[torifile]

No one answered my question above about amazon: do we think they'll stock these? They don't sell any Sony (or other companies') ereaders. And Robo mentioned that he thought Amazon would offer a kindle app for the ipad. I'm not so sure.

[Wyatt]

Originally Posted by torifile No one answered my question above about amazon: do we think they'll stock these? They don't sell any Sony (or other companies') ereaders. And Robo mentioned that he thought Amazon would offer a kindle app for the ipad. I'm not so sure.

I think they will stock them. The difference with other companies' readers is that they are only readers. That's not the case here.

You know what feature I'm excited about? The documents folder. Yes, the iPad actually has a folder that all applications can access, and which synchs to your Mac or PC. We finally have (sort of) filesystem access. I hope that gets carried over to the iPhone/iPod touch soon.

[torifile]

A few answers to some of the questions about the "iBooks" app:
On MichaelM8000:

Originally Posted by Wil Shipley Mike Matas is not at Apple any more. He’s a professional bum now.

On the app's resemblance to DL:

Originally Posted by Wil Shipley No, Apple didn’t license iBooks from me. They just copied me. Ah well.

On some bitterness:

Originally Posted by Wil Shipley I guess it’s not enough Apple has hired every employee who worked on Delicious Library, they also had to copy my product’s look. Flattery?

Reminds me of the Watson/Sherlock situation. $40 billion in the bank and they can't afford to license a UI that is clearly innovative?

[alcimedes]

That's pretty shitty. I thought for sure they would have moved them in-house and that's where it came from. Not impressed that they didn't pay him anything for taking 100% of what his app. (at least in previews) looks like.

I mean shit, I've had "iBooks" for 4+ years now ever since I paid for Delicious Library.

Bad Apple!

Random question:

Anyone know if the iPad can support multiple users or not?

[psmith2.0]

Wow, that's interesting. I assumed that was all part of it and brought in-house. It looks just like that Delicious stuff (and I knew there was that Michael M. connection through it all). Weird to hear that none of that is the case, and they just kinda swiped the look?

I have no idea about the multiple users, but it sure would make sense on such a device (put one in the family room or kitchen, and different family members can have their e-mail, bookmarks, songs, etc. in their own log-in account).

Otherwise, that's going to get a bit messy (people seeing each other's e-mail, corralling everyone's music together, a bookmark list that is six miles long, etc.)? Or is every person in the house expected to buy their own, at $499?



Maybe that's something that will be part of iPhone 4.0? I know I keep saying that on some of this stuff, but there seemed to be so many little "holes", and things not talked about or addressed yesterday (or quickly glossed over). I can't help but think that maybe they're part of an upcoming, unannounced iPhone OS update they just didn't want to spoil or get into yesterday?

[Iago]

My reaction:

* It's not a breakthrough product. It does lots of things well but not one thing exceptionally. That's probably a problem endemic to new device categories, but even so. iPhone is a breakthrough phone. The Mac is a breakthrough computer. The iPad is a breakthrough... iPod Touch.

* It's not as innovative and magical as Apple wants us to believe. I believe that by magical they mean "fast."

I don't like it. The industrial design is gorgeous, but the software is a massive limitation. The springboard doesn't work with that huge screen. It looks dated and lack of simple multitasking is a bit dire.

Overall I'm disappointed.

[joveblue]

Originally Posted by zsummers Also, one thing that has strangely been left out of all of the discussion (and as far as I saw, the presentation): MobileMe. Is that the missing piece here? With an upgrade to MobileMe, you could presumably get file access, family activities syncing, etc. I can see a family with an iMac, 2.5 iPads for the 2.5 kids, and maybe a laptop kicking around for the parent(s). Or maybe just iPads for everyone, connected via the cloud.

I don't have MobileMe, but won't just using it with the existing MobileMe iPhone and web apps be pretty awesome? I thought they would have talked about it a bit too but I don't think they need to do anything special for MobileMe to be awesome on this from the get go. It's really just a big iPod touch after all, with a larger-screen Safari that can access the sweet web apps made for desktops, too.

Originally Posted by Matsu 30/month for 3G unlimited is a great deal IMHO. Someone ought to make a nice dock for it that acts as a wireless hub to let my other household computers share the 3G connection. I don't expect it to be blazingly fast, but it would be workable.

LOL

It's unlimited use on the device itself. Apple will not allow this accessory to work.

Originally Posted by ezkcdude True, but you don't need Flash everywhere. Not for downloading movies. Or so I've been told.

Yeah, except you need to be able to download movies to be able to, uh, download movies.

HTML5 FTW

Originally Posted by zsummers (b) there's no Flash ("the whole internet in your hand" includes Flash--again, maybe 4.0?);

You're flogging a dead horse. Not going to happen.

Originally Posted by Roboman The event stream isn't working at all for me, not even on low. F'ing WiFi.

It never does for me either, within the first few hours. Very frustrating. Apple's fault, not ours, I presume. Works fine later on.


What would be really cool would be if you could use iPhone tethering with it. i.e. buy the WiFi only version and tether your iPhone to it for data.

[psmith2.0]

It is kinda ugly, that homescreen. It looks so "gappy" and too spread out, and those ultra-soft drop shadows on the icons look a bit forced. I think if I had one, I'd just put a black screen behind it so it looked and felt more like an iPhone or iPod touch (and I'd try to scrunch the icons in closer together, if possible).

That photo on their homepage...that dock at the bottom, with the four icons sitting about 300 feet from one another, is kinda ugly and doesn't look right. Maybe five icons across the screen, sitting a bit closer? They scaled up the 4x across look of the iPhone here, but there's so much space...

I'd sure like a peak inside that Settings feature, to see what sorts of things were possible.

I think they kinda used an ugly, drab picture (that twilight lake) to start with...

And also, the dock at the bottom. It's like Snow Leopard, that "glass shelf", but shouldn't it be more like that on the iPhone and iPod touch, considering the OS/platform used? That Leopard dock feels oddly out-of-place here to me.

Call me crazy, but I think I like this so much better...five icons across, no Leopard dock, tighter/crisper shadow on the icons, not so much open, dead space, etc. And I just stuck in a brighter, prettier background than that Lake of Death. I didn't change the size of the icons at all...merely the spacing/layout.

In any case, you'd have room for six more apps on the main home screen.



vs.

[joveblue]

Aw, I like the lake picture

[torifile]

I'm curious about how full featured that Pages app is. Is it as compatible with Word as the "real" Pages is? Can the iPad print?

[709]

Originally Posted by torifile Can the iPad print?

That's something I was wondering about as well.

[torifile]

Originally Posted by Wyatt I think they will stock them. The difference with other companies' readers is that they are only readers. That's not the case here. You know what feature I'm excited about? The documents folder. Yes, the iPad actually has a folder that all applications can access, and which synchs to your Mac or PC. We finally have (sort of) filesystem access. I hope that gets carried over to the iPhone/iPod touch soon.

Where did you read this? And will it be accessible to an app like Dropbox? I'm wondering how one would share docs with a Windows computer that's not "paired" with the Pad.

[joveblue]

OK I seriously cannot get over the stupid name. Every time I read it I have to double-take and go "is that seriously what they're calling it?".

Jesus. So bad.

[Miko]

Right even on Apple's home screen it looks bad. but like so many others we will deal with it.

On the point of the screen this thing does seem a little rushed IMO I mean when it's locked having the same slider from the iPhone all small seems a little desperate they can certainly come up with something a little more visually pleasing and where is the weather app! that would be a kick ass home widget with all that screen to play with.

I still don't know why they can't have the icons rotate when you turn the iPad or iPhone for that matter. they are square so it shouldn't be that big a deal.

[psmith2.0]

Did you notice during the keynote yesterday, at two different times, Jobs said "iPhone" and, later on, "iPod", when referring to the iPad?

As for "iPad", the only people making the the silly "feminine napkin" jokes and digs at this point are, most likely, the same lame-asses who use the "teabagger" thing when talking about that other stuff. It's mildly amusing the first one or three times (not from a professional news anchor/commentator, but that's a whole other thread), but after a while...



Get some new material, folks. Use your head and put a little effort into it.



iPad is fine. It's what it is...a pad. A touch-pad thingie. Whaddya want? It beats all the other names floated. I could never quite get behind "slate" or "tablet", or any of their variations. "Pad" seems more friendly and casual anyway. I was hoping for something snappy and one-syllable (two with the "i" included), so that really limits the choices! iPad is as good as any, once you start lining them up and going through them. Don't worry about the 14-year-olds with their snickering. It'll pass.

Nine years later, I still don't know what the hell "iPod" is/refers to, but it works. But the day I first heard it, I thought "like a pea?"

[screensaver400]

Some others have talked about the changes iPhone 4.0 might make. The more I think about it, the more I think this was really more of a preview to get developers working on apps for the larger screen size.

I mean, the iPhone SDK events are usually in mid-March, right? I could see Apple holding an event in that timeframe where they announce iPhone 4.0, shipping on iPad at the end of March.

Yeah, dev's would have to do another round of testing for 4.0, but the hard work would already be done. That gives them two weeks or so. And, of course, no developers will be able to actually test their apps on a device before they ship in late March anyway.

There are just too many holes in the device, too many oddities (the home screen and the lock screen are some of the biggest).

[Wyatt]

Originally Posted by torifile Where did you read this? And will it be accessible to an app like Dropbox? I'm wondering how one would share docs with a Windows computer that's not "paired" with the Pad.

http://www.macrumors.com/2010/01/27/...-multitasking/

Originally Posted by MacRumors.com File Sharing. A shared file directory is provided that will mount on your Mac or PC. This is presumably how files such as iWork documents will be transferred to and from the iPad. iPad applications will be able to access this shared directory.

I would assume that an iPad version of Dropbox would be able to access it, since all iPad apps will be able to. It's not clear if "universal" apps will be able to yet.

[psmith2.0]

Originally Posted by screensaver400 Some others have talked about the changes iPhone 4.0 might make. The more I think about it, the more I think this was really more of a preview to get developers working on apps for the larger screen size. I mean, the iPhone SDK events are usually in mid-March, right? I could see Apple holding an event in that timeframe where they announce iPhone 4.0, shipping on iPad at the end of March. Yeah, dev's would have to do another round of testing for 4.0, but the hard work would already be done. That gives them two weeks or so. And, of course, no developers will be able to actually test their apps on a device before they ship in late March anyway. There are just too many holes in the device, too many oddities (the home screen and the lock screen are some of the biggest).

I agree completely. I think a lot of things were left out/glossed over yesterday. I think 4.0 factors into that a good bit. I also think that ding-dong from McGraw-Hill was singlehandedly responsible for a good 10-15 minutes of the keynote being cut. And I think some pending deals/arrangements with certain publishers and other companies weren't quite in place either, so those couldn't be talked about or shared either.

I do think some sort of iPhone 4.0 gathering (and it can be small and more low-key and intimate, at Apple's campus) is in the cards, and some of these things will get smoothed out and addressed.

Something about yesterday just seemed..."off" somehow. You can tell there needed to be more. The crowd wasn't completely into it (since 80% of it was just "here's a bigger iPod touch, and let's review all the things we already know how to use!").

Poor Steve seemed to be trying so hard to get folks whipped up, and you can tell he was expecting some applause and cheers after a few key statements...they never came. A few awkward "insert applause here" gaps and pauses.

It's a neat product, but it's just something everyone kinda expected at this point. No real "killer" angle or feature. So it made for a low-key gathering (compared to some others).

[screensaver400]

Originally Posted by pscates2.0 I also think that ding-dong from McGraw-Hill was singlehandedly responsible for a good 10-15 minutes of the keynote being cut.

Maybe I just missed it, but I don't remember textbooks being mentioned at all. Anyone know if said ding-dong was in the audience?

[psmith2.0]

I think he was mysteriously murdered in the CNBC parking garage the day before. I saw something on CNN about it. The killer left behind some bean sprouts and a Bob Dylan CD, so I don't know what that's all about. Some sort of clue, perhaps?

Steve briefly mentioned textbooks at the very end of the portion dealing with the new iBooks Store. Like one sentence, talking about how they'd factor into things as well. But no details, examples or demos. He said something like "we believe the iPad will be a great eBook reader not only for popular books, but for text books too", and that was it. He moved on to the iWork stuff.

[BuonRotto]

Originally Posted by Messiahtosh Photogene on the iPhone is a very capable picture editing app for a mobile device.

Originally Posted by pscates2.0 Someone upthread was bummed there wasn't iLife made for this, but remember... 2. ...I do think they could get some of the basic iPhoto editing/correction tools into this at some point, via software update. Right now, you could connect your camera and import pics in. But (and I'm assuming there are no enhancement/correction tools on this thing, just photo organizing/sharing) if you could straighten, remove red-eye, crop, magic wand, adjust balance, etc., that would save a back-trip to your Mac.

Originally Posted by GSpotter What I'd really want to have is an App that can display RAW files, so I could backup and view pictures on the go...

Originally Posted by Mac+ Ah, yes. Recipes on a touch screen device in the kitchen...

Originally Posted by Satchmo After seeing the Apple Presentation, and particularly the iWork demo, I can see MacOSX software developers porting their apps onto this iPad...

All very good and heartening points. All I was looking for was basic correction in iPhoto and more than just on-the-go playlists in iTunes, as Paul said. RAW development would be great, but sounds like a huge power draw. There are tremendous third party opportunities. And recipes on this thing in the kitchen would be most excellent! So long as your Mac OS X app doesn't require a huge amount of precision input with a mouse or tablet, or uses snaps and zooming to deal with issues of precision, you can do all sorts of stuff on this thing. I don't expect Lightroom or Garageband, but an iWeb-alike or Wordpress blog creation tool would be most excellent as well.

[zippy]

Originally Posted by pscates2.0 I do think it's interesting - and quite telling - how the acceptance lines break down by user types. Many of the hardcore geek/tech types aren't impressed at all, and want no part of it. Yet every "regular Joe" user I know (who doesn't hang put at Mac/tech forums, or sweat the specs and details of every little thing) have sent me e-mails talking about how they can't wait to order one (a few of them PC/Windows users). But they also all fall into that category I've talked about all along of the casual user who only surfs, e-mails and does the music/photo thing. Talk about a device that is right up their alley...they couldn't be more thrilled and interested. 11 people I know have e-mailed me about this since yesterday afternoon. Four were local. Seven are PC users. Eight have only one computer, a desktop. About half of those have, over the past year, talked about getting a laptop or "cheap netbook". Now they all want this. I thought that was pretty cool and interesting to hear. And there are way more of those kind of users and people out there, so I think Apple has another hit on their hands, despite the lukewarm (or outright hostile, in places) reaction from the geekster/techie community. Aunt Glenda's money is just as green as any hipster spec-hound's. Apple will be thrilled to receive it. in fact, I think Apple has created the Switcher or "toe-in-the-water" machine here (even more so than the Mac mini), and will be getting a lot of brand new, first-time customers throughout 2010. That might've been part of it all as well...get some folks hooked on $499 iCrack?

Agreed.

You know how most of us here say that the Mac mini is really as much computer as the average person needs? I think we can now say that about the iPad - almost.

I think it needs some kind of iLife style goodness and then I think that I could honestly say that this thing would be the device of choice for the typical 'dumb' user. Aunt Tildy, grandma, grandpa, junior..... It does just about everything they tend to do with a computer: surf, email, write basic documents, store photos/music, etc..

[psmith2.0]

Yeah, things that weren't practical (or even possible) on a tiny iPhone screen really have a nice shot here, via the third-party developers. I can't wait to see what kind of new, built-just-for-iPad apps come out this year. Lots of good opportunities for people with ideas and talent.

I wasn't sure how demanding or power-hungry those basic correction/enhancement features are in iPhoto. But the day those make it to the iPad...awesome.

I know there are third-party things (I have that little mobile Photoshop on my iPhone), but it would just be nice to have a homegrown Apple version, built into that Photos program, simply so the results and settings match those on your Mac's iPhoto...the same tools and controls you already use, and so you can import things back to your main Mac and expect some consistency among them, regardless of which device you used for the tweaking?

[Brad]

Originally Posted by joveblue OK I seriously cannot get over the stupid name. Every time I read it I have to double-take and go "is that seriously what they're calling it?". Jesus. So bad.

I think drawing an analogy to the Nintendo Wii is appropriate here, as was mentioned somewhere earlier. (Note to self: gotta split this thread up eventually…)

People thought its name was ridiculous at launch, too. Some people still think the name is ridiculous. Yet, it became a phenomenal success despite the silly name, maybe even assisted by the name since it doesn't "feel" like what you'd expect for a gaming console. And like Nintendo the Wii, Apple is likely targeting the iPad at a wider demographic than the "core" Mac/PC market.

See also: iPod. The name made no sense at all for a mere MP3 player.

[zippy]

Originally Posted by torifile A few answers to some of the questions about the "iBooks" app: On MichaelM8000: On the app's resemblance to DL: On some bitterness: Reminds me of the Watson/Sherlock situation. $40 billion in the bank and they can't afford to license a UI that is clearly innovative?

Originally Posted by alcimedes That's pretty shitty. I thought for sure they would have moved them in-house and that's where it came from. Not impressed that they didn't pay him anything for taking 100% of what his app. (at least in previews) looks like. I mean shit, I've had "iBooks" for 4+ years now ever since I paid for Delicious Library. Bad Apple! Random question: Anyone know if the iPad can support multiple users or not?

Well, I kind of agree with this sentiment, but then I kind of don't. A bookshelf is a bookshelf - they don't look much different from one to the other. And putting books on a bookshelf isn't really the most original idea. Besides, there are other Apps out there that use the same concept, so it just seems like one of those 'standard UI' techniques to me.

[InactionMan]

I was nonplussed after the keynote. But the more I think about, the more I tend to agree with the sentiment that what we saw yesterday won't be what is shipped - software wise. Apple had to announce not only to get developers to start porting to the iPad but also because the bloody thing doesn't have FCC clearance yet and they didn't want their FCC application to be the announcement. I think the iPhone OS 4.0 will bring fairly significant changes to the home screen, at least I hope it will because stretching the iPhone interface over a giant screen looks bloody stupid.

I was hoping the OS would be more Snow Leopard than iPhone OS but if they add multi-tasking and maybe some sort of Dashboard/Expose hybrid for running iPhone apps at the smaller size then I'll probably be on board.

The lack of a USB port is daft as is the lack of SD slot. Having to use a dongle to import pictures from my camera isn't the sleek experience I expect from Apple.

[Chinney]

I must say that I continue to be a lot more positive about the capabilities of the iPad than many others here. For reasons a few have pointed out, I do think that this will be a big hit and that will be a revolutionary device, especially as it further develops.

That said, I just noticed, I think, a gap that I had not noticed before. No phone capability (correct me if I am wrong on that one). Now, nobody is going to want to pick this up and hold it to their ear (I imagine an iPhone, circa 1980 ). But with the iPad having a speaker and a mic, and also with Bluetooth capability, why would you not have phone capability? For those of us who carry a shoulder bag anyway, slipping this thing into an inside pocket of the bag, together with use of a small Bluetooth headset, would allow replacement of the iPhone with a very portable mini-computer and phone. Small, light, convenient, powerful. But not quite there.

[Noel]

Originally Posted by zippy I know this is a popular sentiment around here, but I disagree with it. If applications for computers could have effectively managed files for us from the very beginning then we never would have had need for direct file management/access. Stripping that component away really makes operating a computer much easier.

I'm just worried about things like the Pages/Keynote/Numbers document selection screen: if you have more than about 10-15 documents for one of those apps, without a way to sort them (which is how it appeared in the keynote, but I don't really know if this is true) it's going to be a huge pain in the ass to find the one you're looking for. So while I do agree that we don't need a "Finder" per se, each individual app does need to be very capable of organizing documents very well. I suppose it could be argued that you could just use Spotlight to open everything, though.

Oh, and one more point: if the apps all manage their own files, there does need to be a good way for other apps to access them (e.g. when attaching a file to an email).

[zippy]

Originally Posted by InactionMan I was nonplussed after the keynote. But the more I think about, the more I tend to agree with the sentiment that what we saw yesterday won't be what is shipped - software wise. Apple had to announce not only to get developers to start porting to the iPad but also because the bloody thing doesn't have FCC clearance yet and they didn't want their FCC application to be the announcement. I think the iPhone OS 4.0 will bring fairly significant changes to the home screen, at least I hope it will because stretching the iPhone interface over a giant screen looks bloody stupid.

I think the home screen will have some customization - like allowing for more icons per row. And maybe, they have a few other apps to add, and once they do, it will tighten things up a bit.


Now, if we want to get really dreamy/hopeful (and the fact that you can't even pre-order this thing yet really seems like a significant fact to me) here's what I would love to see announced:

1) There will be a camera, but they are still working out some kinks, or waiting for new parts. It wouldn't be very difficult to make a handful of cases for the unveiling that didn't have the punch-out for the camera (either back or front).

2) They are using the new Qualcomm chip that does both GSM and CDMA, but they haven't ironed out a price plan with Verizon yet (and many recent rumors indicate that there have been meetings). They would want purchasers to know all the options when they are making the order so that they wouldn't have a bunch of changes if an announcement came a little late.


I know these are a long shot, but I can dream. And until someone can come up with a more grounded reason why there is no pre-order availability, then I will let my imagination go.

[Kickaha]

Originally Posted by Noel I'm just worried about things like the Pages/Keynote/Numbers document selection screen: if you have more than about 10-15 documents for one of those apps, without a way to sort them (which is how it appeared in the keynote, but I don't really know if this is true) it's going to be a huge pain in the ass to find the one you're looking for. So while I do agree that we don't need a "Finder" per se, each individual app does need to be very capable of organizing documents very well. I suppose it could be argued that you could just use Spotlight to open everything, though. Oh, and one more point: if the apps all manage their own files, there does need to be a good way for other apps to access them (e.g. when attaching a file to an email).

Yup. Kind of like how apps can request photos from the photo browser, through the OS. Generalize this out, and you get an API for "Please, OS, I'd like data of type Foo for the user to browse and pick." I think metadata might cover that in most cases.