[chucker]

Originally Posted by kscherer I just looked up the definition and you are [partially] correct, Chucker. "Marketing" is all-inclusive (advertising is part of marketing, not separate from it). Which means the pundits (myself included) have been using the term "marketing" wrong all this time.

Well, not just pundits. Most companies use the term "marketing" in a manner that might as well mean advertising.

You're right that advertising is technically part of marketing, but I was referring specifically to your distinction:

The first means delivering the product you say you wanted/needed and you buying it because you want/need it. The second is delivering some random product and then convincing you that you want/need it, so you buy it even though you don't really want/need it.

This is true of many companies. Apple, however, has an unusually strict "product marketing" role that intends to fit the first definition, not the second (a cynic might argue that they often wind up in the second role, but that's neither here nor there). Advertising, then, merely becomes an end result much in the way operations/supply does.