[MCQ]

Originally Posted by Paul A friend of mine noticed this the other day on his PC and I just tested it on my Mac... in firefox (and only firefox) loading "w" in the location bar (no quotes) redirects to www.georgewbush.com is this a bug? can anyone else confirm this behavior?

Don't think it's a bug. It appears to check to see if it can load it by finishing the rest of the URL (i.e. add http and com)... otherwise it does a Google search and goes to the first item on the list (equivalent of "I'm feeling lucky").

For example, when I typed "mi", it took me to the State of Michigan website, which is #1 on Google's list for "mi". The top search for "w" is Dubya's site.

[Majost]

Very interesting...

a -> http://www.yourdictionary.com/
b -> http://www.btselem.org/
c -> http://www.cnet.com/
d -> http://www.dlink.com/
...
w -> http://www.georgewbush.com/
x -> http://www.x.org/
y -> http://messenger.yahoo.com/
z -> http://www.healthatoz.com/

I haven't tested all the ones in between, but none of these work in Safari (a.com isn't registered and linked to yourdictionary.com, etc.). Seems like it's more than just one site. Weird sites to choose, though.

Edit: Ah, MCQ, that seems to be the case. Funny thing is, http://x.com links to https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr in Safari. So, maybe they go to .org sites first? x.org is also the Top result from Google. Otherwise, your theory holds.

[Paul]

Ahh.. IC MCQ
very cool.

On a different tangent, there are G4 (7400 and 7450) and G5 optimized (nightly and "1.0") builds available that seem to work great. (I have only tested the G5 version).

[Akumulator]

Firefox craps out alot. It's still by browser of choice, but I'm constantly having to force quit it. Anyone else having this problem?

[Moogs]

Not using it often enough to have that problem. Mostly as a web test platform. Which begs the question: should the latest version of Netscape and the latest stable version of Firefox render all the important HTML and CSS stuff the same?

They use the exact same engine AFAIK, with allowances for new bug fixes here and there on one or the other, so as far as web testing goes, it seems there's not much need to have both browsers installed (if that's all one uses them for).

True™ ?

[Brad]

Originally Posted by Moogs should the latest version of Netscape and the latest stable version of Firefox render all the important HTML and CSS stuff the same?

For the most part, yes, especially soon.

http://www.mozillazine.org/talkback.html?article=5660

The Mozilla Foundation is planning a Mozilla 1.7.5 release for mid-December. This update will include all the checkins to the 1.7 branch since Mozilla 1.7.3 was released in September. It's intended to provide a Mozilla Application Suite milestone that features a virtually identical Gecko version to Mozilla Firefox 1.0.

Basically, Firefox has a few more fixes from the 1.7 trunk that Mozilla doesn't have yet. Funny that it's now Mozilla that's playing the catch-up game.

[Moogs]

Works for me. I think the all-in-one browse, email, chat, editor client idea is an idea whose time is past, basically. Much better to use more specialized apps IMO.

[torifile]

Why does FF work so well and look so bad???!? I want to love it. I do. I really do. But it's hard to get used to the unconventional nature of key commands, etc. And it still looks like ass, even with firefoxy installed.

[Brad]

Originally Posted by torifile Why does FF [...] look so bad???

Because it was designed mostly by Linux geeks for Linux and Windows.

I don't think I need to say more.

[Chinney]

Why don't they just put a Camino skin over it and make us all happy?

[torifile]

Originally Posted by Chinney Why don't they just put a Camino skin over it and make us all happy?

I wish they would. It would be the best of all worlds.

[Barto]

The current theme is Pinstripe, and it has always been the OS X "native" skin for FireFox and Mozilla.

The problem is in XPFE (the GUI abstraction layer), not the theme. Which is unfortunate for Mac users.

[Brad]

Originally Posted by Barto The problem is in XPFE (the GUI abstraction layer), not the theme.

...which basically recreates everything Mac OS X already offers. The toolbar, buttons, text fields, context menus, etc. Firefox is literally trying to reinvent the wheel by bringing *all* of the GUI controls in-house, only using native system methods for window management, processing mouse events, and painting to the screen.

Of course, this is a boon to Linux and Windows users who may not have an elegant toolbar solution or well-behaving widgets, but it's a major disappointment for Mac users who natively have far superior controls that Firefox refuses to use.

It doesn't matter what "theme" you use in Firefox. It's still going to perform like a bad hack and not have the true native behavior of, say, Safari or OmniWeb.

That's why they started the Navigator/Chimera/Camino project. They had this killer engine but Mac users got a half-assed UI. Camino was supposed to fix all the UI problems with Mozilla/Firefox, but sadly its (AOL-sponsored) development fell apart shortly before Safari's release and has never truly recovered.

[Chinney]

Thanks for the clarification. I guess that it would be more involved than just adding a Camino “skin”. But is there not, at least, something from the advances made in Firefox that could be quickly applied to jumpstart the Camino project? Or is Camino a victim of Safari (and an illustration of the feared potential downsides of Apple “occupying the field” for application software areas for OS X).

[Brad]

Originally Posted by Chinney But is there not, at least, something from the advances made in Firefox that could be quickly applied to jumpstart the Camino project?

Yes and no. They both benefit from updates to the Gecko engine. Anything beyond that, though, applies only to the respective app. Tabs, extensions, etc. are all specific to Mozilla (and Firefox because it's much more Mozilla-based than Camino).

Or is Camino a victim of Safari (and an illustration of the feared potential downsides of Apple “occupying the field” for application software areas for OS X).

Yes and no. Camino certainly took a major hit when Steve walked on stage to present Safari. You can read Mike Pinkerton's accounts in his ArsTechnica interview.

By the way, great relevant quote from that article: "First and foremost, Camino is a browser built from the ground up for Mac OS X, integrating as much with the OS as possible. We have Address Book, Rendezvous, and Keychain integration which aren't even on the radar for Firefox. When we discuss features or UI, it's 'Mac-first, Mac-only,' not 'How can we back-port this to Mac so that it will still work?'"

Anyway, that's not to say that Apple single-handedly stomped them out. Camino was facing other bigger problems just days before Safari's release: AOL TimeWarner (parent to Netscape) killed the whole project. Did AOL know about Safari? Maybe, but Safari's role is ultimately irrelevant because soon AOL would dismantle the whole Netscape and Mozilla teams and Camino would still have been left with a skeleton crew at best.

So... uh... where was I going with this?

[Chinney]

Originally Posted by Brad [...] Anyway, that's not to say that Apple single-handedly stomped them out. Camino was facing other bigger problems just days before Safari's release: AOL TimeWarner (parent to Netscape) killed the whole project. Did AOL know about Safari? Maybe, but Safari's role is ultimately irrelevant because soon AOL would dismantle the whole Netscape and Mozilla teams and Camino would still have been left with a skeleton crew at best. So... uh... where was I going with this?

You were just about to tell us why those who have continued on with the Mozilla project through the Mozilla Foundation have not also continued to pursue Camino....

[Brad]

Originally Posted by Chinney You were just about to tell us why those who have continued on with the Mozilla project through the Mozilla Foundation have not also continued to pursue Camino....

Oh yeah!

Because 99.999% of them are Linux/Windows fanbois who wouldn't give half a fart to help a Mac-only project.

[Chinney]

Well maybe this is a job for...AppleNova. As far as I know the Mozilla Foundation people have a open invitation for volunteers Do we have the critical mass of expertise and time among the people here to bring Camino to 1.0? (I feel free in suggesting this, since I have neither the expertise, nor the time. Maybe I could be an beta tester in the "Computer Idiot" category).

Anyway, I am just putting it forward as an idea for AppleNova, if there are enough of you code warriors out there.