MC: Cashout Cove Marketplace!

[709]

Sell and trade your extra loot here, one and all!

Since we can't gift cash-monies yet, let's start with trading.

I need coal blocks, and since they're so friggin dear to make I'll trade anyone that's using their coal for burning purposes 2 stacks of charcoal for 1 stack of coal. Double your burning pleasure!

Also, I've been enchanting books instead of tools proper, so I have some tool enchantments I'd be willing to sell off. Efficiency II I'll sell for 2 stacks of coal, Efficiency IV for 4 stacks. Also, I have a Sharpness II that I'll sell for 2 stacks (or make me an offer on this one).

I'll put the books outside my house in a chest in case anyone's interested, plus the 2 for 1 charcoal. Swap the trade coal back into the chest. Honor system, of course, because easy.

Thanks! I feel like this commerce thing will be fun. :)

[Brad]

Since we can't gift cash-monies yet, let's start with trading.
See the /pay command. ;)

[drewprops]

You mean the "mined" coal? I haz some. I'll happily trade you because I'm young and stupid and don't build much anyhow.


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[Brad]

Yeah, mined coal can be crafted onto coal blocks. Charcoal cooked from logs cannot.

As a result of this discovery, a few of us have been conserving all mined coal and using only charcoal for torches, cooking, etc.

[ThunderPoit]

So you want to use it just as a building material? Not as a super-efficient smelting fuel?

[709]

It's not really that efficient as a block. It only adds another 8 burning units as a block to the 72 units (9 coal) needed to make it. Plus, the downside to that is you have to babysit your furnace and keep it stocked, otherwise you lose those burning units (furnace holds 64 max).

[RowdyScot]

Hoppers can take away the need to babysit.

[709]

But you lose that sweet, sweet XP using hoppers. ;)

[Brad]

But you lose that sweet, sweet XP using hoppers. ;)

I might as well use hoppers and screw the XP. I have enough Fire Protection III books for a lifetime. :grumble:

[turtle]

I need to learn about these hoppers. Sound useful.

I'm open to buying/selling things in game.

[Brad]

So... we have an actual marketplace now for buying items back from the server. The prices aren't quite set in stone yet (I need to revise them after some sleep) and some key items are missing, but the basics are working.

The booths are themed to represent the items available there for purchase. To buy an item from the server, right-click the appropriate sign.

Some prices will be deliberately inflated. This is to encourage normal resource gathering in favor of sitting in front of a cobblestone generator and cashing out periodically. :p

http://i.imgur.com/kHIYvex.jpg

[drewprops]

Go to bed, Brad, you're a capitalist!! :lol:


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[Brad]

So... we have an actual marketplace now for buying items back from the server.
After some sleep, I think I may revise the pricing strategy. Renewable resources will have a relatively larger markup and non-renewable items will be priced more reasonably but take into account rarity, difficulty to obtain, etc. Some easy to find renewable resources won't even be available for sale. So, you'll be better off farming your own food, for example, but if you need some diamonds, the price should be reasonable enough to at least consider buying instead of disregarding and going straight to bedrock.

Decisions, decisions...

[709]

Unsellable items...

Mostly food stuffs, but a few other ones I've noticed as well:

• Raw Beef, Steak
• Raw Pork, Porkchops
• Raw Chicken, Cooked Chicken
• Carrot
• Potato, Baked Potato, Poisonous Potato
• Melon Slices, Melon
• Melon Seeds, Pumpkin Seeds
• Flint
• Spider Eye
• Ender Pearl
• Nether Brick (the cooked Netherrack)
• Glass Panes
• Wooden Stairs and Slabs
• Cobblestone Wall

Not that everything has to be sellable, but things like Flint and Wooden Stairs/Slabs should be in there if possible.

Melons might be a difficult one to price. If a full melon is the same as a pumpkin ($5) that would mean that slices should run around .50¢ (since it takes 9 to make a full melon), but since a slice can make one seed, and wheat seeds are $1 a piece, that would be off. Seeds seem like they're overpriced anyways imo... maybe .50¢ would be more in line?

Glass panes are another weird one. Maybe $1 since it takes $18 worth of glass to make 16 pieces?


Anything else out there that's not on the list?

[Bryson]

I'm not sure the food should be sellable, as it's a 100% renewable resource and the industrial farmers could soon amass more money than they could ever spend.

[709]

That's a good point, but we already have prices for wheat and wheat seeds. Bread too. Maybe we just put a kibosh on any food items?

I could see a freebie stand set up close to the Marketplace for extra seeds and whatnot. Just for people starting out and wanting to make their farms and all. I don't think seeds are sold at the market anyways.

[Brad]

FWIW, I just added a bunch of stuff to the sellable items list. I can't promise I got everything, but it should cover most of the common drops. If you still find things you expect to be able to sell, post here.

[Brad]

...or not? Seems the plugin we're using still refuses to sell some items that are configured to be sellable. Maybe it'll pick them up after the next server restart. We'll see.

[Brad]

Surprise! The /sell, /worth, /pay, /balance, and /repair commands should be back in working order now. :)

I've spent some time this evening completely rewriting the /sell price list. The prices now take into account (roughly) the rarity of the item if mined or the total value of the components if crafted. If you notice I've missed an item type that you think should be sellable, post it here. Also, after some hacking around in the raw source code for Bukkit and Essentials, I figured out the (apparently undocumented) way to properly list the items for sale that I couldn't get working previously (like stone steps, carrots, potatoes).

This of course means that I'll have to re-price all of the things currently listed in the marketplace, but that's OK because nobody can buy from the marketplace at the moment anyway. :p

[drewprops]

I didn't know they weren't working - was in-game and just sold a load of netherrack... didn't even appreciate the work that went into making it work again! (thanks)

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[billybobsky]

Thanks for your efforts Brad... i now have a way to eliminate the excess drops coming through the mob trap in a time/resource efficient manner. On that note: could you add glass bottles to the mix of items that can be sold to the server?

I see that Brad has managed to reduce the likelihood of any get rich quick schemes. just to be sure for everyone else, I will still build the ender farm for the purposes of xp generation after the ender dragon is killed.

[Brad]

Thanks for your efforts Brad... i now have a way to eliminate the excess drops coming through the mob trap in a time/resource efficient manner. On that note: could you add glass bottles to the mix of items that can be sold to the server?
Added!

I see that Brad has managed to reduce the likelihood of any get rich quick schemes. just to be sure for everyone else, I will still build the ender farm for the purposes of xp generation after the ender dragon is killed.
That's the idea, at least, though I know it's not much in the way of anyone who broke the bank and cashed out before the upgrade.

[kscherer]

AWESOME!!

Thanks, Brad

[turtle]

I haz stackz of shinny stuff! WooHoo!

:p

[709]

This isn't so much a Marketplace request, but I was wondering if it would be possible to buy unobtainables like monster spawners/eggs, upcoming barrier blocks, undead/skellie mobs, etc. If it's even something worth considering, I figured the /pay command would just give monies to an an op in return for whatever loot.

I'm not sure if you guys try/want to keep your "personal" balance separate from when you rarely go into creative mode, so that might be an issue. Not sure how to pay for whatever without just transferring cash to another player, but maybe it's not a big deal.

Anyways, could this happen? :)

[drewprops]

I'd love the ability to build a specific spawner in a set location.

If/when we next begin anew from a blank world it would be nice to be able to construct an XP grinder in a specific location instead of building around a found location.

First Minecraft World problem, I know.



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[709]

1.8 looks like it's an optional update for world gens. There's nothing new (so far) that can't be crafted with existing blocks. Sure, if we wanted to carve out another area outside of everyone, that's cool, but it's not necessary to get all the new goodies.

I'd be a *little* afraid of mass mob farming if the spawners were available, but maybe we throttle that by only allowing so many purchases of this sort of thing per user. Or something like that. Bobsky's farm should be enough for any baddie mob drops. Also, by keeping it in the Overlord's hands they can make a decision whether it's practical or not.

[billybobsky]

If we ever get back to defeating the enderdragon, I'd rebuild the xp farm there as well. So there's not much point in having individual xp farms...

If there are questions about the mob trap as such, feel free to ask. It seems like everyone is just assuming it is completely broken, which is hardly the case. It's just that teleporting anywhere near the thing will break the filters -- this is a known minecraft bug caused by the way the game saves redstone when it unloads the chunks.

The best solution is to turn those chunks into 'spawn' chunks using a Bukkit plugin (since Bukkit broke the in-game ability to spread spawn chunks), but the overlords haven't responded to that suggestion, which is why the trap remains closed.

[billybobsky]

If we ever get back to defeating the enderdragon, I'd rebuild the xp farm there as well. So there's not much point in having individual xp farms...

If there are questions about the mob trap as such, feel free to ask. It seems like everyone is just assuming it is completely broken, which is hardly the case. It's just that teleporting anywhere near the thing will break the filters -- this is a known minecraft bug caused by the way the game saves redstone when it unloads the chunks.

The best solution is to turn those chunks into 'spawn' chunks using a Bukkit plugin (since Bukkit broke the in-game ability to spread spawn chunks), but the overlords haven't responded to that suggestion, which is why the trap remains closed.
To be absolutely sure, the bug is also present in Bukkit:

https://bukkit.atlassian.net/browse/BUKKIT-3086

Anyway... I suspect defining the area around the mob trap as spawn chunk would fix the problem by allowing the redstone to settle after someone tps in/out, but a real fix would be nice. The problem is fairly complex as a generic redstone circuit will behave differently depending upon the order in which the components were placed (certainly true for very complex circuits, which we are NOT dealing with in the trap), which means saving how the components are engaged is fraught with difficulty. Any rational system to save the state would have to observe the active redstone until it repeats itself (there by giving a model of a state that could be input when the chunk reloads) or reaches some equilibrium state. Unfortunately, the first condition is the more general but it also allows players to usurp the unloading of chunks potentially allowing for large memory requirement expansion. The real issue is that the chunk unloading process is so quick when teleporting that block update registers are not always saved correctly (essentially, seemingly, never).

[709]

I stopped by there a few times this past month to grab bonemeal for Flowerland and sulphur for TNTing 13topia, and honestly, that place is backed up like a Taco Bell addict. The second I removed a stack it got filled almost instantly.

The lesser-loot boxes are almost barren though… sugar, spider eyes, etc. seem like they should have one dedicated chest at most, not 3 double-wides. I get (and appreciate fully ;)) the want for a full stack of chests, but it'll take forever for those to fill up, no question. That said, I'm not sure that it's necessary to funnel more of the "normal" loot into those spaces. There's more than enough of all of that. I just hate it to be wasted, but whatever. If it's not being grabbed, so be it. :)

There is still some lag though entering through the portal, and a *death-titch* when you exit (netherrack blockage probably), but it drops loot like crazy.


[edit]: Oh! One last thing - you seriously need to put a crafting bench in there somewhere. :D I couldn't find a good place for one since it's x2 based, but I briefly thought maybe under the skulls/heads (if that's even possible - I didn't try it since they're all on nice 45ºs)? It was BYOCB for the TNT making, but I think that room could use at least one. ;)

[billybobsky]

3 double wides? 6 man.... The minor loot is from witches and the very occasional spider... we're lucky to have it at all. I *could* redirect more common loot, but as you say the demand would never reach that level. Ever ever. And who needs zombie flesh. Drew hasn't gone cannibal on us yet.

The lag that comes when you arrive is due to the shear amount of redstone lighting updates. It's all client side, so ymmv. I tried to minimize it by glowstoning the shit out of the filters, but any additional changes (replacing the repeaters with comparators, say) would probably only effect marginal improvements -- and honestly, the comparators not causing local lighting changes is probably a bug (or a 'delayed' feature). So you'll have to live with the small amount of client side lag, unless Optifine improves it...

[709]

Ah! I haven't been there since I started using the updated Magic Launcher & OptiFine a few days ago - I'll go do that tonight and see what difference it may make.

[709]

Also, speaking of the trap – it reminded me to mention that the portal to Triskaidekatopia will be non-functioning until further notice.

Some renovations and moving a few things around. Should be back open by the weekend. Better, faster, stronger.

[billybobsky]

So I tried Optifine and under some settings, mostly involving shaders there is no substantial FPS drop.

However: I discovered that the trap's filters were broken (at least one filter per each set) meaning either people were tping near it or the nether route isn't bug free. So I have closed the trap to everyone (myself included) until the bug is fixed in Bukkit or a work-around is arranged via a plugin. I really would like for the trap to be available to the players on the server, but it seems even the limited use recently has been enough to cause problems that I don't want to and shouldn't have to deal with...

[709]

Oof. I just went to check it out myself and saw the signs. :\

Well, I hope we can get it sorted. It's a thing of beauty.


That said, I did use /back *once" last week to regain my sword after I fell into a chasm and got swamped by zombies, but this was N of 'topia. Could that have caused the glitch? It's the one and only time I've ever used that command in the new world, so I hope that didn't fuck things up.

[drewprops]

I didn't think that we had persimmons to teleport??


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[709]

Just "/back" I believe. I thought it was just a helpful thing to get back to where one died, but apparently you can go back and forth from bed to dead area like /tl. I think. Haven't tested it yet. WS would know. ;)

[drewprops]

Oh, well now, I had never considered using it for flipping back and forth between distant locales... how dumb of me!! (don't worry, I'm used to it)


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[billybobsky]

I've been abusing it everywhere but the trap -- far easier method of getting between my various 'bases'. Essentially you have two avatars on the map, when you die they get 'reset' to home base and death point. Otherwise they are mobile.

709, I am pretty sure your tp-ing wasn't the cause of the issue. It is more likely that the nether route, while less bug inducing was the culprit. Either that or someone else was tping around the trap. I'd like to remind everyone that selling the collected goods for money goes against the spirit of the trap ;)....

[kscherer]

Good thing I don't sell what I collect. Just load up the chests so I doesn't gots to slaughter a million creepers to make a stick-o-dynamite! ;)

And, yes, Grey, /back between two points works *like a freakin' charm*!! :)

[drewprops]

Does it work for the Nether as well?

[billybobsky]

Yes.

[kscherer]

Does it work for the Nether as well?

That's the best part about it. You can wander the Nether aimlessly and zap right back to your house. There are some caveats, however. If you fall into a large lake of lave, sometimes /back will land you on the *top* of the Nether (which is an infinite layer of bedrock and mushrooms (best place to gather shrooms by the way ;) ). Also, if you /back from the Nether to the overworld, and then die in the overworld before going back to the Nether, /back will *not* take you back to the Nether.

It makes for a very slick way to hunt/gather/explore the Nether without having to worry where you are or where you are going.

Another fun fact: When first entering into the Nether, you must commit suicide, then use /back to set the spawn. Otherwise, you just have to wait until you die (which might involve swimming in lava, at which point see above.). Also, make sure you set your bed as your overworld spawn or you might pop out in some obscure location.

Use it *often* if you are gathering expensive items (glowstone, quartz, fortress goodies) lest you go swimming and lose it all. Learned by much trial and error. ;)

Loads of fun!

[billybobsky]

you do not have to commit suicide to use it in the nether.

[Elysium]

This makes me wonder how big the world file is now.

[709]

Also, be careful not to expand the Nether *too* much, ala Brad's post (http://forums.applenova.com/showthread.php?p=778383#post778383). I'd hate to have the Nether wiped after all the work that's gone into it just because it's grown so large from exploring that we need back the disk space.

This makes me wonder how big the world file is now.
Yes, this. Beaten by 5 minutes! :D

[kscherer]

you do not have to commit suicide to use it in the nether.

Correct, but you do have to *die* in the Nether in order to /back to it. Otherwise, you will /back to the last place you died in the overworld.

My intention is to point out that in order to use it as a transport tool, you have to have died there.

When I go on a Nether exploration, the first thing I do is commit suicide so /back will take me back and forth between wherever I am in the Nether and my home base. Otherwise, you have to wait until you die unintentionally, which may involve losing valuable bits to the hot stuff.

[billybobsky]

You're not seeing the full potential of the avatars. You only need to die once, somewhere for the second avatar to exist. It continues to exist and you continue to be able to go back to it regardless of whether it is in the nether the end or the overworld. Basically, you're doing it wrong.

[kscherer]

I totally understand what you're talking about.

I suppose a person could grab the "second" avatar and take that one into the Nether. I have just gone in, knocked myself off, and continued from there.

[drewprops]

Shit. Okay, avatars??



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[kscherer]

Blue things. Yellow eyes, long tail. Ride around on flying lizards.

What, you don't have one? :p

[turtle]

For the insanely curious:
295M ./world
141M ./world_nether
4.4M ./world_the_end

[kscherer]

I have a friend who is curious what plugin we use for the market. Anyone care to splain?

[Brad]

Moonlighting on another server, are we? Trying to learn the secret sauce so you can help set up your own, eh? I see how it is. Harumph!

:p

There are several economy plugins that offer this type of functionality, but our server uses Essentials (http://dev.bukkit.org/bukkit-plugins/essentials/).

[billybobsky]

oops wrong thread...

[kscherer]

Moonlighting on another server, are we? Trying to learn the secret sauce so you can help set up your own, eh? I see how it is. Harumph!

:p

There are several economy plugins that offer this type of functionality, but our server uses Essentials (http://dev.bukkit.org/bukkit-plugins/essentials/).

Thank you, kind sir!

Now, what is your IP address, password, router ID, telephone, and bank account number please?

FYI: I don't even play on my own server anymore! :p

[billybobsky]

A request or two or three:

The new (1.8) enchanting algorithm will require use of lapis lazuli, is it possible to have placed a lapis lazuli purchasing sign at the enderman farm in the alcove area? In addition, perhaps one for anvils (set at the going rate of conversion of iron/iron blocks to anvils) as well since the anvils do get worn out there -- we've been through 4 or so in less than two days?

Old request but bears repeating: in the communal tree farm where the chests are at each level, is it possible to place signs for saplings and bonemeal that are relevant to the level's tree type? I guess jungle trees could be added to the area for the acacia and dark oak.

Many thanks!

[kscherer]

I second what that guy said. :)

[709]

A request for inside the mart proper: I notice there's an empty space in the ender pearl, ender eye & endstone row at the far right market stand. Any chance we could get obsidian in there to fill that last hole? Seems like it would fit with the above mentioned loot. :)

[Brad]

I keep forgetting about this thread! OK, here's what I'm about to add:


lapis for sale in the end
anvils for sale in the end
saplings at the tree farm
obsidian at the marketplace


Did I overlook any?

[709]

Could grassless dirt be available in the mart? According to the wiki it's only available via the /give command, but I wondered if that would work compatibility-wise with the way the mart is set up. I don't need it need it, but if it was available I'd probably use a half-dozen stacks or so for effect. ;)

[kscherer]

Mart request:

Obsidian is obtainable from the mart at $100/one block. :confused:

So, who uses one block of obsidian? :p

Could we make it 10/$1000 instead? Pretty please with glowstone dust on top? :)

[Brad]

After much time neglected, I've returned to updating the Mart signs...

Could grassless dirt be available in the mart? According to the wiki it's only available via the /give command, but I wondered if that would work compatibility-wise with the way the mart is set up. I don't need it need it, but if it was available I'd probably use a half-dozen stacks or so for effect. ;)

Weird. Somehow I thought we already had dirt and grass for sale at the Mart. I've just added both of them!

Mart request:

Obsidian is obtainable from the mart at $100/one block. :confused:

So, who uses one block of obsidian? :p

Could we make it 10/$1000 instead? Pretty please with glowstone dust on top? :)
Done!

I adjusted down a few other inflated prices while I was in there, too.

[ThunderPoit]

Hey Brad, your vending machine ate my money! I tried buying 10 obsidian, it said $1000 had been deducted from my acct, but i didn't check before, so i couldn't verify. Either way, I never got any obsidian.

[kscherer]

I found a funny:

In the Nether mart, Glowstone is $200 for 1 Glowstone block. On the opposite side, Quartz is $800 for 10 quartz crystals. Since it takes 4 crystals to make a block, one quartz block is $320.

Quartz is an easier resource than glowstone, yet 50% more expensive. Either glowstone needs to rise in value or quartz needs to drop. I would suggest that quartz should be in the $150/block range.

[709]

I kind've thought glowstone was intentionally lower than it should be to allow everyone a good shot at getting a stack or 10. We seriously depend on it so much (hell, we line our streets with it :D) that if it was priced out of range it would just be bad for everyone. The world is prettier with glowstone. ;)

Not saying I wouldn't welcome a price drop on quartz, but I wouldn't expect it. What I wouldn't mind is the ability to buy a full block in addition to just the crystals. The 'nether stall' is full-up, but maybe the stall just to the left. Podzol is in two different stalls at two different prices, so removing one could leave room for a quartz block sign.

[kscherer]

I'm not so much worried about the price as the convenience. We need 1.5 large of the stuff, which translates into 6 of crystals. For the sake of the Hub supplies, I would rather be able to buy the stuff at $$/10 blocks as opposed to $$/10 crystals.

However, if it doesn't change in the next few days, I'll just go ahead with option #1. :)

[709]

Request! ;)

Could we get sponge available to buy pre-1.8? It looks like it's going to be pretty rare in the new world (only available via boss-guardian (3 per temple) and maybe a few in some temple rooms) and when the Mart goes *poof* we really don't know how long it'll be before it comes back up.

s'il vous plaît :)

[kscherer]

Ooo, yeah. Good idea. And sea Lanterns, too! :D

[709]

:D If only….


Sponges are already a thing (I think they have been since 1.4..?), but not available in Survival, for whatever reason. The rest of the new blocks are craftable by either stuff we already have now or (in the case of Sea Lanterns and Prismarine variants) stuff we'll have in 1.8.

[709]

http://www.greychristian.com/AN/mcpumpk1.jpg

http://www.greychristian.com/AN/mcpumpk2.jpg

http://www.greychristian.com/AN/mcpumpk3.jpg

[turtle]

Fun pumpkin!

[kscherer]

Brad:

Can we please please please with sugar on top get sponges in the mart before the wipe? We NEEDS them!

[709]

http://www.greychristian.com/AN/26June_MobHead1.jpg

http://www.greychristian.com/AN/26June_MobHead2.jpg

[Brad]

Nicely done, Grey. :)

[RowdyScot]

Epic! Thank you, Grey! :D