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Student extraordinaire
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Canberra, Australia
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2004-05-19, 00:57
If someone had chosen not to "go off the deep end," there would not be a need for 159 posters to join the new forum.
Yes that is over simplifying it, but so is this "pro-community" move has nothing to do with "community" and everything to do with Brad, et al wanting more "power". Barto The sky was deep black; Jesus still loved me. I started down the alley, wailing in a ragged bass. |
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Disturb the universe
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Chicago
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2004-05-19, 01:12
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I said it because it had been explained very clearly several times by several different members, and he didn't pick up on it. Nothing malicious. I don't understand what is making people overreact about this so much. Get a hobby, get a life, get over it, get something! Geez...the revolution was so last week!  Lets have a show of hands of who is over it... <everyone's hand goes up> Join the club. Quit complaining about power grubbing and crap like that and go back to .com if you're that upset with us. Truth be told, I don't want to see you leave, I don't want to see anyone leave, I enjoy your input to the forums. But the fact that people are still going on and on about this is ridiculous. We've got a lot of people who are perfectly fine with the whole thing, and a few drama queens. Come waste your time with me Adapt, Improvise, Overcome |
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Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Paris, FR
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2004-05-19, 04:44
I have to say that while I agree with Groverat and some others that updates to the Look&Feel and whatnot are in order, it seems a bit much to go out and do this. I just hope it has the desired effect of shaking things up at AI.com and things will go back to "normal".
The community and the mods and admins of AI are the best, bar none. Not everyone is easy to get along with and I hope Kasper et al all resolve issues, kiss, and make up... I'm having deja-vu and amnesia at the same time. I think I've forgotten this before. |
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Member
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-19, 05:54
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Member
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-19, 07:03
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btw, why is the LOLsmily omitted? ... in these humble times, where is a lot to laugh out loud about, hm? |
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I shot the sherrif.
 Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-19, 08:23
actually, it's more of a problem with us not knowing how to add that smily in.
give it a week or so, there's still a lot of tweaking going on.  |
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Member
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-19, 17:43
I'm afraid I agree with Groverat--this is pretty stupid, overall. I've read all the threads about it, read the .pdfs and in the end it simply looks like a ridiculous explosion followed by bad behavior.
If I ran a site and I discovered a secret forum where moderators were plotting to create a clone of my site's forums and take as many people with them as they could, I'd be pretty pissed. Kasper may be a jerk in some people's eyes, but so far as I can tell he's not the one whose behavior I find questionable. |
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Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Los Angeles
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2004-05-19, 20:49
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It seems to me that Kasper forced the move by deleting accounts, threads, etc. He could've attempted a dialogue and stopped the split, but from what I've read and heard, he doesn't seem to have that ability. That's too bad. We like it here. It feels new, refreshing. Kasper would probably say to the people who complain about the changes at .com "Don't like it, leave." I think the same thing kinda applies here, but a lot of us are also saying "Help us make .org a great community in the ways that we were not allowed at .com". The move has been made people. There's no use crying about it now. |
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Damned
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Purgatory
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2004-05-19, 21:05
JesusFuckingGod. OK...everyone listen, and listen closely....
THE TRC WAS NOT A FUCKING 'SECRET' FORUM!!! IT WAS UNDER *EVERYONE'S* NOSES AND IT WOULD HAVE TAKEN ONE CLICK TO FIND IT!!! ONE!!! NOBODY WAS HIDING!!! NOBODY WAS LAUGHING AT YOU BEHIND YOUR BACK!!! THE FORUM WAS AS 'FREE" AS IT COULD BE!!! GET OVER YOUR PMS AND PULL YOUR SKIVVIES BACK TO THE UPRIGHT POSITION!!! Christ. I'm tired of this. People seem to be looking for a reason to dissent. The TRC is not that reason. Get over not finding it.  |
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Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-19, 21:43
That thread in TRC was a small focus group to see if anyone agreed with with the faction of the Mods at .com that were unhappy with things at the old place. If everyone had said they were being pussies and should shut the hell up we wouldn't be here posting right now. The thread would have quickly died and Brad and LoCash probably would've had continued to work under the constraints at .com.
The Mods and Admins worked very hard over there, and clearly they are willing to put in an effort here as well. This place offers more room to grow as a site and as a community. Things were stale at .com and with Kasper's attitude it would have never changed. And even the people that disagree with this place even existing it'll work out better for those staying exclusively at .com. Since Kasper found the thread he has been more active over there, even posting in banal AO threads. He is asking for suggestions, contemplating a move to VB3. This wouldn't have happened if that thread hadn't existed. For me, there are two big differences between the two sites, firstly this place is more fun, the attitude is cheerier (more cheery??) Secondly, you are actually allowed to mention the split without being censored or banned here. As Kasper said, they'll be no speculating on that rumor site. |
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Damned
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Purgatory
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2004-05-19, 21:50
Kasper = Damage Control
Give it a month and .com will be...Kasper who?? |
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New Member
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-19, 21:59
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Seems to me that's exactly what he did. He said several times that he was on AIM all the time and where he could be emailed. He said [paraphase] Don't change anything without taking to me first[/paraphase] But that wasn't good enough for some. |
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Member
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-19, 22:48
"Seems to me that's exactly what he did."
Everything *I've* seen so far supports that he was available to talk. I'd like to see something that indicates otherwise. "THE TRC WAS NOT A FUCKING 'SECRET' FORUM!!! (etc)" It was not in the standard forum lists, it had to be found. Thus it is secret--an easy to find secret, but I doubt a discussion of leaving AI would have happened in General Discussion. There's a reason for that. "We like it here. It feels new, refreshing." How nice for everyone. It's unfortunate there isn't one community that is growing, and this unncessary fracture has occured. "Since Kasper found the thread he has been more active over there, even posting in banal AO threads. He is asking for suggestions, contemplating a move to VB3. This wouldn't have happened if that thread hadn't existed." The fact that this has happened is even *more* evidence that Kasper can be reasoned with, and another mark against the folks who claim he simply can't be spoken to. |
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Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-19, 23:10
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Ack. Whatever. |
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Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Los Angeles
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2004-05-19, 23:10
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He could have joined the conversation in the forums or PM'd Admins and Mods privately, but he took the opportunity to wash his hands of the ones who "are forever bitching" and fracture the community. What's done is done. I like it over here. |
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BANNED
I am worthless beyond hope. Join Date: May 2004
Location: Galt's Gulch
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2004-05-19, 23:25
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Stranger still that every action you mention is what the people who created these boards have been begging to have occur for months on end. What's next, attributing the change in heart to give to the needy to have nothing to do with the gun being held to the temple of the man with the wallet? This board was absolutely necessary. If it weren't the number of sign ups would be next to zero. The reality is that this board is running better in a week than .com has run in years. The saddest part of it all is that every iota of work done here was offered up to Kasper, for FREE. The server, the bandwidth, the formating, the work, all offered up for FREE repeatedly by the people you accuse of throwing a tantrum. The reality is Kasper didn't care if the forums rotted on the vine. If he did, all he had to do is turn lose the MODS, of his own forums to do all this work you see here. I read the front page of Appleinsider.com. I also enjoy the forums. But the reality is that as a rumor site, and not a general news site, the front page updates only once a week at best. That means might come for the front page, but stay for the forums. Kasper might have begun realizing that now. I wish him no ill will, but he needs to realize that it is his customers that define his product. His rumors are no better than others and it is the community that has formed there that is of value. Nick |
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Member
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-19, 23:37
"He could have joined the conversation in the forums or PM'd Admins and Mods privately, but he took the opportunity to wash his hands of the ones who "are forever bitching" and fracture the community."
Why is it that in all the archived threads he keeps posting his contact info and asking people to contact him? I'm sincerely asking--could someone clear this up for me? "Strange that you attribute all the changes on Kasper's part as not being any sort of reaction to what is going on over here." I actually didn't say that--I said that the fact that he is capable of change and of posting in the forums makes me further wonder if extreme measures were so necessary. It's clear that the shakeup is the reason for his new activity; the question is whether it was a necessary step, or something done by people who were hungry for power of their own. |
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Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Los Angeles
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2004-05-19, 23:43
mrmister, all of your recent posts have a tone to them that tells me that you side with .com and Kasper.
If that's the case why do you continue to complain about something that is already done and undoable? If that's not the case, why can't you be happy for this new beginning and .com still existing? I don't get it.  |
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feeling my oats
Join Date: May 2004
Location: there are nice people here...that makes me happy
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2004-05-19, 23:46
hungry for power of their own?? maybe, who cares...
kasper wants his board, his site...i guess that makes him hungry for power the people who MADE AI after it went down, with their time, their effort, their knowledge...maybe they decided to want their board, their site no biggie i still like both sites...i have even posted a couple of times to .com since the split... g crazy is not a rare human condition everything is food if you chew hard enough |
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Member
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-19, 23:50
"all of your recent posts have a tone to them that tells me that you side with .com and Kasper."
Well, so far Kasper appears to be less boneheaded and treasonous, but he doesn't come out smelling like a rose, either. "If that's the case why do you continue to complain about something that is already done and undoable?" I actually just *started* complaining, about a gigantic splintering of a community I really enjoy that happened less than a week ago. I complain because the events leading up to the schism reek of petulance and pettiness, and it makes me wonder. Since I like the site (and now, sites) I ask questions. "If that's not the case, why can't you be happy for this new beginning and .com still existing?" Why do I need to be happy? I'd be happier with one larger site. I'd be happier if the mods who led this had done it correctly and negotiated the release of the database, so there would only be one site. I'd be happier if they hadn't been so dense that they discussed it on AI itself, leading to its inevitably discovery. But yes, I obviously like both sites--they are pretty much identical, after all. |
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Member
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-19, 23:53
"the people who MADE AI after it went down, with their time, their effort, their knowledge...maybe they decided to want their board, their site"
That's fine and great--so why does the new board and the new site look almost exactly like the old one, with the same name, almost same URL, etc.? |
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Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Portland, OR
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2004-05-19, 23:54
It shouldn't be about people siding with .com or .org, but with people settling in where they feel comfortable after this unfortunate (but justified) split. AI.com 4-6 months ago was a very wonderful place. I feel at home on these new forums, it is a shame I have to.
I pulled the glass out of my eyes, bought the ticket, took the ride, and I thought it was shit. |
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feeling my oats
Join Date: May 2004
Location: there are nice people here...that makes me happy
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2004-05-19, 23:58
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but why would the new board and site look like the old one?? because brad and locash and alcimedes made the old one...kasper came in 2 years later and started the front page...the forums were almost entirely brads doing...all the images, all the little touches...so, of course the new site would look similar, just like painters paintings look similar g crazy is not a rare human condition everything is food if you chew hard enough |
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is not a kind of basket
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-19, 23:58
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And I still think they look compleatly different. no sig, how's that for being a rebel! |
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Member
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-20, 00:03
"but why would the new board and site look like the old one?? because brad and locash and alcimedes made the old one...kasper came in 2 years later and started the front page..."
BUT, as we all know, Kasper owns/administrates AppleInsider.com--so all these people knew they were signing over their designs to the site. I'm sympathetic to their loss of autonomy--it's their ham-fisted way of "breaking free" that I find distasteful, and part of that distaste is that they didn't even find a new name/URL to use. |
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Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Los Angeles
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2004-05-20, 00:19
OK, last post for you on this subject since you seem to be quite obstinant and don't really get it:
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If Kasper had handled it better, at worst, there would've been a heated discussion and the split would've happened anyway. Quote:
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What will it hurt with us over here and .com over there - each evolving. I don't get why you can't understand that both can exist and evolve seperately and be better overall than one single site. It's baffling h o w y o u j u s t d o n ' t g e t i t ! It makes me laugh really. Quote:
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Member
Join Date: May 2004
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2004-05-20, 00:31
"You don't think that's just a bit heavy handed? Almost nazi-ish? C'mon, he overreacted."
This arguement would hold more water if the mods weren't admittedly sneaking around, planning to take the name of the site, the .org address and recreate the forums there. "If Kasper had handled it better, at worst, there would've been a heated discussion and the split would've happened anyway." if the mods had been forthright instead of decietful they could have created a new site without all this skullduggery and subterfuge, and it wouldn't be so fucking weird and suspicious. "when I'm starting to type this and on your 3rd you're already getting that tone that the .org people are to blame. That's a trend, not just starting." My position has a tendency to solidify when I face a lot of opposition. "Oh, so everything's ok? I hope so, I really do." Oh yes--I mean, I'll certainly live. I'll have to choose which AppleInsider to read, which will take some time to settle out. The big losers here are LoCash, Brad and kasper, all of whom look like schmucks, babies and (w/r/t kasper) nazis. People can say, "what's done is done" all they wish, but it can be important to publically note when you see something that looks a bit fucked. |
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Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Los Angeles
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2004-05-20, 00:47
OK, well, listen man, I just think that you're giving Kasper way too much credit and, to state it again, it wasn't really sneaking around since the thread was easily found (ever click the "View new threads" button?)
And sure it's fucked, but please get beyond it. In time things will heal and who knows what will happen. Try posting any topic mentioning .org over there and you'll see who's still holding the grudge. |
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Rest In Peace
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Atlanta
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2004-05-20, 00:59
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I think we're all winners, like others said. Kasper is finally posting, seems to be listening to his members. Me, I got control of the forums and that healthy part of the membership that thinks it's a better place. We're not criminals, revolutionaries, Gods, or saviours. We're a few guys that thought we could make something better, and we did. I'm not interested in continuing to have circular conversations with people that have already made up their minds. You can hate me, like me, or not care, but don't come trolling that around the boards. Just remember that on appleinsider.org, you CAN talk about this publicly. You can't accomplish that at appleinsider.com... It is with great regret that we say our farewells to Jack, who passed away on May 28th, 2005. Jack, you will be missed by all Superior thinking has always overwhelmed superior force. - Marine Corps Officers "You don't lead by hitting people over the head-that's assault, not leadership." - General Eisenhower |
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Student extraordinaire
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Canberra, Australia
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2004-05-20, 01:09
Yes, I'd like one big happy family too. Guess what, sometimes things don't work out for the best. Move on and quit trolling (while you're ahead).
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