[BarracksSi]

It's only on my TV because I'm too lazy to change the channel, but the guy on the 700 Club on the Family Channel just now said that "Kwanzaa is a fraud."

Wny do I have this shit still on??

[Kickaha]

That's okay, Dec 25th is utterly the wrong date for Christmas in the first place. It was adopted because as the Feast of Saturn in Rome, the Christians could go under the radar for the festivities and not be detected. It also happened to be towards the end of Chanukah (pre-Gregorian calendar 12-day loss), so it made it even easier.

The shepherds were with the flock according to the Bible, when the angel appeared to let them know of Jesus' birth. The only time the shepherds would be staying with the flock 24/7 would be during birthing season - spring. Easter is probably a better rough date than Dec 25th, but what the heck.

What's the story behind the scheduling of Chanukah?

[drewprops]

It was after the World Series, before the better bowl games and after the Kathy Lee Gifford Extravaganza Singathon? Just a guess.

[709]

Originally Posted by BarracksSi "Kwanzaa is a fraud."

He obviously doesn't know anything about the Internet. That peer-to-peer shit is cool.

[BuonRotto]

709 = teh funny

Channukah's origins

All of this stuff is really based on the observance of the winter solstice around the same time. Gee, the days start to get longer after Christ's birthday/the defeat of hellenic corruption/etc.? What a coincidence! It's no wonder almost every culture has a holiday or celebration associated with this time of year, plus the equinox in spring and the fall harvest.

[Hassan i Sabbah]

Warning. Totally humourless, factual post following.

Maybe 'fraud' is the wrong word to use, but it is true that Kwanzaa was invented in the 1960s in the United States, which is the only place in the world where it is celebrated.

It's an African American thing, and hell, there's nothing wrong with inventing a festival, but oddly the name comes from Swaheli (I've just read) and no Swaheli-speaking peoples were taken to America. Its seven 'Guiding Principles' have names from what looks like Zulu to me, and no Zulu-speaking people were taken to North America at all (Swaheli is spoken by many African ethnicities but Zulu's spoken by Zulus, generally.)

It's certainly not big in Africa, where Christmas is the big December bash: why would a Xhosa or a Swazi-speaker celebrate a festival with Zulu names when they already have their own December festivals already, I suppose.

[Hassan i Sabbah]

Originally Posted by Kickaha That's okay, Dec 25th is utterly the wrong date for Christmas in the first place. It was adopted because as the Feast of Saturn in Rome, the Christians could go under the radar for the festivities and not be detected. It also happened to be towards the end of Chanukah (pre-Gregorian calendar 12-day loss), so it made it even easier. The shepherds were with the flock according to the Bible, when the angel appeared to let them know of Jesus' birth. The only time the shepherds would be staying with the flock 24/7 would be during birthing season - spring. Easter is probably a better rough date than Dec 25th, but what the heck.

I could be wrong about this but I read that 'Christmas day' was invented around 500 ad, in Britain or Gaul; it was a missionary thing. The Romans sort of hijacked all the solstice and spring bacchanals.

It seems more likely to me, however, that the same thing happened in northern Europe as happened in Brazil and Cuba, where all the 'pagan' types from Africa literally hid their icons of Chango and Obatala behind icons of the saints so they could practice their religions right under the noses of the slavemasters. I don't know if the Romans tried to prohibit paganism but I bet they did, and I bet that all the pagan-types just changed the lyrics a bit.

I have no proof of this at all.

[naren]

Most early Christian ceremonies and legends, not to mention theology was lifted wholesale from other Mediterranean religions. Early Christianity was closely intermingled with various Greek sects and secret societies which led to amalgamated forms such as Gnosticism.

[Moogs]

The fact that the 700 Club even exists anymore in this country is about as bad a social indictment as you can make. Talk about a farce. Pat Robertson is one of the biggest dipshits in history. Clueless to the Nth degree.

[Naderfan]

And now we hear that Jerry Falwell is trying to resurrect the Moral Majority.

[DMBand0026]

Originally Posted by Naderfan And now we hear that Jerry Falwell is trying to resurrect the Moral Majority.

Ah Jerry Fawell, don't get me started on that sorry excuse for a man.

[EmC]

I was doing a project for school and found this one particularly amusing.



I came across this as well. I found it interesting, but the information is biased, look at the source.

[BarracksSi]

Now, the Salem witch hunts weren't born from religion. The people making accusations were actually hallucinating from the food that they were growing, which was carrying a disease of some kind (I can't remember the specifics, but my bio- and chem-degree holding sister found out about the episode).

When they couldn't explain what they were seeing and doing, they figured it must have been witchcraft, and what's more anti-witch than Christian variants?

"Why do witches burn?"
"Because they're made of wood?"

[Kickaha]

*ahem*

Exodus 22:18 - Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live.

[BarracksSi]

Originally Posted by Kickaha *ahem* Exodus 22:18 - Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live.

Well, yeah, but they wouldn't have suspected witchcraft in the first place if they weren't inadvertently getting stoned out of their minds. :smokey:

[Kickaha]

Drugs are bad, m'kay?

The wacky experiences were possibly food-related, but the methodical murder by burning alive was alllllllll fear of God, based on that passage.

But y'know, Islam is violent.

[EmC]

Originally Posted by BarracksSi "Why do witches burn?" "Because they're made of wood?"

It. Aaaaugh!

Always love the MP reference.

[Dave]

Originally Posted by EmC I came across this as well. I found it interesting, but the information is biased, look at the source.

Wow, even accounting for the biassed source, that's some pretty incriminating stuff. I knew there was something about that guy that I didn't like.

[BarracksSi]

Pat himself isn't scary -- what's scary is that people are stupid enough to believe his shit.

Rotten.com has an editorial tone, but they keep their facts straight.

[BarracksSi]

Oh, while we're on a televangelist kick...

Who else here has seen the Pastor Bob Tilton farting video?

My uncle acquired a copy of a copy of a copy of a copy when it was still underground, and we laughed and laughed.

The guy had it coming.

http://www.rotten.com/library/bio/re...robert-tilton/

minute-long vid segment here, although minus the part where he farts while running across the stage:
http://www.farts.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ult...11;t=000013;p=

[FFL]

Originally Posted by BarracksSi Now, the Salem witch hunts weren't born from religion. The people making accusations were actually hallucinating from the food that they were growing, which was carrying a disease of some kind (I can't remember the specifics, but my bio- and chem-degree holding sister found out about the episode). When they couldn't explain what they were seeing and doing, they figured it must have been witchcraft, and what's more anti-witch than Christian variants? "Why do witches burn?" "Because they're made of wood?"

http://www.hbci.com/~wenonah/history/ergot.htm

Ergot fungus in grain.
LSD is derived from Ergot fungus.

Yep, dey was trippin' f'sure.

[BarracksSi]

Originally Posted by FFL http://www.hbci.com/~wenonah/history/ergot.htm Ergot fungus in grain. LSD is derived from Ergot fungus. Yep, dey was trippin' f'sure.

Awesome, good find.