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very satisfied with new MBP
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brassguy
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
 
2006-08-21, 23:30

I've had my MBP for a week now and I'm loving it. I've mostly been keeping it - putting it in sleep mode when not using it.

Fast coming out of sleep and also very fast booting up from off. My Windows Desktop takes FOREVER to boot up.

MBP is fast, everything integrated - love it.

Only gripes: I really miss right click. It's kind of annoying that Mac Mice have 1 button and there is no right click.

Also - What is up with the LACK OF FULL SCREEN? I like to view websites in full windows, etc - but that doesn't seem possible on macs? Why not????

--------
Still deciding - get .Mac or not? I didn't buy it with my order - so can I still get it discounted %30?

another minor gripe: Still haven't recieved my Apple Care for my MBP. Do they usually mail it out so slowly??? They fed exed everything including the iPod Apple Care - but never recieved the MBP Apple Care. They don't seem to have FedExed that.
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Brad
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
 
2006-08-21, 23:34

Quote:
Originally Posted by brassguy
Only gripes: I really miss right click. It's kind of annoying that Mac Mice have 1 button and there is no right click.
Are you talking about the trackpad? Or Apple's Mighty Mouse? Both of them support right-click. For the Mighty Mouse, configure it to use right-click from the System Preferences. For the trackpad, place two fingers on the surface and click (you might also have to toggle this in System Preferences).

Quote:
Originally Posted by brassguy
Also - What is up with the LACK OF FULL SCREEN? I like to view websites in full windows, etc - but that doesn't seem possible on macs? Why not????
I don't believe anything should stop you from manually resizing a window to fill the screen.

If you mean that the green resize button doesn't act as a maximize button, that's by design.

The quality of this board depends on the quality of the posts. The only way to guarantee thoughtful, informative discussion is to write thoughtful, informative posts. AppleNova is not a real-time chat forum. You have time to compose messages and edit them before and after posting.
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Windowsrookie
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2006-08-21, 23:46

Why would you want to view it full screen? There woulld be large amounts of unused space.
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brassguy
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
 
2006-08-21, 23:56

Just enabled right clicking on my mighty mouse. And enabled it on trackpad. Thanks for the friendly responses. Surprised that right click isn't the default. Right click still not as useful as on Windows - but really glad that macs do have it. :

I like the Mac Scroll Ball better than Microsoft's Scroll Wheel though.

I'm used to having all my windows full screened. Mac isn't very full screen friendly. But you can make windows larger - so thats good. No full screen button or option though.

For anyone wondering: It doesn't appear to burn that hot. Warm certainly - but not that warm or hot. Also - the whine is not annoying and only noticeable if you listen for it.

Any thoughts on .Mac and is the MBP Apple Care supposed to take a while to get to me? Been a week since the MBP was delivered to me.

thanks again.
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Kraetos
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Boston-ish
 
2006-08-22, 00:27

Quote:
Originally Posted by brassguy
I'm used to having all my windows full screened. Mac isn't very full screen friendly. But you can make windows larger - so thats good. No full screen button or option though.
I agree with WR when he says that "Maximize" is a colossal waste of space. When you hit the maximize button, you are trying to accomplish one of two things:

1) See information that is outside the window, or
2) Focus your attention on the frontmost window by eliminating visibility of all other windows. (You might not be aware that this is what you are trying to accomplish - that Maximize button has you trained )

On a Mac, you can accomplish both of these tasks:

1) The green button. Expands the window to the edge of the content.
2) -Opt-H (i.e. "Hide others" in the Application menu.) This will (temporarily) remove all other windows from view, except windows belonging to the active application, thus focusing your attention on the frontmost Window.

Logic, logic, logic. Logic is the beginning of wisdom, Valeris, not the end.
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BlueApple
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
 
2006-08-22, 02:20

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad
For the trackpad, place two fingers on the surface and click (you might also have to toggle this in System Preferences).
Wow, didn't know this before. Thanks.
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Mugge
Thunderbolt, fuck yeah!
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Denmark
 
2006-08-22, 10:06

Just thought I'd say I very much agree with the thread title.

At first It did behave a little dodgy and hot but the firmware update pretty much fixed that problem. Especially the display quality and the filth resistant aluminium enclosure has been nice.

I dare say it's going to be a long time keeper.

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neiltc13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
 
2006-08-22, 10:39

I find that the two-finger tap on the trackpad is easer than placing two fingers on and then pressing the mouse button.
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almost2mac
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
 
2006-08-22, 17:15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kraetos
I agree with WR when he says that "Maximize" is a colossal waste of space. When you hit the maximize button, you are trying to accomplish one of two things:
Some websites - especially forums - are designed to resize and take up all the available space, so often it's not a waste of space if you can get some breathing room in your columns.

It's a little different on a mac in that you have to physically drag the window as big as you want it, but it does seem to remember that size afterward if you click between normal and "other" size.

Mail is the only app I've seen happily take the whole screen, and that's the one that doesn't warrant it! Many of my emails are one ginormous line of text across the widescreen!
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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2006-08-22, 17:19

Quote:
Originally Posted by almost2mac
Some terribly-designed websites - especially forums - are designed to resize and take up all the available space, so if you want to support that horrible idea, it's not a waste of space if you can get some breathing room in your columns.
T,ftfy. You only proved Kickaha's point. The single biggest reason to have a maximized window is to use a UI design that's flawed to begin with.

Last edited by chucker : 2006-08-22 at 17:56.
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torifile
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Join Date: May 2004
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2006-08-22, 17:30

Can we sticky all the reasons having a maximize button is the stupidest idea ever? Please? Especially with a wide screen monitor. I'd practically have to move my head to read a maximized window on my iMac. Every time someone mentions this, I die a little on the inside. (Or at least I cringe. But "dying on the inside" sounds so much more dramatic. )
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Kraetos
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Boston-ish
 
2006-08-22, 17:45

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucker
T,ftfy. You only proved Kickaha's point. The single biggest reason to have a maximized reason is to use a UI design that's flawed to begin with.
Aaaand chucker swoops in for the win, again.

Maximize is a horrible convention, and the fact that it's a feature of Windows just gets all its users addicted to it. And because users are used to it, people write websites to "use" it.

Boo maximize. Hooray green button!

Logic, logic, logic. Logic is the beginning of wisdom, Valeris, not the end.
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torifile
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2006-08-22, 18:54

I currently have my windows about half the width of my screen and all the way down. With a widescreen monitor, I can get two perfectly sized windows side-by-side relatively easily.
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shatteringglass
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
 
2006-08-22, 20:21

Kind of off-topic, but who else hates the fact that Apple themselves call the green window widget "maximize"? It was originally "zoom" in old Mac OS versions, and it should've stayed that.
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Kraetos
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Boston-ish
 
2006-08-22, 20:35

Quote:
Originally Posted by shatteringglass
Kind of off-topic, but who else hates the fact that Apple themselves call the green window widget "maximize"? It was originally "zoom" in old Mac OS versions, and it should've stayed that.
I thought it was still called zoom. Where have you seen otherwise?
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shatteringglass
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
 
2006-08-22, 20:40

When Steve Jobs first introduced the Aqua interface at MWSF 2000, he referred to the green button as "maximize". On Apple's Mac OS X product site, on all Aqua-related pages, the green button has been called "maximize" until recently, when they took down the diagram of a standard OS X window.

Curiously, in Apple's HI guidelines, it's still called "zoom".
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Brad
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
 
2006-08-22, 21:21

Jobs is known to stumble over and misspeak technical terms, even product names. At the unveiling of iTunes, for example, he called it "iMusic". The event you cite was when Mac OS X wasn't even in beta testing and Aqua was still privy to only a handful of people at Apple. The zoom functionality barely even worked at that time. So, I wouldn't rely on that event for the proper naming of a widget.

As for Apple's web pages, I trust you mean this graphic?



It says zoom, not maximize. Further, here's a quote from that page in 2001:
Quote:
Bright buttons offer access to familiar functions. The red button closes the window, while the green button grows the window to full size. The yellow button minimizes the window to the Dock. You can see a miniature version of the window in the Dock, and if you minimize a QuickTime movie, it keeps playing while in the Dock.
Emphasis mine.

In digging through the Wayback Machine, I'm not able to find a single instance where Apple has called it the "maximize" button. Can you?

The quality of this board depends on the quality of the posts. The only way to guarantee thoughtful, informative discussion is to write thoughtful, informative posts. AppleNova is not a real-time chat forum. You have time to compose messages and edit them before and after posting.
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shatteringglass
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
 
2006-08-22, 22:00

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad
As for Apple's web pages, I trust you mean this graphic?

The diagram you have is older than than the one I was thinking of. (So I was wrong in saying Apple always called it "maximize" since the beginning of Aqua, but Steve really pushed "maximize" during the MWSF 2000 keynote, enough to lead me to believe that's their new term.) The one I was thinking of, I saw on an early Tiger site, I believe, which hasn't been archived yet.

I swear I'm not crazy! Or else I wouldn't have remember this discrepancy between "zoom" and "maximize" in their marketing.

Wow, I really have lost it.

Whatever, I have no proof. I concede defeat, you guys.
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Brad
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
 
2006-08-22, 22:03

For what it's worth, I also checked the developer docs from my original 10.0 CDs and they too said zoom, not maximize.
  quote
shatteringglass
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
 
2006-08-22, 22:11

Ouch. Now you're just rubbing salt in the wound.

Halfway into looking at every cached Aqua page at month-long intervals on archive.org did I realize how far I'm going just to prove a point.
  quote
Brad
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
 
2006-08-22, 22:18

Quote:
Originally Posted by shatteringglass
Steve really pushed "maximize" during the MWSF 2000 keynote, enough to lead me to believe that's their new term.)
Well, I just checked the MWSF 2000 video and, although he never actually uses it to "maximize" any windows, Steve did say that the "green means maximize the window".

Once.

Anyhow, I'd better get back to listening to my iMusic here...

The quality of this board depends on the quality of the posts. The only way to guarantee thoughtful, informative discussion is to write thoughtful, informative posts. AppleNova is not a real-time chat forum. You have time to compose messages and edit them before and after posting.
  quote
shatteringglass
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
 
2006-08-22, 22:25

I should know better. You're always right.

Wow, my memory must be a lot worse than I previously thought.
Quote:
Anyhow, I'd better get back to listening to my iMusic here...

Last edited by shatteringglass : 2006-08-22 at 22:31.
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chromos
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Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: SF, CA
 
2006-08-22, 23:44

Quote:
Originally Posted by brassguy
Just enabled right clicking on my mighty mouse. And enabled it on trackpad. Thanks for the friendly responses. Surprised that right click isn't the default. Right click still not as useful as on Windows - but really glad that macs do have it. :
.
.
.
Any thoughts on .Mac and is the MBP Apple Care supposed to take a while to get to me? Been a week since the MBP was delivered to me.

thanks again.
Congrats on your MBP! Glad to hear you love it.

As you continue using Mac OS X, I think you'll find that right click is actually implemented better than in Windows. Specifically, there shouldn't be anything in a right-click contextual menu that you isn't easily discoverable in a menu or elsewhere in the UI. It drives me batty when Windows apps hide a Very Important Function™ in a contextual menu that you invoke by right-clicking a non-obvious UI element.

Also, don't sweat the Apple Care (but good for you that you got it). You have an entire year to activate it.

As for .Mac, I love it but then again I'm lazy and I like how quickly I can get my vacation photos up in spiffy looking web pages with iWeb. Also, I keep my work and home macs synced up like buttah. And my email address ends in mac.com. You can still get .Mac for $80 from Amazon (e.g., by linking out from Macintouch.com, I have no affiliation but it helps a good site).

Last edited by chromos : 2006-08-22 at 23:49.
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Yontsey
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Cleveland-ish, OH
 
2006-08-22, 23:51

I usually just hold dont Control and then click the track pad if I need to right-click anything
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spikeh
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2006-08-23, 07:39

Quote:
Originally Posted by brassguy
another minor gripe: Still haven't recieved my Apple Care for my MBP. Do they usually mail it out so slowly??? They fed exed everything including the iPod Apple Care - but never recieved the MBP Apple Care. They don't seem to have FedExed that.
Don't sweat it. I called them and they aren't sending out the confirmation codes for Applecare until after the 90-day warranty expires. You'll get it after you've had your MBP 3 months.
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DK-Lach
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Denmark
 
2006-08-23, 12:00

Quote:
Originally Posted by torifile
Can we sticky all the reasons having a maximize button is the stupidest idea ever? Please?
Okay! Let's all quit the "maximize-button-slapping"!

Time has indeed run out for the maximize-button on todays high-res 4:3 and widescreen monitors. But the button is highly usable on a 1024x768 monitor. And believe you me - there is still ALOT of those around...

And on a personal note... Back at my old school, they had a lot of eMacs, and their resolution was set at - yes, you guessed it - 1024x768. I'm telling you. I practically went insane, because there was no easy way to utilize all of the desktop realestate when browsing. Need I say, that I hate vertical scrolling on webpages??

So leave the maximizer-button alone and start lobbying for the possibillity to resize windows in OSX along all the edges and not just the lower rigth corner.
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Mugge
Thunderbolt, fuck yeah!
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Denmark
 
2006-08-23, 12:47

Can't someone just write a little software-thingy that put's a maximise button up on the applications top-bar along with the other three buttons?

I suggest they make it blue.

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torifile
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2006-08-23, 13:04

Quote:
But the button is highly usable on a 1024x768 monitor.
I disagree. It's useless on all monitor resolutions and it's a bad habit people need to get out of. It only makes sense on a machine that can only run one application at a time and we haven't been cursed with those in quite some time (unless you count a Palm).
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Kraetos
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Boston-ish
 
2006-08-26, 16:04

Giving you Fitts (via John Gruber)

In a nutshell: Office 2007 pays close attention to Fitt's law. When you mazimize Office 2007, the top menus become "mile high."

So, theres another reason why maximize works on Windows but is less useful on OS X. OS X already makes better use of Fitt's law because OS X's menus are already "mile high." It wouldn't surprise me if Vista adds this functionality into ALL windows - because I don't believe XP does.

Logic, logic, logic. Logic is the beginning of wisdom, Valeris, not the end.
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Mugge
Thunderbolt, fuck yeah!
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Denmark
 
2006-08-26, 16:13

That was an interesting read, Kraetos. I even understod the formula for once.

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