[Prototype]

Yeah!!! No. 1 seed!!! I-L-L!!! I-N-I!!!

No wait, I'm looking at 2005's bracket. Oh well. Go Illini!

[Wyatt]

I just finished my serious bracket.

Final Four: Florida vs. UCLA, Texas vs. Ohio State, Ohio State takes the title over Florida (89 total points)

The Midwest is my upset region, with a 12-13 matchup in the second round (ODU vs. Davidson) and #11 Winthrop all the way to the Elite Eight.

My only other "big" one is Duke going out in the first round, but I don't consider that as big a stretch as some others will.

[Partial]

Originally Posted by jdcfsu My Noles' bubble burst again... stupid mid-major garbage. I guess beating #1 ranked Florida and having all of your losses be to RPI top 50 teams isn't as good as only loosing 3 games and playing one of the weakest schedules in the country. But hey, it doesn't matter because Florida State will represent in the nations oldest, and most prestigious post season college basketball tournament as a #2 seed.

What team are you referencing?

[Yontsey]

Originally Posted by tensdanny38 What team are you referencing?

Florida St, who probably wasnt even in the last four teams out

[jdcfsu]

Originally Posted by Yontsey Florida St, who probably wasnt even in the last four teams out

According to ESPN's guy we were but who knows for sure. I'm just tired of all the treatment the mid-major conferences get in basketball and football. If they had to play a schedule that the SEC, ACC, Big 12 teams had to play, there is no way they would even come close to getting any recognition, but because they play relative nobodies they can post a record that looks impressive. There needs to be something like an NCAA Division I-A for all the mid-major conferences to even the playing field a bit.

[Yontsey]

Originally Posted by jdcfsu According to ESPN's guy we were but who knows for sure. I'm just tired of all the treatment the mid-major conferences get in basketball and football. If they had to play a schedule that the SEC, ACC, Big 12 teams had to play, there is no way they would even come close to getting any recognition, but because they play relative nobodies they can post a record that looks impressive. There needs to be something like an NCAA Division I-A for all the mid-major conferences to even the playing field a bit.

Youd be surprised. A lot of those mid-majors upset a fairly good amount of "major" teams. I cant think of specific teams with teams they beat this year, but I know mid majors upset teams like Kansas, Syracuse, and Villanova, to go along with many more.

Mid majors are at a disadvantage because major conference teams are scared to play a lot of these solid programs and when they do, they never ever play the mid-major on the road, so the odds are already against them. A lot of these mid-major teams deserve the credit they get, if not more, but due to the way the system works, they dont get it. Take George Mason last year for example...

Besides, if you say Florida St is getting screwed, then you also have to consider teams liek Syracuse, Air Force, West Virginia, and Drexel that I think shoulda gotten in ahead of FSU. Drexel should have definitely been in the tourney instead of Stanford. What a joke.

[jdcfsu]

Oh, I'm not saying FSU is the only team screwed out, there were more don't get me wrong. And you make valid points about the mid-major's but I still think they are given too much credit. Sure they are good for the occasional upset and cinderella run, but for the majority of them out there a weak conference and few RPI top 50 games should not make them better then an FSU or any other team "on the bubble" that plays in a major conference where they are in essence fighting for their season every time they take the court. The tournament should be the top 65 teams, not the top 30-35 and then special consideration for some other teams that might not be as good but think they deserve a fair shake as well.

[Foj]

Yellow Jackets are going to go all the way!

At least into the second round.

[kieran]

I don't know how to take all the press about Drexel as good or bad.

Having Drexel being talked about as the biggest snub is making the snub a little easier to handle, but it's crazy that they're even being talked about as a snub. They should be in.

On another note, how bout getting screwed by two selection committees in one day? The NIT rewarded us not getting in the Tournament with a 3 seed in the NIT. WTF is that?

There is a definite bias towards the BCS conferences no matter what anyone says. How do Stanford and Arkansas make the field? Even an announcer on ESPN, a graduate of Arkansas, admitted he said, "You gotta be kidding me!" when Arkansas' name was announced.

[Wyatt]

Originally Posted by kieran23kk Having Drexel being talked about as the biggest snub is making the snub a little easier to handle

I know exactly what you mean. My school got snubbed in the D-3 football tourney this year (a much better system than the BCS, but that's for a different discussion). It was nice to hear that we were one of the two "big snubs" this year, but it still sucked to miss the tourney in a 1-loss season.

[Yontsey]

Originally Posted by jdcfsu Oh, I'm not saying FSU is the only team screwed out, there were more don't get me wrong. And you make valid points about the mid-major's but I still think they are given too much credit. Sure they are good for the occasional upset and cinderella run, but for the majority of them out there a weak conference and few RPI top 50 games should not make them better then an FSU or any other team "on the bubble" that plays in a major conference where they are in essence fighting for their season every time they take the court. The tournament should be the top 65 teams, not the top 30-35 and then special consideration for some other teams that might not be as good but think they deserve a fair shake as well.

I dunno if I can grasp your argument here. 31 bids are awarded due to conference tourney winners. Fair deal. 34 there after are awarded to the next deserving teams given record, RPI, SOS, ect. There were several "mid-majors" in the top 25 this season and they rightfully deserved that. You say the mid-majors get too much credit, but this year, only 6 mid-major schools received at large bids and is the lowest total for mid-majors since 2002 or 03. If anything, I say the mid-majors dont get enough credit because people over look their accomplishments. Take Gonzaga fo example. It took them like 10 years of consistantly making it to the tournment and advancing deep until people starting considering them a legit threat and not a mid-major.

[jdcfsu]

I'm not saying the mid-majors don't deserve a shot, but what I am saying is that all the mid-major conference winners and at large bid receivers do not. There should be some sort of play-in system for all those mid-major conferences. An initial tournament or something where all those mid-major conference winners play for a handful of spots in the tournament. Either that, or make the tournament the RPI top 65 period. Winning a conference doesn't get you anywhere automatically. I just don't think it's a far system right now and it probably won't ever be, much like the BCS, because of all the money that is involved in it.

[kieran]

So you're saying that mid-majors aren't good enough to get into the tournament to play with the boys from the BCS conferences? How does that make sense?

Florida State couldn't even finish above .500 in conference play. Neither did Arkansas. If you can't even win half of your conference games, you have no business playing in the tournament.

Edit: I forgot to mention your RPI suggestion. Teams can't help that the other teams in their conference drag down the RPI of the entire conference. There are always going to be bottom feeders in every conference that bring down everyone's RPI. You can't just use that to select teams.

[jdcfsu]

FSU didn't finish above .500 in conference play, but every team in the conference was an RPI top 50 team. You can stick a team like FSU or Arkansas in a conference where they are the only team that ranks in the RPI top 50 and of course they are going to do better then .500 in conference play. This is where strength of schedule comes into play. Like I said before, it's not a perfect science, but I still think too much emphasis is given to the mid-majors.

[kieran]

I think you may be the first person in history to ever say that the emphasis is given to the mid-majors.

In the past three years, out of the 34 at large bids, 12, 8, and 6, respectively have gone to teams from mid-major conferences.

If too much emphasis is given to mid-majors, how can a team with an out of conference SOS rated at #7 in the country with 14 road wins be left out of the tournament?

Drexel went on the road and won games against big name opponents, which is what the committee said they wanted from mid-majors, and still couldn't get in.

[jdcfsu]

Originally Posted by kieran23kk If too much emphasis is given to mid-majors, how can a team with and out of conference SOS rated at #7 in the country with 14 road wins be left out of the tournament? Drexel went on the road and won games against big name opponents, which is what the committee said they wanted from mid-majors, and still couldn't get in.

Again, I'm not saying that all the mid-majors should be banished from the tournament. A team like Drexel should be in because they scheduled tough teams and went on the road and won. But then you have a team like Jackson St who, because they won their conference, is going to the dance despite a strength of schedule and RPI barely in the top 50 and with ZERO RPI top 100 wins! It's ridiculous. Just because you win a conference championship you shouldn't gain an automatic bid to the tournament. This is where the tournament favors mid-majors.

[torifile]

There's no way they should take away the automatic bids. That's how the tourney started. Going to the dance by winning a tournament is what makes the NCAAs so great. Everyone has a chance to go.

If you want it to be fair, they need to use a particular criterion (like the RPI), publish it and give the 34 at large bids to to the 34 best teams that were left out.

[kieran]

The automatic bid part of the tournament is by far the best part of it. By giving automatic bids, the committee is telling everyone that they have a shot to win the national championship.

Teams just need to win to advance. That puts everyone's fate in their own hands at one point. If you keep winning, you win it all. After a loss, you don't deserve to control your own fate anymore and should be put in the pool with everyone else.

Also, if you take away an automatic bid from a team like Jackson St, what does that do? Just let in more mediocre teams from the power conferences? I don't think many people want that.

[Yontsey]

I wonder if he'd be complaining about automatic bids of Florida State won the ACC tourney?

[jdcfsu]

Originally Posted by torifile If you want it to be fair, they need to use a particular criterion (like the RPI), publish it and give the 34 at large bids to to the 34 best teams that were left out.

That would be a fair way to do it.

Originally Posted by kieran23kk Also, if you take away an automatic bid from a team like Jackson St, what does that do? Just let in more mediocre teams from the power conferences? I don't think many people want that.

Not exactly, all these mid-major conference winners that don't fit in the tournament's RPI (or whatever other) requirements would play of, as I said before, for X number of spots. Say there are 16 teams in said mid-major playoff, well take the last 4 standing. Like I said, some sort of mid-major play-in round to determine the teams that should be in. Or, like I said in my original argument, create some sort of Division 1-A where all these mid-major conferences can come together. In either situation, a mid-major team that schedules tough non-con teams should be rewarded and, given they fit the normal criteria for tournament admission, be given a bid. But giving a team like Jackson State an automatic bid is, at the same time, penalizing a team who plays in a difficult conference or, to use Drexel, who does go the extra mile and schedules tough non-con games.

Originally Posted by Yontsey I wonder if he'd be complaining about automatic bids of Florida State won the ACC tourney?

I don't think there was much chance of that happening, though I would have really complained, along with a lot more people, if NC State won the ACC tourney and thus stole admission to the big dance on a 15-14 season.

[kieran]

Originally Posted by jdcfsu TBut giving a team like Jackson State an automatic bid is, at the same time, penalizing a team who plays in a difficult conference or, to use Drexel, who does go the extra mile and schedules tough non-con games.

It does hurt Drexel this year, but they had their chance to win the automatic bid by winning their conference tourney. Jackson St. got the bid to the tournament by winning their conference. That's the beauty of the whole tournament, everyone has a chance to get in by winning when it counts.

I'm fine with mediocre teams getting in by winning their conference (E.g. George Washington), but the problem seems to lie with the mediocre teams from the power conferences getting at large bids over good teams from the mid majors.

(As you can tell, I'm just a little angry over the whole Drexel situation. Give me a day or two and I'll settle down. I just wish they don't let me down for standing up for them by blowing it in the NIT against NC State tomorrow night.)

[torifile]

I don't think there was much chance of that happening, though I would have really complained, along with a lot more people, if NC State won the ACC tourney and thus stole admission to the big dance on a 15-14 season.

Are you kidding? That would have been great! You're not a b-ball fan if you wouldn't have enjoyed that. I'm as big a UNC fan as anyone and I was half pulling for State to win.

BTW, anyone else having a problem with the CBS bracket being screwed up? 1/4 of my picks (south region, I think) are missing.

I'm not the only one. Nice. I hope my picks are preserved.

[jdcfsu]

Oh, don't get me wrong, I was pulling for State as well, but I'm just saying I would have been just as pissed as the next guy if they stole a bid in from a team that was more deserving. NIT did away with auto-bids insofar as not even letting the returning champion earn an auto-bid.

As far as everything else is concerned, I can't wait for the games to get going -- and why did CBS want so much information for my sportsline ID?

[PKIDelirium]

I put a fake street address and phone number in it.

[Kickaha]

Originally Posted by torifile Are you kidding? That would have been great! You're not a b-ball fan if you wouldn't have enjoyed that. I'm as big a UNC fan as anyone and I was half pulling for State to win.

You and me both. That was one hell of a first half, I was actually kinda worried... which means, good game.

Then it all went got lopsided and boring. :P State got close a couple of times, but then...

[billybobsky]

i don't normally do this but I think Ohio State will take it...

[kieran]

Originally Posted by Kickaha You and me both. That was one hell of a first half, I was actually kinda worried... which means, good game. Then it all went got lopsided and boring. :P State got close a couple of times, but then...

...and then they lose and become a six seed in the NIT, which means my Dragons get them in the first round tomorrow night. It should be a good game, but i worry about how Drexel will deal with being snubbed from the Big Dance.

[SKMDC]

I'm in, but under my christian name, david jordan.
I have no actual vested interest this year, so perhaps I'll do better than usual.

[kieran]

Just a little reminder.

Picks must be submitted by 12:00 EST on March 15 (Tomorrow)


I'm just getting ready to pick my upset bracket. Got my first one done.

[Partial]

I posted a pick'em pool thing just for fun in a seperate thread in AO. No money is involved obviously, so its just for fun. You guys should sign up and we'll see what happens!! I made a lot of homer picks, but I am thinking OSU is gonna get it done!