Yarp
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Road Warrior
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Mr. Vieira
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Tennessee
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How, specifically? In what ways would they suddenly suck if - if - "next level" means what you're saying? What are they going to do - or, rather, undo - to their Macs that would make you worry?
They're certainly not going to "iPad-icize" them, right? I doubt it means touch-anything, and I don't think he's talking in terms of OS or any sort of interface/file system overhauls (or making Macs based on the iPhone OS). I take it to mean the latest processors and graphics, and perhaps some more aggressive pricing? Push an iMac model down to that $999 neighborhood (we know they can). Maybe that new interface that was being talked about (Light Peak?). Maybe new, redesigned (slightly overdue, as it's been six-and-a-half years with the same case) Mac Pros? Probably just an annual boilerplate statement. Every year something has to be taken to the "next level", otherwise it'll feel like you're just running in place. I wouldn't worry about it. |
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Thunderbolt, fuck yeah!
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Denmark
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Speaking of Steve. Is it just me or has he gone into overdrive the last few days here? Seems like he's willing to pick a fight with anyone stupid enough to get in the pit with him. |
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Selfish Heathen
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
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See related: Tinkerer's Sunset Quote:
The quality of this board depends on the quality of the posts. The only way to guarantee thoughtful, informative discussion is to write thoughtful, informative posts. AppleNova is not a real-time chat forum. You have time to compose messages and edit them before and after posting. |
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Yarp
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Road Warrior
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I don't think Apple would ever ditch some level of customization. But what I fear happening is OS X Home edition and OS X Pro edition. Ya know?
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Thunderbolt, fuck yeah!
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Denmark
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I don't think so, OS X is already pretty locked down compared to Windows and let's not get to far into the thought that all future computing has to be as simple as the iPad. There has never been as many power users as there are today, they will demand power and Apple will supply it or see someone else take their market.
If anything the iPad will be the new "Home OS X", but don't count on seeing it on your MacBook anytime soon. |
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Selfish Heathen
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
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But then there are the frightening things that the iPhone/iPod/iPad OS brings with it, namely the requirement of using the Apple-approved app store and the locking out of the user from modifying his own device. Apple can't completely enforce this across all Macs because at some level Apple has to allow deeper access for the people who are writing the software. Consumers need not play with the filesystem, but developers do. Consumers need not access the System folder, but developers do. This is where I expect different "editions" of Mac OS (I hesitate to call it Mac OS "X" because things will be so different) to enter the picture at some not-too-distant future point. You have your consumer-level OS that comes on all devices and then you have your developer-level OS that comes with a contract and fee, like we have today for the iPhone/iPod/iPad development model. Pessimistic? Maybe, but I don't think it's a far stretch. edit: Now, I'm not suggesting the iPhone/iPod/iPad OS will literally be transitioned over as the default consumer-level Mac OS but that some evolution between that and what we know today as Mac OS X will be. The quality of this board depends on the quality of the posts. The only way to guarantee thoughtful, informative discussion is to write thoughtful, informative posts. AppleNova is not a real-time chat forum. You have time to compose messages and edit them before and after posting. |
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Chicago
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This is also reminiscent of Simple Finder. Last time, it was too restrictive, even for the non-geek, though, IIRC.
As for Flash, I want to see it die as much as anyone, but Apple had better tread carefully, because Adobe has the ultimate ammo: pulling support for the Creative Suite after 10.6. That would kill the Mac. |
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Sneaky Punk
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Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Ottawa, ON
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Adobe must be seeing a future beyond Flash themselves...and my prediction is that they would not pull that sort of stunt.
As for Brad's suggestion, I am not sure that I see the realistic basis for that being Steve's vision. Nightmare, yes. Reality, no. When there's an eel in the lake that's as long as a snake that's a moray. |
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: Ottawa, ON
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Selfish Heathen
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
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Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2004
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What is tinkering if not working around blocks? Yeah, it may block the script kiddies, but come on - anyone actually interested in continual tinkering is going to *have* to learn more just to do it. Like the old days. The folks I see getting weeded out by this through frustration are the ones that want a simple *programming* experience. There really isn't any such thing. You roll up your sleeves, you dive in with both hands, and you get grease under your nails. Or you go home. I'm not saying it's right, I'm just saying that line amuses the hell out of me in the middle of a worthwhile discussion over an admittedly worrisome trend. Last edited by Kickaha : 2010-02-01 at 11:23. |
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Banging the Bottom End
Join Date: Jun 2004
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The problem is that today, there's the DMCA to stop healthy tinkering if the guy decides to tell his friend about it or show him/her how to do it. The 70s was the era of the Magnusson-Moss Act, where it was codified by law that third party parts could not negate an entire warranty, the warranty could only be negated if the manufacturer could prove the problem was caused by the third party parts. So in the 70s, there was wide recognition of a right to tinker, but today, there's only IP infringement, copy protection cracking and other charges designed to drain a normal person's bank account if the company decides to wage a legal attack against a person.
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Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2004
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Oh, I agree. The DMCA is an evil piece of law that needs to die in a fire. No doubt about that.
But to have essentially a line that says "They're making hacking haaaaaaaard..." just hit my funnybone. |
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Selfish Heathen
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
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Yarp
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Road Warrior
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Geeze, thanks BARD, but I'm not that worried.
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ಠ_ರೃ
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Minnesota
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With their "vertical integration model," Apple has already made it frustrating and difficult to use anything other than Apple hardware and software at every level. Sure, the experience is great if you use Apple stuff for everything... use an iPod with your iMac, and you had better be using iTunes and QuickTime for all your media needs, and you can take videos with your iPod and display photos, but you had better be using iMovie and iPhoto and nothing else. But if you stray from that model even a little, things get dicey.
My fear is that "the next level" will switch that from "difficult" to "impossible." |
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I'm not really concerned at all about Job's comments or the future of the Mac. Tinkering is fun if you're a computer geek but even that gets a bit old after a while. What's fun to me is this burgeoning platform duopoly. I suppose by next year I'll have the 2010 iPhone, and iPad and a 27" iMac Quad Core and they'll all be in sync regarding data. What's important to me about computing today is my data and how I access it. There will always be ways of making something look beautiful or different but that's auxiliary to my goal of having all my desired information at my fingertips. omgwtfbbq |
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Formerly CoachKrzyzewski
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ಠ_ರೃ
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Minnesota
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Not sayin', just sayin'
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Getting back to the the original post, I think as long as Apple is in the content creation business, they will offer Macs. I don't see them going away. I do see Macs becoming a kind of back-end to the consumer offerings: create more "pro" content on Macs eventually (though it's worth pointing out that iLife as a consumer product is still only available on the Mac) and that gets passed up to the content consuming devices like the iPad. I don't see Apple abandoning the Mac in that sense, just narrowing its focus over time. That probably means fewer developers for the Mac eventually, which is somewhat worrying. Apple seems to be weakest trying to understand that segment though. So we'll see I guess. Seems like a clear concept to me though without sacrificing the platform.
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The iMac is becoming a lifestyle Mac. It's now up to 27" meaning it can function like a small TV yet still manage all the peripherals and ancillary items you need (which Apple hopes includes iPods, iPhones and iPads) The Mac Pro will continue to be the Power Users Mac and I see no reason for Apple to sell their Pro apps off. Those of us who wish to run Final Cut Studio, Aperture and Logic Pro will continue to pine for a high end iMac and Mac Pro. Next step will likely be an update to the Apple TV with either an A4 or another PA Semi designed variant. omgwtfbbq |
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Mr. Vieira
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Tennessee
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Macs, as we know them, will be around for a good while. We know this. And all this handwringing and worrying about "the future" just seems a bit...odd. Get a grip, folks. You'll be able to buy a kick-ass iMac or MacBook in 2015, to run Adobe CS 7 on. I think everyone has applied their own personal "nightmare scenario" to something Steve never even said. You're looking through the iPad prism and applying it everywhere, whether it makes sense or not. Apple isn't going to shoot themselves in the nuts like this. But who's to say both things can't happen? Why can't Apple make a big move to appeal to the non-geek, consumer/grandpa 'n' aunt crowd (they certainly outnumber the geeks and tinkerers) while still maintaining their diehard, flagship OS and Mac lines? Who says it has to be "either/or"? They know where their bread is buttered. Actually, they're luckier than most companies because they get it buttered from two distinct, separate user bases. The "halo" users, brought into the fold via iTunes, iPod, iPhone, their first Mac, etc. and then the rest of us who've got a good decade or so in, have owned numerous Macs, hang out a crazy places like this and argue about Flash and "Avatar", etc. I see that as a good thing. Apple is standing on two very strong legs. Man, Apple releases a true "computer for the rest of 'em" and everyone else feels threatened/left out and poops their pants in a blind panic about The Future™. At least that's how it kinda comes across. Sorta. Last edited by psmith2.0 : 2010-02-01 at 13:37. |
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Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2004
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I think this is the first sign of a huge schism - prosumer OS/machines for the geeks (Windows, Mac, Linux), and consumer OS/machines for everyone else (iPad, iPhone, er... anyone else?). Each will have its own ecosystem, but they'll be related - the prosumer feeding the consumer, whether through apps or media. There's no reason Apple won't do both, and obviously, it's in their own best interests to do both. The fact that they have a single unified code base underneath is just GOLD. Quote:
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Formerly Roboman, still
awesome Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Portland, OR
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This thread just feels like a total non sequitur to me. Jobs make his requisite "this year is gonna be rad!" comment, and suddenly it's the end of the Mac as we know it? Huh?
I'm with pscates. Macs aren't going anywhere. We'll just all have iPads too. |
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is the next Chiquita
Join Date: Feb 2005
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It used to be that a tinkerer was someone who could hardwire few wires with registers and wield a soldering iron. It then happened that the tinkerer was now someone who could twiddle bits. Not too long after, it was the tinkerer who can write "mov [rax],[rex] cmp [rax], [rix+80dh], je 0x00001234" and knew what it meant. Then it was inevident that the tinkerer was someone who could write a networking protocol in ANSI C. By and by, tinkerer was now someone who could drag'n'drop a control into a pretty GUI and build an application in months. And so on.... But who's the real tinkerer here? Thus the kiddie scripts are threatened because they're now irrelevant. Little they knew they were only relevant because of necessity. No wonder they have their panties in a bunch. |
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Veteran Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Unknown
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Regardless what these new Macs for 2010 are going to be... I just ordered a refurb 13" MBP for $999.
Woot. |
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Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2004
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Nice! I'm in the market for one myself.
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Selfish Heathen
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
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My iPad is bigger than your i... wait that just isn't right. The quality of this board depends on the quality of the posts. The only way to guarantee thoughtful, informative discussion is to write thoughtful, informative posts. AppleNova is not a real-time chat forum. You have time to compose messages and edit them before and after posting. |
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