[dhiraj19]

I think the following has a pretty decent shot at becoming reality as people are getting comfortable with typing without physical keys with iPhone and on screen with multitouch technology. Screen is becoming more robust and better day by day.

Definitely, if this is possibility then it may happen in 2H08 or 1H09 and start with Apple laptops.

Reptitively and singing with chorus, I think iPhone is not new phone or music player or internet player or even device with 3 identities.

iPhone is keyless keyboard device with QWERTY interface. If a person can think some years in future, following may happen starting Apple laptops:

If QWERTY keyless keyboard is successful in iPhone. People adapt to change, which is possible and it is still QWERTY but without physical keys. Naturally, people will start to anticipate that there will be another Halo effect for apple laptops purchase, which is not complete picture.Apple brings out its laptops with dual screen with physical keyless keyboard which comes up in similar fashion as iPhone. iPhone is a test vehicle for new interface wave. (Think mouse, gui earlier
Also, Laptop's future was kept in full perspective during iPhone development. Leopard makes it stronger. OS X was used in iPhone. I'll doubt if this change is an afterthought.

Its another

ONE MORE THING

from Steve Jobs in MacWorld.

We are looking at another paradigm shift in laptops and people's interface to technology devices.

Here apple brings another change in computing market and challenges PC market so fast that PC vendors are left not to play catchup but have serious trouble in adjusting to this paradigm shift.

How to make PC competitors sweat. There will be some PC manufacturers who'll adapt, new players will flourish, older or existing will perish as always.



In Continuance to my first post after reading all comments

(last post read -> Eugene (17.22 hrs))

I highly appreciate everyone’s comments for my post. I fully respect everyone’s thoughts and arguments (for & against).
My focus of this post wasn't a technical assessment or discuss concept novelty but plain simple force with which Apple can bring or may bring this shift to market.

I agree here with the technical assessment made. I never doubt technical difficulties in bringing something like this. Its such like implementations which makes techies genius and architects of wonderful things adopted by masses.

Please ponder over the following and then see if the above mentioned scenario is possible.

1. Are you hesitant to type the way I have said?
2. Is it uncomfortable to think about such typing?
3. Did you get typing on iPhone right in first instance or did it take time for adaptability? How about iPod’s click wheel?
4. Having a tablet PC with physical keyboard can only be differentiated if there is no need of keyboard and stylus with it? Also, does it remain tablet PC after that?
5. If its just mental block, it may take time getting accustomed on mass scale. That’s why it is on iPhone first.


If its hesitance, uncomfortableness about QWERTY without physical keys, it'll go away. I think present 13" laptop is sufficient to make that change, no need of new smaller/larger form factor. One screen tablet PC makes you loose half screen with QWERTY present. Therefore, dual screen.

No company other than Apple is slick and audacious enough to bring this to masses by enticing them to ride a new paradigm shift. Many advanced technologies and novel ideas start from start-ups but they don't convince masses due to lack of the reach. So, Its Apple!!!!!

If you are polling, before submitting the poll think if Apple will bring it to market or not?

(After 6 months I would like to know how many of you still look on iPhone QWERTY to type. Also, for typing how many look down at the keyboard. Its a perception that when you press a key u see something on screen. If you touch you may see associated character on screen, is a possibility and not an impossible scenario. Changing lights or colors on type screen while typing. Going from blue to red (etc). I am diverting here from the main point, so back to the post.)

Comments,
- Dhiraj

[Koodari]

Would be OK for a 11" Macbook Mini or similar that is not meant for long periods of use at a time.
But there is no way that touchtypers will give up their keyboards with physical response.

[kieran]

I don't see this happening anytime in the near future. People are comfortable with the keyboards for their computers right now and that is a big complaint about the iPhone right now. There is no tactile feedback and people like that, me included. I would deal with the iPhone keyboard because it is a phone and there isn't enough room for the keyboard as I would like, so an on-screen keyboard was the best option.

I don't see this happening anytime in the near future.

[Apple Rocks The Socks]

Seems like and awesome idea! But id rather stick with physical keys but you never know how apple would do it so maybe I would like it better... Maybe the screen would have felling.. Like the images displayed on it would have a texture so you could feel the keys there but the screen could change into whatever the application asks for. That’s how I think Apple would do it.

[sirnick4]

The only problem I have with this is that there is no way to get your fingers in a set position without looking down at the keys.

Having a keyboard with no keys would force people to look down while typing (for awhile, at least). It would be like beginning keyboard class all over again.

This could work if there was a small onscreen keyboard as well that showed where your fingers are.

[Banana]

Well, while I do have to agree about tactile feedback problem, would anyone think differently if there were small indentations on the home row keys to help you know where it is without looking down?

I think it'd help a bit, but the problem is if it's otherwise flat, it'll be hard to figure out "far" your finger need to travel to adjacent rows, and whether it will land on the correct key, as it is not necessarily lined up vertically.

See see.

[sirnick4]

Or how does typing work exactly? Does it happen when your finger just lightly touches the keyboard? If so, having the indentations wouldn't really matter because as soon as you put your fingers on the home row it would type those letters.

Would they require a stronger press of the keys?

[bassplayinMacFiend]

What if a keypress wasn't registered until you lifted your fingers from the key? That's what happens with the iPhone now.

An iPhone-style display keyboard would certainly make switching between different keyboard layouts or languages a breeze.

[edit]
Wonder if some type of USB/BlueTooth glove could provide the tactile feedback touch typers demand? Would be a step closer to the dataglove / neural interface described in Gibson's Neuromancer.

[zippy]

I just don't see how this could really work well when you're talking about full fledged, two handed typing. It's one thing to do this with one or two fingers ala the iPhone and hunt/peck style typing since you wouldn't rest your finger(s) on the key pad at any time while typing. But with proper keyboards, and proper typing skills, you always have your fingers resting on the "home" keys. Either these are going to get accidentally typed all the time, our you'll have to implement some kind of pressure settings that would end up being incredibly annoying too.

I'd chalk this idea up to a solution in search of a problem with regards to full sized computing.

[Wyatt]

Originally Posted by zippy I'd chalk this idea up to a solution in search of a problem with regards to full sized computing.

I couldn't agree more. Still, I voted "may happen" -- but not because I think Apple will do this. I think somebody else certainly will try this at some point, even if it's just a reference design from somebody like Intel at first. I'm not in love with the idea, personally, because I touch type and I rely 100% on tactile feedback (particularly being able to feel the edges of keys as I move my fingers) to type effectively and quickly.

I think if there was a "touchscreen" keyboard, I'd have to go back to hunt-and-peck, and that's not an advancement.

For a device where keyboard real estate might be taking away from something else (like on a phone or PDA), I'm all for a software keyboard. Any other time, though, I'd rather just have a good old fashioned physical keyboard.

[Capella]

Another problem with this is that some people who use laptops/computers are visually impaired. My mother is legally blind and can see the screen in front of her, but she's incapable of seeing the keys unless she looks at them and not the screen, and even then it's difficult for her to see the letters. She types entirely by feel of the keys and memorizing which ones are where. Without that kind of tactile feedback, she'd be unable to type.

[BuonRotto]

The only reason I really think it may happen is because Apple always seems to add some hardware feature that drives some people (usually those with unusual usage habits, or just old school folks) absolutely bat-crazy. A keyboard without tactile response would be one such feature.

On the other hand, if you're going to go full-on multitouch, why not just make a true tablet with on-screen contextual keyboard with one big honking screen?

[kieran]

As quoted from one of my favorite movies, "Office Space"

Originally Posted by Samir Nagheenanajar “That’s the worst idea I’ve ever heard. Forget this idea it is terrible, terrible.”

[torifile]

I don't see tactility as a problem because force feedback is an easy way to deal with that (I see the iPhone doing that in the near future). As others have said, though, people expect a real keyboard when they're doing "real" work. As a replacement tech, I just don't see it happening but as a "companion" type device it's certainly possible. That said, I don't see Apple doing it.

[kscherer]

This is something that I could not see happening on a true laptop, but I could see it happening on a Tablet thingy, very much designed like an iPhone, but with a 13" screen.

They'd Sell trillions of them.

Could happen.

[Kraetos]

This would be a great idea if there were a way to have tactile feedback. I can think of a couple.

Otherwise, it would just slow you down.

[kscherer]

Originally Posted by Kraetos This would be a great idea if there were a way to have tactile feedback. I can think of a couple. Otherwise, it would just slow you down.

I think we'd get used to it. The iPhone has no tactile feedback, and I love the virtual keypad. I could easily get used to a larger version, so long as they maintain the smart typing thing.

[homeboy87]

FOR-GET IT!

I including many computer geeks type with our fingers and not our eyes. To type on touch screen requires that you are looking at the screen which a normal tactile keyboard doesn't. The physical feeling of knowing where your finger are and what keys you are touching enables you to type very fast without looking down.

Physical keyboard for me thank you.


On screen keyboards are only used to decrease the size of a device by not having a physical keyboard on it, like phones, mp3 players and similar. Exchanging a keyboard on a laptop for a screen will barely bring any benefits as far as typing goes. It would only increase battery consumption and decrease productivity.

[torifile]

Originally Posted by homeboy87 FOR-GET IT! I including many computer geeks type with our fingers and not our eyes. To type on touch screen requires that you are looking at the screen which a normal tactile keyboard doesn't. The physical feeling of knowing where your finger are and what keys you are touching enables you to type very fast without looking down. Physical keyboard for me thank you.

Have you ever used a virtual keyboard for an extended period of time? I'm getting pretty good on my iPhone's keyboard and I can see a time when I'm good enough at it (and the auto-correct has been tweaked by use) that I wouldn't need to look down.

Also, when the keyboard and the screen are on the same "plane" as they are with the iPhone or a single screen device, looking "down" and looking at what you're typing are pretty much the same thing.

[Kraetos]

Originally Posted by kscherer I think we'd get used to it. The iPhone has no tactile feedback, and I love the virtual keypad. I could easily get used to a larger version, so long as they maintain the smart typing thing.

The iPhone keypad is great. But remember: you're looking right at it when you type. With a keyboard, you (if you're an experienced typer, anyway) aren't.

Don't get me wrong: a keyboard that can change the size or function of their keys based on the user or the application would be great. But there would have to be something to orient your hands so you don't have look at the keyboard.

A small bump on the J and F keys (like any keyboard) would help. Also, perhaps a very slight vibration to mimic the press of a button would work. Another idea is that the screen is just a thin OLED membrane, underneath which is hundreds of small squares, maybe the a 4th the size of a normal key, with less than 2mm of travel distance. "Keys" map to encompass a certain number of squares, for example, a standard key has four squares under the membrane. This allows the keyboard to be extremely flexible in the layout, but still provides tactile feedback. Right now, this technology would cost an arm and a leg, but anything is possible in the future.

I'm surprised nobody has brought up the Optimus Keyboard yet. It's halfway between a current keyboard and a touch keyboard in the respect that the keys can change. Of course, the Optimus costs $1,500.

[psmith2.0]

The more I think about it, I'm wondering if this rumored "subnotebook" thing is, instead, a larger, non-phone iPhone type of deal? Think about it...

For surfing, photos, music, chatting, Wi-Fi, Bluetooth, iTunes Store access/purchasing, calendar/to-do, widgets, voice notes, iSight built-in, etc. (basically everything an iPhone does/is, except the "phone" part.

But with more robust document creation (letting you create word processing files, Pages, Keynote, GarageBand, etc.). The way you see these apps now (GarageBand with the sliders, faders, knobs, etc.), except they'd all be manipulated, via Multi-Touch, directly onscreen? iTunes and iPhoto would work the way they do on iPhone, only more so (and on a larger scale).

Something between iPhone and a full-blown MacBook, with a 10" or so screen? Apple-only apps, interface and control (think iPhone), but the ability to create documents of different types, use iLife and iWork, print, video chat, etc. (think MacBook). A nice mixture of the two, taking the best features or approaches from each source (iPhone and Mac).

For those people not making a living with Adobe or Microsoft apps (I know more people who don't don't do that stuff than who do), who, instead can do everything they want with Apple's core, in-house stuff, they'd be set! You could hook your iPod to it, or your digital camera or camcorder. Or a USB thumb drive (make it have one USB and one FireWire port). And, of course, your iPhone (some people might have this and iPhone and that's it...that serves all their "computer-using needs").

Take iPhone. Scale it up 250%. Give it a smidge more muscle/horsepower. Allow iLife and iWork support. Stick an iSight on the front. Give it a flip-out "kickstand" in the back. Give it one USB, one FireWire. Multi-Touch. Widgets. Storage. File-browsing. Wi-Fi, Bluetooth, .Mac connectivity, Safari, Mail, iChat, iCal, Address Book, QuickTime and Preview. All controls on screen, as with iPhone. Virtual keyboard can pop up when needed, you can flick through CDs, photos, etc.

Holy crap, that would be neat!

[homeboy87]

Originally Posted by torifile Have you ever used a virtual keyboard for an extended period of time? I'm getting pretty good on my iPhone's keyboard and I can see a time when I'm good enough at it (and the auto-correct has been tweaked by use) that I wouldn't need to look down. Also, when the keyboard and the screen are on the same "plane" as they are with the iPhone or a single screen device, looking "down" and looking at what you're typing are pretty much the same thing.

Well on a laptop the keyboard and the screen isn't on the same plane. Replacing a proper keyboard on a laptop with a touch screen wouldn't be as efficient and would result in a lot of mistypes since we are used to resting our fingers on the keyboard.

Regardless of how good the on screen keyboard on the iPhone is, an on screen keyboard will never be as comfortable and productive to type on as a proper keyboard.

[Eugene]

Remember Apple's filing for a full-width touchpad? Just make the palmrest area a glass touchscreen/trackpad and keep the physical keyboard where it currently is. Having a tracking surface that large allows for 1:1 scaling for certain apps while also introducing positional flexibility. Instead of having to manipulate a pointer in the center of your laptop's base, you can now leave one of your hands in a more natural position at times.

but getting back at the original topic... Having no physical keyboard at all is retarded. The reason why the iPhone doesn't have a keyboard is due to size restraints.

[torifile]

Originally Posted by homeboy87 Well on a laptop the keyboard and the screen isn't on the same plane. Replacing a proper keyboard on a laptop with a touch screen wouldn't be as efficient and would result in a lot of mistypes since we are used to resting our fingers on the keyboard. Regardless of how good the on screen keyboard on the iPhone is, an on screen keyboard will never be as comfortable and productive to type on as a proper keyboard.

Yeah. I mentioned up-thread that I don't think a laptop will be keyboard-less. Some sort of slab would work best with this type of keyboard (or as well as anything would). The screen and keyboard would need to be on the same plane for this to have any hope of working (ever used a Wacom to do text recognition with Inkwell? It's not natural at all.)

[kscherer]

Originally Posted by pscates2.0 The more I think about it, I'm wondering if this rumored "subnotebook" thing is, instead, a larger, non-phone iPhone type of deal? Think about it... For surfing, photos, music, chatting, Wi-Fi, Bluetooth, iTunes Store access/purchasing, calendar/to-do, widgets, voice notes, iSight built-in, etc. (basically everything an iPhone does/is, except the "phone" part. But with more robust document creation (letting you create word processing files, Pages, Keynote, GarageBand, etc.). The way you see these apps now (GarageBand with the sliders, faders, knobs, etc.), except they'd all be manipulated, via Multi-Touch, directly onscreen? iTunes and iPhoto would work the way they do on iPhone, only more so (and on a larger scale). Something between iPhone and a full-blown MacBook, with a 10" or so screen? Apple-only apps, interface and control (think iPhone), but the ability to create documents of different types, use iLife and iWork, print, video chat, etc. (think MacBook). A nice mixture of the two, taking the best features or approaches from each source (iPhone and Mac). For those people not making a living with Adobe or Microsoft apps (I know more people who don't don't do that stuff than who do), who, instead can do everything they want with Apple's core, in-house stuff, they'd be set! You could hook your iPod to it, or your digital camera or camcorder. Or a USB thumb drive (make it have one USB and one FireWire port). And, of course, your iPhone (some people might have this and iPhone and that's it...that serves all their "computer-using needs"). Take iPhone. Scale it up 250%. Give it a smidge more muscle/horsepower. Allow iLife and iWork support. Stick an iSight on the front. Give it a flip-out "kickstand" in the back. Give it one USB, one FireWire. Multi-Touch. Widgets. Storage. File-browsing. Wi-Fi, Bluetooth, .Mac connectivity, Safari, Mail, iChat, iCal, Address Book, QuickTime and Preview. All controls on screen, as with iPhone. Virtual keyboard can pop up when needed, you can flick through CDs, photos, etc. Holy crap, that would be neat!

Exactly what I am thinking. And a virtual keyboard on that would save all kinds of space. Allow them to create a super-thin, little tablet that ran a smaller version of OS X and could handle all that day-to-day stuff.

Anyone who needs a whopper of a keyboard would have to plug one in.

And to add to that, for all of you who aren't interested in a virtual keyboard, this type of device would not likely be what you would want anyway. Like P2 said, it would be intended for the mobile consumer, rather than the mobile professional or geek-type users. Those folks would likely be steered toward the MacBook Pro.

When it comes down to it, a proper tablet has no room for a real keyboard. Hand recognition is still unreliable, so a smart, virtual keyboard is the best route to take.

And no, you cannot have a little bump for F and J, because the keyboard (due to its virtualness) needs location-independence so the thing can be drawn anywhere on the screen. And any other kind of "flex-bumping" or other feedback has got to be quite a way off.

[Electric Monk]

I tend to agree that a subnotebook 10" would work as long as it had that hapetic/vibration feedback.

However I think the patented multitouch mouse needs to come out first so applications adapt to gestures (I doubt an Apple apps only laptop would sell, quite frankly). Once they do that bringing out a subnotebook model with a screen for a keyboard is the way to go.

As for the home key feedback, I don't see any problem with a couple slight bumps in the keyboard screen. OLED would be flexible enough and two tiny bumps won't throw off the gestures any. Look at the current tiny sticking out pieces on Apple keyboards and run your fingers over your keyboard without pressing down—would those bumps bother you on a screen you're using for gestures? No problem for me.

Also I know I could handle hapetic feedback touch typing if I could orient on the home row without looking down.

[Eugene]

As I commented earlier, a second touchscreen wouldn't replace the keyboard, but the existing trackpad. Just increase its size to cover the entire palmrest and use the same touchscreen technology in the iPhone. Add a couple of APIs for creating custom interfaces. Apple should leave the main screen as a display only.

If you play video games like WoW, imagine being able to put extra visual keybinds down there. If you manipulate images, you'd be able to lasso stuff with your finger instead of your mouse or buying a bleeding edge Wacom tablet anyway... It'd be the ultimate screen space for mock analog controls or custom macros.

[joveblue]

Originally Posted by pscates2.0 The more I think about it, I'm wondering if this rumored "subnotebook" thing is, instead, a larger, non-phone iPhone type of deal? Think about it... <snip>

How would you type on it? You'd have to either hold it in one hand and hunt-n-peck with the other or put it down on your lap or something which would give you a sore neck pretty quickly.

[kscherer]

Originally Posted by Electric Monk As for the home key feedback, I don't see any problem with a couple slight bumps in the keyboard screen. OLED would be flexible enough and two tiny bumps won't throw off the gestures any. Look at the current tiny sticking out pieces on Apple keyboards and run your fingers over your keyboard without pressing down—would those bumps bother you on a screen you're using for gestures? No problem for me.

The problem with bumps isn't the bumps, but with the immediate inability to put the keyboard into any orientation or any size. You would have to have bumps scattered all over the place.

Originally Posted by Eugene As I commented earlier, a second touchscreen wouldn't replace the keyboard, but the existing trackpad. Just increase its size to cover the entire palmrest and use the same touchscreen technology in the iPhone. Add a couple of APIs for creating custom interfaces. Apple should leave the main screen as a display only. If you play video games like WoW, imagine being able to put extra visual keybinds down there. If you manipulate images, you'd be able to lasso stuff with your finger instead of your mouse or buying a bleeding edge Wacom tablet anyway... It'd be the ultimate screen space for mock analog controls or custom macros.

Yes, but how would you get your visual cues on the screen as to where your fingers are? The beauty of the iPhone is that, where the button is, there you press! If the visual is in front of you, but the interaction below you, and you are trying to interact with on-screen buttons, you would be constantly adjusting and guessing as to where to press or glide or slide your fingers. A Wacom tablet can sense its pen from several millimeters, which doesn't require the pen to be in constant contact with the surface. With Multitouch, this is not the case.

Originally Posted by joveblue How would you type on it? You'd have to either hold it in one hand and hunt-n-peck with the other or put it down on your lap or something which would give you a sore neck pretty quickly.

You would treat it like a standard laptop, as it would be close to that size.

[psmith2.0]

You put it on your lap, or a table or desk. Or lie on a couch or bed with it. You prop it up with your own legs (or blanket), or you pop out the little kickstand thingie I mentioned to give it some angle/propping up.

I don't know. Maybe it's not a good idea for long-haul typers/writers. But everything else you could do, it would just be like a larger iPhone (minus the phone part).