Banging the Bottom End
Join Date: Jun 2004
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I just picked up a Sony PSP last Friday and this thing is really cool! Not only does it play games, but I've loaded all the pics I've taken of my son onto it so I have a virtual photo album with hundreds of pics with me at all times!
My next attempt will be to transmogrify some of my home movies into a format the PSP will understand so I can show those off too. Considering that I almost bought a digital picture frame last Christmas for $300, the PSP is a bargain. Plus, I have an awesome little gaming system to keep boredom at bay during my bus rides to/from work. What I do think is funny though is that with all the wiz-bang graphics and 3D wizardry that is capable with the PSP, so far my favorite game by far is Lumines. I'm a total Tetris-a-holic so I knew this game would be my downfall before I bought it. Still, Twisted Metal is fun too. Now I just have to learn to control these cars better so I can actually survive a round or two. |
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Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Houston, Texas
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Over 5 million sold. Total failure.
Oh Nintendo, when will you ever learn? |
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Less than Stellar Member
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Played with my nephew-in-law's DS tonight. It was fun. I want one. Any other impressions of it?
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Veteran Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
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It's going to be a good year to have a DS over a PSP(Specially with GTA being in 2006 and such)
Here's many reasons Nintendo fanboy first, Apple second |
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Less than Stellar Member
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My DS just arrived! Woo hoo! Gotta get a game for it. Which should I get first?
(Damn the studying! I'm going to play some games!!!) |
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Yarp
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Road Warrior
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I've been pretty interested in the DS lately, I'm thinking about getting one. I cannot justify spending so much money on a portable gaming system, that I would never buy a PSP, though it does look radical. The DS looks far better suited for "toss in the car and forget about unless you're bored" which, I imagine is exactly what I'd do with it.
(edit: yes I know, based on my prior posts in this thread that's astounding, but heck, the DS is looking pretty cool to me lately) |
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Less than Stellar Member
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Wrao,
If you've got the money, you should definitely get one. I bought two games earlier today. Mario DS (of course) and this funky game "Feel the magic". That one is just absurd. The thing about the DS is that it's not the same as a mini console. It's a different experience. I've got a console already and a BIG tv. Why do I want a smaller version of it? The DS is just *different* despite what Eugene says. It's pretty cool. If it's not red and showing substantial musculature, you're wearing it wrong. |
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Yarp
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Road Warrior
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That's kind of how I feel about it too. The DS looks like it's a fun little toy that will actually be fresh and interesting. The PSP looks like a portable PS2, which, I already have a PS2, and I barely use it anyway.
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Veteran Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
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Absurd? what's absurd about goldfish in the stomach?
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Portugal
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DS looks like an old cheap tetris system. Would never buy it!
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Less than Stellar Member
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@morningstar: My favorite so far has been cleaning the woman. Completely off the wall. And it really makes use of the DS' unique features. If it's not red and showing substantial musculature, you're wearing it wrong. |
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Yarp
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Road Warrior
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Oh man, tetris rules. I played too much damn tetris last summer.
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Okay, time for me to do an overblown post outlining my opinions on everything that has been said in this thread, I guess.
Firstly, let me just outline where I stand on the whole videogaming industry. I am a Nintendo fanboy. There's no use denying it, because I'm pretty much a definitive Nintendo fanboy in terms of my opinions, if perhaps not my level of intelligence (I've seen some pretty inarticulate Nintendo fanboys). I have only ever owned Nintendo consoles, and have relatively little experience of the other consoles (due to not actually owning any of them...) For the record, my first console was a Nintendo 64, followed by a Game Boy Color, then a GBA, a Gamecube, GBA SP and DS. And without fail, I've had extremely positive experiences on all of those. So, to the topics at hand. Firstly, the more off-topic stuff. Nintendo 64 vs. PS1. Now, I don't pretend to be an expert on the history of the gaming industry, but even I think that the N64 had a definite technical edge over the PS1 when they were in competition. The only thing the PS1 had going for it technically, as has already been mentioned, was its larger storage medium. It's also been mentioned in this thread that the N64 was much easier to develop for than the PS1 - I don't know anything about this, so I'm just going to take it at face value. The fact is that the N64 had the power to create far better graphics than the PS1 could dream of, and the power to create true 3D worlds in a way that the PS1 could only feebly imitate at best. The N64's superiority here is pretty much indisputable. Slightly more disputable, since it's a matter of taste, is that N64 had far better games than the PS1, both initially and through the course of its life. N64 launched with Super Mario 64. This was the first true 3D engine game ever made, and in pretty much everyone's opinion, it was a masterpiece. The likes of the game's engine had never been seen before, so it could have won people over purely on novelty value, but it wasn't content with that, and instead managed to be a truly brilliant game, and an indisputable system-seller. I'm sure there are people who would buy the N64 even today to play SM64. Now there've been cynical comments in this thread basically saying that SM64 was a travesty and ruined the Mario series, and that Mario should always have stayed a side-scroller. Now, it's fair enough to say that you don't like SM64 - although it's certainly a rarity, since it's such a great game - but to say that it was wrong to make it is just silly. The industry was just beginning to branch out into the new realm of 3D gaming, and not carrying on old franchises into that new realm would simply have been a shame. Fans want to see existing worlds live on, love seeing continuations of existing sagas, and Nintendo were right to transfer their franchises across to N64. Of course, transferring a 2D franchise into 3D means some level of reinvention, which in turn means that some fans are going to be lost along the way, and some new ones made; that's only natural. But that doesn't mean that it shouldn't be done; to not move forward simply to prevent change is madness. At any rate, the N64's stash of brilliant games didn't by any means end with SM64. There was Lylat Wars - more of an evolution than a reinvention of an existing franchise, but a welcome one that played like a dream. There were the twin Rare shooter gems - firstly, early on in N64's life, Goldeneye, and then later on, Perfect Dark. Both acknowledged as among the best games of their times. Top-notch platformers weren't by any means scarce either - there were no more first-party N64 platformers after SM64, but Nintendo's then second-party Rare filled the gap admirably with the brilliant Banjo-Kazooie, Banjo-Tooie and DK64. Another N64 platformer (well, primarily platformer, though it had some more adventure-game elements) that I loved was the distinctly quirky but brilliant Mystical Ninja Starring Goemon, a Konami creation. There were racing games for everyone - Mario Kart 64, Diddy Kong Racing, F-Zero X and Beetle Adventure Racing were the four N64 racing games I owned, and all of them got me hooked despite the fact that I'm not usually particularly big on racing games, simply because they all had brilliantly fun, unique and addictive gameplay and style. The Super Smash Bros. series started on N64, as did Paper Mario, both brilliant games that later went on to spawn even more brilliant sequels on Gamecube. And of course then there's the legendary Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time, and its equally brilliant though less well-known sequel Majora's Mask. Both of those games' genius speaks for itself. Pretty much any of these games I've just mentioned could be counted system-sellers for someone, and a decidedly large proportion are serious system-sellers. And I'm very sure there are some games I'm missing either because they've temporarily slipped my mind while I was coming up with that list, because they're not my style of game, or simply because I tragically missed out on them. And for the record, I don't think PS1 could even begin to come up with a list as impressive as that. Whilst it had a gigantic range of mediocre-to-rubbish games, and a fair selection of quite-good titles, its selection of actual gems was severely limited, and it is those, unsurprisingly enough, that hold the real interest for me. There have been people in this thread comparing Nintendo to Apple, and I'm inclined to agree with them, because I've always seen the two companies as alike, even aside from the fact that they are both currently underdogs to some extent. They both, for a start, create both their own hardware and top-quality software that runs on that hardware, something that no other company in either of their markets really achieves. In Apple's case, of course, this allows them to create a flawless user interface and ensure that everything works together smoothly. Essentially the same thing works for Nintendo - because they create both their hardware and software, they have full control over their interface and can create games to take best advantage of it. This was clear in the N64, where they incorporated the Analogue Stick into their controller and then went on to make SM64, which showed off perfectly what it could do. It is even more clear in the DS, where undoubtedly the best games will be from Nintendo themselves, firstly because they always are on any Nintendo console, but secondly because they designed the unique interface with ideas in mind and they are most certainly going to realise those ideas. And it's almost certain to be clear in the Revolution, which is apparently going to have an incredibly unique interface of its own, though of course no-one knows what it is yet. Nintendo is also like Apple in that they have focus on quality. For Apple, the focus is always first and foremost on quality of user experience. Similarly, for Nintendo, the focus is always first and foremost on quality of gaming experience - and more specifically (although not exclusively) on quality of gameplay experience. Enjoyable gaming is without a doubt their top priority, even to the extent on missing out other things such as the multimedia facilities that other systems offer. PS2 and Xbox could play DVDs and music and the like. Gamecube didn't do any of that - it played games; that was what it was for. Even in the next generation, where PS3 and Xbox 360 seem to be wanting to broaden their multimedia capabilities and 'take over the living room' as the phrase goes, it seems unlikely that the Revolution is going to be doing that sort of thing - indeed it seems feasible that even the ability to play DVDs may be available only as an extra. Not that Nintendo haven't already revealed extra branching non-central features of the Revolution - of course they have! But what is the feature they've revealed? An online network, with access to a huge past library of...games. Where Sony and Microsoft's consoles are branching out into playing all sorts of other unrelated media, Nintendo's console is branching out to give old games a new lease of life. That says it all about their sense of focus. I'm not saying that their focus on games to the practical exclusion of all else is necessarily an entirely good thing - it would, I imagine, be quite handy to have a games console that can play DVDs, or play my music, or stream multimedia content from my computer. But when I'm buying a machine for gaming, if I have to choose between that and a console that allows me to enjoy games more easily, thoroughly and enjoyably, I'm going to opt for the second option every time. And Nintendo's focus on quality of games doesn't just go into their hardware features, of course, it's also evident in the sheer playability, enjoyability and love that goes into the games that they produce, and that is what I love them for. There are people who say that Nintendo should abandon hardware altogether and become purely a games developer, and there's logic in that argument, because that's what they are first and foremost - the best damn games developer out there. But to become purely a third-party developer would be to restrict them, to put them at least partly under the control of Sony or Microsoft, and that's quite definitely not desirable. And with their focus on innovation in hardware as well as software, losing them in that respect would be a huge blow to the industry. The other console designers' entire philosophy is so different from Nintendo's that it really isn't funny any more. Sony were bad enough on their own when it was just them against Nintendo, and at one point, Sega - Sony were the lone purely corporate giant in the industry, with their attitudes not focused on actual gaming, but on technology. But then Microsoft joined the fray, bringing its usual corporate clunkiness with it, and the two of them started leading the console industry with their non-gaming-oriented philosophies. Essentially, Sony and Microsoft don't look at consoles as consoles - that is, something that you buy and then you play games on. They look at them as platforms, like computers - Microsoft especially. Perhaps it's partly because they don't tend to actually develop games for the systems themselves, but they're ruining the entire concept. I look at posts like this from back on page 2 of this thread: Quote:
The point is, the console philosophy has always been - this is a [consolename]. It plays [consolename] games. You buy it. You put [consolename] games in it. You play them. You have fun. So what's this "Of course I'm talking about a modded Xbox"? I'm not a hardware junkie. I don't even know entirely what the term 'modding' means, least of all with relation to Xboxes. Should I? I'm a gamer. I use consoles because I want to play games. That's it. You buy wireless controllers for a console if you don't want the hassle of wires, yeah. You buy more controllers if you want multiplayer. You might buy some kind of novelty controller if you want to play some cool type of game. Those sort of things make sense. But upgrades? Mods? A console isn't a computer - no, strike that, I mean a PC. You can't treat it like one. The closest thing to a hardware upgrade I want to see on a console is something like the Expansion Pak for the N64 - it lets the console play games that are a damn sight more powerful, any game that needs it is labelled quite clearly with a big Expansion Pak logo, and just to be helpful, the first game that uses it comes free with one. And like the Expansion Pak, it shouldn't be a common thing - that was a once-in-a-console's-lifetime upgrade thing. You know why? Consoles are supposed to play games and just work. You buy a game for a console, you expect to be able to plug it in and be able to play it as it was supposed to be played. Not like PC 'gamers' who buy a game for their PC, analyse the reccomended specs to see if it'll be able to run all the flashy effects properly, realise they don't because they haven't bought the new graphics card that came out last week, go out and buy one for the sole purpose of playing this game, play it and get annoyed because their computer crashes/is a bit slow/is running something else at the same time/has a virus/doesn't feel like it right now because it's busy having cybersex with that hot toaster in the bathroom. Then they go buy another game (and of course a new graphics card to go with it. Of COURSE. And possibly a new CPU.) Yes, I'm being overblown. No, I don't think console gamers are going to go all PC and start switching bits and pieces of their consoles' innards regularly anytime soon, especially since the true console ethos, which effectively physically prevents it, never mind being a better model, is still being followed for the most part. But when people start talking about console 'modding' like it's something everyone does, and businesses like Sony and Microsoft turn their screwed-up corporate eyes on the industry with philosophies like they have now, I do get worried that someday, they might. Now, finally, onto the actual topic of the thread - DS. I own a DS, as I mentioned, and without going into any kind of overanalysis, let me just first say I think it's great, in that it's unique and fun. It also, being unique, has a ton of unexplored potential, and more than that, it even has features in it that have hardly been put to use at all yet (I'm looking at you, microphone). So it's a machine that's original, fun, and full of potential. What's not to like? Well, if you're going to be picky, then graphics is the obvious place to start. The graphics are, no question about it, outdated compared to home consoles. Never mind that handhelds have historically been many, many years behind home consoles and no-one's complained yet - it is. The only reason, of course, that people are taking note of this is because of the PSP, which has graphics rivalling home consoles. (Well, I say 'rivalling home consoles' - what I mean is almost up to the standard of PS2, the least powerful of a generation of consoles that is swiftly drawing to a close. But let's not split hairs.) But really - if it wasn't for the PSP and its spiffy graphics showing up as well, nobody would complain about the DS' graphics, period. This is the first handheld to be able to handle 3D worlds, and it does so with graphics superior to the N64. That's a serious leap from GBA, and to be frank, I thought GBA graphics were pretty nice themselves in their own little way. But the PSP's graphics are on a totally different level, which brings scepticism towards DS. But you see - there's one thing these people are missing amongst all the 3D hype around the DS, being so keen to naysay. Because in my opinion, what DS' forte really is is GBA-style games. Think about it. This is a whole new segment - the GBC was between NES and SNES, the GBA was quite clearly the handheld SNES, but what's the DS? It's not something that's been touched on before, no pun intended. It's a console with more power than the N64, but controls that lend themselves more to SNES-style gameplay. Among other things. Obviously, the SNES didn't have a touch screen and microphone and all that, but if you just look at the base controls - because the touch screen doesn't have to be everything - you can clearly see that this console is engineered towards that type of gameplay. Yes, there are openings for other types of gameplay - FPS for one it handles brilliantly if the Metroid Prime Hunters demo is anything to go by, and of course there are whole new avenues opened up by the touch screen; just look at the likes of Wario Ware: Touched, Polarium, Yoshi's Touch and Go, Pac-Pix, Nintendogs and their ilk. But its core games, and the ones I'm most interested in (well, except maybe MP: Hunters) are the ones that are basically GBA on steroids. Nintendo have been pretty damn smart here, if I do say so myself, with the whole 'third pillar' proclamation - ie. that DS isn't a replacement for the Game Boy line, but rather an entirely new product in a line of its own. Right now, it doesn't seem to make much sense - what's the point in developing for the GBA when you could make the same game on DS and it could be better? - but when the next Game Boy is announced, then it's going to start making a whole lot of sense. This is a momentous point, you see. This is the point where 2D gaming could essentially be lost. Gamers got something of a taste of that when the N64 came out and suddenly everything was moving to 3D - but they were soon sated, because now they had home consoles to provide them with their 3D needs and handhelds for their 2D needs. And with few exceptions, that's how it's stayed, each keeping to its own territory. Now, handhelds are reaching the same technological point that home consoles reached with the N64, and this time there is no whole other market to fall back on for 2D gaming, so 2D gaming could quite easily get lost in a world where both consoles and handhelds play 3D games - because on a console where 3D is the norm, 2D tends to get forgotten. But then there's the DS. When the GBA 2 comes out - and that, naturally, is going to be essentially a PSP, except with better graphics, longer battery life, good games and That Nintendo Feeling(TM) - when the GBA 2 comes out, Nintendo really will have three pillars. There'll be Revolution, which by this time will have replaced Cube as the standard home console, and will provide gamers with their top-end gaming needs, with innovation naturally prominently in there somewhere, and online access to all the classic NES, SNES and N64 games that everybody loves, thus letting them live on forever. There'll be GBA 2, providing gamers with powerful gaming on the go, with wireless technology allowing for incredibly convenient impromptu multiplayer, and even free online play if you're near a wireless hotspot, although naturally serious online play is better suited to your Revolution at home - also free of course, at least for the first-party titles, and those are the ones that count the most. And then there'll be DS, which covers the games that GBA 2 and most likely Revolution won't handle quite as well - the slick FPS games, the unique touchscreen or voice command based games, and quite simply the 2D games. The console won't be forgotten, that'll be ensured by its unique capabilities, and because it won't be forgotten it'll still be able to churn out 2D gems as well as innovative titles - and of course 2D titles that make use of the unique features to boot. And I for one am glad, because DS means I'm going to see the likes of Mario and Luigi 2, an all-new side-scrolling Super Mario Bros. game (that guy who said Mario should have just stuck to 2D should be happy), a new (probably 2D) Zelda game, and so on. I'm a firm believer in the rumours that there's a new 2D Metroid title called Metroid Dread in the works for it as well, and that...well, that's just the icing on the cake. Sweet, sweet 2D games. We really would miss them if they went away. Thank DS for keeping them alive. You know you want to. And once you see that bigger picture, all the supposed problems with the DS start to make sense. The graphics aren't up to standard? Well, actually, they're absolutely PERFECT for handling 2D games, and they're pretty nice with things like Wario Ware or MP: Hunters as well. Just digital controls? I'm afraid the only thing analogue controls are really necessary for is 3D action games, and they aren't what this console's aiming for. We're not going to be seeing a lot of Super Mario 64 DS-style games - that was just to show off what the console's capable of and prepare for the 3D glory of Metroid Prime Hunters, which the control setup does wonders for. The 3D platformers and adventure games and all that sort of thing are all going to be showing up on the GBA 2 when that comes out - and there, they'll be at home. Apologies for the excessively long post responding to old topics in a thread that's just gone and been resurrected, but this is just the sort of thread that makes me feel the need to post, you know? And when I post...well, I post. |
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Personally I loath Nintendos games. The Mario Brothers have been crap ever since they were around in the arcade, and again IMHO that genre of games appeals only to freaks.
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They also want to breath life into the old game library for the simple reason that it is more revenue from old product. Not an evil thing, but a sensible business ploy. But also cynical. Quote:
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[quote=Carlos Net]But to become purely a third-party developer would be to restrict them, to put them at least partly under the control of Sony or Microsoft, and that's quite definitely not desirable. And with their focus on innovation in hardware as well as software, losing them in that respect would be a huge blow to the industry.[quote] Without the Japanese market they would not be a major player anymore. Quote:
Personally I hate M$... But the XBox has some bangin' software on it. The PS2 stuff is also awesome. Super Mario Kart... Well.. I haven't seen that ported to either yet!! Quote:
See what I mean about Nintendo selling the least they can to a market place? Quote:
[quote=Carlos Net]Well, if you're going to be picky, then graphics is the obvious place to start. The graphics are, no question about it, outdated compared to home consoles. Never mind that handhelds have historically been many, many years behind home consoles and no-one's complained yet - it is. The only reason, of course, that people are taking note of this is because of the PSP, which has graphics rivalling home consoles. (Well, I say 'rivalling home consoles' - what I mean is almost up to the standard of PS2, the least powerful of a generation of consoles that is swiftly drawing to a close. But let's not split hairs.) But really - if it wasn't for the PSP and its spiffy graphics showing up as well, nobody would complain about the DS' graphics, period.[quote] Well I don't know about anybody else.. But I would. The graphics suck. Quote:
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'Remember, measure life by the moments that take your breath away, not by how many breaths you take' Extreme Sports Cafe | ESC's blog | scratt's blog | @thescratt |
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Oh dear. You really do have exactly the opposite opinions to mine, don't you?
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Fact: Nintendo makes games other than the Mario Bros. series. I've never actually played what people would call the 'classic' Mario games; the closest thing I've got to that is Super Mario Advance 3, where you don't even control Mario, so now you're generalising based on games that I haven't even played. However, I do know a lot of people would take offence at your statement that only 'freaks' like the Mario Bros. games, since they're widely acknowledged as some of the best classic games out there. But yeah. Nintendo also makes Zelda, Starfox, Metroid, F-Zero, Pokemon, Pikmin and Kirby to name some of their most successful franchises that don't involve Mario at all. That's a huge range of game styles and gameplay, and you quite simply can't generalise across them; there's only one thing I can think that they have in common, and that's that they're all GOOD, in that there are huge numbers of people out there who find them enjoyable. I'm not saying that every single person in the world is going to find all of those franchises to their tastes, but there's no denying that they're all very good at what they do. If we expand our view to include Mario, then we can also include the Mario Sports titles (Mario Tennis, Mario Golf, the upcoming Mario soccer and baseball games), the Super Smash Bros. games (which include Mario alongside numerous other famous Nintendo faces), the Mario RPG series (Super Mario RPG on the SNES, and the Paper Mario/Mario and Luigi sagas), the Mario Party series (which has had too many releases for its own good, to be quite honest ), the Mario Kart series, and the Donkey Kong series (which started off as part of the Mario franchise but broke off from it). So unless you object purely to the appearance or character of the games (which, admittedly, can vary quite a bit anyway), it's difficult to see how you could even insult as group all MARIO games, seeing as how there are so many different types, all with very different gameplay. Oh, and if we're talking about variety of gameplay, we should probably take the above list and multiply by two, seeing as a large number of these games have seen both 2D and 3D releases, with distinctly different gameplay in some cases, and fairly different gameplay in most. Quote:
The point is, I'm not saying Nintendo isn't a business and doesn't look for profit. I'm saying that it makes profit by focusing on producing top-quality, enjoyable games. Quote:
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As for breathing life into the old game library, that's not cynical at ALL. That's what's called a strategy that means EVERYONE profits, consumers and manufacturer alike. The SOLE purpose of the downloadable past library is to make the Revolution console more attractive to consumers. It's an entirely free service (well, third parties can charge for downloading THEIR games from it, but all first-party games will be guaranteed free). If you think providing a free service like that with a console is cynical, then you think ANYTHING is cynical, thanks very much. They're trying to sell more consoles purely by adding to the experience it offers with a huge library of free content. That's not cynical. Quote:
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Good grief. The DS is fun and different. That's enough to secure its success. And it's not outrageously priced so it's toy and not an investment. Who knew talking about Nintendo would espouse such reactions?
I think that the sales numbers of the DS belie the notion that it will fail. I, for one, am glad Nintendo's doing something different than making the consoles portable. If it's not red and showing substantial musculature, you're wearing it wrong. |
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Philadelphia, PA
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Yeah get back to cleaning women
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Grand Theft Auto Snake Eater Shall I go on... Quote:
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Hey.. Nothing personal.. Just expressing my opinions also, and clarifying a few points.. I hope you enjoy your DS. Really. 'Remember, measure life by the moments that take your breath away, not by how many breaths you take' Extreme Sports Cafe | ESC's blog | scratt's blog | @thescratt |
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Nintendo games are just too cutesy for me.. Your lack of insight into games like GTA and SnakeEater and Halo shows that we definitely come from different gaming backgrounds... So I kind of understand why you don't understand why I don't like Nintendo games, and you don't rate the kind of games I like.. Quote:
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I am simply saying that for something that is not meant to be a games machine it stands up pretty well on features.. Stereo, TOUCH SENSITIVE SCREEN (Which you rattled on about), nice games etc. etc. Quote:
Personally I wouldn't have either. The PSP is definitely a yuppy toy. I think it will also be a failiure when put alongside the SNES or the PS2, for example. But both will sell large quantities.. They just won't become the same pillars of our culture as those too did perhaps. The DS is just past it's time and will become a white elephant.. It unfortunately has poor quality games on it too... Double Wammy! But, as I said before.. Enjoy. 'Remember, measure life by the moments that take your breath away, not by how many breaths you take' Extreme Sports Cafe | ESC's blog | scratt's blog | @thescratt |
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: Minnesota
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scratt, you're very annoying in this thread, displaying an uncharacteristically high level of console fanboy-ism (at least for AN... I've seen people at other forums that would put you to shame). The fact that all your arguments are based on your own highly subjective opinions about what you enjoy and so forth hurts your credibility.
I feel like locking this thread, but doing so would require me to read all the recent posts... and that would take too long. I don't think you guys are quite angry enough to justify a lock yet but please try to keep it in line. I'll just say that in my own observation, it's starting to get annoying and shrill. You're also bordering on making personal attacks... Quote:
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Hi Luca,
Long time since you've come in on one of my conversations.. I have to be perfectly honest here and say that I am expressing my views, yes. But I really do not see where the portion of my post that you quoted could be seen as being in any way out of order. If you read the thread in it's entirety, which you admit you haven't you will see that I am sure.. I am guessing you have misunderstood my meaning somewhere?!?! Reading it again, perhaps the insight comment. All I meant by that was that Carlos Net had not played them much, by his own admission, so could not be expected to be able to comment on them in detail, whereas I have played Nintendo games quite a lot, and feel I can comment on them. I will take your comments on board but would point out, respectfully, that it was I that was told to "Shut up". As for the rest of the discussion between myself and Carlos Net, I think we have been forceful with our views, but respectful of each other and don't need (again respectfully) a 'parent' to ajudicate yet. If Carlos Net see's it any differently I am happy to hear his views.. scratt 'Remember, measure life by the moments that take your breath away, not by how many breaths you take' Extreme Sports Cafe | ESC's blog | scratt's blog | @thescratt |
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ಠ_ರೃ
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Minnesota
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Yeah, I understand. I just noticed that the thread could be heading in that direction so I thought I'd give you a warning. You two aren't exactly at each other's throats. Yet.
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Member
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As for your mention of personal attacks, I think this quote, which I mentioned earlier on, is all you need:
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Now, looking at your responses, scratt: Quote:
Nevertheless, your comment that Nintendo games are just 'too cutesy' irks me, mainly because it's again something of a shallow analysis, based purely on the overall style, and even possibly purely on the graphics of the game, with no respect to gameplay. With your apparent 'experience', I can only be confident that you have at least played a large proportion of the games in question and not liked the gameplay either, or I would hope you would not make such judgements. I understand that the style and overall atmosphere of a game can be important to whether or not you like it - it certainly influenced my own opinion of the GTA series quite a bit - but it should never be the be-all and end-all, which it why it irks me that you have mentioned it as your only reasoning. It seems to imply that that's your main reason for passing judgement on a whole ton of games that are all very different in gameplay (as I mentioned, even within the Mario franchise, there are a multitude of different games), and perhaps that you didn't give those games enough of a chance - that you predisposed yourself against them. I would be a little upset if that were the case, that is all. Also, it's something of an inaccurate generalisation. Whilst the majority of Nintendo's games are light-hearted and cartoony, there's still variation. There are games that follow that to a greater or lesser degree - The Kirby games, at one end of the scale, are the most cartoony imaginable, and the central Mario games generally have little in the way of plot, and have a cartoony atmosphere; then there are games like the Pokemon series, which are more of a purely gaming experience (although the cartoons have created a distinctly childish image around them). Then, we have the likes of the Mario RPG games, which are set in the Mario universe but have more personality and storyline to them. The Mario RPG games represent some of the best things about the Mario universe to me, because they effectively take the Mario world's quirky nature and exaggerate it, inserting humour and often making it parody itself, in a way that absolutely suits the world itself. Then we have the Starfox games, which clearly aren't realistic, with their animal characters, but have much more of a fairly light-hearted sci-fi than a cartoony feel to them. And then there are games like Metroid and F-Zero, that quite simply don't fit your stereotype of 'cutesy' at all. Quote:
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Less than Stellar Member
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Mario 64 DS rocks. I've played it for hours already. I know it's an "older" game but the touch screen adds new life to it. I can see the touch screen pushing the envelope more and more as developers adopt it.
/trying to get slightly more on topic If it's not red and showing substantial musculature, you're wearing it wrong. |
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Veteran Member
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I think Carlos Net and I have explored our little side topic enough now.
I think you hit the nail on the head Carlos Net, with your break down of the graphics. I just cannot take the games seriously because of the graphical style. I have no problem running around being a punked pimp (or whatever!?!) when I am in the mood for that. Actually I like hiding out in GTA and sniping people until the feds and the army turn up! Hilarious. But generally a game I play with mates when we have too many beers etc.. When I race a racing car I want to feel like I am racing a racing car in a game. Super Mario Kart does not cut it.. But Gran Turismo does. When I feel like being a military expert hiding in the jungle trying to sneak into enemy compounds Snake Eater does it. I don't know of anything on the Nintendo platform that will allow me to do that. I guess I am more into simulation that platform game. Or perhaps more accurately I want something which has the whole spectrum.. Take a look at God of War on the PS2, and tell me if there is anything in the Nintendo universe which does that? So back on topic.. From that point of view I think the PS2 and the PSP have a much better market bandwidth. They have games right from Crash Bandicoot (More of a Nintendo style game) through to God of War, to GTA, to Grand Turismo... I get really irked with everything having to me a Mario xxxxx game. From that point of view I think the DS has a limited market appeal and will only sell to the faithful. The PSP will be a flop because not enough people will spill the dosh on it, as those who might already have a PS2 and probably cannot justify the outlay. So IMHO both will fail in terms of the billions of units Sony and Nintendo would like to sell. Of course they'll sell millions in the homeland (Japan).. Every game sells upwards of a million units there.. But to answer the threads original question I think the DS will be a relative failiure if you judge that in terms of market penetration and sale. 'Remember, measure life by the moments that take your breath away, not by how many breaths you take' Extreme Sports Cafe | ESC's blog | scratt's blog | @thescratt |
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Yarp
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Road Warrior
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Mario 64 is one of the best games of all time! I specifically went out of my way to get a copy of it for my Nintendo 64 recently because it's a totally radical game. I never get tired of it. The DS version is a little strange... but it's ultimately just as much fun. |
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