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windowsblowsass
2004-06-11, 11:47
I dont even know who he is.
im not him i never was him i never will be him

Luca
2004-06-11, 11:53
Actually, his screen name here is "Undertaker." He went by Quagmire at the old forums.

Besides, I already said I checked both your and Undertaker's IPs, and not only are they different, but you two use different ISPs. So I know you are not the same person, and others should accept that as well (even if they would have liked to believe it).

HOM
2004-06-11, 11:59
Fair enough. The similarities were just too convincing for me.

Sorry about this. I was the one that started it and I think I convinced DMB last night. Thanks for the info Luca, I appreciate it.

Now it's your job windowsblowass to get your shit together and stop posting like Quagmire.

Wrao
2004-06-11, 12:05
i never will be him

you sure about that?

SKMDC
2004-06-11, 12:17
lucky for us then :\

SKMDC
2004-06-11, 13:25
all three of you quaqmire, undertaker, & windowsblowsass
all refer to president reagan as MR. REAGAN.

alcimedes
2004-06-11, 13:43
could be, but they're different, no question. let's let it rest folks.

Akumulator
2004-06-11, 13:56
I'm Quagmire.

Cybermonkey
2004-06-11, 14:35
:lol: i think everyone should apologise to WBA, thats a very nasty insult :D

And there was me thinking i was the only one that gets annoyed by said person :p

Zodiac
2004-06-11, 14:43
One little hint. Don't post do much if you sound like quagmire(sorry).

I just said you are like quagmire and im sorry. just a hint.

edit- Don't post so much and start so many threads entirely.

SonOfSylvanus
2004-06-11, 14:56
One little hint. Don't post do much if you sound like quagmire(sorry).

I just said you are like quagmire and im sorry. just a hint.

OK, zodiac ;) :devil:

Zodiac
2004-06-11, 14:59
OK, zodiac ;) :devil:

Oh no... now they're after ME! :lol:

LoCash
2004-06-11, 15:36
You people need to get over ripping on quagmire.

now, windowsblowsass You need to do something about your damn email address. Every time the damn messageboards send you an email, I get an email back to sysadmin@appleinsider.org from Cashette telling me I have to pay to send you bloody email. Make Cashette.com stop sending these emails back to me or I'm going to block incoming mail from the domain.

Thanks.

Cybermonkey
2004-06-11, 15:55
WBA is kasper!!! :D

windowsblowsass
2004-06-11, 15:59
You people need to get over ripping on quagmire.

now, windowsblowsass You need to do something about your damn email address. Every time the damn messageboards send you an email, I get an email back to sysadmin@appleinsider.org from Cashette telling me I have to pay to send you bloody email. Make Cashette.com stop sending these emails back to me or I'm going to block incoming mail from the domain.

Thanks.
oh ok thats spam control ill handle it

its fixed now

LoCash
2004-06-11, 16:00
Many thanks.

Mac+
2004-06-11, 22:45
wba Could you please use some punctuation in your posts? Even if you are not quaggie, never were and never will be, it would help to set yourself farther apart from him if your posts read slightly more coherently. ;)
Aside from that, welcome to the place. :)

Zodiac
2004-06-12, 11:54
Soooooo..... He was banned,

alcimedes
2004-06-12, 12:01
temporarily. none of the PM's he had gotten seemed to sink in.

Zodiac
2004-06-12, 12:27
I see.

psmith2.0
2004-06-12, 12:28
:lol:

I mean, honestly. How big of a royal, raging numbnut chucklehead do you have to be to get banned from a site as loose, casual and freewheeling as THIS one?

:confused: :err:

A pretty big one, I suppose.

Wouldn't that require actual effort and TRYING to get into trouble? Makes me wonder about some people...

:\

Moogs
2004-06-12, 14:17
Luca, you mentioned the fact that he used two different ISPs. How does that mean it's not him? Could be posting from a neighbors apartment or have two dialup accounts, or whatever... no?

I haven't followed the whole thing too closely but it seems people think the writing style and posting habits are very similar. That's the very best indication you can have because it's hard to convincingly fake someone else's writing style over a period of time. Too easy to slip up....

If anyone briefly summarize who at the other forums was accused of masquerading as someone else (and what their original offense was), as well as how that relates to this place, I'd appreciate it. The whole grape-vine, gossip thing is something I always lose track of....

:err:

LoCash
2004-06-12, 14:37
Luca has just as much access to view specific location details of users who post as Administrators do. This guy is not and was not Quagmire. He's just not. Let's move on.

curiousuburb
2004-06-12, 15:00
Posting from home and school or work might easily mean unique ISPs as well as IPs.

Net Newbies might not be hip to the alternative techniques to cloak (http://www.the-cloak.com/anonymous-surfing-home.html) or surf anonymously (http://www.google.com/search?num=50&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&q=anonymous+proxy), though some cookie persistence might be required to maintain login id/pw

MAC address info might allow tracking of users who multi-reg, but if you've got access to a lab or use separate machines at home and work it would still be relatively easy to spoof several accounts.

On the Internet, nobody can tell if you're duplicitous.

Observation and skepticism can be applied to a body of writing as pattern recognition and stylistic profiling, but even these techniques might fail for the first few posts due to insufficient information, or a presumption of innocence and 'grace period'.

If you want to pursue the tangents of why folks might explore this freedom to try on alternate personalities online, try reading (incomplete list) Sherry Turkle, Brenda Laurel, Janet Murray, research Julia and the explorations of Turing Testing and psychological modeling of virtual behaviour in online gaming...

maybe Torifile can chime in with suggested readings as well.

Luca
2004-06-12, 15:44
Even if I didn't have the IP information, I think I'd still arrive at the conclusion that WBL != Quagmire. See, Quagmire seems to genuinely like this place. He's an idiot, but at least he seems to admire the people running it and even when he messes up, he's not that bad. We've probably warned him enough in the past to prevent him from the sheer stupidity that you saw in WBL's posts and behavior.

Besides, internet kiddies who don't pay attention to spelling, grammar, or capitalization are a dime a dozen. You could replace Quag with many other people and no one would tell the difference based solely on their writing style.

Mac+
2004-06-12, 20:51
I'm with pscates - for somebody to cop a temporary ban at this place they must have been deliberately coaxing it. That is pretty sad. :confused:

curiousuburb great post - I'd be interested in that Brenda Laurel book, what was the title please? (feel free to use PM if you want)

curiousuburb
2004-06-12, 22:36
curiousuburb great post - I'd be interested in that Brenda Laurel book, what was the title please? (feel free to use PM if you want)

Brenda Laurel's "Computers as Theatre (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0201550601/qid=1087097624/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/103-3750122-1857437?v=glance&s=books) is one worth reading

One of the names I forgot to include in my original list is even more topical:
Sherry Turkle's "Life on Screen" (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0684833484/qid=1087097573/sr=1-21/ref=sr_1_21/103-3750122-1857437?v=glance&s=books) - excellent sociological research into online identity

Mac+
2004-06-12, 22:54
Ahh - thanks... I have heard of this book. I already have the "Art of HCI Design", but I think I will order this for my semester break reading - not too far away now! :)

Moogs
2004-06-13, 13:03
Luca has just as much access to view specific location details of users who post as Administrators do. This guy is not and was not Quagmire. He's just not. Let's move on.


Sorry. I wasn't trying to be confrontational... I was just asking him for a technical clarification on the IP thing because I've never quite understood how you can eliminate someone (as a candidate for multiple accounts let's say), just by knowing the IPs don't match exactly.

Maybe I don't understand it enough, but for example, wouldn't every person in a given neighborhood, going through a given ISP, have nearly the same IP address except for the last node / set of digits? So - and again I've dropped the Quag thing now, I'm just asking a technical question - how do you know the difference between a neighbor at 689.789.22.135 and the person being monitored at 689.789.22.234 and his second account at 689.789.222.321? I mean you can only narrow it down to a specific zip code and ISP at the most, couldn't you?

LoCash
2004-06-13, 13:29
Oftentimes you can narrow IP blocks down to different regions of the country. Keeping that in mind, as well as an intuition of who it is you're trying to determine this individual is or not, helps you eliminate and rule out things. In this case, we know a bit about quagmire's browsing habits based on logs that vBulletin keeps with IP addresses he has used. We also know a bit more about him as an individual, and that coupled with the fact that he's never utilised IP blocks from other ISPs or other regions, we're able to rule out that it wasn't him.

Technically, yes, there are a lot of things someone could do to attempt to visit this site with a separate IP. The logs don't show someone attempting to do that though, and Quagmire doesn't strike us as the kind of person that would.

Mac+
2004-06-13, 13:56
I love the fact that Quaggie is sort of known on a personal level outside of these forums. Gives the kid a third dimension. ;)

But what I'd like to know is, did you meet him face to face or is your knowledge of him as an individual built up from his posts, PMs and perhaps iChat sessions? Not being accusatory, just curious how members of this forum have met each other or got to know one another as more than just an anonymous log-in ID.

Quagmire
2004-06-13, 14:38
I love the fact that Quaggie is sort of known on a personal level outside of these forums. Gives the kid a third dimension. ;)

But what I'd like to know is, did you meet him face to face or is your knowledge of him as an individual built up from his posts, PMs and perhaps iChat sessions? Not being accusatory, just curious how members of this forum have met each other or got to know one another as more than just an anonymous log-in ID.

We talk on ichat.

Gavriel
2004-06-13, 15:24
Even if I didn't have the IP information, I think I'd still arrive at the conclusion that WBL != Quagmire. See, Quagmire seems to genuinely like this place. He's an idiot, but at least he seems to admire the people running it and even when he messes up, he's not that bad. We've probably warned him enough in the past to prevent him from the sheer stupidity that you saw in WBL's posts and behavior.

Besides, internet kiddies who don't pay attention to spelling, grammar, or capitalization are a dime a dozen. You could replace Quag with many other people and no one would tell the difference based solely on their writing style.

Do you think it is ok to call members idiots, Luca? Quaggy may not be the most eloquent person here, but that does not give you the right to speak of him like that.

Quagmire
2004-06-13, 15:29
Personally I am ok being called an idiot. To some measure I am. I don't care what people call me because they do not know me personally. They can assume what I am. Only a few people know who I am really like.

Luca
2004-06-13, 16:46
Gavriel, you're right, it was rude of me. I was trying to use it as an affectionate term of sorts... I really don't know anything about Quagmire's intelligence, he just seems like a silly, maybe clumsy guy (in a good way!). We all know people like that - they can be annoying sometimes, and who isn't, but they're also fun to hang out with.

I'll put it this way - I'm happy that Quagmire is here, and I'm also happy that windowsblowsass is gone (for the time being).

Quagmire
2004-06-13, 20:17
Gavriel, you're right, it was rude of me. I was trying to use it as an affectionate term of sorts... I really don't know anything about Quagmire's intelligence, he just seems like a silly, maybe clumsy guy (in a good way!). We all know people like that - they can be annoying sometimes, and who isn't, but they're also fun to hang out with.

I'll put it this way - I'm happy that Quagmire is here, and I'm also happy that windowsblowsass is gone (for the time being).

Now that wasn't nice either. Outside of the forums he is a nice guy. He needs to learn how to control himself like I needed to do when I was new around.

Mac+
2004-06-13, 21:44
ut ^ really good posts above... clear, concise and honest (I presume). I also like the way you used your own expereinces as a "noob" to relate to what wba was doing.

Btw - you seem to intimate that you know him outside the forums. Are you guys from the same country/suburb/school or something? Or once again, is it knowledge based upon internet chat conversations?

Quagmire
2004-06-13, 21:45
ut ^ really good posts above... clear, concise and honest (I presume). I also like the way you used your own expereinces as a "noob" to relate to what wba was doing.

Btw - you seem to intimate that you know him outside the forums. Are you guys from the same country/suburb/school or something? Or once again, is it knowledge based upon internet chat conversations?


Once again ichat.

_Ω_
2004-06-13, 22:04
The Undertaker is an iChat fiend ;)

LoCash
2004-06-13, 22:25
If I might offer a slightly intoxicated opinion :)

UT and WBA are both younger readers. If you can think back to when you were about sixteen, and if you were anything like me, you were highly motivated and ambitious, you can see a piece of yourself in these two kids. They just need a little mentoring and motivation.

I think they both act with good intentions. They both just need a little mentoring from those of us in the community; they want to learn. That's one wonderful thing about this community: We take in new people with open arms and, in a way, we do mentor them. I've seen this happen many a times over with so many new members, quagmire/undertaker included. As I have told quagmire personally, the people we rip on changes over time. It used to be, and sometimes still is, TW99... then there was Messiahtosh, etc. I'm still hoping Messiahtosh will make a video for us :)

Mac+
2004-06-13, 22:45
If I might offer a slightly intoxicated opinion :)

UT and WBA are both younger readers. If you can think back to when you were about sixteen, and if you were anything like me, you were highly motivated and ambitious, you can see a piece of yourself in these two kids. They just need a little mentoring and motivation.

I think they both act with good intentions. They both just need a little mentoring from those of us in the community; they want to learn. That's one wonderful thing about this community: We take in new people with open arms and, in a way, we do mentor them. I've seen this happen many a times over with so many new members, quagmire/undertaker included. As I have told quagmire personally, the people we rip on changes over time. It used to be, and sometimes still is, TW99... then there was Messiahtosh, etc. I'm still hoping Messiahtosh will make a video for us :)

Good post - even if you were slightly intoxicated LoCash! (Actually I'm sort of disappointed you didn't add a slurred "I love ya quaggie *hic*") :lol:

Besides, wasn't it Winston Churchill who once proclaimed: "I've taken more from the bottle than the bottle has taken from me" ?

Anyway, that's what I love about this community too - the fact that we are all interested in similar things (Apple products, for starters) and that we help each other out.

Personally, I have nothing against quaggie - I ribbed him once or twice about the clarity of his posts - but then I had to eat my words when I first replied to an ut post without realising it was the one and same person! :wow: I think he has really come a long way - hoping not to speak too early ;) - and I'm glad he's here! :)

LoCash
2004-06-13, 22:53
It was another famous and admirable person that said, "A woman drove me to drinking, and I never had the god given common courtesy to say thanks."

Kudos if you can name the person.

Quagmire
2004-06-13, 23:04
Here is another saying," While we are make refrigerators, our enemies are making bombs." It maybe not directly but, it is obvious.

Hint: I am releated to him through my mom side of the family.

Mac+
2004-06-13, 23:17
"A woman drove me to drinking, and I never had the god given common courtesy to say thanks." WC Fields - I guess you should never work with children either. ;)

LoCash
2004-06-13, 23:22
I'd be god's gift to children. You can bet your ass mine are going to military school and will no longer be able to call me their father until they are accepted to Annapolis with a Marine Corps option.

Mac+
2004-06-13, 23:31
No - I think you misunderstood me... I think that was also a quote from WC Fields about not working in movies with children or animals.

But hey, ummmm.... you can raise your kids anyway you like LoCash :confused: :rolleyes:

SKMDC
2004-06-13, 23:56
i have always found quagmire/undertaker to be a rather ernest youngster.
kind of the william hung of .com/.org. and i mean that in a nice and positive way.

as for windowsblowsass, well i either thought he was a imposter or just someone going out of his way to piss us off. i'm not going to make apologies....i pm'ed everyone to get him smacked down.
but i can give him a second chance.

Quagmire
2004-06-14, 10:45
i have always found quagmire/undertaker to be a rather ernest youngster.
kind of the william hung of .com/.org. and i mean that in a nice and positive way.

as for windowsblowsass, well i either thought he was a imposter or just someone going out of his way to piss us off. i'm not going to make apologies....i pm'ed everyone to get him smacked down.
but i can give him a second chance.

It is good that you are giving him a second chance. He admited to me on ichat he did post cockey being all mad at you guys. I told him to calm down. I gave him some tips which is on the posting guidelines. Like don't post angry, don't piss people off, and don't post anything about what happened in the past. I say overall just give him another chance and he will turn out being a good kid.