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Please Respond if you Have an Aluminium Apple Cinema Display (Pink Hue Defect)


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Please Respond if you Have an Aluminium Apple Cinema Display (Pink Hue Defect)
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SonOfSylvanus
Fro Productions(tm)
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: London Town
 
2005-02-11, 17:42

I have encountered a very annoying, if not deal-breaking, colour defect with Apple's Cinema Displays. A post at the Apple Discussion Forums describes it best:

Quote:
I recently purchased a 20" Apple Cinema Display to go with my powerbook. It looks great when the colors on the screen are bright, but with a black background, I noticed that when I look at the screen in the dark there is a purple, pink, yellow -ish hue to the screen when viewed at any angle other than straight on.
(See the full thread here.)



The "pink hue problem" is something that you cannot fail to notice if you look at a predominantly black screen from an angle. It is even more obvious if you can compare the Apple Cinema Display to even a PowerBook, which has a pretty poor viewing angle as it is.



(Click for large image)

See this webpage for more pics and a comparison with a PowerBook display.

After discovering this defect on the first 20" ACD that I ordered via phone (in the UK), I promptly contacted Apple Aftersales, acquired an RMA and arranged for a replacement unit to be sent. Unfortunately, the replacement ACD exhibits the same problem. I do no colour-critical work, but, obviously, I would prefer a display that was not defective. The defect messes up everything from "atmospheric" DVDs to the Flurry screensaver.

I'm not a happy bunny. I was all ready to deluge you with pics of my awesome new set-up as well...



I now know that there have been pink hue problems with the Apple 23" Cinema Displays and that (if the minor outcry on the Discussion Forums is to be believed) Apple a few weeks ago deleted several threads detailing the defect.

1) Via this thread I am hoping to find out how widespread is the pink hue problem, when it started and if the problem is limited to certain countries.

Please post and include:
  • If you have experienced this problem on a 20", 23" or 30"
  • Your date of purchase
  • Your country of purchase
  • If you have calibrated your display and this has resolved the problem

2) I also want to ask another question: Can I hang on to the defective display that I have now for a considerable period of time (I'm thinking maybe months, but before the expiry of the standard warranty) and then, when I have learned that the pink hue problem has been fixed (and only then), contact Apple and arrange for a replacement to be sent, claiming a manufacturing defect?

...

Thanks for your help.

I hope that this thread is useful for people looking to make purchases.


bouncy bouncy

Last edited by SonOfSylvanus : 2005-02-12 at 07:02. Reason: Added calibration question. Edit 2: Added pics.
  quote
Luca
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: Minnesota
 
2005-02-11, 21:24

In case it helps, I saw this defect on a 23" Cinema display at an Apple retail store. The same 23" has been there since fall of last year (probably shortly after the aluminum update). The 20" and 30" displays in the store, as well as the laptops and iMacs, exhibit no color problems, but keep in mind that most of these displays have been in the store since they were first introduced. Perhaps the color problem is getting more widespread and coming to new 20" displays now, but I haven't heard of the 20" ones having problems until now so it's possible that they have only had these problems with the most recent batches.

It's quite obvious even on a standard OS X desktop. The menu bar, which should be a very light gray, becomes noticeably pink. I asked a tech about it and he claimed that it was a result of the lighting in the store, which is an obvious cop-out because he didn't want to admit that there was a problem with the display. The Apple store has all-white lighting and besides, only the 23" showed the problem.

I think it's ridiculous that Apple keeps avoiding the problem. People complain about it constantly and they just delete their posts. Meanwhile they're charging $200-$400 more for their display than many other companies (Dell isn't the only one offering a 20" widescreen for ~$600). Apple's customers hold them to a very high level of performance, and given the prices they charge, Apple needs to deliver.
  quote
ast3r3x
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2005-02-11, 21:37

I will say it could be the monitors are not calibrated properly, or maybe it IS calibrated properly.

The 17" LCD when calibrated with a spyder makes OS X look really ugly. But the colors are basically correct. Just one example.
  quote
Jasoco
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
 
2005-02-11, 23:23

No problem here. My 20" works fine.
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Brad
Selfish Heathen
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
 
2005-02-12, 01:20

I would strongly suggest calibrating your display with an advanced tool like SuperCal, as ast3r3x mentioned.

Some of the PowerBooks, for example, ship with a horrible ColorSync profile. It's really an embarrassment and I wish Apple would do a better job with the default settings.

The quality of this board depends on the quality of the posts. The only way to guarantee thoughtful, informative discussion is to write thoughtful, informative posts. AppleNova is not a real-time chat forum. You have time to compose messages and edit them before and after posting.
  quote
SonOfSylvanus
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2005-02-12, 05:56

It could really be the colour profile? Wow. Okay, I'll try calibrating later this weekend (last time I used SuperCal it took me 30mins-1hrdon't have time now).

Any more replies, even to say that your display does not exhibit the problem, would be much appreciated.

Thanks

bouncy bouncy
  quote
Brad
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Join Date: May 2004
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2005-02-12, 06:00

Well, Apple's default profile for my 12" PB actually makes everything look brownish-orange. The brushed metal windows that should be completely desaturated, for example, actually looked bronze.
  quote
SonOfSylvanus
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2005-02-12, 06:03

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad
Well, Apple's default profile for my 12" PB actually makes everything look brownish-orange. The brushed metal windows that should be completely desaturated, for example, actually looked bronze.
Thing is, my ACD calibration seems fine to me. I'm no expert, but the colours look about right. I'm almost certain that this is NOT a calibration issue.

bouncy bouncy
  quote
Luca
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: Minnesota
 
2005-02-12, 06:33

Yeah, I messed with the color calibration of the 23" in the Apple store to no avail. I could never get a neutral tone. It never hurts to check, especially since you have a 20" and not a 23", but when someone says "pink hue" I automatically think defect and not calibration error.
  quote
åsen
Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2005-02-13, 16:13

  • 20" display
  • Purchased 30 Jan 05
  • Apple Store UK
  • Not calibrated
my pink screen

A quick and dirty photo of my new 20" display and my new 12" PowerBook. I put a plain black desktop picture on both displays. Although it looks a bit blue in the photo of the PowerBook, in real life the PowerBook is fine. However, the 20" display has a rather craptacular pink effect.
  quote
ast3r3x
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2005-02-13, 16:21

Wow, I really like how those displays look!

If I were you, I'd just twist your display and stop sitting to the left side of the display
  quote
Moogs
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: NSA Archives
 
2005-02-13, 16:36

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad
I would strongly suggest calibrating your display with an advanced tool like SuperCal, as ast3r3x mentioned.
Apple's default profiles are worthless, but if you want a truly accurate profile, I wouldn't go the SuperCal route. SuperCal is undoutedly the best of all visual calibration tools (i.e. the ones you use your eyes to measure with), but if you want something really accurate, get a

Monitor Spyder 2, or if you've got a whole color workflow (like a good scanner and an epson 2200), get the best there is short of spending a real fortune -- the Eye-One Photo suite from Gretag Macbeth. It's about $1400 depending on the configuration you get but it will give you a complete color workflow solution and provide professional profiles for your specific devices, including digital cameras.

In reading one particularly lengthy thread in the Apple discussion forums, it sounds to me like they've got a manufacturing problem and are simply replacing, replacing, replacing until you get a good one. I imagine they're charging back the cost of the displays to the screen manufacturer or some portion of it. How disappointing. And tellingly, there were a bunch of old 23" models available new from a couple of retailers a month ago, now all of them are gone -- and they were only like $20 cheaper.

Apple fucked up. G5 PSU all over again. They need to shit-can the high level managers who have been in charge of QA the last 18 months or so. They are doing an awful job by Apple standards IMO.

...into the light of a dark black night.

Last edited by Moogs : 2005-02-13 at 16:47.
  quote
Moogs
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Join Date: May 2004
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2005-02-13, 17:26

Just found this when looking for color-accurate LCDs from companies other than Apple. Impressive. Sony and NEC-Mitsu have a couple nice ones too but they often buy from the same screen companies Apple does.

Barco, OTOH, always has the very best components money can buy in their screens and a pretty much flawless reputation for color accuracy and quality build.

Seems they

(fucking .mac photo scripty crap... I always forget how to get the direct jpg link from their publishing structure. Anyway... http://homepage.mac.com/themoogs/PhotoAlbum7.html)

will go for about $4500 US. I sent an inquiry Barco's way to get more info on retailers and such. Will let you color-hungry types know what I find out.

...into the light of a dark black night.

Last edited by Moogs : 2005-02-13 at 17:52.
  quote
SonOfSylvanus
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Join Date: May 2004
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2005-02-13, 18:53

Moogs, I've heard this is Da Bomb when it comes to colour accurate displays.

...

Eh... here's the pic... The ColorEdgeCG220:


bouncy bouncy
  quote
SonOfSylvanus
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Join Date: May 2004
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2005-02-13, 18:59

So sen, it looks like we both will be returning our displays quick sharpish?!
  quote
Moogs
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Join Date: May 2004
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2005-02-13, 19:32

Thanks SoS. I've heard of Eizo when shopping around at some of the color stores and such (colormall), but didn't know much about them. If it covers 100% of the RGB 98 space that's about all you're ever going to a need. 5 year warranty isn't half bad either. And it's only $6500!

Although they have a 21" (1600x1200) model that doesn't cover RGB 98 and is under $3000.

...into the light of a dark black night.

Last edited by Moogs : 2005-02-13 at 19:38.
  quote
iDaver
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: USA
 
2005-02-13, 20:06

For what it's worth; I noticed a pink hue on my 23" Cinema. Calibration eliminates it for the most part. There is a slightly noticable color variation, side to side when looking at certain solid colors (mostly purples) full-screen, but how often do you do that? I checked and found the same to be true on Dell's 20" 2001FP display. My guess is that Dell uses the same panel manufacturer as Apple.

This is a problem, sure but not, in my opinion the major bummer some make it out to be.
  quote
Moogs
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: NSA Archives
 
2005-02-14, 00:32

For those of you in the graphic arts or otherwise who need very accurate color reproduction from an LCD, I started this thread in the new Buying Advice forum. In case anyone's in the market....

http://forums.applenova.com/showthre...123#post166123

...into the light of a dark black night.
  quote
dfiler
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Pittsburgh
 
2005-02-14, 08:42

Just a quick note for those suggesting color calibration:

A good percentage of the 23" apple displays are permanetly pink. This is a well known and documented problem which no amount of calibration will ever remedy.

Granted, there are people that have a slightly pink display that can be fixed by calibration. Yet, this is of no help to those with one of the defective displays.

Do a quick google on pink apple display problems and you'll turn up a billion reports. It really is astounding that there hasn't been a recall. I'm not one to scream the sky is falling, but in this case, the product has a widespread, major defect.

I predict a class action lawsuit relatively soon...

But you know what... I still want one, one of the non-pink ones.
  quote
Kurama
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
 
2005-02-14, 11:42

so the laptop lcd's are fine; thats good because I'm fixen to get a 15in powerbook sometime today.

I was gonna get a 2nd display but now I'm reluctant to buy one.
  quote
dfiler
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Pittsburgh
 
2005-02-14, 11:51

Yep, the laptop displays are fine. Or... at least don't have the pink problem. (Keep in mind when reading the forums, all compnies ship some faulty units.)

This thread was started about a 20 incher. But while on the topic of pink displays, it's important to mention the known, major pink problem with the 23" model.
  quote
Kurama
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
 
2005-02-14, 11:58

indeed;

those displays are beautiful but my question is when the monitor is faulty could you say "it's shot"
  quote
Feng
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Melbourne
 
2005-05-31, 19:17

I received my 20 today only to be faced with the disappointing combination of the pink hue issue and pronounced backlight bleeding in upper right corner. As there were but a few replies about the 20, I decided that it would be safe enough to order one. After an hour of attempting to calibrate the screen, I spoke with apple support in order to arrange an exchange.
I fear that this problem is widespread and that I will be faced with the same issue when the replacement arrives. Has anybody who purchased a pink 20 been able to replace it successfully? Oh, incidentally, the apple employee from order management confirmed to me that they are having difficulties with the 23s. It baffles me as to why the evidently faulty screens are not taken off the production line during quality inspection.

Hmm, will I curse the colour pink for the next three years?
  quote
holbox
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
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2005-05-31, 22:37

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasoco
No problem here. My 20" works fine.
LIKEWISE .........
  quote
CobaltFire
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2005-05-31, 23:48

Slightly off topic, but my PowerBook 15" display is rapidly having worse and worse backlight issues, as in too-bright, in a set area. It is like a cross in the middle of the screen. Should I go ahead and talk to Apple about this, or will they blow me off? As for the pink displays, that is the reason I don't have one yet for my PowerBook, don't want to buy a faulty display. Another interesting thing to note is that the 20" LCD panel is IDENTICAL to the one in the Dell 2005FPW screen. I recall them having some problems, and I think it was actually with a reddish color as well, but they seem to have fixed the problem lately.
  quote
Luca
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: Minnesota
 
2005-06-01, 00:56

Your PowerBook is obviously defective and you should talk to Apple about it. Why not? I mean, if they blow you off then now only are they wrong (unless you're out of warranty of course), but at the very least it's worth a shot.
  quote
SonOfSylvanus
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2005-06-01, 06:54

I hope that there is no blowing off involved... Heh heh.



Ahem... As for my pink hued display. I have put off taking it in for a second exchange until after my exams.

Yeesh, exams

I am fully confident that my returned display will be accepted as faulty and that I will have no trouble in getting a brand spanking new one in its place, or at least have this one fixed good an' proper...

Or there'll be hell to pay...

601.60 of hell to pay...


bouncy bouncy
  quote
Bryson
Rocket Surgeon
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: The Canadark
 
2005-06-01, 07:18

Quote:
Originally Posted by CobaltFire
Slightly off topic, but my PowerBook 15" display is rapidly having worse and worse backlight issues, as in too-bright, in a set area. It is like a cross in the middle of the screen. Should I go ahead and talk to Apple about this, or will they blow me off?
I know this sounds a bit obvious, but you're sure it's not light coming through the translucent Apple logo from behind? If not, I had an odd uneven backlighting issue on my p'book and they've replaced the screen entirely, so you should be able to get it sorted.
  quote
Feng
New Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Melbourne
 
2005-06-01, 19:23

Would somebody be kind enough to provide the pink sufferers with an image of their non-faulty 20. If there is a willing kind soul, could you please take a snap of your screen on a similar angle and under similar conditions to the image below, as this will aide comparisons.

If your only motivation is moneythere will be $5 USD available (via paypal) for the first individual who provides some useful comparison shots.



Last edited by Feng : 2005-06-01 at 19:30.
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SonOfSylvanus
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2005-06-02, 02:34

I know you want a 20" comparison, but did you see my comparison with my 15" powerbookeven that should give you some idea.



HTH

bouncy bouncy
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