that the small x.x.X releases very rarely include new functionality; they are almost exclusively limited to big fixes and performance tweaks. So, it would be quite the feat for a minor release to include something that would "obsolete" the current major version.
apple007
2008-05-17, 16:29
And what of the 10.1, 10.2, 10.3, and 10.4 releases of Mac OS X? Al of their predecessors were arguably bug-ridden for various different reasons, but that didn't stop Apple from marching forward with development of the future release while releasing minor bugfix updates to the current release. I believe none of the major Mac OS X versions were "past their shelf life" before Apple started work on or even demoed functionality for the next version.
I don't dispute that at all; I'm just saying it seems like people are taking Jobs' quote as gospel when the quote itself seems to be subject to debate. Isn't there another quote from Jobs floating around in which he says the OS X update schedule would likely lengthen from the historical average?
Further, the last two major updates, 10.4 and 10.5, were both released 18 months after their predecessors. After the problems and delays Apple encountered in getting Leopard out the door, and then into usable condition, it seems highly unlikely Apple will try to develop and release 10.6 in less than 10 months (from WWDC to the speculated April 2009 release). (I'm well aware Apple could have begun development of 10.6 months ago, but with iPhone 2.0 and 10.5.2, which is reported to be the biggest-ever non-major update to the Mac OS, I doubt Apple has had an excess of programmers for 10.6 lately.)
I'm not sure if it's recorded anywhere, but I'd be curious to know where, on average, the current-gen OS X had been (i.e., version number), and/or the amount of elapsed time into a current-gen version of OS X, when the next major update was announced. Maybe I'm dead wrong, but it just seems very early for people to be expecting anything from Apple re: 10.6 when 10.5 is so new, and when Apple has so much more on its plate.
... Also, keep in mind that the small x.x.X releases very rarely include new functionality; they are almost exclusively limited to big fixes and performance tweaks. So, it would be quite the feat for a minor release to include something that would "obsolete" the current major version.
Agreed. The problem I'm having is envisioning anything that would render 10.5 obsolete in the near term. I don't follow OS speculation all that closely, but is there anything missing from 10.5 that people are clamoring for (aside, of course, from Mail.app hiding at startup)? I'm sure Apple will work hard to dazzle us, but issuing an update just for an update's sake risks being little more than fancy bloatware.
I don't dispute that at all; I'm just saying it seems like people are taking Jobs' quote as gospel when the quote itself seems to be subject to debate. Isn't there another quote from Jobs floating around in which he says the OS X update schedule would likely lengthen from the historical average?
And indeed they have. They were about 12 month. Now we're at 18+.
Further, the last two major updates, 10.4 and 10.5, were both released 18 months after their predecessors. After the problems and delays Apple encountered in getting Leopard out the door, and then into usable condition, it seems highly unlikely Apple will try to develop and release 10.6 in less than 10 months (from WWDC to the speculated April 2009 release). (I'm well aware Apple could have begun development of 10.6 months ago, but with iPhone 2.0 and 10.5.2, which is reported to be the biggest-ever non-major update to the Mac OS, I doubt Apple has had an excess of programmers for 10.6 lately.)
Features for 10.6 were likely sketched out before 10.4 was released. Yes, I said 10.4, that's not a typo. Looking 2-3 years down the road is just good planning.
I'm not sure if it's recorded anywhere, but I'd be curious to know where, on average, the current-gen OS X had been (i.e., version number), and/or the amount of elapsed time into a current-gen version of OS X, when the next major update was announced. Maybe I'm dead wrong, but it just seems very early for people to be expecting anything from Apple re: 10.6 when 10.5 is so new, and when Apple has so much more on its plate.
I see what you're going for here, but I can't agree. Heck, give 10.6 two full years after 10.5's actual delayed release... that means that next June, devs would have three months to prep for another major release. While that's entirely possible, it's not a lot of time for really utilizing new technologies. Of course, any sooner of a release, and they'd have *less* time, if nothing is said about 10.6 this year... which makes me think that we'll get just a teaser on 10.6's major technologies coming down the pipe, and nothing else. I wouldn't be at all surprised if much of what's in line for 10.6 comes in the form of info between the lines. "While you're working with NeatNewAPI, please keep in mind Issue Foo..." WWDC '09: "We're happy to introduce CoreFoo..." It's kind of how they've worked in the past. I don't, however, expect a full rundown of the 10.6 APIs or features.
Agreed. The problem I'm having is envisioning anything that would render 10.5 obsolete in the near term. I don't follow OS speculation all that closely, but is there anything missing from 10.5 that people are clamoring for (aside, of course, from Mail.app hiding at startup)? I'm sure Apple will work hard to dazzle us, but issuing an update just for an update's sake risks being little more than fancy bloatware.
Nobody really expected or asked for CoreAnimation in 10.5, and yet look at what it's managed to enable. Don't underestimate their ability to pull Really Neat Shit(tm) out of their hats. Laying the groundwork with Obj-C 2.0, gcc4.2, LLVM, and such in this release, gives them the opportunity to really go gangbusters in the next few years.
apple007
2008-05-17, 17:09
And indeed they have. They were about 12 month. Now we're at 18+.
The average was 12 months when OS X was new and immature. The recent average has been 18 months, and one can reasonably argue Apple should have taken 21-22 months to release Leopard rather than the public beta that was 10.5. (That might be a harsh assessment, but the shear size of 10.5.1 and 10.5.2 almost makes it look like 10.5 was largely re-written after release.)
(BTW, when I mentioned "another quote from Jobs," I was talking about a recent quote; i.e., from around the time Leopard was released.)
I see what you're going for here, but I can't agree. Heck, give 10.6 two full years after 10.5's actual delayed release... that means that next June, devs would have three months to prep for another major release. ...
Hey, I didn't say 10.6 would never be previewed or released. My argument in this thread is that next month's WWDC seems very early for anything 10.6, let alone a formal announcement of a ___ 2009 release. Apple could preview 10.6 in September 2008, or December 2008, or March 2009, and leave plenty of time for developers to get things right in time for 10.6.
That said, as good as Montevina looks, isn't Intel's 2009 release ("Calpella") supposed to the The Big One as far as new technology? And if so, couldn't/wouldn't that have some serious repercussions re: Mac OS X programming? I can't imagine Apple would rush 10.6 out in April 2009, only to have to undertake another massive rewrite, a la 10.5.2, because of new technology due from Intel around the same time. (I have no idea if Apple gets an early look at technology like that, or if 10.5.2 is evidence it doesn't.)
The average was 12 months when OS X was new and immature. The recent average has been 18 months, and one can reasonably argue Apple should have taken 21-22 months to release Leopard rather than the public beta that was 10.5. (That might be a harsh assessment, but the shear size of 10.5.1 and 10.5.2 almost makes it look like 10.5 was largely re-written after release.)
There were in fact 30 months between Tiger (April 2005) and Leopard (October 2007), so you probably mean something like 36 months?
That said, Leopard has been solid for me from day one; none of the minor glitches I've had were showstoppers for me. So yes, I think your assessment is rather harsh. Most of the negative press I've seen focused around an APE-related problem that had been fixed for a while already, and that people mostly ran into because they did not even know they had APE installed, thanks to Logitech Control Center.
That said, as of 10.5.2 and Safari 3.1.1, Leopard still suffers a massive cookie deletion problem (http://www.unsanity.org/archives/apple/apple_hates_bug_filers.php). I'm baffled Apple hasn't managed to fix this rather well-known issue in over six months. But I merely regard this as an annoyance (all those silly sites to log back in to!), and it hasn't kept me from using Leopard every day.
(BTW, when I mentioned "another quote from Jobs," I was talking about a recent quote; i.e., from around the time Leopard was released.)
Hey, I didn't say 10.6 would never be previewed or released. My argument in this thread is that next month's WWDC seems very early for anything 10.6, let alone a formal announcement of a ___ 2009 release.
I don't think there will be much of a "formal announcement", but I do consider an ever-so-tiny sneak preview likely.
Apple could preview 10.6 in September 2008, or December 2008, or March 2009,
How? By doing a second WWDC? They only have one opportunity per year to make such announcements and spread them well. So if they don't do it now, the earliest they could do it is indeed March 2009, and only by making WWDC insanely early next time around. (Announcing at MWSF makes even less sense.)
That said, as good as Montevina looks, isn't Intel's 2009 release ("Calpella") supposed to the The Big One as far as new technology? And if so, couldn't/wouldn't that have some serious repercussions re: Mac OS X programming? I can't imagine Apple would rush 10.6 out in April 2009,
As Kickaha alluded to, I expect Apple to take advantage of LLVM to make their code less dependent of such architectural changes.
only to have to undertake another massive rewrite, a la 10.5.2, because of new technology due from Intel around the same time. (I have no idea if Apple gets an early look at technology like that, or if 10.5.2 is evidence it doesn't.)
I have no idea what, aside from the update download being rather big, gives you the impression that 10.5.2 was "a massive rewrite". Even if you feel that it fixed a ginormous amount of issues, that still wouldn't make it a rewrite in any way, much less a massive one.
Regarding Calpella ("Core 3") and 10.6, last I heard, Calpella is due in Q2 2009, which is April-June - which just so happens to be the dates I pulled out of my hat for 10.6. ;)
And again - I'm not saying Apple will demo every new feature in 10.6 at WWDC. That's what MWSF will probably be for, as Apple tends to keep its cards close to its chest with OS releases (lest they are copied). I'm just saying that they'll probably let us know that it's coming, and give it a name, and maybe give developers some hints as to where it's headed (per Kick's earlier example). They might release info on a few featured to whet our appetites, bit all the whiz-bang stuff will probably be saved for MWSF.
apple007
2008-05-17, 17:52
There were in fact 30 months between Tiger (April 2005) and Leopard (October 2007), so you probably mean something like 36 months?
Yup. I added 4 months to the average instead of adding 4 months to the actual elapsed time. My bad.
That said, Leopard has been solid for me from day one; none of the minor glitches I've had were showstoppers for me. So yes, I think your assessment is rather harsh. ...
That seems like a minority opinion from what I read here, and elsewhere, after the initial Leopard release. Several hundred bugs were identified fairly quickly that resulted in massive (biggest ever?) update downloads. (Hell, to this day, a huge number of users still can't reliably wake their CPU from sleep.) That doesn't sound like a rock-solid OS release to me.
How? By doing a second WWDC? They only have one opportunity per year to make such announcements and spread them well. So if they don't do it now, the earliest they could do it is indeed March 2009, and only by making WWDC insanely early next time around. (Announcing at MWSF makes even less sense.)
If the 10.6 info. is only an "ever-so-tiny sneak preview," as you put it, then how important could it possibly be to have people see or hear it in person? Jobs can't sneeze without three new web sites and 42 YouTube videos going online. I'm sure anything Apple says about 10.6, in whatever form or forum, will get more than its fair share of exposure.
I have no idea what, aside from the update download being rather big, gives you the impression that 10.5.2 was "a massive rewrite". Even if you feel that it fixed a ginormous amount of issues, that still wouldn't make it a rewrite in any way, much less a massive one.
Well, it was the biggest update ever to the Mac OS, so that counts for something. If not much was rewritten, then why was the update 343MB? Also, the under-the-hood optimizations (new Intel compiler and libraries) made 10.5.2, in the words of one news site, "the largest and most important intermediate system update ever released by Apple."
That seems like a minority opinion from what I read here, and elsewhere, after the initial Leopard release. Several hundred bugs were identified fairly quickly that resulted in massive (biggest ever?) update downloads. (Hell, to this day, a huge number of users still can't reliably wake their CPU from sleep.) That doesn't sound like a rock-solid OS release to me.
Law of the Internets #49: You're only ever going to hear from folks having problems. Haven't had any of those bugs bite me, for instance, and I'd say most people are in the same boat.
I have a sneaking suspicion that many of the bugs are from systems that weren't... how shall I put this delicately... mangled by APE, SIMBL or other hacks.
If the 10.6 info. is only an "ever-so-tiny sneak preview," as you put it, then how important could it possibly be to have people see or hear it in person? Jobs can't sneeze without three new web sites and 42 YouTube videos going online. I'm sure anything Apple says about 10.6, in whatever form or forum, will get more than its fair share of exposure.
Because it's PR?
Well, it was the biggest update ever to the Mac OS, so that counts for something. If not much was rewritten, then why was the update 343MB?
Because a lot of shit got recompiled using that new compiler?
Also, the under-the-hood optimizations (new Intel compiler and libraries) made 10.5.2, in the words of one news site, "the largest and most important intermediate system update ever released by Apple."
Yes, and in the words of one news site, Britney Spears is "the largest force in pop", so, y'know... trust the news sites to get it right as much as you feel comfortable to. :)
I think the 3G iPhone + App Store is a given really. I'm dying to get my hands on some games and make even more use out of my Touch :)
I've heard from a friend we won't be seeing any new ACD's being introduced, so I'm not expecting that.
I think they might unveil a new MBP as the timing & event would be appropriate, with all those 5000+ developers there waiting to upgrade.
apple007
2008-05-17, 18:27
Law of the Internets #49: You're only ever going to hear from folks having problems. Haven't had any of those bugs bite me, for instance, and I'd say most people are in the same boat.
True, but there were some fairly major bugs in 10.5 (and 10.5.1, and 10.5.2) that lead me to believe this was a below-average update by Apple standards. When I'm reading stories on MacFixIt about Mail.app messages going *poof* when transferred between folders, and about hundreds/thousands of people who can't reliably wake their (often brand-new) systems from sleep, that doesn't inspire a lot of confidence. I always expect bugs, especially in the new features of an OS update, but simple things like emails going AWOL, and CPUs that won't wake from sleep? Not so much.
Because a lot of shit got recompiled using that new compiler?
... Yes, and in the words of one news site, Britney Spears is "the largest force in pop", so, y'know... trust the news sites to get it right as much as you feel comfortable to. :)
Look, we can argue this forever, but a 343MB update to the Mac OS wasn't just a routine, ho-hum update to the OS. A lot of users were counting the minutes until 10.5.2 was released, and that fact notwithstanding, the sheer size of it made it noteworthy in the annals of OS updates.
Look, we can argue this forever, but a 343MB update to the Mac OS wasn't just a routine, ho-hum update to the OS. A lot of users were counting the minutes until 10.5.2 was released, and that fact notwithstanding, the sheer size of it made it noteworthy in the annals of OS updates.
You're right, it was rather large... but that means *bupkus* for what was actually changed or fixed... as you said, a new compiler optimization leading to a massive recompile would be that large.... without a single other line of code being changed.
Big, yes. But that's not proof of # of bugs.
There were some humdingers, obviously, but they didn't seem to be horrifically widespread. I certainly don't consider it to have been any worse than 10.3.0 or 10.4.0, to be honest.
apple007
2008-05-17, 18:50
You're right, it was rather large... but that means *bupkus* for what was actually changed or fixed... as you said, a new compiler optimization leading to a massive recompile would be that large.... without a single other line of code being changed.
Big, yes. But that's not proof of # of bugs.
I understand a 50MB update might not necessarily fix more bugs than a 40MB update, but the list of bug fixes accompanying 10.5.2 was massive, and the under-the-hood improvements were significant, as well. It didn't weigh in at 343MB by accident.
There were some humdingers, obviously, but they didn't seem to be horrifically widespread. I certainly don't consider it to have been any worse than 10.3.0 or 10.4.0, to be honest.
You might be right, but the weight of available evidence seems to lean the other way. People always seem to make a big deal out of bugs (or alleged bugs) in new releases, but as someone who is usually a first-day or first-week adopter of Mac OS updates, I don't recall a backlash to a prior release as great as the one to 10.5. And I certainly don't recall any major bugs like disappearing email, or a problem with CPUs not waking from sleep (that has apparently been a known issue for months).
To me, bugs involving third-party apps or hardware are always to be expected, but intra-OS X bugs like missing email or failure to wake from sleep? Inexcusable, IMO.
RE: Leopard:
The vast, vast majority of problems occurred on systems with unauthorized hacks. Until recently, Logitech drivers installed things in the library it shouldn't have been installing.
People bitch and moan about how the upcoming iPhone SDK doesn't allow nearly enough access iPhone OS's internals, but I'd rather it go the other way: I want OS X development to be almost as limited. Imagine how stable the system would be if the only things going into the system library were Apple approved?
(The System library, not the User library)
This problem will get worse with time, as we've seen with Windows. We all love to bash Vista, but a lot (not all) of Vista's problems we're driver related. Programmers will always like to muck around in places they shouldn't be mucking around in.
Hear, hear. The permissions locks on /System are *SUPPOSED* to eliminate that category of asshattery on the part of developers, but there are always some who figure they know better, the dipshits. (And, of course, there are always clueless users who blindly follow along.)
and about hundreds/thousands of people who can't reliably wake their (often brand-new) systems from sleep
This is not a new bug to 10.5, though. It's been affecting MacBook Pro owners since the 10.4.x releases. Heck, it might even be a hardware flaw, regardless of the Mac OS X version.
Okay, so... I think I have a possible 10.6-level new feature set that would be a hell of a game changer.
1) iPhone takes off like mad, networked mini tablet in your pocket.
2) .Mac gets a big boost, Back To My Mac is made more robust.
3) Resolution Independence becomes a solid reality.
4) Carbon gets announced as dead this year at WWDC (check the tracks - it's not even mentioned).
5) Cocoa is now the One True API for UI goodness.
I think this list is a shoe-in, honestly. Put them all together, and you get...
iPhone becomes a thin client for your Mac at home. Not just a file viewer, using QuickLook like I mentioned before, but an honest to god thin client. Split the workload between the two CPUs using the new threading and process APIs in 10.5, let the GUI be scaled appropriately with resolution independence, and have pinch-zoom take care of the last bit of visibility issues, if any. Use QuickTime streaming to handle bulk-data bursts, and Cocoa to send/receive the GUI messaging. Obj-C 2.0's GC makes the memory management issues that plagued this back in the NSDisplay days a thing of the past, LLVM compilation makes the hardware differences moot, and allows bits of JIT code to be blatted back and forth as necessary to share the load.
I give it two years.
New Macpros maybe?? Or its too early for that? I guess it is...
I believe the big star of the WWDC is going to be the iPhone 3G
New Macpros maybe?? Or its too early for that? I guess it is...
I believe the big star of the WWDC is going to be the iPhone 3G
I don't know. I think we'll see new MacBook Pros first, even though they were updated more recently than the Mac Pro. But that's just me.
I know the 3G iPhone/iPhone 2.0/whatever other crazy multi-touch thing(s) Apple announces will inevitably be the star of the show, but I'd really like some progress to be made in making the Pro gear (MBP, MP, Cinema Displays) more competitive. Faster processors? Better graphics and higher resolutions? Blu-ray? Maybe a new design, just for the hell of it? Give me something, Apple. The last MBP update was just so...underwhelming. I really don't want to think that Apple is intent on charging $700 for a larger screen and a graphics chip.
I read that the new Mac Pro processors -Nehalem- will be released in Q4 this year. So Any New processor now is going to be Penryn I guess... right? Penryn are great processors
This is not a new bug to 10.5, though. It's been affecting MacBook Pro owners since the 10.4.x releases. Heck, it might even be a hardware flaw, regardless of the Mac OS X version.
This didn't even start with Macbook Pros. My iBook G4 started having that problem a number years ago, just after 10.4.4 came out.
apple007
2008-05-20, 16:58
... but I'd really like some progress to be made in making the Pro gear (MBP, MP, Cinema Displays) more competitive. ... Maybe a new design, just for the hell of it? ...
As someone who was going to buy a new MBP back in Feb. but then waited because of Montevina (and the potential for other upgrades), I'd like all the other things you listed except a new design "just for the hell of it." To me, the current MBP design is outstanding, and aside from possibly some slight appearance tweaks to make MBPs distinct from MBs, I'm not sure how the MBP can get much better while maintaining all existing functionality.
I'm not sure how the MBP can get much better while maintaining all existing functionality.
As far as the case goes, they could start by bringing back a hinge that can open more than about 100°. My trusty old PowerBook can open to nearly flat, which is very useful when using it while standing up. Drives me crazy when I use a newer machine.
As someone who was going to buy a new MBP back in Feb. but then waited because of Montevina (and the potential for other upgrades), I'd like all the other things you listed except a new design "just for the hell of it." To me, the current MBP design is outstanding, and aside from possibly some slight appearance tweaks to make MBPs distinct from MBs, I'm not sure how the MBP can get much better while maintaining all existing functionality.
Um, the same way any laptop can get better? Thinner, lighter, sleeker?
Are you honestly saying that the MacBook Pro design is perfect and could never be possibly improved upon, or are you just determined to find something to disagree with in every one of my posts?
BlueRabbit
2008-05-20, 22:28
As far as the case goes, they could start by bringing back a hinge that can open more than about 100°. My trusty old PowerBook can open to nearly flat, which is very useful when using it while standing up. Drives me crazy when I use a newer machine.
I'll second this. It's also really useful when using the computer while lying in bed.
As far as the case goes, they could start by bringing back a hinge that can open more than about 100°. My trusty old PowerBook can open to nearly flat, which is very useful when using it while standing up. Drives me crazy when I use a newer machine.
Thirded! The limited screen angle of my MBP really seems awkward compared to my 12" PowerBook or especially the old titanium PowerBooks.
Also, I think the MBP is long overdue for the latch-less magnetic closure.
apple007
2008-05-20, 22:50
As far as the case goes, they could start by bringing back a hinge that can open more than about 100°. My trusty old PowerBook can open to nearly flat, which is very useful when using it while standing up. Drives me crazy when I use a newer machine.
Very interesting piece of info. I was unaware of this issue.
Um, the same way any laptop can get better? Thinner, lighter, sleeker?
Are you honestly saying that the MacBook Pro design is perfect and could never be possibly improved upon, or are you just determined to find something to disagree with in every one of my posts?
No, all I was saying is that I'd hate to see the MBP redesigned "just for the hell of it," which sort of implied any change would be better than an internally-updated MBP that uses the current-gen model's design.
Obviously, "thinner, lighter, sleeker" would be great, but as I mentioned above, it doesn't seem like the MBP can improve much on any of those aspects without sacrificing capability, which I would hate to see. (I believe some of this was debated in the "next-gen MBP ..." thread; there just isn't much "progress" to be made as far as slimming the MBP while keeping all current-gen capability. In fact, the opposite might be true if Apple includes Blu-ray and/or a 7200rpm HD.)
Thirded! The limited screen angle of my MBP really seems awkward compared to my 12" PowerBook or especially the old titanium PowerBooks.
Also, I think the MBP is long overdue for the latch-less magnetic closure.
Ditto^2.
Hell, just last night I was sitting on the MTA, and the lid didn't open enough for me to get a straight-on view of the screen.
And ditto^3!
Furthermore, I would like to underscore again that it's more important for the MBP to be powerful than light.
If you want light. Get an MBA.
And ditto^3!
Furthermore, I would like to underscore again that it's more important for the MBP to be powerful than light.
If you want light. Get an MBA.
True...but I'd love to see this thing get down to under 5lbs. At it's current 5.4 lbs., lugging it from the office to home is something I don't look forward to.
Maybe a lineup with the following weights:
MacBookAir - 3.0 lbs.
MacBookPro - 4.6 lbs.
MacBook - 5.0 lbs.
apple007
2008-05-21, 12:51
True...but I'd love to see this thing get down to under 5lbs. At it's current 5.4 lbs., lugging it from the office to home is something I don't look forward to.
Maybe a lineup with the following weights:
MacBookAir - 3.0 lbs.
MacBookPro - 4.6 lbs.
MacBook - 5.0 lbs.
This is a nice idea in theory, but how do you propose to get to those weights? The MBA is already 3 lbs. and the MB is already 5 lbs., but how do you trim .8 of a pound off a 15" MBP (or, for that matter, off a 17" MBP, which weighs in at 6.8 lbs.) without losing functionality?
(BTW, I currently carry around a 17" PB and I'll be buying a 17" MBP soon, so I'm all for making them weigh less. Just not, as 'Mugge' said, at the expense of power/functionality.)
if you're gonna shave .8 pounds off the macbook pro why leave the macbook untouched? It's a smaller computer and should by all means be lighter too...
apple007
2008-05-27, 18:44
In the same article I just linked to in the "latest (alleged) 3G iPhone pictures" thread, AppleInsider is claiming Intel might have delayed the launch of Centrino 2 (aka Montevina) by as much as 2-3 weeks, and delayed the version needed by Apple for MBs/MBPs by as much as 4-5 weeks (from June to late July).
This might kill any chance of an MB/MBP update at WWDC, unless Apple simply announces them with a future shipping date. With the back-to-school period so important, a delay like this has to be a major PITA for computer makers (and buyers).
I've lugged my MBP all over the place, and the weight has never bothered me. I'd rather have the weight go up a bit if it created significant performance increases. Isn't that why we buy the things?
In the same article I just linked to in the "latest (alleged) 3G iPhone pictures" thread, AppleInsider is claiming Intel might have delayed the launch of Centrino 2 (aka Montevina) by as much as 2-3 weeks, and delayed the version needed by Apple for MBs/MBPs by as much as 4-5 weeks (from June to late July).
This might kill any chance of an MB/MBP update at WWDC, unless Apple simply announces them with a future shipping date. With the back-to-school period so important, a delay like this has to be a major PITA for computer makers (and buyers).I really hope that's not true, as I'm getting *very* close to just buying the current MBP. It's just sluggish. 867Mhz can only go so far...
apple007
2008-05-27, 21:09
I've lugged my MBP all over the place, and the weight has never bothered me. I'd rather have the weight go up a bit if it created significant performance increases. Isn't that why we buy the things?
Agreed. Right now, I carry my 17" PB about a mile each day in 90-plus-degree Mexican heat, and it's not an unbearable task.
I really hope that's not true, as I'm getting *very* close to just buying the current MBP. It's just [i[sluggish[/i]. 867Mhz can only go so far...
I hope not, too, but Centrino 2 seems well worth the wait, not to mention any other goodies or revisions Apple might include in the next-gen MBs and/or MBPs. I just hope my trusty PB G4 will give me a couple more months before its well-earned retirement (or semi-retirement).
I hope not, too, but Centrino 2 seems well worth the wait, not to mention any other goodies or revisions Apple might include in the next-gen MBs and/or MBPs. I just hope my trusty PB G4 will give me a couple more months before its well-earned retirement (or semi-retirement).I hope at the very least Apple will announce a ship-date at WWDC so I can pre-order. I could live with that.
Also, how reliable is TG Daily?
That news is a real debbie downer. I was hoping to have a new one within the next couple weeks. I agree with Ryan though, I hope they at least announce a date and have a pre-order or something.
apple007
2008-05-27, 23:07
Well, the Intel rumor isn't a rumor anymore: Intel announced a July 14 ship date for Centrino 2, with mass quantities of all models not available until the first week of August. I don't think Apple has ever announced new CPUs that far in advance, so it seems like new MBs/MBPs are unlikely at WWDC.
Curse you Intel!
:grumble:
I don't think I can wait that long, I'll be starting school and I'd rather have the notebook a few weeks before then.
That news is a real debbie downer. I was hoping to have a new one within the next couple weeks. I agree with Ryan though, I hope they at least announce a date and have a pre-order or something.
It seems, with the upcoming back-to-school season, Apple is going to be severely stuck. They need to have enough of something portable in-stock without risking a massive inventory of outdated product when the update happens. They can't just do what they did with the iMac a few years ago (no stock...), they'll lose too many student customers. I suppose we hope for a similar occurrence as the recent iMac bump which lets them get a new MBP shipping in July.
Well motha f___a!!!!!!
Perhaps theyll be ready for the back-to-school sale. Don't they offer a $150 voucher for the Apple Store too with it typically or is it specifically for iPods?
apple007
2008-05-27, 23:20
I don't know ... I don't see how Apple could possibly announce and ship a slightly-updated current-gen MB/MBP in June or July and then start shipping Centrino 2-equipped MBs/MBPs in August. My guess is the current-gen MBs and MBPs will remain exactly as-is until Centrino 2 ships.
Well motha f___a!!!!!!
Perhaps theyll be ready for the back-to-school sale. Don't they offer a $150 voucher for the Apple Store too with it typically or is it specifically for iPods?
The Back-to-School sale usually consists of a free $200 iPod, using the following math:
- You get 10% off the iPod
- And $180 towards any iPod with a new Mac
There's also a never-ending $100 off a printer mail in rebate. By never ending I mean, it expires every six months or so, but an identical offer takes its place instantly. Not sure what the reasoning on this one is, but I presume its to get the customers that don't mail their rebate before the offer expires.
As for Macs themselves, education discounts remain the same:
- $20 off the mini
- $50 off the baseline iMac
- $100 off every other iMac
- $100 off the MacBook
- $100 off the MacBook Air
- $200 off the MacBook Pro
- $200 off the Mac Pro
I don't know ... I don't see how Apple could possibly announce and ship a slightly-updated current-gen MB/MBP in June or July and then start shipping Centrino 2-equipped MBs/MBPs in August. My guess is the current-gen MBs and MBPs will remain exactly as-is until Centrino 2 ships.That's my guess too; my last post was just poorly-worded.
However, I think in this case, Apple needs to pre-announce the new MacBook Pro.
washington mac user
2008-05-28, 02:21
if they pre-anonounce the MBP, they will lose a lot of sells from June to August. I don't think Apple will do that.
apple007
2008-05-28, 13:48
That's my guess too; my last post was just poorly-worded.
However, I think in this case, Apple needs to pre-announce the new MacBook Pro.
if they pre-anonounce the MBP, they will lose a lot of sells from June to August. I don't think Apple will do that.
While I'd prefer what 'Ryan' suggested, I'd tend to agree with 'washington mac user'.
Unless Apple is 100% sure it will have all of the chips it needs in July/August, it would be crazy to pre-announce new CPUs not only two months in advance, but two months in advance heading into one of the biggest sales periods of the year. It would also be risky because problems with the new chipsets could then pop up on Apple's end, perhaps causing even further delays.
The only way I could see a WWDC announcement is if Apple simply got stuck by the delay: Stuck with low supplies of current-gen models in anticipation of a June/July rollout of their Centrino 2-equipped models, and/or stuck with a run of newly-redesigned MBs/MBPs that need Centrino 2, and can't just have the current chipsets installed into them. (Aside from Centrino 2, speculation has been rampant about redesigns of both the MB (aluminum) and MBP.)
The thing I hate the most about this delay is that I'm still using 10.4.11. If I don't get my hands on a new MBP until August or later, I'll be looking at adopting Leopard 9 months or more after launch (which will be a personal record for me by about 8.5 months).
Now I'm reading reports which state Intel is only facing delays in the integrated graphics and/or wireless modules of Montevina, neither of which the MBP use. Maybe Intel will ship the north/south (which one is it that matters here?) bridge on time and delay the rest of Centrino 2? Apple could still ship a new MBP in June/July in quantity.
apple007
2008-05-28, 14:42
Now I'm reading reports which state Intel is only facing delays in the integrated graphics and/or wireless modules of Montevina, neither of which the MBP use. Maybe Intel will ship the north/south (which one is it that matters here?) bridge on time and delay the rest of Centrino 2? Apple could still ship a new MBP in June/July in quantity.
Where did you read that? I read mainstream articles last night that quoted an official Intel announcement that Centrino 2 won't ship until July 14, with mass quantities of all models not necessarily available until early August.
Where did you read that? I read mainstream articles last night that quoted an official Intel announcement that Centrino 2 won't ship until July 14, with mass quantities of all models not necessarily available until early August.I'm not contradicting that, but I read on AI that Intel's problems were in the graphics and wireless modules. I was just speculating that perhaps Apple would somehow get the chips they actually need for the MBP, since they don't use those, from Intel early.
http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/08/05/28/confirmed_intel_delay_will_push_back_macbook_overh auls.html
apple007
2008-05-28, 22:51
The whole thing sounds like a big mess. According to Intel, the delay is being caused by a minor, quickly-corrected problem with a chipset and a "clerical error" in paperwork relating to the Wi-Fi capability that prevented/delayed FCC approval. It seems hard to believe either of those issues could cause a 2-month delay.
Nikki Dial Fan
2008-06-01, 02:37
OK, here are my wild-ass guesses about WWDC08:
* iPhone 3G announcement
This absolutely must happen. There has been far too much media speculation for him not to announce it and Apple's current stock price reflects expectation of the announcement on that date. Steve and/or another company's CEO will demo one or two brand-new killer apps developed with the iPhone SDK.
I'm going speculate that the iPhone will be available in additional colors, and that the case will NOT be made out of plastic. Apple is pretty much done with plastic cases, and they have patented an idea for a zirconia case (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zirconia) which would be cool. I've got my fingers crossed for black.
* .Mac upgrade with new brand name & social networking
This should be tied in with, yes, you guessed it, the 3G iPhone announcement. ".Mac" is too Mac-centric a name. To make Windows users with iPhones feel more included, it'll be changed, possibly to "Mobile Me."
And since we're trying to include Windows users here, the non-mobile .Mac services will be renamed to "Me." Social networking features will be built in so everyone can mash up the usual vanity / dating / party-alert pages. Just another way that Apple can beat Microsoft to the punch. (Maybe Microsoft will mount a desperate hostile takeover of MySpace next year...)
* New MacBook & MacBook Pro
It's now or never if Apple wants to stay ahead of the back-to-school '08 purchase wave. Yes, the Penryn MacBooks were just recently introduced. No, it wasn't Apple's idea. Intel forced them to rev their product line by arbitrarilly stopping production of the older chip. Still trying to stamp out AMD, I guess.
If Steve doesn't announce the MB & MBP updates at WWDC, he'll need to do it really soon. Announcing at WWDC isn't mandatory, since the focus is, like I keep saying, the 3G iPhone.
Steve rarely makes more than one major hardware announcement per keynote, and almost never in the same market (consumer and pro.) No matter how good the next MB & MBP are, they're going to be upstaged by the 3G iPhone. To give them more time in the spotlight, it would be better to wait until late June or early July, then hold a special press event for the announcement. August is already past the institutional back-to-school puchasing window, so it has to be in June or July.
Spreading the major hardware announcements a few months apart gives each new product its own "hype window" before the next new thing takes center stage. And I think the next MB will be all-metal, like a thicker MacBook Air, with a MacBook Air-like keyboard. Those changes, to me, qualify as a major hardware upgrades, so they should be given time on Apple's home page.
Since the MB and MBA will be somewhat similarly styled, the MBP will need to follow suit. The same fingerprint-resistant textured aluminum as the MBA and iPod nano, slightly tapered edges, maybe some polished aluminum accents. There will need to be some visual differentiation between the amateur and pro MBs, so maybe a polished silver Apple logo on the pro, and just a laser-etched Apple logo on the non-pro.
All portable Apple products have a special organic tactile feel, and that MBA textured aluminum really does feel special. It does look and feel nicer than the plain brushed aluminum of the current MBP in my opinion.
* Mac Pros
WWDC is a good time to announce new pro towers. It's been a while since they've been updated. And since they're "headless" it'll be an equally good time to announce upgraded matching displays. Maybe with HDMI.
* Mac OS X 10.6 preview
Not until next year. The major focus of this WWDC is on the iPhone SDK, as it should be. No reason to distract developers with another OS rev just yet. Leopard is still evolving and I wouldn't be surprised if 10.6 had a massive upgrade to the "touch" functionality, possibly to better integrate it with a new tablet product of some kind.
* iPods
Too early in the year. The big sales numbers all come in the holiday quarter, so the touch-enabled iPod nano should be announced, say, between labor day and Halloween. I'd be extremely surprised if Steve announced a new iPhone and iPod at the same event. Ever.
So, to sum it all up:
- 3G iPhone announcement guaranteed
- .Mac upgrade with iPhone integration and Windows compabitility very likely
- Mac Pro announcement fairly likely
- MB/MBP announcements just barely possible
- 10.6 announcement very unlikely
- iPod announcement very unlikely
ezkcdude
2008-06-03, 12:18
There should be something based on the Intel Atom platform. Asus is going to eeeat this market up.
and Apple is glad to let them have it.
ezkcdude
2008-06-03, 12:37
and Apple is glad to let them have it.
AppleTV with Atom. That's my prediction.
Nikki Dial Fan
2008-06-03, 19:02
OK, here are my silly wild-ass guesses:
1. 3G iPhone: Steve MUST announce this. Apple's stock price reflects the announcement at WWDC08 and there's too much media hype for it not to happen. One or two CEOs will demo their native iPhone killer-app-wannabes on stage.
2. 3G iPhone in black zirconia. Apple is done with white plastic, so if there will be any colors other than silver, they'll start with black. I think carbon fiber would be cool, but Apple has taken out patents on using zirconia as an enclosure material. Look it up on Wikipedia under "Zirconia." (I expect carbon fiber to be used internally in future MB/MBP/MBA models, since Apple has hired a carbon fiber design expert.)
3. .Mac rename. .Mac becomes "Me.com", and a mobile version specifically designed for iPhone will be called "Mobile Me." Name change is because it will be available to Wintel losers, er, users as well as Mac users. This makes sense since iPhone is cross-platform and thus Apple wouldn't want to keep a platform-specific name.
It might be free, too. Apple makes spectacular software, but its function is really to sell Apple hardware, and selling hardware is how the company makes most of their money.
4. Possible MB/MBP redesign. Apple needs to announce this year's notebooks before the back-to-school buying begins in earnest. MB and MBP will have the same textured finish as the iPod nano/Classic and should be slightly tapered at the edges, like thicker versions of the MBA. Visual differentiation between MB and MBP will be a different colored Apple logo. So if Steve doesn't announce new 'Books at WWDC, it has to happen some time in June.
5. Leopard 10.6 preview. Absolutely not going to be mentioned in the keynote. Maybe just a little teaser here and there in one-on-ones with Apple engineers. But the last thing Apple wants is to divert attention away from the iPhone SDK.
And, if Apple keeps WWDC and iPhone releases at about the same time, it's hard to see any Mac OS X revision getting the spotlight (pardon the pun) at any WWDC from here on out. Remember: Apple delayed Leopard so iPhone could a) be perfected, and b) bask in media attention for several months before Leopard was released.
6. Mac Pro and/or mini update. Possible at MWSF08, but too many hardware announcements dilute attention from each other. If the next-gen Pro or mini are drastically better in some way, Apple should hold a special media event to introduce them.
Just my $0.02. We'll see what happens on Monday.
iPhone is currently unavailable at both AT&T and Apple online.
pscates2.0
2008-06-05, 11:10
Oooh...is this a recent (today) development? I was thinking that's been the case for a while, but I might be wrong.
In any case, this can only mean one thing...invasi...oops, I mean "new iPhone".
iPhone is currently unavailable at both AT&T and Apple online. All Apple stores are showing it as unavailable. Carphone Warehouse (http://www.carphonewarehouse.com/commerce/servlet/gben-server-PageServer?ARTICLE=MAIN.UK.INTERNET.STATIC.APPLE.I PHONE#) in the UK don't have them in stock either.
It seems like it's available from T-Mobile (http://www.t-mobile.de/iphone/addHandset.do), with a special low price until june 30th. Then again, their 16GB iPhone pricing is ridiculous.
OMG the bullshit is so thick you'll need an axe to hack through it:
http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/08/06/05/larger_apple_multi_touch_devices_move_beyond_proto type_stage.html
Fahrenheit
2008-06-05, 12:16
OMG the bullshit is so thick you'll need an axe to hack through it:
http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/08/06/05/larger_apple_multi_touch_devices_move_beyond_proto type_stage.html
Oh, 50-50? Really? Cheers for that helpful insight, AI.
:lol: Might happen, might not. Sounds like an even split to me. :D
pscates2.0
2008-06-05, 12:48
Another one of those "analyst" stories, which, at this point, should automatically equal "nope" (have they ever been right about anything).
We give 50/50 that something is possibly going to happen at WWDC, based on supplier checks and various things pulled from our butt (darts, basically, which we've thrown at the wall). But we reserve the right to be full of shit, and something - or nothing - might not happen at all, depending on various factors which I probably can't disclose. Therefore, look for some significant product announcements or not on Monday. We're not really sure, either. It might. Maybe. You never really know with this sort of stuff. But all the preceding will still affect the stock performance and public perception, making me an extra special kind of dickhead (great power, no responsibility). Thank you for reading. Go Apple!
- Paul's Tech Investment/Analysis Emporium & House o' BBQ
But seriously...I predict that these guys don't know what they're talking about.
I also predict - since I'm on a roll - that no matter what is announced Monday, there will be whining and handwringing throughout the land, for reasons ranging from "somewhat legit" to "just plain $#%^@ stupid".
Now where can I get a job making these brave, forward-thinking predictions and analysis? I seem to have it down-pat, and a knack for it.
Way to go out on a limb there with the 50-50 projection.
It might happen, but it might not.
Stupid analysts
Attention everyone:
I have just awoken (yes, at 3:30 pm :() from my pre-Stevenote dream.
In it, I was in some sort of hotel room (?) on some sort of computer. I went to Apple.com and the front page loaded, giving glimpses (that I don't remember) of to-be-announced things, but the page quickly reverted back to the regular iMac front page. Dammit. But then I clicked into the Store.
And there it was.
I don't remember what it was called, but it was a miniature notebook with a nine inch screen. It ran something called eOS, which was sort of a cross between the iPhone/iPod touch OS (iOS?) and MacOS X, in that it was designed for a keyboard and touchscreen, instead of a keyboard and mouse (apparently). It had a real desktop, but all the icons and buttons were bigger; likewise, it could also run Windows, but only in its "Classic" theme (perhaps due to its lower processing power). I don't recall if this mysterious notebook used Intel's Atom or Via's Nano or any similar processor, but it would sort of seem to. It was priced higher than other "companion machines," of course: It started at $929.
Oh, and one more thing: the inside was white, I think, but the lid was this nice banana yellow! It was the weirdest thing ever, but I liked it.
I really am hoping that Apple eventually does something in the "netbook" space - even Sony, who previously denounced the market segment as a "race to the bottom," seems to be getting in on the action. I still think a "MacBook mini" for $799 would be huge. Or if Apple makes a "new Newton" multi-touch mini-tablet, they could easily throw a keyboard on there for a "new eMate." Maybe they could sort of tie it in to their new "Me" service ("MeMate"?), although I'm sure they'll want the iPhone to be seen as the center of that realm.
I'm not predicting that we'll see such a device at WWDC, of course. I think it is rather...unlikely. But I hope we do. In yellow. :p
ROBO HATH SPOKEN.
Robo and pscates needs to ask torifle for some therapy.
:D
ezkcdude
2008-06-06, 09:02
Attention everyone:
I really am hoping that Apple eventually does something in the "netbook" space - even Sony, who previously denounced the market segment as a "race to the bottom," seems to be getting in on the action. I still think a "MacBook mini" for $799 would be huge. Or if Apple makes a "new Newton" multi-touch mini-tablet, they could easily throw a keyboard on there for a "new eMate." Maybe they could sort of tie it in to their new "Me" service ("MeMate"?), although I'm sure they'll want the iPhone to be seen as the center of that realm.
ROBO HATH SPOKEN.
What's funny is that even though most of the folks here poo-poo the idea of competing with the Eee, if Apple does get into this space, most of you would do a 180 so fast, the windpower generated may be able to solve our energy problems. It's only because you've been led to believe Jobs thinks it's below Apple to be in this market, therefore, it must be true, right? As soon as Jobs gives the sub-notebook market his approval - you guys will all be trying to convince one another you were the first one to think of it. I've made this prediction before, but here goes again:
10"
1280x720
2 GB RAM
16 GB SSD
2 lbs
$999
Takers?
What's funny is that even though most of the folks here poo-poo the idea of competing with the Eee, if Apple does get into this space, most of you would do a 180 so fast, the windpower generated may be able to solve our energy problems. It's only because you've been led to believe Jobs thinks it's below Apple to be in this market, therefore, it must be true, right? As soon as Jobs gives the sub-notebook market his approval - you guys will all be trying to convince one another you were the first one to think of it. I've made this prediction before, but here goes again:
10"
1280x720
2 GB RAM
16 GB SSD
2 lbs
$999
Takers?
That's really outside the Eee market segment, though. And if it ran Mac OS X Mac, it would instantaneously kill off all MBA sales.
I mean, that actually has more RAM than the $1,099 MacBook. :eek:
Something a bit smaller, a bit cheaper, and running something more akin to iPhone OS X iPhone might have a chance, though.
I just hope Apple puts a real keyboard on it. The UMPC market didn't really take off until manufacturers started putting keyboards on their models, and a Newton II - being not quite pocketable and not quite notebook-size - doesn't really have a chance without it.
Plus, at almost *three times* the cost of a base Eee, you're eliminating from your customer pool those who are buying the Eee units mostly because they're cheap. I know someone who bought one for each of his kids: aged 6, 5, and 2. Why? "Because they're essentially disposable at that price."
Not the same market.
Plus, at almost *three times* the cost of a base Eee, you're eliminating from your customer pool those who are buying the Eee units mostly because they're cheap. I know someone who bought one for each of his kids: aged 6, 5, and 2. Why? "Because they're essentially disposable at that price."
Not the same market.
Yeah, I alluded to that in my post.
For a mini-MacBook, $799 would be pushing it. That's about $50 more than the highest-end "main" version of the highest-end netbook, the HP mini (you can BTO higher-spec'd models, of course). And that would be if it was a 10" MacBook mini, which I doubt Apple will do (they'd rather sell you an Air for twice the price).
I think they could sell a smaller netbook that didn't run "full" Mac OS X for $699, as long as it had some other stand-out features (like a touchscreen). I think that'd actually do pretty well, in fact (which means, of course, that Apple will choose to sell it for $799). Most other netbooks don't ship with a "full" OS anyway - they usually use a scaled-down "easy" Linux instead.
If Apple decides to bring back a tablet Newton for $599-699 or so, I could totally see them selling a "convertible" eMate for $699-799.
I think anything on that front, however, is somewhat unlikely. Apple probably sees the iPhone as the answer, despite it being completely different.
ezkcdude
2008-06-06, 12:00
That's really outside the Eee market segment, though. And if it ran Mac OS X Mac, it would instantaneously kill off all MBA sales.
I mean, that actually has more RAM than the $1,099 MacBook. :eek:
Something a bit smaller, a bit cheaper, and running something more akin to iPhone OS X iPhone might have a chance, though.
Well, let's say it had 1GB RAM (with 2GB option), 8GB SSD (with 16 GB option), starting at $799. I think they would sell like hotcakes.
I predict... An OS X powered Shopping Cart!!!
It has a 10" multi-touch screen and a RFID reader, automatically registering the stuff you put in the cart, making a list, calculating the price, etc.
This means no waiting in line at the register, since you pay directly on the cart. There's no need to put your stuff on the belt to be inspected and noone except yourself need to know what you buy. It is expected this will result in a dramatic increase in sales of candy, cake and porn. This will also save needed workers, and all but eliminate shoplifting, since the system is clever enough to register the presence of any shoplifted items.
BMW will also announce a partnership with Apple to outfit their complete line of cars with docks for the Apple Shopping Cart. This eliminates the enormous waste of paper and plastic and will, again, be able to save significant worker resources.
Oh, Keynote Bingo is out:
http://arstechnica.com/staff/fatbits.ars/2008/06/05/wwdc-2008-keynote-bingo
One square says "No new displays", so there might be a chance this time ;) (of course I just upgraded :grumble:)
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