Why should I buy a Mac?

[tomster2300]

Hey,

I'm starting college next week and am looking for a laptop. I've browsed Dell's selection, my school's selection (student discount deal with Dell), Toshiba, powernotebooks.com, etc. and I believe I have settled on an Apple 12 inch iBook. The problem is I've been a Windows user my entire life (I built this desktop I'm typing on and slapped XP Pro on it out of habit) and are kind of wary of jumping ship for a Mac. My main issue is compatibility when working in a Windows' world.

Some of my fears subsided when my friend brought his G3 12" iBook over and let me play with it. It was asleep when it came in, and when I opened it it had already connected to my wireless network. I thought that was extremely convenient. I tried accessing my network's files and internet and they worked without a hitch. I also enjoyed the entirely new OS.

My only concern is how well it will work around campus. Nearly our entire campus is wireless; will it be able to connect just as easily over there? What about software conflicts? If I write something on Word at school or here at home and want to view it on the iBook, will it work? Vice versa?

I'm tech savy Windows wise. If something goes wrong, I can figure out how to fix it. With a Mac I know nothing.

I think I just need the whole spill on why I should switch to a Mac ;)

Thank you all in advance.

[Bryson]

Hey,


My only concern is how well it will work around campus. Nearly our entire campus is wireless; will it be able to connect just as easily over there?

Easier. Seriously. I just set-up an ad-hoc wireless network at the event I'm at, and all those with macs were able to get on immediately. All those with PCs had to "futz" for a moment before it worked.


What about software conflicts? If I write something on Word at school or here at home and want to view it on the iBook, will it work? Vice versa?

If you get Microsoft Office 2004, I can't see any reason why not. Can't speak for iWork as I don't use it much, but I understand that'll work too. I have had some minor differences in page layout (especially when using tables) but nothing major.


I'm tech savy Windows wise. If something goes wrong, I can figure out how to fix it. With a Mac I know nothing.

Well, your Mac won't go wrong anywhere near as often as your old PC (or even a new PC). And when (if!) it does, come on over here, or pop into an Apple store for some Genius Bar action...

I think I just need the whole spill on why I should switch to a Mac ;)


On top of everything I just said, try this:
Much more intuitive interface. I don't need the manual anywhere near as much on a mac.
No, repeat: No viruses, malware or spyware for the mac in the wild right now, and probably not ever.
Properly gorgeous product design. I took a look around a PC shop the other day and the only stuff that came even close to a Mac in terms of product design was the Sony Vaio stuff. Some of it.

[tomster2300]

Thank you for the advice. I've heard that Mac's get no viruses like you said, how can that be so? What do you think of the 12 inch iBook, is it a good deal?

EDIT: Unfortunately the student discount only knocks $60 off the price, bringing it down to around $940. (Or was it $40 off?) Either way, it's not much sadly.

[spotcatbug]

I've heard that Mac's get no viruses like you said, how can that be so?
I love how Windows viruses, spyware, etc. are so rampant that a life long Windows user can hardly conceive that an OS could be virus-free (essentially). :)

Anyway, one, small point regarding your losing your tech-savvy abilities in going from a PC to an iBook: At least in the hardware department, if you're getting a notebook computer, whether it's a Mac or PC, you aren't going to be messing with the insides of it, so tech-savvyness doesn't come into play there.

[tomster2300]

That's very true. But what software comes on an iBook and how is it better than the Windows competition? What makes a Mac stand out against a Windows machine (positively stand out, not negatively :)).

Thanks so far for the help.

[staph]

Thank you for the advice. I've heard that Mac's get no viruses like you said, how can that be so?

Depending on whom you believe, a combination of good security policy, well-coded software, and security by obscurity (i.e. Mac market share is much smaller, and virus writers allegedly target the low-hanging fruit, i.e. Windows).

It's theoretically possible to write a virus for Mac… but except for a couple of particularly childish trojans (the pirate Office 2004 installer which actually deleted your home folder comes to mind), nobody has yet.

[tomster2300]

Alright, thanks. That's the reason why Firefox security is better than IE, it has a smaller user base.

So why should I choose a Mac over a Windows based machine? :confused:

[psmith2.0]

Hi tomster.

Check this stuff out as well...some good info and additional reasons:

http://www.apple.com/switch/

I know the following isn't scientific and doesn't represent everything/everyone, but I can this in totaly honesty: I NEVER have a problem with my Mac, getting online wirelessly at remote locations, connecting a camera to it, connecting other devices, etc.

On the other hand, it seems a week doesn't go by that I don't hear from a PC-using friend or relative who is having major trouble of some kind...OS, hardware, software, connecting devices, driver issues, installing this, uninstalling that, virus/security concerns, random errors, slow-downs, etc.

Listen to a typical hour of that Kim Komando show on the radio. Holy crap...the problems talked about on that show should be enough to make anyone consider something different than a Windows-based PC.

:rolleyes:

I listen every Saturday morning, just to remind myself how good I have it.

:p

[staph]

That's very true. But what software comes on an iBook and how is it better than the Windows competition? What makes a Mac stand out against a Windows machine (positively stand out, not negatively :)).

Thanks so far for the help.

You may wish to consult: http://www.apple.com/ibook/software , but in short:

Appleworks (a comprehensive, but fairly basic office suite);
the iLife suite (iPhoto, iMovie, GarageBand, iTunes etc);
Quicken 2005;
Nanosaur 2; and,
Marble Blast Gold.

Plus the various applications which are actually part of the OS package (iChat, Chess, Dictionary, DVD Player, iCal, Preview, QuickTime Player, TextEdit etc.)

The Mac OS is probably the biggest stand out feature. You'll find that Macintosh applications in general are coded to much more stringent UI guidelines, and so are generally nicer to look at, and more intuitive to pick up. There are some really stand-out, and relatively cheap third party products which are pretty compelling, like OmniOutliner (an outliner), Nisus Writer Express and Mellel (word processors), Delicious Library (a library application — honestly, it's cooler than it sounds), Newsfire (an RSS aggregator) etc.

The OS itself is relatively stable, multitasks well, and doesn't make your eyes hurt. More importantly, it gets the hell out of your face. This is only a negative point of view because Windows does it so poorly with the task-based interface, myriad wizards, stupid little things asking to clean up your desktop, etc. There are also areas of spit and polish which make your life a lot nicer…

If you want a really detailed comparison, you may like to have a look at X vs. XP.com (http://www.xvsxp.com/), a relatively unbiassed comparison of the two OSs feature for feature.

[tomster2300]

Thank you Staph, I will look over that enormous list - I was hoping something like that existed out there somewhere.

I'm going to need a laptop which is relatively light, small, and can be easily carried throughout the day. Through everything I looked at the ibook seemed to fit these requirements. I was intrigued about how simple everything was to operate. Basically it seems like something new to play with and try out. I'm kind of tired of continuously tweaking and fixing Windows to be honest.

The other thing which is holding me back from outright purchase is the tech specs. I can get a much more powerful Dell for the same price. A $1600 Dell Inspiron (decked out I9300) can be found for $1000 after entering Dell's online coupons for $600-$700 off. Problem is these laptops are heavy and much larger. I think those are also desktop replacements to an extent. I'm looking for a portable, quality laptop which I can use on the go. The ibook seems like it would be the right choice, but when I can get a better bang for my buck I hestitate. Anybody else faced this problem?

[sirnick4]

You don't have to worry about compatibility issues with Word or any of the Office Suite.. Also, when you send attachments through OS X Mail, you can check this little box that says "send Windows friendly attachments" It's pretty nifty if I do say so myself :)

[sirnick4]

The one thing that the Dell's won't have is Mac OS X. Trust me, after about a week, you'll fall in love with the OS.

Plus, no PC comes standard with the iLife suite. Some try, but no one can compete with its ease of use. All of the iLife apps play really well with each other. It's just one of those things you have to try for yourself to know what I'm talking about ;)

[Luca]

Ask yourself this: Do you really need all that power? If you already have one or more PC desktops (as it sounds like you do), will you need just as much power on the road? Besides, if you get a really powerful Windows laptop instead of the iBook, you'd be throwing away many of the main advantages the iBook has. The iBook is small, light, portable, convenient, and gets great battery life. One of those $1000 (after coupons) desktop replacements may be a lot more powerful in terms of hardware, but you'll probably only get an hour or two of battery life, it'll weigh a lot more, and overall it'll just be a lot less convenient.

I understand exactly what you're thinking, though. I have been a Mac user all my life, but last summer I sold my only Mac and bought a Windows PC (for gaming). At first I thought I made a great choice - my computer was hella powerful, and it cost less than almost any Mac available (and FAR less than a comparable PowerMac). But after a few months I realized I missed the Mac platform, so I sold it and moved over to a Mac mini. Yeah, I'm getting a lot less hardware for the money, but in the end it's the software experience that defines how you use your computer. That was hard for me to realize as a hardware geek, but it's absolutely true.

So yeah, get the iBook. It's just what you need and it'll allow you to try OS X a little without having to completely migrate over. Also, Macs tend to hold their resale value really well, so if you really hate it after a month or two you can probably make almost all of it back by selling it.

[tomster2300]

So I guess the extra price is worth it then. You have to buy Microsoft Office separately for Windows; what kind of word processing software comes with an iBook? Is it on par with Word, or is it on par with Wordpad, the crappy program that comes included with XP which Microsoft tries to pass off as a word processor?

Plus what is iWord? Thanks.

EDIT: Luca you got that post in before me :) Thanks for the advice, somebody's personal experience is exactly what I was looking for.

[Brad]

I've never heard of iWord. Perhaps you're thinking of Pages (http://www.apple.com/iwork/pages), the word-processing component of Apple's new iWork (http://www.apple.com/iwork/).

iBooks include AppleWorks (http://www.apple.com/appleworks/). While it's severely outdated next to modern applications, a lot of people still swear by it and use it regularly.

[tomster2300]

iWorks, that was it. I'm sorry, you can tell I know nothing about Mac software. Is iWorks the equivalent of Microsoft Word? I'll check those links out you gave me, thanks.

[Bryson]

iWork (no s) isn't really the equivalent of Microsoft Word. It's two applications, Pages and Keynote, that approximate to Word and Powerpoint. Even then, it's slightly different. You can get Microsoft office for Mac anyway, but obviously it's more expensive than iWork. Office for Mac, IMO, is better than office for PC.

I'd say Pages was way ahead of Wordpad etc in terms of features, but behind Word. Many would argue that it has Word on ease of use though, for 95% of applications.

Keynote takes Powerpoint and kicks it into the corner.

There is no iWork equivalent to Excel, though. You'll need Office or Appleworks for that.

[atomicbartbeans]

Tomster, you don't have to buy M$ Office for decent Word compatibility. NeoOffice (http://www.neooffice.org/) is free and much easier to use than Office. Plus, it is compatible with Office documents. :)

Trust me, you'll love an iBook. I got mine in January, and I would never own a Windows PC ever again. :) OS X = good.

[StevesMom]

So I guess the extra price is worth it then. You have to buy Microsoft Office separately for Windows; what kind of word processing software comes with an iBook? Is it on par with Word, or is it on par with Wordpad, the crappy program that comes included with XP which Microsoft tries to pass off as a word processor?

Plus what is iWord? Thanks.

EDIT: Luca you got that post in before me :) Thanks for the advice, somebody's personal experience is exactly what I was looking for.

in terms of purchasing MS Office, there's a very cheap "Student & Teacher" version available that bundles Word, Excel and PowerPoint together for $149 if you're an edu user (and it sounds like you are).

Personally I never use anything but Excel any more from the whole package (and I only use Excel becasue there's no real alternative). iWork rules.

[tomster2300]

I don't suppose they'd give a larger discount if I were a college student and my mother was an educator would they? (Both are true). Oh well. So an iBook would work well on campus and turn a few heads?

BTW, it wont let me italize or put smileys in my posts through the advanced mode-- what's up with that? It won't let me do any kind of advanced editing as a matter of fact. I can put a basic smiley into the quick reply because I know the shortcut for it, but I don't know the other ones.

EDIT: Forgot to ask. How does the iBook function as a movie maker? Do the powerbooks offer more options in this category? Unfortunately the 12" model doesn't include a dvd burner which kind of hampers the movie making experience. I found that out while using Premiere Pro on this desktop. I made numerous movies, then spent many hours degrading the video quality so it could fit on a cd. Anybody who's ever had to do this knows how bad it stinks.

[tomster2300]

Sorry to double post, but I've been reading about iLife off Apple's website (thanks for the link :)) and it just amazing. It seems like all the iLife programs should work wonderfully with one another. Anybody here used it, and is it as nice as it sounds?

Now for some reason the smileys work again lol. :confused:

[Mugge]

Hi tomster 2300.

My first mac is the 12" iBook I'm using now. I don't use it for movie editing, but I guess it can handle iMovie (not as good as a PowerBook) if you need DVD burning you can always get an external burner.

I use mine for office and internet, and here are my main reasons for loving it:

*OS X! Why tolerate the inferior? Windows XP sucks compared to OS X!!!
*It has 3+ hours of battery life, when hardest at work, 4 when used casually.
*It's a tough machine, and the new models even have that HD protection sensor.
*It easily has power enough to be your "daily driver".
*It doesn't make so much noise as you average PC laptop. Don't be that jackass who brings a jet engine to a lecture, you'll just look stupid.
*It attracts girls. I'm not making this up ;)

I've had my share of Windows boxes, but I haven't felt this exited about a computer since the Amiga days.

[Jason]

Many people at my university use iBooks (a few Powerbooks) around campus on the wireless network. i've spoken to nearly all of them at one time or another and nobody ever had any problems working in this predominately windows environment.

Regards

[sirnick4]

iLife is awesome! I went to Europe last summer and I made a DVD of all my pictures with cool music in the background, picture transitions, etc.

It's cool that I get to be a Director myself. I call the shots :)

[atomicbartbeans]

Sorry to double post, but I've been reading about iLife off Apple's website (thanks for the link :)) and it just amazing. It seems like all the iLife programs should work wonderfully with one another. Anybody here used it, and is it as nice as it sounds?
Dude... if you have a Mac, you're going to use iLife. And it's awesome. iPhoto, iMovie, GarageBand, iDVD, and iTunes have no peers for ease-of-use, efficiency, and integration. Nothing even comes close. :)

[Franz Josef]

Dude... if you have a Mac, you're going to use iLife. And it's awesome. iPhoto, iMovie, GarageBand, iDVD, and iTunes have no peers for ease-of-use, efficiency, and integration. Nothing even comes close. :)

As the man said. You will simply find a degree of stability and integration that you did not believe was possible and you will wonder why Windows systems simply do not do this too. If you want to use your laptop to facilitate and enhance your daily productivity in ways you cannot yet imagine, buy an iBook. You will find that it changes the way you interact with technology. In truth, Mac OS X on an iBook is simply not comparable to XP on a Dell - it is a completely different dimension of user experience. And whether you are using Pages or iTunes or just picking up email wirelessly, you will find that Apple simply makes your life easier.

[tomster2300]

Do you guys know if I can buy a 12 inch ibook under $998? The student discount brings it down to $949, but that's still expensive for me. Anybody know of a good deal on a new one? (I'd prefer one which has just been updated, not an older model). Thanks for all the advice so far guys, you have been very helpful in my decision making.

[DMBand0026]

That's as low as you're going to go on a new model. Sorry. Look into the refurbished models or the ones on sale if you're really interested in a deal.

[tomster2300]

Welli I don't want a used one, so I guess I'l just need to start saving up.

[faramirtook]

You can probably get a great deal on an iBook on eBay. Macs hold up for much longer than PCs. A used iBook would serve you just as well as a new iBook.

[Franz Josef]

Welli I don't want a used one, so I guess I'l just need to start saving up.
Buying an iBook is a bit like buying a good diamond engagement ring for your fiancé. It's an investment in a relationship so cost is important - but value more so. :)

[Brad]

"Refurbished" items that Apple sells are literally as good as new. In fact, sometimes they are better than new because Apple gives them a rigorous inspection before putting them up for sale.

I'd seriously consider a refurbished iBook if I was you. They're on the red tag "special offers" page at the online store. Occasionally they have really amazing deals there, but the sell out very quickly. You just have to check it regularly every day and go for it when you see a good deal.

[Luca]

I'll second what Brad says. "Refurbished" is nowhere near "used." In most cases, the computer was either removed from the box and used once only to reveal a show-stopping failure, or the box was never even opened. In the first case, the buyer got the computer and discovered a major hardware problem, so Apple took their brand new machine back and gave them a new one. In either case, though, Apple checks over the machines very carefully and fixes any problems with them.

In any case, you'll get a great machine, and if it has any major problems, it has the exact same warranty that comes with brand new Macs so you can always have Apple fix it for you.

[csb]

Just adding my little knowledge, i switched over to Mace about 2 years ago and have had very few problems and thosethat i did have were really easy to fix a few times i had to ask for help here but everything done was easynot like windows. I still have to play with my daughters windows machine every other week to fix something and it never seems to run right after the time spent on fixing it.
As for MS word the mac version runs great and is compatible with windows machines I have networked with my windows machine and take files from it often (i have to break down and buy a MAC compatible scanner).
As a student you are eligible for the student discounton the Mac , and you can get the Student Teacher edition of the office package which is a lot less that the regular package but is the same just not upgradablebut at the price you can buy the next version out and still come out ahead of the game.
I'm no expert but since the switch i have grown to lovve the Mac and i would never go back the OSX system is great soo much better than windows
good luck on whatever decision you make

[losslesshead]

I also second buying a refirbished iBook. Someone I knew got a refurbished Mac, good as new.

[Dave_D]

You guys in the U.S. are so lucky to even have a refurbished class. Here in Asia it's all new stuff only so you can imagine how many are deprived of a chance of the Mac experience.

iBook, PowerBook... whatever you can afford + OS X + iLife + NeoOffice = A marked better computing experience!

Good Luck.

[tomster2300]

Thank you guys so much. I deposited some cash today and found I have $1,053 bucks to use, but am still hesitating. Most of you have gone through college I believe, so what do you think; do I really need a notebook for class? My parents said that since I'm getting the new car that they won't help fund my laptop, so it would be all my funds. (This is my first car ever, so it's kind of a college gift).

They also said that they realize I'll probably need a laptop for college, but I should wait and see what my professors say. They want to know what is recommended, but I know professors won't recommend a power notebook for a journalism major -- I think the iBook would be a great fit. It's not incredibly powerful, but it looks like it's a good little workhorse for what it is. They said they would help me financially after some of those car / insurance payments were paid. Time wise I dont know when that will be exactly. (I'm kind of impatient).

I'm not sure if I'm willing to part with such a large amount of cash (I'm 18 for crying out loud). Is it worth it? Thanks everyone.

[Kickaha]

I'd say go for it.

1) Most colleges *require* a laptop for incoming freshmen now.

2) Journalism? You're going to be writing. A lot. You don't want to be tied to a desk. Nothing beats being able to kick back against a big tree in the quad to type up your work. :)

3) The newly refreshed iBooks are plenty powerful for basic academic needs. Gaming and HD video editing might be a bit beyond it, but I don't think that's the power you're going to be needing. ;) My in-laws just got one last week, and it's faster than my PowerBook that I use for my CompSci PhD research.

Go for it. :)

[tomster2300]

I'd say go for it.

1) Most colleges *require* a laptop for incoming freshmen now.

2) Journalism? You're going to be writing. A lot. You don't want to be tied to a desk. Nothing beats being able to kick back against a big tree in the quad to type up your work. :)

3) The newly refreshed iBooks are plenty powerful for basic academic needs. Gaming and HD video editing might be a bit beyond it, but I don't think that's the power you're going to be needing. ;) My in-laws just got one last week, and it's faster than my PowerBook that I use for my CompSci PhD research.

Go for it. :)

:)

That sounds wonderful, but I have to throw a monkey wrench into the equation. I'll be living at home this semester and will commute daily. I have my nice desktop here at home, so do you think I would still need a laptop? My campus is home to 32,000 students (UGA) and I'll be on campus from 8-2:15 for most days, while 8-4:25 on Fridays. I have it set so I'll have an hour of downtime between each class, so I think that's when it would really come in handy. I dont know if I'll want to fight for a school computer every day to type something up. Plus I'm planning on joining the school's main newspaper, which is published daily and requires you to report to their office for typing stories.

I also have been writing for our city newspaper for two years, so a laptop would come in handy for those traveling interviews I'm always doing.

Sorry to ramble, I'm just putting all my reasons (to persuade myself) down in front of me. Thanks.

[Messiahtosh]

I am in college right now and I would definitely go with a notebook, especially for a communications major like journalism. I'm in advertising/pr with a minor in IST and I've gone through 3 semesters without a hitch, and have actually had probably more successful presentations and beautifully laid out papers than students with PCs. I have not encountered a single compatability issue at Penn State yet and I doubt that I will.

Go for the iBook, not only will you love it, you'll produce quality papers/assignments with the same effort that would result in a mundane PC-created paper.

Good luck.

[tomster2300]

Do you think it would last me all four years? I guess by that time I'll be more financially capable and would have more choices available to me (I better have by then :)). Thanks for the advice so far everyone.

[Franz Josef]

I'm not sure if I'm willing to part with such a large amount of cash (I'm 18 for crying out loud). Is it worth it? Thanks everyone.

Having a notebook is definitely a good idea - I would even go as far as to say you really don't want to be a student without one.

[MCQ]

:)

That sounds wonderful, but I have to throw a monkey wrench into the equation. I'll be living at home this semester and will commute daily. I have my nice desktop here at home, so do you think I would still need a laptop? My campus is home to 32,000 students and I'll be on campus from 8-2:15 for most days, while 8-4:25 on Fridays. I have it set so I'll have an hour of downtime between each class, so I think that's when it would really come in handy. Plus I'm planning on joining the school's main newspaper, which is published daily and requires you to report to their office for typing stories.

I also have been writing for our city newspaper for two years, so a laptop would come in handy for those traveling interviews I'm always doing.

Sorry to ramble, I'm just putting all my reasons down in front of me. Thanks.

It depends how much you want the convenience of having the notebook available to you. Odds are you could use the university's computer labs and whatever offices the university newspaper has while you're on campus. But, often times labs can be quite packed.

Having the freedom of being able to take it with you on/off campus is nice. It'is also very beneficial if you make trips home or travel frequently, which it sounds like you'll do in journalism. Also, for collaboration on team projects where you meet at the library or someone else's place, it's really convenient. I will say that whenever you do get a notebook... it's one of those things where you'll wonder why you didn't get it sooner. Kind of like dial up --> broadband.

As far as the discounts: if you can find a way to get the extra money (or have your parents pitch in a few hundred temporarily)... you should be able to get the education promotion of a free iPod mini with Mac purchase after main in rebate. So, after getting the rebate check, you could probably sell the iPod mini for $150 and bring the end price down. Just requires a bit more cash upfront, and some time.

http://www.apple.com/education/backtoschool/

Lasting 4 years? Yeah, sure it could. The only thing I'd say is an upgrade to the HD (or buy an external one)... college students seem to fill them up quite quickly in college. :)

[Kickaha]

:)

That sounds wonderful, but I have to throw a monkey wrench into the equation. I'll be living at home this semester and will commute daily.

If your commute is on public transportation, you can *work* during that time. ;)

I have my nice desktop here at home, so do you think I would still need a laptop? My campus is home to 32,000 students (UGA) and I'll be on campus from 8-2:15 for most days, while 8-4:25 on Fridays.

You're not going to want to dash home everytime you want to work on something. :/ Trust me, I did that as an undergrad for a while. It *sucked*. I'd find out about some assignment I had to take care of, but y'know, I'd want to head out and socialize... and I had this downtime during the day. :p I got the laptop, and voila - more free time. :)

I have it set so I'll have an hour of downtime between each class, so I think that's when it would really come in handy. I dont know if I'll want to fight for a school computer every day to type something up. Plus I'm planning on joining the school's main newspaper, which is published daily and requires you to report to their office for typing stories.

I also have been writing for our city newspaper for two years, so a laptop would come in handy for those traveling interviews I'm always doing.

Sorry to ramble, I'm just putting all my reasons (to persuade myself) down in front of me. Thanks.

I think you're doing a fabulous job. :D

[tomster2300]

I think you all are right. Are there any benefits upgrade wise that might be coming for the ibook? I read on cnet that they're holding out for a wide screen upgrade or something which is coming in Sept.? What is all that about? Thanks.

[Kickaha]

HIGHLY doubtful, since the iBooks were just bumped what, three weeks ago?

Expect PowerBook refresh in Sept, is my guess.

[tomster2300]

I found what I was talking about. It's the linked words under their Downside: that talks about wide screen.

http://reviews.cnet.com/Apple_iBook_G4__12_inch_/4514-3121_7-31466301.html

[Franz Josef]

I found what I was talking about. It's the linked words under their Downside: that talks about wide screen.

http://reviews.cnet.com/Apple_iBook_G4__12_inch_/4514-3121_7-31466301.html

There has been a good deal of speculation about widescreen iBooks but as Kickaha says above, it is very doubtful there would be a further bump any time soon. You might want to have a look at http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/ if you've not seen it already.

[tomster2300]

There has been a good deal of speculation about widescreen iBooks but as Kickaha says above, it is very doubtful there would be a further bump any time soon. You might want to have a look at http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/ if you've not seen it already.

Nope, haven't seen that. Thanks for the link, I'll check it out.

[tomster2300]

I found this mention of the wide screen at the end. They say it was false.

http://www.macrumors.com/pages/2005/07/20050726085148.shtml

I guess that's what cnet meant by "lighting a candle"...I must have misinterpreted that.

[HezMah19]

serriously dude, once you've got a apple laptop to do your work on, you will wonder WHY THE HELL DIDNT I DO IT SOONER!!! lol
Ive got a 15" PowerBook to use for the remainder of my education (im 15, but the 'Book will serve me well, muhahaha!) Im doing a Film & Media Course at school, or else i would have got an iBook...its perfect for Education. It does ALMOST everything i wanted it 2 do...but i really wanted that bigger screen and shiny silver as well...lol

serriously, you WILL NOT regret it.

Cheers
JM

ps. iWork makes your stuff look fantastic, ive never been complemented to such a massive extent about the visual apeal of my work.

[.Hack]

I believe I've owned my iBook for just about a month now, maybe even longer, and I love it! Everything just runs so smoothly and flawlessly. I look back on the days that I was a Windows user and remember how I was ALWAYS looking at little tips and tweaks to make my system more secure, give it a better look, or just make the general user experience better. Now that I'm a mac user, I've noticed that I have no desire to find out all the ins and outs of OS X, because I just don't need to. I'm not saying that you shouldn't become a knowledgeable OS X user, but the desire I had with Windows just isn't there anymore. Everything is safe, secure, and working like a charm! I no longer spend my time trying to figure out a way to get something to work correctly, how to keep my system immune to the latest virus, or update and run my malware removal programs.

Life without Windows is just so much more peaceful for me, and probably will be for you too! I still use my parent's Windows PC, but never unless I absolutely have to (and those times are usually for transferring something off of the computer that I aquired before switching to my iBook).

Most of all I must say that my favorite part is how nice everything looks and how well the hardware works. My iBook had no problems connecting to our wireless network, also has no problems with usb and the like! It all is automatically detected and everything flows great. OS X itself is also beautiful and simply easy to use. I was up and running with my iBook within 10 minutes of bringing it home and setting down in front of it. That's right, 10 minutes! When we bought our Dell, it took over 30 minutes to an hour before everything was up and running.

I hope you buy the iBook, and also hope that you have a great time using it. You aren't going to regret it, it's perfect for students. I'm having to use both Pages and Keynote for english projects. Keynote blows powerpoint out of the water, everything looks so much more professional. Pages has some great templates to guide you through making professional typed papers/brochures/etc...

Have fun, don't be afraid to learn. Change is always inevitable, sometimes it's for the best, and in this case I'd say it definitely is. Good luck to you and have fun in college with your iBook :)

[switchr92]

Dude, definately go iBook, u'll love it. It's really portable, has great battery life can case being jostled around in a backpack, has iLife '05 (the best digital suite in the market, mac or PC), will have little or no problems (and if there are any, there won't be hp saying shout at MS and the vicaversa), is compatible with iWork (which u'll love for college), and best of all, u have us 4 any other questions u might have in the future. As for the "more bang for your buck" in dell or whatever, the iBook is sleeker than anything u could buy from dell, and as long as u upgrade the HD and RAM (3rd party, like crucial), it will run just as well. And the Xbrite screens sucks, u can't use them in any sun, way too much glare. Go iBook!

[switchr92]

Oh, and if i were u, i wouldn't go refurbished, the new update gives u little things like the scrollpad, HD sensor (if u drop it, the hard drive locks to avoid data loss), and bluetooth, which in my opinion makes it a better buy.

[tomster2300]

Well I called the closest Apple store today (which is in Atlanta) and spoke with a sales representative. They ought to have a store here in town -- it's a college town; one downtown would probably make some money and be very convenient (for me at least :)). Anyway, I think I'm going to go spend an afternoon up there just to look around and play with the G4 iBook to see how I like it. My friend showed me his old G3 which I suppose is very similar, but up there they can help me learn about the software and OS. (He got his G3 off ebay and it lacks many programs such as iLife, though he did have OS X Tiger installed on it). I'd really like to see both Tiger and iLife in person (and more detail) and just play with them and the notebook in general. I use Premiere Pro on my desktop for video editing, and while the imovie looks more simplistic, I believe it would be something that might be intriguing and possibly something my parents could use. Maybe it would be an incentive for them to buy it if they see in person how cool everything is (*cough* and how it will help me accomplish more in college *cough*). Premiere Pro is a bit too complicated for them.

I have until Sept. 24th (somewhere around there) to make my purchase and receive a free iPod mini due to their student discount special. :) I don't have an iPod, but I do have a 20 gig nomad jukebox. I like it a lot but it's just too large to carry with you.

EDIT: I've been noticing the number of views to this thread since I created it. It's amazing how popular this topic is. Hopefully it has helped others besides myself.

BIG EDIT: I don't know if I've asked this or not (this thread is getting pretty long lol) but since I'm getting the 12 inch, what kind of external dvd burner is compatible with an iBook? I'd probably want one which connects through firewire (that could be the only way they connect, I have no idea.) It would be cheaper to get the 12 inch with an external instead of opting for the 14 ". Actually, I have to go this route since I don't have any more money lol. If many are compatible, then could you recommend a specific make / model? Has anyone else gone this route? Thanks.

[BarracksSi]

I use Premiere Pro on my desktop for video editing, and while the imovie looks more simplistic, I believe it would be something that might be intriguing and possibly something my parents could use. Maybe it would be an incentive for them to buy it if they see in person how cool everything is (*cough* and how it will help me accomplish more in college *cough*). Premiere Pro is a bit too complicated for them.
Just remember, just because an app might seem more simplistic doesn't make it any less "powerful". I'm pretty sure that you'll be able to jump into it pretty quickly.

Four years will be fine. The OS won't degrade (it just doesn't), and it won't gradually run slower & slower. The only things to go wrong are hardware failures (pretty rare anyway) and becoming a pack rat & running out of HD space.

I will recommend that you spring for AppleCare before your first year of warranty is up, especially for a laptop. If something does go wrong, Apple will bend over backwards to make things right.

[Bryson]

Premiere Pro is $700, so you can't really compare iMovie with it. Final Cut Pro is $1000, or Final Cut Express is $300, so you're looking between those two Apple products.

Final Cut Pro beats the pants of Premiere Pro. Much more than $300 worth!

[Engine Joe]

Premiere Pro is $700, so you can't really compare iMovie with it. Final Cut Pro is $1000, or Final Cut Express is $300, so you're looking between those two Apple products.

Final Cut Pro beats the pants of Premiere Pro. Much more than $300 worth!

I'll second that - as a long-time Premiere user who just bought the Final Cut Studio bundle - Final Cut Pro runs circles around Premiere, while giggling mirthlessly.

[tomster2300]

BIG EDIT: I don't know if I've asked this or not (this thread is getting pretty long lol) but since I'm getting the 12 inch, what kind of external dvd burner is compatible with an iBook? I'd probably want one which connects through firewire (that could be the only way they connect, I have no idea.) It would be cheaper to get the 12 inch with an external instead of opting for the 14 ". Actually, I have to go this route since I don't have any more money lol. If many are compatible, then could you recommend a specific make / model? Has anyone else gone this route? Thanks.

Does anybody recommend which external dvd player to get? With an external I could use it for both the iBook and my current Windows desktop. Thank you for all the help so far. It is very appreciated.

[Robo]

Three words:

GO FOR IT.

Especially since, if you can scrounge up an extra $179 for a bit, you can get a free iPod mini with it via mail in rebate. Free is good. Especially free iPods.

I'll probably be buying the same iBook you are getting, and it'll be my first Mac too (I've used my stepdad's Mac for a few months). Mac OS X is really, really nice...and iLife is awesome. I really don't think you'll be dissapointed.

So...enjoy your Mac (and college!). ;) If you have any questions about it, well...I've officially declared AppleNova the Awesomest Mac Forum Evar. Visit the Genius Bar and people should be able to help you with whatever ails your iBook. Or you, for that matter. They're that smart. :D

[sirnick4]

If you have any questions about it, well...I've officially declared AppleNova the Awesomest Mac Forum Evar. Visit the Genius Bar and people should be able to help you with whatever ails your iBook. Or you, for that matter. They're that smart. :D

I second that!.. I've been to others and this is by far the best Mac forum site.

[BarracksSi]

Does anybody recommend which external dvd player to get? With an external I could use it for both the iBook and my current Windows desktop. Thank you for all the help so far. It is very appreciated.
For an internal upgrade, check this out (I might get one for my 12") --
http://www.mcetech.com/ibg4dvdr8dl.html

For external, though, it's a little bit trickier as far as getting a drive to be fully supported by the iLife apps and the Finder.

Here's some info regarding external burners --
http://forums.macosxhints.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=41759
http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/25100
http://homepage.mac.com/geerlingguy/mac_support/mac_help/pages/0015-burn_idvd_other.html

[tomster2300]

Thank you. Do you know of any sites which offer reviews of the newly updated version of the 12 " iBook? I cant seem to find any online.

EDIT: So it looks like I'll be having trouble making an external drive sync with iLife, huh? Even though a compatibility feature is present in idvd 5, it looks like people are still having problems.

Doesn't that top internal link void the warranty though?

[Brad]

Yes, breaking open the case to replace the DVD drive will void the warranty.

Honestly, you'd be best to buy a cheap "internal" DVD-R/RW drive and put it in a FireWire enclosure. It'll be faster for less money than most self-contained external DVD-burners. There have been threads about this topic here as well. Try searching for something like "firewire enclosure" and you're bound to get a number of results.

I cannot recall ever seeing someone here complain about issues with external drives and the latest version of iDVD. Previous versions limited you strictly to using an internal drive, but this is no longer the case.

As for Finder and other support, I would suggest installing PatchBurn (http://www.patchburn.de/). I use it on my Power Mac with no problems.

[HezMah19]

Brads right, thats the easiest way 2 do it (IMO)

[BarracksSi]

I stand corrected about the internal vs. external DVD burners, then..

Thank you. Do you know of any sites which offer reviews of the newly updated version of the 12 " iBook? I cant seem to find any online.
It's not different enough to really warrant new reviews over the previous version, really. Imagine the "older" reviews, add in some comments about the scrolling trackpad and drop-sensing hard drive, and you've got your current iBook review.

Here's what Google comes up with:
http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=iBook+G4+July+2005+review&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

some selections:
http://reviews.cnet.com/Apple_iBook_G4__14_inch_/4514-3121_7-31466302.html
http://reviews.cnet.com/Apple_iBook_G4__12_inch_/4505-3121_7-31466301.html (although Justin Jaffe at cNet screwed up about the FireWire port)
http://www.macworld.com/news/2005/08/04/ibookbenchmarks/index.php

[tomster2300]

Thank you everyone. Well due to some college money mismanagement on my part I just received a check for $200 which is going towards the laptop.

With this in mind, do you think I ought to continue saving for a 14" iBook? Spec wise they're extremely similar. Should I get the 12 " and just spend the extra money on a larger hard drive and a firewire dvd player?

[Franz Josef]

Yes. :)

[Bryson]

Yes to which question, Franz?

Anyway, IMO, I'd spend the cash on extras for the 12". The 14" has a larger, but no higher resolution screen, so each pixel is larger, and the screen appears to be less sharp.

[Franz Josef]

Yes to which question, Franz?
12" ;)

[Kickaha]

Thank you everyone. Well due to some college money mismanagement on my part I just received a check for $200 which is going towards the laptop.

With this in mind, do you think I ought to continue saving for a 14" iBook? Spec wise they're extremely similar. Should I get the 12 " and just spend the extra money on a larger hard drive and a firewire dvd player?

The Combo Drive in the 12" iBook *plays* DVDs just fine. It doesn't *burn* them. Unless you want the bigger pixels for vision issues (my 65+yr old inlaws just got a 14" this past week because of that), the 14" just adds weight and size you don't want to be hauling around campus. I'd say go for the 12", build to order it to add a bigger hard drive ($50 gets you a 60GB instead), and if you ever decide you want to burn DVDs, get an external burner at that point.

[tomster2300]

Alright, I was just worried that any external dvd burner would have compatibility problems with iLife or any other apple software. I'm always running into files much larger than a cd's 800 mb capacity.

[Kickaha]

iLife only used to work with the internal drive, but they've since relaxed that. Make sure you confirm that the unit you're looking at *will* work, but most should. :)

[tomster2300]

Are there any options at all which aren't compatible with an external drive? You would think that Apple would lose money by not making their software 100% compatible with their software. Is iLife now 100% compatible with particular external dvd burners? Thanks.

EDIT: Should I wait for an intel based ibook to come out? If so, will any of them be under $1,000 like this one is, or will they all be incredibly highly priced?

[Franz Josef]

EDIT: Should I wait for an intel based iBook to come out? No - probably too long to wait so only if you are very happy with current laptop. Current iBooks run no risk of obsolescence due to the change.


If so, will any of them be under $1,000 like this one is, or will they all be incredibly highly priced? Likely to have similar prices as currently, so yes, likely to have entry models costing much less than $1,000

[BarracksSi]

EDIT: Should I wait for an intel based iBook to come out? If so, will any of them be under $1,000 like this one is, or will they all be incredibly highly priced?
Tacking onto what Franz Josef said...

You could be waiting up to two years or so for an Intel-based iBook. Apple's not saying much about their Intel plans (they rarely ever give any notice about upcoming products, anyway).

I see the current PowerPC iBooks as the best PPC versions ever, really. Apple's been writing for Intel for over five years, but I'd still feel more comfortable with the last-generation PPC laptops than I would with a first-generation Intel version. I'd wait for a revision or two to be sure of how well they're put together.

The current iBooks are really good, and with 10.5 being written for both PPC and Intel Macs, you'd have a fully-supported computer for 5 more years (and which will run another five or more if older Macs' histories are any indicator). Don't worry about it getting "out of date" -- if it does the job now, it'll do the job years from now.

[Carlos Net]

Don't worry about it getting "out of date" -- if it does the job now, it'll do the job years from now.

I second that. I'm currently running a 400MHz G3 iMac with Panther. It may be pink, it may be short on disk space (I only have 9.5GB >.<), but it still works fine for my everyday iTunes, MS Messenger, Microsoft Word, Internet browsing stuff. And this is a computer that was probably manufactured...say, around 1999? Admittedly, I'm in dire need of a new Mac, because this one doesn't even have the disk space to install Tiger, but for a six-year-old computer, it functions remarkably well. In fact, I suspect it would be frankly zippy if not for a deficiency in both memory and virtual memory (512MB RAM, only one gig free HD space, and that somehow manages to fluctuate to anything between nearly 2 gigs and 500 megs daily O_o)

But yeah well as this old trusty iMac may have aged, I am yearning for a new Mac... I'll probably end up getting a laptop in a year or so's time when I'm heading off to uni. If there are widescreen iBooks by then, I'll be extremely pleased (it's the worst thing about iBook, as far as I can see, that it's stuck with 1024*768), and if they're Intel, so much the better; I'll be able to dual-boot it with Windows and even Linux if I feel like it; get the best of both worlds... But that's probably just me dreaming... that stuff'll probably be Powerbook material around that sort of time period, not on the iBook...

Ah, well. All the more reason to get a Powerbook, then. If I could ever hope to afford one, that is T_T

[tomster2300]

I just noticed that somebody linked this thread as a reference to another person who asked why they should buy a Mac. That makes me feel good :).

Alright, well now that I have the money I'm still wondering how much I would use it at school. I'm sorry to keep harping on this question, but I'm just debating if it is a "necessity" or not in today's collegiate world.

EDIT: I spoke with somebody yesterday who said you were only able to view Word documents with the ibook's supplied word processor. He said you would not be able to save it as a file that could be opened back on a Windows machine. Is this true?

[staph]

EDIT: I spoke with somebody yesterday who said you were only able to view Word documents with the iBook's supplied word processor. He said you would not be able to save it as a file that could be opened back on a Windows machine. Is this true?

There are two bundled word-processor like apps:

(1) AppleWorks: import/export of Word documents works just fine — just make sure you select "Word Document" as the file format in the Save As dialog.

(2) TextEdit: very basic import/export of Word documents — as for AppleWorks above, but only capable of really basic document features (pretty much because that's all TextEdit is capable of).

I'm not sure what your friend was talking about. At any rate, both of them export to RTF just fine, which is probably a better interchange format anyway.

[sirnick4]

I spoke with somebody yesterday who said you were only able to view Word documents with the iBook's supplied word processor. He said you would not be able to save it as a file that could be opened back on a Windows machine. Is this true?

Yeah.. that's not true at all...

This is the kind of stuff that people say who don't really really know the truth.

AppleWorks comes on an iBook and plays very well with Word Documents.

It's a decent program.

[tomster2300]

Alright, so AppleWorks is basically Wordpad while TextEdit is basically Notepad? The problem with Wordpad for Windows is that Word files will not open in it, nor will Wordpad files open in Word.

Will there be no problems whatsoever with me typing and saving something in Appleworks then opening it in Word (not wordpad) and vice versa. I know I've asked this before, but since I spoke with this guy I got kind of concerned.

[tomster2300]

Yeah.. that's not true at all...

This is the kind of stuff that people say who don't really really know the truth.

AppleWorks comes on an iBook and plays very well with Word Documents.

It's a decent program.

Alright, thanks. You got this in before I got my last post in.

[sirnick4]

This is a link to the Apple Store (AppleWorks page)...

Click on the AppleWorks software, and then look at the 3rd paragraph down

Click here (http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore.woa/72504/wo/iO5f28jc7PRi2pBrnKE1SLeKqeU/2.0.11.1.0.6.12)

[staph]

Alright, so AppleWorks is basically Wordpad while TextEdit is basically Notepad? The problem with Wordpad for Windows is that Word files will not open in it, nor will Wordpad files open in Word.

Actually no, TextEdit is closer to Wordpad (support for styles, tables, advanced typography, images etc.). AppleWorks is… somewhere between very simple components like Wordpad and MS Office. It contains a word processor, spreadsheet, database, presentation module and drawing module. They're pretty basic, but they're not wordpad level by any shake.

In addition, Apple has built basic Word import-export into the operating system, so third party applications like Mellel and DevonThink can leverage them without licensing fees or effort.

While I'm at it, the free Abiword and Neooffice/J both give you very decent Word import/export.

[sirnick4]

This is directly from the AppleWorks page on apple.com

Clicky (https://webspace.utexas.edu/njl224/Picture%201.png?uniq=-ymx0qx)


Sorry.. .it's a .png file...

I'll convert it in a sec

[tomster2300]

Thanks guys, that's more reassuring for me. One last time, you guys think I could truely benefit from having my own laptop in college? I just found out that many places downtown are wireless as well, so that's an additional reason to get one I suppose. My college is downtown -- one street separates the campus from downtown. That's why we're one of the top ten party schools in the nation :).

[tomster2300]

This is directly from the AppleWorks page on apple.com

Clicky (https://webspace.utexas.edu/njl224/Picture%201.png?uniq=-ymx0qx)


Sorry.. .it's a .png file...

I'll convert it in a sec


Whoa, weird shapes and numbers :).

[sirnick4]

Yeah, wireless is sweet!

Please tomster.. Buy it!!

This will probably be the best purchase you have ever made. When I bought my Powerbook last year, it was for me.

Switching to a Mac sounds kinda scary at first... but I PROMISE that once you use it, you will wonder why it took you so long to switch ;)

That's just my 2 cents.. :)

[sirnick4]

here's that link btw a/b AppleWorks...

here (https://webspace.utexas.edu/njl224/Picture%201.jpg?uniq=-ymwxzp)

[tomster2300]

Yeah, wireless is sweet!

Please tomster.. Buy it!!

This will probably be the best purchase you have ever made. When I bought my Powerbook last year, it was for me.

Switching to a Mac sounds kinda scary at first... but I PROMISE that once you use it, you will wonder why it took you so long to switch ;)

That's just my 2 cents.. :)

Well I know I want one, I'm just trying to justify the price by figuring out if I need one :). It's the price which is getting me. :\ I think I'm just going to break down and buy it so I can quit wondering. If I don't use it much this semester I still have three and 1/2 more years.

BTW, Is this the link you keep trying to direct me to?

http://www.apple.com/appleworks/

[sirnick4]

yeah, that's the one ;)

[sirnick4]

ha, I can't wait till you get it.

You'll laugh when you go back and read this long thread ;)

[MCQ]

Well I know I want one, I'm just trying to justify the price by figuring out if I need one :). It's the price which is getting me. :\ I think I'm just going to break down and buy it so I can quit wondering. If I don't use it much this semester I still have three and 1/2 more years.

Okay. Price-wise, it's tough to beat as far as a 12" notebook. Dell's best option is a similarly configured 700m notebook. With their *best* deal, a $750 off $1500 coupon, you can get one for around $800 (before tax). However, you wouldn't get bluetooth, HD with sudden motion sensor, or graphics as powerful as the Mobility Radeon 9550. You also wouldn't get something as nice as the iLife suite.

The iBook with edu discount is around $1000 before tax(assuming you upgrade to a 60GB HD). Combine it with the BTS promo of a free iPod mini after rebate that you could sell afterwards, you could get the 12" iBook for around $850 after a little bit of legwork. You also get the free support of this community with any Mac or OS X questions. :)

If for some reason you use the iBook for a bit and don't like it... sell it on eBay after a couple months. You can probably break even at worst, and still buy whatever notebook you want at that point.

It's as close to a win-win as you'll get.

[tomster2300]

Well I can get the Dell Inspiron 9300 for $1,000 after a $600 coupon. It includes:

Intel Pentium M 1.6 ghz processor
6800 GO 256 mb
256 mb DDR2 ram
40 gig HD
24x CD-RW/DVD combo
internal wifi
17" wide screen

The only problem I can see is its weight which is 9.4 lbs. That's awfully heavy. That thing is certainly pretty nice though; it's geared towards being a desktop replacement.

That offer -- despite its weight -- is hard to pass up.

EDIT: I forgot to add that I would purchase either 512 or a gig of additional ram from newegg.

EDIT: What kind of peripherals would I use bluetooth for?

[MCQ]

You've already mentioned that weight would be an issue though and that you would want mobility as a journalism major.

Don't buy something because it's a good deal. Buy something because it meets your needs. Buying a desktop replacement notebook when you already have a nice desktop at home, and you want something to easily travel around with doesn't seem to serve any purpose.

[tomster2300]

Alright. I'm sorry for repeating myself, I just want to make sure I find out and show my other options. I know I'm dragging this thread out and apologize for doing so, I just have a lot of questions (though I do feel like I'm beating a dead horse).

I found out from Apple's site that the iPod deal requires that you pay for the iPod then send in a mail-in rebate. If I bought this rig at an Apple store would I still have a mail-in rebate or could they just give it to me? (I'm assuming I would still have to).

I'm going to call them in the morning about this, but I was hoping somebody could tell me tonight. Thank you all for putting up with me and my questions.

[DMBand0026]

Ask away, that's what we're here for. :)

You'll have to mail in the rebate, they won't give it to you on the spot. Sorry. :(

[tomster2300]

How long do the rebates take to come back usually?

[RowdyScot]

You said you were wondering if you would actually *need* a laptop at college. Let me say this...I couldn't have survived without mine last year. Being able to just pull out my PowerBook and work allowed me to finish things when I had the time without having to run home. I just had to find a place to sit down. I'll put it this way. You don't *need* an iBook for college, unless you want free time and a social life. And for a journalism major, you will highly benefit from having an iBook with you. I was a reporter and layout editor last year, and my PowerBook was always right there for interviews and to hop into InDesign to add a completed article to the newspaper.

As far as the Dell offer is concerned, I only see a minimal difference in proc speed and more weight, and XP instead of Tiger. Believe me, that's not a fair trade. Tiger is a far superior OS.

I'd also like to say that you should look into what software might be offered free through UGA. Many universities offer free programs for use on their network, and if so they should have Mac versions of the software.

[DMBand0026]

I got one in about two weeks, but it has taken me as many as 6 to get them back. It's the standard "Please allow 6-8 weeks for processing of your rebate" thing. Although it never really takes that long, it's just nice for them to have the buffer. I'd say 2-4 weeks is a pretty safe bet.

[tomster2300]

You said you were wondering if you would actually *need* a laptop at college. Let me say this...I couldn't have survived without mine last year. Being able to just pull out my PowerBook and work allowed me to finish things when I had the time without having to run home. I just had to find a place to sit down. I'll put it this way. You don't *need* an iBook for college, unless you want free time and a social life. And for a journalism major, you will highly benefit from having an iBook with you. I was a reporter and layout editor last year, and my PowerBook was always right there for interviews and to hop into InDesign to add a completed article to the newspaper.

As far as the Dell offer is concerned, I only see a minimal difference in proc speed and more weight, and XP instead of Tiger. Believe me, that's not a fair trade. Tiger is a far superior OS.

I'd also like to say that you should look into what software might be offered free through UGA. Many universities offer free programs for use on their network, and if so they should have Mac versions of the software.

Unfortunately UGA does not offer any deals on actual apple systems. They don't even sell them. They do sell some Mac software though. I asked about the Mac version of Office and they said it was $150 -- that seems to be the same price you can get it off Apple with the student discount. UGA's big partner is Dell; they offer exclusively Dell laptops and pcs unfortunately. Their laptops are all Latitudes and are extremely overpriced in my opinion. I don't care if the Latitudes use higher quality parts than Inspirons...this shouldnt warrant a $700+ price increase over an Inspiron configured exactly the same. That is BS. The UGA guy tried to explain to me that they would last longer than an Inspiron...please. I'm glad I don't buy into that stuff...literally :lol:

Thank you also for the rebate info. Hopefully I can talk my parents into paying for that since they'll get their money back.

[sirnick4]

Ditto to RowdyScot..

I can't imagine how I would have been able to survive with out my powerbook this past year of college.

I really like Word's feature of being able to record the professor and type at the same time.. and being able to click in my document to hear what the professor was saying at the time I typed something. I don't think this feature is on the PC version of Word. <-- I could be wrong though.

But as far as needing it... I guess it is possible to get through with college without it.. but it is one of those things, IMO, that makes me more organized. I use iCal to remind me when assignments are due.. Mail to keep up with all the email you get in college (trust me, it's a lot)... Address Book to keep in touch with everyone (tons of other features too, btw)... Bluetooth with my cell phone to keep all of these things listed above in sync.. the list goes on and on..

Buying an iBook is a very good investment. Macs last longer than PC's, it's just a proven fact. Plus, as mentioned b4, the resale value is more too :)

Although, with the Intel switch and all, that might be so true now, but.. My real point is that a Mac is the Rolls Royce of computers :)

[tomster2300]

Ditto to RowdyScot..

I can't imagine how I would have been able to survive with out my powerbook this past year of college.

I really like Word's feature of being able to record the professor and type at the same time.. and being able to click in my document to hear what the professor was saying at the time I typed something. I don't think this feature is on the PC version of Word. <-- I could be wrong though.

But as far as needing it... I guess it is possible to get through with college without it.. but it is one of those things, IMO, that makes me more organized. I use iCal to remind me when assignments are due.. Mail to keep up with all the email you get in college (trust me, it's a lot)... Address Book to keep in touch with everyone (tons of other features too, btw)... Bluetooth with my cell phone to keep all of these things listed above in sync.. the list goes on and on..

Buying an iBook is a very good investment. Macs last longer than PC's, it's just a proven fact. Plus, as mentioned b4, the resale value is more too :)

Although, with the Intel switch and all, that might be so true now, but.. My real point is that a Mac is the Rolls Royce of computers :)

How much did you pay for Word?

[MCQ]

Alright. I'm sorry for repeating myself, I just want to make sure I find out and show my other options. I know I'm dragging this thread out and apologize for doing so, I just have a lot of questions (though I do feel like I'm beating a dead horse).


No problem, we're here to help. :) You're doing a great job of research... just trying to help present options that would best suit your needs from your description, so that you come up with a well-informed decision. I think the 700m is a much better candidate for a portable notebook than the 9300.

Oh yeah, as far as Bluetooth: typically used in wireless connections for things like Bluetooth-enabled cell phones(transferring phone numbers, calendars, etc), wireless mice, etc.

Office for Mac (Student/Teacher edition) is $149, though Apple has a $50 mail-in-rebate to bring the price down to $99 after rebate.

[sirnick4]

15 bucks at UT. you should wait to get it when you go to college

[sirnick4]

Don't buy it from Apple... till you know for sure that your school offers a deal like mine.. Most colleges do, Microsoft is pretty good with that :)

[tomster2300]

Wow, that's cheap. I'm taking you didn't buy the Office suite then, just the single program? I didn't know they offered it like that.

[sirnick4]

No, I did :) With Virtual PC too

[DMBand0026]

Most schools do, and that's for the whole thing, Word, Excel, Entourage...and whatever else comes with it.

[sirnick4]

Yeah, it's pretty sweet. I run XP whenever I need to. Live it up! College is great for stuff like this!

Hmm.. sounds even more enticing doesn't it? :)

[sirnick4]

I don't know if you know about Mathematica.. well, normally it is like $1000, but since I'm a college student, I can get it for $92.

Now.. if only I could stay in college my whole life ;)

[tomster2300]

Whoa, so you got the whole suite plus virtual pc for $15? Nice.

I'm trying to configure that Dell 700m on their website MCQ and I'm trying to add the 40% off coupon code, yet it won't work for me. It comes up with a window stating Error: This coupon has already been redeemed. I know I've added that coupon once before when configuring another system, but I never made a purchase...why would it be saying that I've redeemed it? This is very annoying.

[MCQ]

Whoa, so you got the whole suite plus virtual pc for $15? Nice.

I'm trying to configure that Dell 700m on their website MCQ and I'm trying to add the 40% off coupon code, yet it won't work for me. It comes up with a window stating Error: This coupon has already been redeemed. I know I've added that coupon once before when configuring another system, but I never made a purchase...why would it be saying that I've redeemed it? This is very annoying.

Check gotapex.com for details on the 700m coupon... the one I refer to works on one specific 700m configuration.

As for Office... not all universities have the partnership with Microsoft that allows the $15 CD deals. I'd check with the UGA first to see what they have to offer.

[sirnick4]

I'm not positive.. but it looks like Microsoft doesn't do the $15 thing at UGA

But, I would still check before you bought it from Apple.

[tomster2300]

So I should just buy the laptop from Apple and then check at the UGA bookstore about software? Thanks for the help everyone. I'm going to bed for the night but I'll check back in the morning.

[sirnick4]

So I should just buy the laptop from Apple and then check at the UGA bookstore about software? Thanks for the help everyone. I'm going to bed for the night but I'll check back in the morning.

Yeah, definitely.. I actually got sucked into the whole "buy Microsoft from the Apple Store" thing.. So, I paid $150 bucks for it (w/o Virtual PC) only to realize when I got to school that I could get it for 15 dollars..
:\

So, I bought it anyways :) Mostly cuz I wanted to try out Virtual PC.

But, buy the computer from Apple.

Athens, Georgia is in a weird location because the two nearest Apple Stores are an hour and a half away. I'm lucky becuase there is one right here in Austin :)

There are also tons of Apple certified Reseller stores though, which can be found on the Apple site. From my experience, you get pretty good customer service from these stores, so thats a plus.

I'm still looking to see if Microsoft offers that deal.. I'll keep looking and let ya know if I find anything :D

[tomster2300]

How does Virtual PC work for you?

[staph]

How does Virtual PC work for you?

It works just fine.

Don't expect blazing speed, but it's tolerable when you really have to use a Windows only application (e-Tax, I'm looking at you).

[tomster2300]

http://www.journeyed.com/search.asp

These are the prices offered through UGA. These prices aren't great are they?

[MCQ]

http://www.journeyed.com/search.asp

These are the prices offered through UGA. These prices aren't great are they?

Standard pricing. Any college student with valid ID can get those prices. I reiterate the $99 after $50 mail in rebate if you go through the Apple Store online is likely your best option.

Another option is Amazon at $133... there's a $35 mail in rebate available there to get it down to $98, but you may have to work a bit harder on the rebate. Last time I did a rebate with Amazon, it took 10 weeks+, several e-mails and a resubmission.

[tomster2300]

Standard pricing. Any college student with valid ID can get those prices. I reiterate the $99 after $50 mail in rebate if you go through the Apple Store online is likely your best option.

Another option is Amazon at $133... there's a $35 mail in rebate available there to get it down to $98, but you may have to work a bit harder on the rebate. Last time I did a rebate with Amazon, it took 10 weeks+, several e-mails and a resubmission.

Good grief. I think I'll start off with Appleworks and if I need something more then I'll upgrade to it. How outdated is Appleworks?

[staph]

Good grief. I think I'll start off with Appleworks and if I need something more then I'll upgrade to it. How outdated is Appleworks?

Pretty outdated, but more than good enough for undergraduate humanities degrees. Also, you can't beat the price.

[Luca]

Yeah, don't buy Office now just because you think you might need it. You have several free options available to work on Word documents with your Mac. There's AppleWorks, Text Edit (a lot like Word Pad, but a very nice program nonetheless), and NeoOffice. If anything, you should try out NeoOffice and see how you like it, since that has complete Office compatibility and works natively with Office files. AppleWorks requires a translator - you can open Word files, and save to a Word file, but you have to translate the file into a .cwk (AppleWorks proprietary) file to work on it.

You can always use RTF (Rich Text), a very good and extremely compatible format for text. Any good word processor should easily be able to handle Rich Text files natively.

[staph]

AppleWorks requires a translator - you can open Word files, and save to a Word file, but you have to translate the file into a .cwk (AppleWorks proprietary) file to work on it.

I think you might want to rephrase that as "Appleworks features Word import/export only" i.e. you have to use import (rather than open) every time you open a Word file, and export every time you save to it unless you convert it to a .cwk file whilst you work on it. The translator (MacLinkPlus) is, of course, built in.

If you really care, you can get a more up to date version of it here (http://www.dataviz.com/products/maclinkplus/), but only for cash dollars.

[Kickaha]

Well I can get the Dell Inspiron 9300 for $1,000 after a $600 coupon. It includes:

Intel Pentium M 1.6 ghz processor
6800 GO 256 mb
256 mb DDR2 ram
40 gig HD
24x CD-RW/DVD combo
internal wifi
17" wide screen

The only problem I can see is its weight which is 9.4 lbs. That's awfully heavy. That thing is certainly pretty nice though; it's geared towards being a desktop replacement.

That offer -- despite its weight -- is hard to pass up.

It might weigh and cost even more by the time you're done: http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/businesstechnology/2002439223_ptlaptops13.html

[critter]

tom, prepare for a terribly long story... perhaps a terrible long story also, i dunno :-)

anyway, after using pc after pc after pc, im really glad i had to buy a mac (my major requires it). let me elaborate on a pro that has already been mentioned.. ease of connecting to wireless networks. good god. my dad bought a compaq laptop (after swearing hed never buy a compaq again), but this shitty thing ended up being five hundred bucks after rebates so he was sucked into it unfortunately. he bought it for his ebay 'business' (he has a real job also, and his newfound ebay business brings in certainly enough money to buy an apple), anyway, he bought it for is ebay business so when he goes on vacation he can check his auctions and reply to emails and all that. what i find too unfortunate/humorous is that he has only been able to use the laptop ONE TIME wirelessly. he connected to a stores wireless connection at the beach and hasnt been able to use it wirelessly since, not on other open wireless connections at the beach on other trips since then, not even on my familys wireless network. then i come home and he expects me to figure out the problem, which i end up doing because sometimes im a good son, so i sit there for probably two hours, as the little 'trying to connect to wireless connection' bar goes on and on for a while, never connecting, then i reinstall the linksys software (its a pcmcia card, of course it was a new laptop this year and didnt come with wireless built in.. you get what you pay for) and fiddle around with the crap for another hour and cant get it to work. so instead of spending an extra thousand (at most) to get a laptop that will have no trouble connecting to wireless connections, the one thing he bought the computer for, he has spent five hundred to have a useless machine.

okay so thats only one story, but for his desktop pc, which he bought about a year and a couple months ago (because in the computer he had previously the hard drive died so he had to get a new computer immediately for the ebay junk), every -seriously- every time i come home, there is some problem that i have to fix on that computer. i come home probably every month or two. its terrible.

okay. so i have had a pc my first three years of college. i switched majors so this semester my major will require a mac so i just got one. now going back in time a little, this past year i knew id be getting a mac but felt like i should wait. during that time, my cd writer (48x buslink, burn proof of course) started messing up an average of one out of two cds. messing up meaning nero would freeze and id have to ctrl alt del the not responding program (my computer was decent for a pc of two years old at the time, 200gb of hard drive space [two drives], 768mb ram, that kinda crap, so it shouldve been okay burning a cd and having a few other programs running). after trying a few different things, i returned the cdrw drive to best buy and got a plextor dvd writer. after installing it, things really started going bad. my computer would restart about once a day and then later about once a week. this would drive me up the wall as you could imagine and im a mild mild mild-tempered guy. so my free time was spent trying to figure out the problem. that computer has never had ..i cant think of the name.. morpheus or mm.. any of those p2p filesharing programs, all my software was legitimate, cs, office, all that. okay, so i ran norton anti-virus, no viruses, ran ad-aware everyday to get rid of whatever internet explorer had so graciously brought to me (i was using firefox and ie (and netscape until i couldnt stand it anymore), but i needed ie for a few things that firefox didnt do to my liking). at first i thought my computer was overheating so i blew all the dust out of it i could, i ended up replacing the power supply hoping that would help, it didnt, i considered buying a different processor, but then figured itd be better to put that hundred or so dollars towards the mac id be getting in less than a year. so the problems continued. somehow my calculator disappeared. i didnt have a real calculator anymore because i had taken all the maths i needed, so i relied on the computer calculator for bills and junk because i took care of all of that between the people in my apartment. so that was obnoxious. then my internet explorer quit functioning, so i tried to reinstall it and then menu for reinstalling was so fucking confusing, it went something along the lines of: dont put a checkbox beside the items you dont want to reinstall not dont un not not un. and so of course i checked beside internet explorer because it was the only thing i wanted reinstalled, and some..........how it ended up permanently screwing that up so i didnt have explorer anymore. oh yeah, i forgot to mention that after i installed the dvd writer, my sound would mess up after a couple hours of using winamp or windows media player, and it would play like a quarter second of the music every ten seconds. it was a complete pain in the ass. so i would restart my computer and play my music for another hour and a half before my sound would screw up again. i assumed it was a problem with the onboard soundcard so i bought a new sound card. all seemed good for a week and then the problem started again. i had an old version of windows media player, i think seven, whichever one came with xp home three years ago. so i read reviews for wmp ten, which were pretty poor for being the operating systems bundled media player, but i thought if it worked it would be worth the cons. but it didnt. so i had wmp ten and then figured id go back and download nine but of course that is impossible because if you have a newer version windows wont let you download an older version. godddddd. so i decided to reformat the computer. that was pleasant for the first week and then of course my sound decided to be crappy again, my computer would restart for no reason, et cetera et cetera.

SOOOO what im getting at :-) is that i couldnt have wanted a mac with more intensity. i had friends who had them and loved them, and there i was dealing with that garbage ass pc. so finally the day came to buy the mac, tax free weekend in north carolina, student discount, iPod rebate, ahhhhh.

finally, i could not be happier with my purchase. i had to buy a computer so there was only so much i could do about postponing for the next thing to come out, which was nice, it kept me from going any longer without a good computer :-) but anyway, osx is much better than xp, much more pleasant to use, beautiful, self-explanatory, easy, any positive thing i could think of will describe osx over xp.

additionally, my friend has told me that osx is more advanced than what windows vista will be (anyone wanna confirm that?). sheesh. sorry that was so drawn out...

EDIT: Added some extra paragraph breaks where it looked like you wanted to put a paragraph. You have to hit Return twice for it to create a space, otherwise it just starts a new line. Hopefully this will be a little more readable... - Luca

[Luca]

I added a few paragraph breaks where you had originally put just a single new line. That should make it a bit easier to read your post.

And by the way, hear hear. Windows is so frustrating. Thing is, if you get your computer up and running perfectly, you'll be fine. It's like a house of cards... it's great if you set it up just right and maintain it meticulously. But 99% of computer owners either don't know how to keep their Windows installation clean, or they try and fail, and so you end up with most people running horribly messed up computers. Windows has potential for some great power, given the amount of hardware customization and the low prices available. But if anything (and I mean anything) gets messed up at all, you're F'd. The house of cards comes crashing down and you'd be better for a complete format and reinstall at best.

To the original poster - as I think I said before, don't lose sight of your ultimate goal. Just because you can get more hardware for the same price, should you? Battery life and portability are just as important as overall power and speed, if not more. I mean, if you have $50k to spend on a car and you're going to be driving it in the mountains, are you going to buy a Porsche Boxster just because you personally think it's cooler than, say, a Land Rover? I mean, I'd rather have a Boxster than a Land Rover too, but if I'm driving it in the mountains there's not much of a question which is the better choice.

[critter]

ill fix it somewhat :-) grammar nazi! just messing....

[critter]

hahah or something magical will happen and someone will do it for me :-) thanks

[turtle]

My $.02...
It's worth the plunge to get a Mac notebook. Get away from WinXP/Vista while you can. As you can see from my sig I have a few PC's but LOVE my Mac. My WinXP systems do their job but I enjoy using my Mac. I have FAR more powerful systems than this Mac, but they can't beat the software. iMovie and iPhoto are two easy example of why it is worth switching.

iMovie-> I borrowed a friends old Sony MiniDV camcorder and recorded my wife and daughter in a ballet show. My first time using a camcorder ever. When I got finished I stopped by the store and got a firewire cable since my friend uses USB. I connected the camera to the Mac and iMovie opened and connected to my camera. I transfered the video onto the Mac and began to edit and convert for e-mail and home video use. So simple I almost got my own Sony just to play with!

iPhoto-> I have an older Olympus with a SmartMedia card. Works great with my PC (well until I went 64bit) but I got a USB card reader so I could download while on the fly on vacation and deal with the pics later. I hooked the card reader to the Mac and put my media card in it, guess what happened? The Mac mounted the card and then iPhoto opened and downloaded the photos from the card. I then am able to manipulate them with iPhoto, PhotoShop etc...

What about WinXP's? The ease of use is just not there. See, as Luca said, it isn't the hardware that makes the difference. Trust me on this one, you really won't get a better "deal" getting a WinXP machine. While the product could be cheaper, it won't be better. The hardware only drives the software. You use the software, not the hardware. Remember this fact. Hope this helps.

[sirnick4]

Good point indeed turtle2472

[tomster2300]

I bought my textbooks today and two of them came with bundled software. Is bundled software usually compatible with Macs? I guess I'm going to have to look the book up online and check that way since I don't plan on unwrapping them until the first day of class -- they warned me that they didn't know which of the two possible textbooks I needed, so I'm not going to open it. The stupid class hasn't been assigned a teacher yet, so they bookstore has no clue on which book to recommend -- dumb. If I open it (it's in clear plastic wrap) then they won't give me the full price of the book back if it turns out to be the wrong one.

[sirnick4]

All of my textbooks that have come with software have been hybrid disks.

I find it hard to imagine if they didn't do it.

[zippy]

I just helped my sister order a 12" iBook the other week. She is heading to college and I think she got a pretty screaming deal from the Apple online store:

12" stock iBook: 949.00
Office 2004 ( minus $50 rebate): 99.95
Mighty Mouse: 44.00
iPod Mini (after rebate) free
HP DeskJet5740 (after $100 rebate) free
Shipping: free
Leaving Windows forever: priceless

Total bill was $1092.95 - a great deal if you ask me!

[sirnick4]

I bought my textbooks today and two of them came with bundled software. Is bundled software usually compatible with Macs? I guess I'm going to have to look the book up online and check that way since I don't plan on unwrapping them until the first day of class -- they warned me that they didn't know which of the two possible textbooks I needed, so I'm not going to open it. The stupid class hasn't been assigned a teacher yet, so they bookstore has no clue on which book to recommend -- dumb. If I open it (it's in clear plastic wrap) then they won't give me the full price of the book back if it turns out to be the wrong one.


Oh btw, most textbooks have websites on them that you can go to. That would show u the compatiblity of the software.

[tomster2300]

That's what I tried to do last night on google but couldn't find anything.

[sirnick4]

So it doesn't show the software requirements on the actual cd?


Everyone I've bought has had it directly on the cd. Are these journalism classes? or another? If they are journalism t-books, then surely they would be Mac compatible. . . A lot of journalists use Macs. (except for people like the Wall Street Journal.. hee hee. Who knows.. Maybe even they have started to come around..) :)

[tomster2300]

That's the problem. The software is in its own little cardboard sleeve thing on top of the book, and everything is wrapped in plastic wrap. I'm afraid to open it in case it turns out not to be the right book and I need to return it. Ripped plastic wrap = I cant get my money back for it. What I can see through the wrap is a very generic little box with just the name of the program on it. I searched both programs online and found nothing stating its compatibility.

I start class this Thurs. so I'll find out sooner or later.

[Kitsune]

Thank you for the advice. I've heard that Mac's get no viruses like you said, how can that be so?

Well, Mac users like to hint that it's because their computers are forged from gold, but the more accurate truth is that it's because modern virus writers don't care about Macs. They're out to cause trouble or make money through identity theft, so naturally they're going to expend their effort on the OS with the majority market share.

In the olden days of 1988ish when the computer wars were still in progress, there were a great number of viruses written for Macs. Only without an Internet to spread through, they relied on infecting software and being spread via floppy to other computers, so they weren't so widespread as modern worms are. And by the time OS X was written, the Macintosh market share had dwindled close to the single digits, so nobody bothered to write viruses for the new system. Thus, Macintosh's current virus-free status. Should it become popular enough to challenge Windows again, however, you can bet your house that the virus writers will turn their attention back to Macs. There are security vulnerabilities in OS X, there are attacks that can compromise a Macintosh.

NOTHING is one hundred percent safe in today's world, so never get lazy about making very certain that you have all of the security updates for your computer, no matter what computer you own. If, a day or a month or a year from now, someone does come out with a widespread attack that targets Macs, you'll be very, very sorry if your sole defense against it is ignorance. You can make Windows iron-clad safe if you're paranoid enough to take all the steps, and you can make your Mac as weak as a stick of butter before a hot knife if you're lenient enough to ignore them. It's disingenuous of Apple to try to tout system security to their buyers, because system security always relies on the user. I worry that too many Mac users are too complacent about building their house out of bricks because of that perceived safety that Apple advertises.

[Kickaha]

Um, not quite.

Macs don't hold interest for the *commercial* virus writers, the ones that make $ on the backs of infected boxes. You're right on that.

Macs are Target Numero Uno for the virus writers out to make a name for themselves, and yet... nada.

You are right, no system is 100% secure, but apparently Macs are, out of the box, secure enough that even the challenge isn't enough for the hot new youngnesses out there to put in the effort.

Yes, you *CAN* put in a rather large amount of on-going effort to make a Windows box 'secure'. Yes, you *CAN* screw up a Mac badly enough to make it an open relay point for the protocol of your choice. The point is that out of the box, as most consumers are going to be running things, the Mac simply is more secure.

Nothing's perfect, but when the scorecard reads 0 goals against you after five years, even the most boneheaded user is going to notice a wee trend.

I agree with you 100% about not getting complacent though. Keep those Security updates up to date. Know what services you've opened up, and why. Other than that though... there simply isn't a lot to do on a Mac. Cripes, I don't even *own* anti-virus software. There's just no need.

(And actually, there were 37 viruses for Macs pre-OS X. I'm not sure how that becomes 'great numbers' when compared to the what, 80,000+ for Windows now?)

[sirnick4]

True, Macs can potentially get viruses.. nothing is 100% perfect but...

It simply is harder for a virus to get on a Mac because it is UNIX-based. You can't install any program on a Mac without the administrator's password which is different than a PC.

Again, nothing is perfect, but, like Kickaha said, the Mac is way more secure out of the box than any PC. <-- This is very important for basic consumers who don't really know how to protect their computer from viruses.

I don't have any virus program installed on my Mac (I used to have Virex w/ .Mac) because I really don't see the need. I know my computer is safe. I really dig the "Stealth Mode" feature (a part of the firewall) in Tiger. It kick's butt! :)

[Kitsune]

Well, my experience is perhaps skewed in that 1988 saw me in a lab of Mac SEs in a middle school, and every time I ran a virus scan on a machine it'd come up with around a hundred infected files. Those viruses were tenacious, fast-spreading little suckers; I'd get bored and clean out every machine on a Monday and they'd all be infected to the brim by Friday.

But on the upside, someone stuck Sim City on a couple of the machines, which was nice.

[Kickaha]

Oh yeah, we didn't have many, but damned they were quick to spread.

Hmm... smaller number... higher quality...

Crap, even our viruses were better. :)

[Kickaha]

True, Macs can get viruses.. nothing is 100% perfect but...

I'd edit this to 'Macs can *potentially* get viruses, some day, when someone actually manages to write one successfully...'

Right now there are zero. Period. End of story. Nada, zilch, ziiiiiiipah.

[atomicbartbeans]

Yeah. :)

[staph]

(And actually, there were 37 viruses for Macs pre-OS X. I'm not sure how that becomes 'great numbers' when compared to the what, 80,000+ for Windows now?)

by Sophos' count, it's broken 100,000.

[HezMah19]

Vi-rus? What is this Vi-rus you speak of??? :lol:
God I love mac... :)

[Radarbob]

I've owned apple computers since 1981 and Macintoshes since 1987. I've seen it all....

Will it last four years
Yes. (that's a period there)

By "lasting 4 years" we mean will software I need / want run on it in the future? My experience, yes, absolutely. Macintosh has historically been VERY much more forward compatable than PCs. Matter of fact, I'm writing this reply on an original iBook (300MHz!). Bought it in 1999 and it came with OS 8.6. Now I'm running OS 10.2. If you understand how fundamentally different "classic" mac OS is from OS X you know how amazing that really is.

Historically the useful life of the macintosh has been shown to be longer than a PC. That certainly has been true for me.

I have a program that I originally bought to run on my Macintosh SE under OS 7 in 1993 - and it runs today in OS X under classic mode. That is stunning, it certainly suprised me. Yes, this is exceptional, but it underscores my point. You know, that's like asking a win 3.1 app to run in XP. To a PCer, he would think you're making a joke if you suggested that!

Not so powerful?
Gotta be careful throwing around phrases like that. There are lots of variables - so take the next fact w/ a grain of salt... My iBook (300MHZ remember) running OS 9 was *clearly* faster than my neighbor's PC laptop running at 600 MHz.

compatability
As far as I'm concerned that's not even an issue anymore. Now, I'm talking about joe average using his computer for everyday things - and for college work.

I routinely swap documents between my mac and PC at work, in particular MS Office - word and excel. BTW, thumb drives are great!

BTW, file format issues is as much a PC-to-PC problem as it is mac-to-pc. Every release of MS Word Micosoft changes the file format - thus older versions of Word cannot read the files! Great incentive for you to upgrade! Just save documents in a common format (the older verion's format or a "standardized" format like RTF - just look in your "save as..." dialog box)

For a computer programming class I used to write the programs on my mac and then copy them to the PC and compile and run them. For another class I wrote the programs on my mac, FTP'd (a way to transfer files over a network or the internet) the program to a UNIX machine and compiled and ran them there.

I used to take my iBook to work with me because the Mac only editor, BBEdit, is the best computer code editor. ALL pc editors suck lemons by comparison.

Food for Thought
I can run multiple operating systems on my 6 yr old mac - OS 8, OS 9, OS X, UNIX (which is what OS X really is) and and several versions of Windows by using Virtual PC (if I wanted to!) - a program that fakes out Windows into thinking it's on an intel box. Oh, new macintoshes do not run OS 9 or earlier anymore. They just cant. That's what "classic mode" in OS X compensates for.

So the question is not "what can I do with my Mac?" it's "What can't I do with my Mac?".

A final tip for journalism software
There is a mac program called Nisus Writer that is designed for writers. I suppose the devil is in the fine details; You'll have to get to know that a bit to see how it's better for the writing process than, say, the unused/useless feature bloat that is MS Word. Anyway Nisus Writer is supposted to be especially excellent if you write in a foreign language with funny alphabets that go "the wrong way". I don't use Nisus Writer, but I've heard good things.

[losslesshead]

All in all, you ARE going to be happy with an iBook you get. Macs do last long (as proved above). When I used windows, after about two years my machine would crash and burn. And that gets too pricey after only a short amount of time. Plus, Macs are REALLY fast. My 2.0 GHz iMac is WAY faster than my former computer, a 3.4 GHz P4!

[Spits]

Hey tomster2300, I see your major issue is the price. But can't you buy the iBook via ADC Student membership? I am not really sure about the exact discount you'll get on an iBook (10% or 12%), but it costs $100,- and you'll get an once-per-lifetime discount. That's the way I'll buy my powerbook soon (which get a discount of 20% :))

[Brad]

Spits: the discounted prices for ADC members are available at the ADC version of the Apple Store. Go here (http://developer.apple.com/membership/usa.html) and click the link titled ADC Hardware Purchase Program Store under Ordering Information.

I can't post a direct link to it because the ADC store doesn't allow direct linking.

[Spits]

Spits: the discounted prices for ADC members are available at the ADC version of the Apple Store. Go here (http://developer.apple.com/membership/usa.html) and click the link titled ADC Hardware Purchase Program Store under Ordering Information.

I can't post a direct link to it because the ADC store doesn't allow direct linking.

Yes that's the normal ADC membership. But I meant the ADC Student Membership (http://developer.apple.com/students/). It gives the same discount (http://developer.apple.com/membership/usa.html) as normal ADC Members receive. But it is a once-per-lifetime discount, for a cheaper price. And maybe it's a good option for the topicstarter, tomster2300.

[Brad]

Huh? :confused: What are you talking about? You just said yourself that the ADC Student Membership gets the same price as a regular ADC Membership.

The "once in a lifetime" bit just means that you can order from the ADC version of the Apple Store once in a lifetime. There's no mysterious additional discounts to be included; the prices are exactly what are shown there online.

[Spits]

I'm sorry, I think we have some kind of miscommunication caused by my English(because I'm dutch my English is sometimes unclear). But I totally agreed with your posts, but you were linking to the normal ADC membership. And I just wanted to make clear for the TS that I was speaking about the Student membership. So to make it clear for him he can be a Student member for $100 instead of $500(for normal ADC membership).
So I really am totally agreed with your post. :)

And it wasn't my intention to give an idea of the existence of a mysterious discount. Maybe you can tell me from which part of my post you're understanding this, so I can edit that?

[lexpurr]

hello all,

sorry for joining in late into this discussion/reopening a closed post,

but i have read this long-long post, having my own hesitations as to passing or not to Mac, and if yes, which laptop.

and having read all of you, i think i've finally made up my mind: ibook 12" it'll be.

however i still have one unanswered question:
since the 12" display is really small, and since i'm still having my confortable big heavy desktop 15" screen,
will i be able to use it with my ibook when i'm at home?
does anybody else do this- like uses when possible a normal screen?

thanks for all your comments,
L

[staph]

however i still have one unanswered question:
since the 12" display is really small,

You get used to it pretty quickly. Really.

and since i'm still having my confortable big heavy desktop 15" screen,
will i be able to use it with my ibook when i'm at home?
does anybody else do this- like uses when possible a normal screen?

You certainly can, although it's only supported at the native resolution (1024*768) or lower. There's a VGA adapter in the box when you get it.

I only ever bother when I'm doing Indesign stuff, because of the large page area to deal with, and the inordinate number of palettes in its UI.

[lexpurr]

Thanks Staph for the quick response.

actually i only use 1024*768 on my 15" screen, so that'd be perfect. however, would i need extra stuff for it, like cables and so? or does my ibook as i buy it come with all that it takes?

one more thing: what 's this " a VGA adapter in the box when you get it."?

cordialement,
L

[lexpurr]

oh and what about getting more RAM to ibook? is it worth buying that extraRAM directly with the ibook, or can i buy it elsewhere cheaper, and install it myself?
thanks

[Franz Josef]

since the 12" display is really smallWelcome lexpurr. You will very likely find the 12" screen doesn't seem at all small in everyday use. Partly as a result of good hardware design and partly as a result of a very intuitive OS (particularly a feature called Exposé - http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/expose/ ), the 12" screen punches well above its weight.

[staph]

Thanks Staph for the quick response.

actually i only use 1024*768 on my 15" screen, so that'd be perfect. however, would i need extra stuff for it, like cables and so? or does my ibook as i buy it come with all that it takes?

Should be fine out of the box, with the included cable.

one more thing: what 's this " a VGA adapter in the box when you get it."?

cordialement,
L

The iBook has a mini-VGA* video port. The adapter is a little cable which plugs into the mini-VGA, and gives you a normal DB-15 VGA plug on the other end — so you should be able to plug your monitor straight in, with no hassles.

*I think it's a mini-VGA, but I could be wrong. It doesn't matter anyway, because of the adapter.

[staph]

oh and what about getting more RAM to ibook? is it worth buying that extraRAM directly with the ibook, or can i buy it elsewhere cheaper, and install it myself?
thanks

Yep, it's worth it, and if you're confident enough to install it yourself, you can almost certainly get it cheaper from elsewhere.

Here (http://www.info.apple.com/usen/cip/pdf/ibkg4/ibg4-mem-cip1.pdf) are some instructions on how to do it.

[lexpurr]

"if you're confident enough to install it yourself"
Hmmmmmm. i had a quick look on that pdf. basically it dont look so complicated... one reality is that i managed to make a "courtcircuit" once by plugging the wrong way cables in my PC. basically we noticed SMOKE coming out of it. we, meaning two girls, one of us being blonde :). result: i managed to burn down a connector to the motherboard. should i trust myself more on the way of assembling computer machines?

[staph]

"if you're confident enough to install it yourself"
Hmmmmmm. i had a quick look on that pdf. basically it dont look so complicated...

It really isn't, provided you're careful. Just don't use excessive force (you can be firm, just don't go overboard). You'll want to make sure that you get Mac-compatible memory, but it isn't that hard. The people at MacBidouille (http://www.macbidouille.com/) can probably help with good places in France to buy it, I imagine, if no one here does.

one reality is that i managed to make a "courtcircuit" once by plugging the wrong way cables in my PC.

My high school French suggests that the technical term you want is "short circuit". ;)

basically we noticed SMOKE coming out of it. we, meaning two girls, one of us being blonde :). result: i managed to burn down a connector to the motherboard. should i trust myself more on the way of assembling computer machines?

I seriously doubt you'd be able to manage anything as dramatic with memory installation. The RAM slot has a little guide, slightly off-centre, which physically prevents you from installing the RAM unless it's the right way around. The Airport card is pretty similar.

[lexpurr]

hello,

i finally did it: thursday night, october 6th, i ordered online an iBook 12" with 80G and an iSight.
only to find out yesterday that there was going to be a mystery release next wednesday.
what shall i do? try to cancel my order? what are the chances that they might release a new iBook or a new iSight??

Lexpurr shaking with excitement

[staph]

hello,

i finally did it: thursday night, october 6th, i ordered online an iBook 12" with 80G and an iSight.
only to find out yesterday that there was going to be a mystery release next wednesday.
what shall i do? try to cancel my order? what are the chances that they might release a new iBook or a new iSight??

Lexpurr shaking with excitement

Well, the iBooks were only updated a couple of months ago (http://www.macrumors.com/buyersguide/), so it would be almost unheard of for them to be updated again this soon.

As for the iSight… not sure. Probably not, but who can say?

[MCQ]

hello,

i finally did it: thursday night, october 6th, i ordered online an iBook 12" with 80G and an iSight.
only to find out yesterday that there was going to be a mystery release next wednesday.
what shall i do? try to cancel my order? what are the chances that they might release a new iBook or a new iSight??

Lexpurr shaking with excitement

Doubtful. Nothing's been mentioned about either product at the major "rumor" sites, so you should be okay. :)

[Franz Josef]

There are no guarantees lexpurr but any upgrades on 12th October are expected to be to the PowerBook / PowerMac lines. Who can say.

What you do know is that an iBook with a 80GB HD is an exceptionally good laptop - that harddrive will store an awful lot of music / photos / movies. In your place I'd just smugly enjoy my iBook / iSight as Steve is announcing upgrades on the 12th. :)