[drewprops]

Okay kids, where are we with web design here in the year 2005?
Where are we going?

We all know that Flash intros suck. Bigtime.
We all know that dynamic content is GOOD.
Newsfeeds make sure that your content gets OUT THERE.

Besides those three, what other lessons have we learned from the last two years of web design and what trends do we see continuing into the future?

I'll be attempting to explain some of this tomorrow morning to people who are likely too old to understand and/or care. People who will ask me to design a website that looks and feels like it was designed and made in 1982.

Still, I'm going to educate them before we begin the road to ruin.

[Brad]

• Standard-compliant code is a MUST.
• CSS usage is very good.
• Meaningful CSS usage is even better.
• Making it accessible is important and very easy if previous bullet is decently thought out.
• Like flash, image-driven layouts are BAD.
• Site-nav bars are good. Site maps are usually bad and an indicator of an unnecessarily complicated site layout.

hmm... I'm sure Jack might have some input too.

[drewprops]

The biggest thing that I learned in 2004 was that a website consists of three things:

• content
• structure
• style

Teaching this to people who know little about computers and nothing about web design is tantamount to attempting to train a cocker spaniel to land a 747.

The reason we go to a website is to find content. Anything that gets in the way of that search is a great reason to look for the information on a different website. I believe that's the best tack to take when I try to explain why a Flash-introed site is a Bad Thing for a dry, corporate client.

[709]

Originally Posted by drewprops Teaching this to people who know little about computers and nothing about web design is tantamount to attempting to train a cocker spaniel to land a 747.

Oh man, welcome to my world.

[boxofjack]

I for one hope to see the return of the large animated gif

[Fooboy]

"Teaching this to people who know little about computers and nothing about web design is tantamount to attempting to train a cocker spaniel to land a 747."

Haha!!!

I just picture this little cocker spaniel with its paws up on the dash - looking straight ahead while wagging its tail and barking ... looking up at the co-pilot out of the corner of its eyes with a "Aren't I worthy of praise?" dog look.

Mean while, the planes engines are whining, red lights and emergency indicators are going off as its about to plow the side of a mountain.

[SledgeHammer]

Originally Posted by Fooboy "Teaching this to people who know little about computers and nothing about web design is tantamount to attempting to train a cocker spaniel to land a 747." Haha!!! I just picture this little cocker spaniel with its paws up on the dash - looking straight ahead while wagging its tail and barking ... looking up at the co-pilot out of the corner of its eyes with a "Aren't I worthy of praise?" dog look. Mean while, the planes engines are whining, red lights and emergency indicators are going off as its about to plow the side of a mountain.

Sounds like a Far Side cartoon.

I mostly have only to second Brad and drewprops. Also, as a rule, frames are bad. I got rid of them in the latest update to the site I design using CSS. Kept the look and the functionality, but the frames are no more. (Don't mind me, I'm just feeling proud of myself.)

[LoCash]

Edited to protect my employment.

[SledgeHammer]

Well, if it's any consolation at all, you're first site looks really good. But you know that. I don't understand people sometimes. When will the world learn that tables SUCK? ...At least in terms of a design structure.

EDIT: Oh, and your VP is wrong. This is the pinnacle of web design.

[ast3r3x]

I guess it's not really ideal for a business website, but I liked the boldness of the black design you showed me LoCash.

[jump]

Oh boy are we going to have fun on Monday

[Windswept]

Originally Posted by LoCash The biggest thing that I learned in 2004 and this first quarter of 2005 is that it doesn't matter how good of a web designer I am, I am always going to be forced into creating a mediocre product by people that have no design sense whatsoever. Here's a fun story about how my art department got fired yesterday. The only reason I still have a job is because the COO told the CEO that he really couldn't just fire the marketing/art department.

How will you manage without an art department? Won't that dump all the work on you? I'm sorry that things are in such an upheaval at work, but at least you still have *your* job. That guy must be crazy, to just up and fire everybody. Hope you have been able to get some rest this weekend.

Carol

[LoCash]

Hey, I was going to get canned too, so it wasn't going to be my problem

Starting Monday I've gotten my department to start reporting to the COO, so problems like this shouldn't happen anymore. Yay.

[johnq]

<constructive criticism>
Personally I feel the Camvera you designed originally is a bit too "templaty", kinda too iWorks/Pages...

I think it's the whitespace, a bit too much of it. I love whitespace in designs but...

I did sonesta.com's templates (although I'm not to blame for subsequent Flash or ASP or lack of CSS! ) which uses a lot of whitespace and holds up pretty well for various hotel colors...imho...

http://www.sonesta.com/egypt_portsaid/
http://www.sonesta.com/coconut_grove/
http://www.sonesta.com/egypt_cairo/
http://www.sonesta.com/boston/
http://www.sonesta.com/peru_arequipa/ (many more, just use the popup menu)

I think yours needed a bit more definition separating the various sections, whether it is accomplished though spacing, font sizes, rules etc.

The one "they like" is a bit too-separated, although it's "very okay" and aside from the obvious boxes, content is treated differently.

Content needs not only a structural hierarchy but also a visual hierarchy, a bit harder to define, especially what is too little or too much.

</constructive criticism>

Anyway good luck and HOLD ON to that frigging job.

I've been not working full time for longer than I care to think about. At this point I'd put up with any office politics and dunderheads for a decent reliable wage.

[LoCash]

The camvera.com I launched is a bit different from what I originally proposed, though your suggestions would have applied even to that one. We're a wireless broadband company, so the immense white space is intentional to project the concept of wireless; of freedom, of open air, of no clutter separating you from the internet. Of course, I only wish they offered the criticism you did, it would have been a step up from, "I don't like paragraphs that indent" and "My favourite colour is blue. You need more blue in the design".

*sigh*

I'm over this web site though. I'm ready to move on

[Moogs]

One thing more designers must realize: you can develop elegant, fully featured sites with nothing but XHTML, CSS 2.1 and a little JavaScript. There is absolutely zero need for tables anymore, unless you're showing tabular (imagine that) data. There are many good hacks available for crappy browsers like IE so there's no need really to rely on BS table-based designs, invisible GIFs, etc.

You can even do image rollovers with CSS now.

[Windswept]

Originally Posted by LoCash Hey, I was going to get canned too, so it wasn't going to be my problem

Yikes! Well then, I'm glad it 'stayed' your problem. Sheesh.

Starting Monday I've gotten my department to start reporting to the COO, so problems like this shouldn't happen anymore. Yay.

"Yay" is right. Close call, huh?

Think of it this way: you *could* be a Marine 2nd lieutenant packing for Iraq about now. I'm SO glad you aren't. (Another close call, n'est-ce pas? Just my opinion.)

[ast3r3x]

Originally Posted by Moogs One thing more designers must realize: you can develop elegant, fully featured sites with nothing but XHTML, CSS 2.1 and a little JavaScript. There is absolutely zero need for tables anymore, unless you're showing tabular (imagine that) data. There are many good hacks available for crappy browsers like IE so there's no need really to rely on BS table-based designs, invisible GIFs, etc. You can even do image rollovers with CSS now.

I love CSS. An AI member actually taught me how to do CSS rollovers. It's especially nice if the center of your button is the same, you can just use a 1px wide image and stretch it, and save load time.

[jump]

Gee, all this whining makes me glad I got out of the "creative" end of business and back into schmoozing for a living. :smokey:

[autodata]

Originally Posted by drewprops Okay kids, where are we with web design here in the year 2005?

it's a programmers' world

[jump]

I miss you, you little brat!

Liz

[Batman]

As said above, CSS, XHTML, Accesibility, Dynamic Content. Currently I co-admin a site that looks like junk, and am completly re-building it from the ground up. Thanks to CSS, with the new site I change the enitre layout on the fly by just tweaking the CSS (much like csszengarden.com), and content with some PHP and SQL so that the content of certain pages come straight from the database so they can be changed using a form page so that others can edit the site easily. Lastly, Standards Compliance!!! (that means the browsers too - you heard me Redmond).

[intlplby]

before some of you discount flash intros and image driven sites you need to remember that not all sites are there to deliver raw text information to the user....

some websites are meant to be more experience based ..... most sites should follow the guidelines you all mentioned, but some sites still are about experience more than content.......for a dry corporate client a flash intro is bad, but for other some clients it may be appropriate......