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Do you trust Toyota?


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View Poll Results: Select all that apply:
My opinion of the Toyota brand remains the same considering recent developments. 24 51.06%
My opinion of the Toyota brand has degraded considering recent developments. 9 19.15%
If I were buying a car today, I would consider buying a Toyota despite recent developments. 22 46.81%
If I were buying a car today, I would no longer consider buying a Toyota because of recent developments. 3 6.38%
If I were buying a car today, I wouldn't have considered a Toyota regardless of recent developments 16 34.04%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 47. You may not vote on this poll

Do you trust Toyota?
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
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2010-02-14, 02:05

I agree about the quality shift, although I think my 04 Corolla is well made, I doubt it will last as long as the 1979 Corolla my Mum bought new in 1978. That car ran well for over 20 years, and only started to have problems around 2001, then the struts gave out in 2005 and we sold it to a shop class teacher.
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Quagmire
meh
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2010-02-14, 09:46

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyTheA View Post
Honda/Acura still kick Arse...
With the exception of their styling and engines( no low end power below 5000 RPM).
  quote
Mugge
Thunderbolt, fuck yeah!
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Denmark
 
2010-02-14, 09:57

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quagmire View Post
You missed my intention. The chart has General Motors Corporation listed which is now Motors Liquidation and still going through bankruptcy to eventual liquidation. General Motors Company is the new company that bought General Motors Corporation's 4 core brands during the 363 motion back in June when GM Corp filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy.

So that is why I asked how GM Company was doing because in the legal and technical perspective, it is a new company separate from General Motors Corporation.


Same shit, different asshole.

You should have been a lawyer, Quagmire.

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Robo
Formerly Roboman, still
awesome
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
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2010-02-14, 11:08

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyTheA View Post
Quality has always been a big priority for them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyTheA
The Tundra doesn't have the same build quality that the old T100 had. It is also an interference Engine with a timing belt instead of a chain (Cheaper for the company) [...] For the past ten years it seems they have been trying to mimic GM by selling so many models and making their cars REALLY big. The new Tundra is has major stability problems, is F-ing Huge, and is part of this new recall debacle. If I get a new truck someday, it probably won't be a Tundra.
Does not compute?

Toyota has an image of being of superior quality. They have the enviable position of being the Safe Choice for millions of Americans, and while there was a factual basis for that once, I don't think that it's necessarily true any more (but consumer perceptions are slow to change). I don't think Toyota "cares about quality" any more than any other automaker with an eye on the bottom line. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if Ford actually cared about it more nowadays, just because they're trying to change their image. They're the ones who have to fight to change minds; people just assume that a Toyota is superior by default. Ford can't afford to be complacent, but Toyota can.

I'm not at all happy about the recall, but I am sort of glad that it stands to put an end to the near-deification of Toyota in the mass market's eyes. That's been unwarranted for years. Toyota isn't a charity, they don't sell quality cars for low prices just to be nice (or because of some mystical Asian ethic). They're a business, just like any other. Yes, it takes effort to actually do homework and judge each vehicle on its own merits. It's easier to assume that Car X will be better because it says TOYOTA on the back. But you'd be wrong some of the time.

For every one person who buys an American-brand car just because it's "'Murican," I'd wager that there's two or three that by a new Toyota just because gosh-darnit, that 1989 Camry lasted forever, or because Asians are good at math and thus have to make the higher quality vehicle, right? Both groups prop up companies who should (if quality is the goal) be forced to fend for themselves. (And who's going to prop up the poor Swedes? )

I wish people were smarter and would (gasp) actually research their $25,000+ purchase, instead of just assuming that "common knowledge" is always true. (I'd say they're just harming themselves, but they're not, really. Reducing the need for companies to actually compete hurts everyone.) I mean, sure, I went through my "buy anything but American, lol" phase...and then I grew out of it, before I was old enough to drive.

It's apparently a challenge just to get people to even test drive, say, the new Fusion. Are people that afraid of having their preconceptions challenged? Of being wrong?

and i guess i've known it all along / the truth is, you have to be soft to be strong
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PB PM
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2010-02-14, 14:30

I agree with you Robo, buying a car is a big deal, its too bad I didn't think so when I bought my car a few years ago. I only test drove one car, which was a big mistake.
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Quagmire
meh
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2010-02-14, 14:34

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM View Post
I agree with you Robo, buying a car is a big deal, its too bad I didn't think so when I bought my car a few years ago. I only test drove one car, which was a big mistake.
Same. I pushed to get the Aura, but then the Pontiac G8 was unveiled 2 months later. I love my Aura, but having a RWD sedan would be better.

giggity
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PB PM
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2010-02-14, 14:38

Well, I didn't even end up buying the car i wanted, that's that said part, I wanted a 03/04 Civic and walked away with a butt ugly Corolla LE. I think what sold me on it was how comfortable it was, and the height adjustable seats. I had been driving a 1987 Accord, so I guess anything I tried would have seemed nice, which is why it was such a mistake.
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JohnnyTheA
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
 
2010-02-15, 01:10

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboman View Post

For every one person who buys an American-brand car just because it's "'Murican," I'd wager that there's two or three that by a new Toyota just because gosh-darnit, that 1989 Camry lasted forever, or because Asians are good at math and thus have to make the higher quality vehicle, right? Both groups prop up companies who should (if quality is the goal) be forced to fend for themselves.
Brand loyalty is a very good "long term" marketing strategy. Long term solutions are something the US companies haven't had a good track record on. If you are happy with a car you have driven for 10+ years, it makes some sense to favor the same manufacturer when you get a new car. Buying a car can be risky and if you are happy with brand x, then there is a perception of less risk if you go with who you are happy with. This is a good thing if it encourages auto makers to constantly improve their quality. Also, Toyota's also had higher resale values which protect the new car buyer.

Toyota seems to have cashed in this brand loyalty, that it tooks 20+ years to obtain, so that is could grow like crazy and build huge new plants in the US (with US workers). Now they are closing them...

By the way, my Tundra was made in the US along with Engine and Tranny. Most of Toyota's cars sold in the US are made in the US. For some reason this recall is MOSTLY a US problem. The ones they make in Japan must have different pedals...

JTA
  quote
Robo
Formerly Roboman, still
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Join Date: Jul 2004
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2010-02-15, 01:18

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyTheA View Post
Most of Toyota's cars sold in the US are made in the US.
I know.
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
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2010-02-15, 01:41

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyTheA View Post
Most of Toyota's cars sold in the US are made in the US. For some reason this recall is MOSTLY a US problem. The ones they make in Japan must have different pedals...

JTA
Which is why the recall in Canada is smaller, since half our cars still come from Japan, and the rest, which have the problem are made in Ontario, more to the US spec.
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BuonRotto
Not sayin', just sayin'
 
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2010-02-15, 19:12

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyTheA View Post
Honda/Acura still kick Arse...
With exception to the Fit and maybe the Civic (which is already getting long in the tooth), they're ugly, often underpowered, noisy and... reliable. They're not kicking arse by any means really, but they are a pretty safe bet if you can convince yourself they look good acceptable.

Actually, I think Subaru is, pardon the pun, firing on all cylinders these days. The Tribeca needs to taken behind the barn, or maybe just go into celebrity rehab, but otherwise they're rather nice machines. The styling is not the best but it's frankly better than Toyota or Honda.

The other company that is cleaning up is Ford. They do have nice styling and excellent features, great handling too. Their QC is supposed to be top notch now though I suspect a lot of people (myself inclued) are waiting another couple of years to see how the current models fare in Consumer Reports' reliability ratings.

If they keep it up and there is justice in the Universe, they will be the Toyota/Honda of the 2010s.

[edit] Oops, I forgot about Hyundai.
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PB PM
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2010-02-15, 19:41

Ugh, Hyundai... terrible designs. I like the look of the new Ford's, if I got a new car today, it most likely would be a Ford. Now that I say that, it sounds really strange to me, because until a few months ago I wouldn't have even considered their vehicles .
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torifile
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2010-02-15, 19:58

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM View Post
Ugh, Hyundai... terrible designs. I like the look of the new Ford's, if I got a new car today, it most likely would be a Ford. Now that I say that, it sounds really strange to me, because until a few months ago I wouldn't have even considered their vehicles .
I'd consider a Ford in a couple of years after we see where resale values are. The worst thing about buying new is the hit you take when you drive the car off the lot. For all the crap Honda gets about their designs, their resale value was one of our primary motivators for choosing to purchase one.

If it's not red and showing substantial musculature, you're wearing it wrong.
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BuonRotto
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2010-02-15, 20:05

True about Hyundai, but they're getting much better (as is Kia of all companies!) and their aggressive marketing and service and so far decent reliability is winning over folks. They are not lust-worthy maybe but they are good appliances, as much as that pisses some people off.

Yeah, I think a lot of people are waiting to see if Ford's vaunted improvements in design and quality control are the real deal. So far, things bode well, but the perception gap is the biggest problem. Honda isn't in such bad shape, just that they have lost their "Japanese BMW" repute since they don't really make performance cars (save the s2000) any more, and their engines are middling. When you don't have great engines or handling, the persistent road noise issue gets annoying. There's just not much to set them apart anymore, except that their cars are getting uglier by the second. It's easy to turn around. Hell, just fire whathisname in the US design team and give us the European styling for starters.

I'm actually very interested in seeing what they do, or hopefully *don't* do to the Euro Accord wagon.
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
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2010-02-15, 20:11

Quote:
Originally Posted by torifile View Post
I'd consider a Ford in a couple of years after we see where resale values are. The worst thing about buying new is the hit you take when you drive the car off the lot. For all the crap Honda gets about their designs, their resale value was one of our primary motivators for choosing to purchase one.
I'm not too worried about resale value, since I always buy cars that are a few years old anyway, never really "new." With that being the case, its more of an advantage to me if the resale value is low.
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Robo
Formerly Roboman, still
awesome
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
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2010-02-15, 21:54

One of my friends has a 2010 Mercury Milan (basically the same as the Ford Fusion) and I was impressed. The Ford Fusion also won Car of the Year from, like, everyone.
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addison
Formerly “AWM”
 
Join Date: May 2009
 
2010-02-15, 23:08

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM View Post
I'm not too worried about resale value, since I always buy cars that are a few years old anyway, never really "new." With that being the case, its more of an advantage to me if the resale value is low.
You should look at Saabs. They have hideous resale/residual values. No offense Roboman
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PB PM
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2010-02-16, 00:49

No, I don't want a car that costs an arm and leg to fix if something goes wrong.
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Rehnquist
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Join Date: Oct 2005
 
2010-03-04, 14:08

Can you trust anyone who wants your money?
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Brad
Selfish Heathen
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
 
2010-03-04, 18:23

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rehnquist View Post
Can you trust anyone who wants your money?
I want your money. Do you trust me?
  quote
Bryson
Rocket Surgeon
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: The Canadark
 
2010-03-04, 18:40

Obviously not. You are corupt.

That does seem like a strange statement. I have lots of suppliers who "want my money" - but I trust them to provide a reasonable service or goods in exchange for that.
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addison
Formerly “AWM”
 
Join Date: May 2009
 
2010-03-05, 16:17

When will journalists learn when it comes to auto recalls? This may just be stupid editing but given the history of faked stunts by the networks you never know. For some reason the more this story goes on the more skeptical I'm getting that something is wrong with these cars beyond the drivers or their floormats.
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Rehnquist
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
 
2010-03-17, 17:18

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad View Post
I want your money. Do you trust me?
Oh you are special though x

LOL
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bassplayinMacFiend
Banging the Bottom End
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
 
2010-03-19, 12:47

The last two Prius non-braking accidents have had new reports stating the cars' black boxes showed no brake pedal being pressed at the time of the crash. It seems for the moment the press is taking the computer's side, but what if this is the problem and somehow brake pedal presses are being ignored by the computer?

Don't the Pruis' use regenerative braking? Would this require more computer control because you're turning the brakes into electric generators, so the primary purpose of braking the car may have been diluted in an effort to make it more energy efficient somehow?

Anyway, the memos coming out about management bragging about saving $100M by talking the NHTSA out of a recall ~3 years ago gives me more pause than anything else. Yes, I know Toyota wouldn't be the first company to pull something like this, but what about Japanese honor? Will we see some ritual suicides in atonement for the deaths caused by out of control Toyotas?
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PB PM
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2010-03-19, 13:39

Some heads will roll at some point, but consider that all the cases we are seeing are cars and trucks made in the American plants, not in Japan. So people in charge of the US plants might be losing their jobs real soon.
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