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Going back to the Borg... maybe
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iFerret
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2008-09-20, 18:05

I'm getting to the point where I feel that it may be necessary for me to dump my MacBook and switch back to a Windows based solution.

Firstly, I'm moving between unsatisified/disappointed and appalled with regards to the quality of the MacBook. Not only is my MacBook hot enough to fry an egg on (not quite, but it does get very, very warm) but it has developed some discolouration on the bottom surfaces and some scratching elsewhere. To add to this, my MacBook is also suffering from the well documented cracking on the top case beneath the keyboard, where the risers from the screen touch the bottom part. This has resulted in a nasty looking crack around 2 inches long that I don't like at all.

Personally I feel that this is unacceptable from a nearly 2500 dollar (New Zealand) computer. I am at a loss to explain why Apple created a white notebook computer. This thing shows dirt like a bitch and there are few ingrained things that just don't come out - near the top of the screen is something that looks like iron filings. It's been there for months and does not come off. Though I am kind of pleased and surprised with how it's held up with regards to being white, I thought it would be much dirtier, much faster.

Second I'm realising more and more that I need Windows for stuff. I can get access to Adobe CS3 for Windows, but not for Mac and Adobe refuses to switch the licenses out due to them being volume issued or something like that. My school is entirely Windows based, and it's a lot easier from a student's point of view just to use Windows - Macs aren't actually allowed on our network due to supposed (read: bullshit) "compatibility issues". I also like to play a few games here and there which are Windows based. Using Boot Camp is an option, but the MacBook's performance isn't really up to scratch.

I like My MacBook for the most part, but it definitely has some major drawbacks. The fact that I can get a better specced Windows laptop for half the price of my MacBook really pisses me off too. For an extra $1000 I get OS X, is that really worth it?

I'm not sure what the point of this thread was, I guess I'm looking for advice on my situation. I wonder if I can use the discolouration and cracking as a reason to return the MacBook for a refund? Going to a certified support centre to get it fixed is a lot of extra cost and work for me. Sending it away for a month isn't really acceptable either. Any ideas?
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Kickaha
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2008-09-20, 18:10

Maybe AppleCare is vastly different down almost under, but my turnaround on laptop repairs is about 3-5 days, from the time I box it up to the time I unbox it. One time I was without it one business day. Send it out Tue night, got it back Thu morning, repaired.

If the crack is from a known issue, it should be covered.
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iFerret
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2008-09-20, 19:28

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kickaha View Post
Maybe AppleCare is vastly different down almost under, but my turnaround on laptop repairs is about 3-5 days, from the time I box it up to the time I unbox it. One time I was without it one business day. Send it out Tue night, got it back Thu morning, repaired.

If the crack is from a known issue, it should be covered.
The crack is a known issue. I called AppleCare shortly after it first developed and they told me they'd cover it, but that I'd either have to travel out of town or send it to them. Travelling out of town (twice, as apparently the service people would have to identify the issue and document it and then decide what they were going to do, and then a second time so they could do it. Alternatively I could leave the MacBook with them, but that would still involve another out of town trip and being without my MacBook for while).

Sending it in meant that it would go first to somewhere in New Zealand and then to Australia to be fixed. That would take a couple of days and then it would be sent back. Two weeks in transit approximately and a few days to fix it, they said. I can't be without my precious laptop .
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Yontsey
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Join Date: Apr 2005
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2008-09-20, 20:07

Quote:
Originally Posted by iFerret View Post
The crack is a known issue. I called AppleCare shortly after it first developed and they told me they'd cover it, but that I'd either have to travel out of town or send it to them. Travelling out of town (twice, as apparently the service people would have to identify the issue and document it and then decide what they were going to do, and then a second time so they could do it. Alternatively I could leave the MacBook with them, but that would still involve another out of town trip and being without my MacBook for while).

Sending it in meant that it would go first to somewhere in New Zealand and then to Australia to be fixed. That would take a couple of days and then it would be sent back. Two weeks in transit approximately and a few days to fix it, they said. I can't be without my precious laptop .
then why'd you get AppleCare?
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iFerret
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2008-09-20, 20:22

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yontsey View Post
then why'd you get AppleCare?
I didn't . I'm still in the limited one year warranty form of AppleCare or whatever it is.
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Yontsey
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2008-09-20, 20:29

Quote:
Originally Posted by iFerret View Post
I didn't . I'm still in the limited one year warranty form of AppleCare or whatever it is.
ah ok my apologies. I read it wrong.
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Fahrenheit
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2008-09-21, 03:43

So you're basing your hatred of Apple on the fact that you are too scared to send it off for repair? What are they supposed to do then?
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chucker
 
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2008-09-21, 04:10

Quote:
Originally Posted by iFerret View Post
I'm getting to the point where I feel that it may be necessary for me to dump my MacBook and switch back to a Windows based solution.

Firstly, I'm moving between unsatisified/disappointed and appalled with regards to the quality of the MacBook. Not only is my MacBook hot enough to fry an egg on (not quite, but it does get very, very warm) but it has developed some discolouration on the bottom surfaces and some scratching elsewhere. To add to this, my MacBook is also suffering from the well documented cracking on the top case beneath the keyboard, where the risers from the screen touch the bottom part. This has resulted in a nasty looking crack around 2 inches long that I don't like at all.

Personally I feel that this is unacceptable from a nearly 2500 dollar (New Zealand) computer. I am at a loss to explain why Apple created a white notebook computer. This thing shows dirt like a bitch and there are few ingrained things that just don't come out - near the top of the screen is something that looks like iron filings. It's been there for months and does not come off. Though I am kind of pleased and surprised with how it's held up with regards to being white, I thought it would be much dirtier, much faster.
Recently, I had problems with my MacBook Pro's left fan. I called Apple, and they promptly agreed to have it replaced for free. I went to the local dealer to have it done, but instead, they took a closer look and decided they wanted to do much more "since they have to open it up anyway".

Long story short, they replaced the keyboard, top case, trackpad and some other components. For free. As part of AppleCare coverage. For a machine that's nearing two and a half years of age. Not that there was anything wrong with those components; they simply started showing their age (admittedly, I hadn't been keeping it squeaky clean all the time, and I also use it on average 10-12 hours a day, each day, so wear and tear did happen).

Maybe AppleCare isn't quite as good over there, but you should give it a shot nonetheless. Discoloration sounds to me like a problem they might address.

Quote:
Second I'm realising more and more that I need Windows for stuff. I can get access to Adobe CS3 for Windows, but not for Mac and Adobe refuses to switch the licenses out due to them being volume issued or something like that. My school is entirely Windows based, and it's a lot easier from a student's point of view just to use Windows - Macs aren't actually allowed on our network due to supposed (read: bullshit) "compatibility issues". I also like to play a few games here and there which are Windows based. Using Boot Camp is an option, but the MacBook's performance isn't really up to scratch.
Apple isn't responsible for your school being crappy, ignorant and incompetent. If there's a few apps that don't exist for Mac OS, they can be run through VMware Fusion or Parallels Desktop or perhaps even CrossOver. Games aside, Boot Camp is largely irrelevant if you prefer to use OS X.

What is Apple to do about your schools' policies, really?

As for games, few laptops in the price range of MacBooks have dedicated graphics cards. Yes, the lowest-end laptops with graphics cards are significantly cheaper than MacBook Pros, but they also don't have the same build quality, and they'd be completely unsuitable for your main use: school. They're heavy, thick, loud, and have low battery life.

Quote:
I like My MacBook for the most part, but it definitely has some major drawbacks. The fact that I can get a better specced Windows laptop for half the price of my MacBook really pisses me off too. For an extra $1000 I get OS X, is that really worth it?
You were complaining about quality control in the first few paragraphs. Good luck with one of those "better specced Windows laptop[s] for half the price", then…
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iFerret
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2008-09-21, 04:20

Guys, I don't hate Apple.
I love my MacBook, I love OS X and I really like Apple. I just don't particularly like some things about my MacBook.
Having said that, buying a Windows laptop and going back to the Borg really is a scary thought.

Apple is definitely not to blame for my school's crappy IT policies. I was just saying that having a Windows laptop would make it much easier for me to get on at school. It's a convenience and necessity thing.

Farenheit, as I said I have no hatred of Apple. I just dislike the obscene heat, discoloration and cracking I have experienced with my MacBook. Other than that, I love Apple and their products. I don't expect Apple to do anything - they've offered to do what I expected and that's fine with me. It's my own problems that prevent me from using their service, not Apple's fault at all.

I'm not to scared to send it off for repair - I'm not able to send it off for repair. This MacBook is used for school stuff and work stuff, I can't afford to have no laptop for two or three weeks while it is repaired. I also can't financially or timewise afford to travel out of town twice to get it repaired.

Chucker, I have no doubt that AppleCare's service would be excellent. I know for a fact that it is, having had my broken iPod headphones replaced free of charge when it was my fault they were broken. Apple has agreed that my issues are warranty ones and they will cover them for free. I just can't afford to have the repairs done.

I'm a bit stuck as I don't want to give my MacBook up but it looks to me as if I might have to
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chucker
 
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2008-09-21, 04:40

Have you considered renting a laptop while the MacBook is off for repair? Are you sure it'll take "two or three weeks"? It's usually a matter of days here…
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thegeriatric
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2008-09-21, 05:09

Can you borrow/use a friends machine while yours is away?
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iFerret
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2008-09-21, 05:12

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucker View Post
Have you considered renting a laptop while the MacBook is off for repair? Are you sure it'll take "two or three weeks"? It's usually a matter of days here…
I hadn't even thought about renting a laptop. That's a great idea, thanks Chucker.
Two or three weeks was the estimate I was given.

Quote:
Originally Posted by thegeriatric View Post
Can you borrow/use a friends machine while yours is away?
It's a great idea, but unlikely to be successful. Thanks anyway geri.
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_Ω_
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2008-09-21, 08:08

Whenever I have had repairs to made in NZ it has taken hours. I just drop it in in the morning and then pick it up at my leisure some time later in the day. All through applecare. I guess I am lucky that I live near many authorised dealers and repairers.

But good luck with the borg....

Angels bleed from the tainted touch of my caress
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Windswept
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2008-09-21, 18:50

Quote:
Originally Posted by iFerret View Post
I hadn't even thought about renting a laptop. That's a great idea, thanks Chucker.
Two or three weeks was the estimate I was given.
If you can rent, that would be great, and would solve your problem of being without a laptop. Many people these days cannot manage being without a laptop, and pretty much need to figure out what arrangements to make when repairs are needed, as they inevitably will be from time to time.

If you live in a place that might cause two or three-week repair turnarounds, then you will always have the current problem when repairs are needed. You will either need to rent a substitute laptop or buy a back-up, so that you will always be covered when repair situations arise. Right?

I hope you can find a rental.
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Kraetos
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2008-09-22, 11:07

I'll sound off with a less popular opinion: if you need Windows, you need Windows. It sounds like your school is totally unsupportive of Mac OS X, in the same boat, I'd be considering a PC laptop as well. (Luckily, my school embraces Apple. In fact, I'm the Campus Rep )

But... don't fall prey to the "better speced laptop for half as much" myth! It may be better speced but if it costs that much less than the MacBook and has better specs, the build quality is probably awful. Spend a little more and get yourself an XPS, or better yet, a ThinkPad.

If you do buy a PC, hang on to the receipt.

Logic, logic, logic. Logic is the beginning of wisdom, Valeris, not the end.
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Engine Joe
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2008-09-22, 11:45

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kraetos View Post
I'll sound off with a less popular opinion: if you need Windows, you need Windows. It sounds like your school is totally unsupportive of Mac OS X, in the same boat, I'd be considering a PC laptop as well. (Luckily, my school embraces Apple. In fact, I'm the Campus Rep )
But, barring some very odd and specific circumstances, wouldn't Boot Camp handle this issue?

Sounds like he's more displeased about the build and service.
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Luca
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2008-09-22, 12:48

I held off posting in this thread since you probably know my opinion anyway, but just to clarify... what you need to do is analyze the situation and determine how much OS X really helps you. That's what I did when it came time to decide whether I wanted to stay with it or not. In the end, I decided that while I like OS X, it wasn't good enough to justify the added expense. Windows still works just fine, contrary to what many people here believe.

It's just a series of trade offs. With OS X, you have an OS that you like and are familiar with, and you still have the option of using Windows. But with the added problems of servicing it, having a Mac is less convenient. Does that totally balance out the advantage of having OS X? It's up to you.
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Kraetos
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2008-09-22, 13:04

Quote:
Originally Posted by Engine Joe View Post
But, barring some very odd and specific circumstances, wouldn't Boot Camp handle this issue?

Sounds like he's more displeased about the build and service.
Sounds like he wanted a real GPU, too. And even if that wasn't the case, keeping a Mac around to use it exclusively for Windows seems a little silly, yes?

Logic, logic, logic. Logic is the beginning of wisdom, Valeris, not the end.
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Engine Joe
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2008-09-22, 13:07

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kraetos View Post
Sounds like he wanted a real GPU, too. And even if that wasn't the case, keeping a Mac around to use it exclusively for Windows seems a little silly, yes?
Well, plenty of PCs have integrated graphics -- especially ones "more affordable" than a MacBook, which was one of his arguments (price). And who says he'd be using Windows exclusively? Do people not use their computers for more than work/schoolwork?

And he already owns the MacBook.
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Luca
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2008-09-22, 13:13

Quote:
Originally Posted by Engine Joe View Post
Well, plenty of PCs have integrated graphics -- especially ones "more affordable" than a MacBook, which was one of his arguments (price). And who says he'd be using Windows exclusively? Do people not use their computers for more than work/schoolwork?

And he already owns the MacBook.
1. That's true, but if you do some research, it's not hard to find Windows notebooks with dedicated GPUs for under US$1000. At $1100-$1300, it becomes even easier.
2. Convenience issue. If you have to use Windows for work but want to use OS X at home, you have to reboot twice every day (minimum). More if you have to do work stuff at home or if you want to boot into Windows to play games.
3. Servicing. If AppleCare has really bad support in New Zealand, having to wait a few weeks to get your computer back is unacceptable. However, this can only be a factor if you buy from a company that is known to have good warranty service in NZ. That might be difficult, but some Google research will probably help you out.
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Engine Joe
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2008-09-22, 13:40

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luca View Post
1. That's true, but if you do some research, it's not hard to find Windows notebooks with dedicated GPUs for under US$1000. At $1100-$1300, it becomes even easier.
Absolutely true. But again, he already has a computer. Sure it needs some work done, but the price of a rental in the meantime is far better than $1000. At any rate, the price differential on a similarly spec'ed machine with dedicated GPU isn't particularly material. (as a side note, iFerret doesn't even raise this GPU issue in his original post, so I'm not sure why it's even in the discussion...)

Quote:
2. Convenience issue. If you have to use Windows for work but want to use OS X at home, you have to reboot twice every day (minimum). More if you have to do work stuff at home or if you want to boot into Windows to play games.
I think this is pretty lame, to be honest. Are we so spoiled that purchasing a whole new computer - he already has the MB! - is preferable to a 2 minute or so wait after getting home from classes?

Quote:
3. Servicing. If AppleCare has really bad support in New Zealand, having to wait a few weeks to get your computer back is unacceptable. However, this can only be a factor if you buy from a company that is known to have good warranty service in NZ. That might be difficult, but some Google research will probably help you out.
That's what this all comes down to in the end, IMO. iFerret's decision should be based on this, not this other ancillary stuff.
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Luca
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2008-09-22, 14:08

Quote:
Originally Posted by Engine Joe View Post
Absolutely true. But again, he already has a computer. Sure it needs some work done, but the price of a rental in the meantime is far better than $1000. At any rate, the price differential on a similarly spec'ed machine with dedicated GPU isn't particularly material. (as a side note, iFerret doesn't even raise this GPU issue in his original post, so I'm not sure why it's even in the discussion...)
True, good observation. I read through all the posts and iFerret never mentioned graphics performance at all, so this shouldn't be a point of argument. In fact, it actually opens up his choices a lot since if you are okay with shared graphics, you can get a PC notebook for very, very cheap.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Engine Joe View Post
I think this is pretty lame, to be honest. Are we so spoiled that purchasing a whole new computer - he already has the MB! - is preferable to a 2 minute or so wait after getting home from classes?
There are a lot of people who still buy the Mac version of games that come out even though they run worse and cost more because it's more convenient. I'm not saying this should be the main reason for his decision, but it's just one factor. All I'm really saying is there's not much justification to keep a Mac around if you're booting into Windows most of the time anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Engine Joe View Post
That's what this all comes down to in the end, IMO. iFerret's decision should be based on this, not this other ancillary stuff.
Yeah, that's the main thing. Like you said, he already has a computer. Problem is it's broken and he's looking at a several week turnaround time to get it replaced. If it breaks again within the warranty period, that's another couple weeks. If he buys AppleCare, that's an extra couple hundred bucks (way more than most companies charge for extended service) and he still has to put up with slow service. Otherwise, he's SOL if he chooses not to buy the warranty (and I could understand not wanting to pay several hundred dollars to buy warranty service that isn't even very good in the first place).

Basically, the difference between what we're saying is that you're saying that for him to buy a new computer, he should have a good reason to do so (which I agree with). I'm saying, he already has a good reason to do so, and he has to decide whether it's a good enough reason to move on it.

My argument is:

- It's not worth putting up with crappy slow AppleCare service for the MacBook.
- Get it fixed and then sell it while it's still worth something and before the 1-year warranty runs out.
- Replace it with a notebook whose company provides quick support to customers in New Zealand.

In the end, only iFerret can decide what he wants to do. All we can do is lay out the facts for him and help him understand what the situation will be.
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Kraetos
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2008-09-22, 16:13

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luca View Post
True, good observation. I read through all the posts and iFerret never mentioned graphics performance at all, so this shouldn't be a point of argument. In fact, it actually opens up his choices a lot since if you are okay with shared graphics, you can get a PC notebook for very, very cheap.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iFerret View Post
I also like to play a few games here and there which are Windows based. Using Boot Camp is an option, but the MacBook's performance isn't really up to scratch.
(Emphasis mine)

Also, sounds to me like he would be selling the MacBook to help pay for the PC laptop.
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iFerret
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2008-09-28, 18:13

Thanks guys .
Going into the store I bought it from today to see what they say.

Last edited by iFerret : 2008-09-28 at 19:50.
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iFerret
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2008-09-28, 22:52

Okay, shop sending it to Renaissance/Apple today or tomorrow.
Will be without my lappy for 15 working days at least

It really has to be done though, as both sides of the palmrests have cracked and the top of the screen bezel is cracking now too. The glossy coating on the screen has also developed some defects - bubbling and scratching and that sort of thing.
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iFerret
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2008-10-24, 19:39

Well I got my computer back yesterday and can conclude that Renaissance (who provide technical servies like repairs for Apple in NZ) are an extremely useless company.

They rang a week or two after the MacBook got sent in to say they were waiting for authorisation form Apple to do the repairs (Apple had indicated previously to me and Renaissance that it was warranty covered) and told me to ring Apple Australia to get them to hurry it up a bit. I did so and was told Renaissance had not requested anything, no notes had been made and no authorisations asked for or given.

Anyway, after Apple got involved things sped up a lot and I now have the MacBook back which is excellent. They replaced the top case, screen bezel and even the battery. The battery didn't seem to have any problems though.

Unfortunately not all is well - the new battery seems to have about half the battery life under pretty much the same usage conditions. Furthermore, the screen bezel doesn't seem to have been applied very well as it is coming off in the corners. Looks like shit. I also found food crumbs in the laptop, which I don't think were mine.

I don't know whether to just live with it or take it back again...
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Foj
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2008-10-24, 20:13

I'd take it back again
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Maciej
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2008-10-24, 22:00

Quote:
Originally Posted by Foj View Post
I'd take it back again
Me too.

And man, thats a lemon if I've ever had one. (Which I have).
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FFL
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2008-10-24, 23:00

It sounds like you should call Apple first, and report your concerns to them.
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iFerret
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2008-10-25, 02:11

Oh I think I will call Apple.
Some customer service guy gave me his number, so I'll give him a call on Tuesday (Monday is a public holiday, he doesn't work weekends).
Thanks guys.
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