[Luca]

Hey, all you Adium users... try Proteus. It's like way better. $15 shareware, but worth it. If anything, it gets you nearly fully functional file transfer - you're unfortunately not able to send folders, but you can send any individual file. There's a little transfer window that pops up and shows you how fast it's going. Really nifty. Adium's file transfer is not only unreliable, but the interface for using the feature is terrible and a result of negligence on the part of the developers, not from lack of the right file transfer technology.

[ast3r3x]

I just looked quickly, but I can't say I like proteus' interface better than adium. It's drawer for contacts take up too much space for me, and would only be better in the rare occasion that I'm talking to more than 6 or so people at a time. I also didn't see a way to customize the buddy list, but maybe I'm wrong.

I like adium's small footprint and look. Once it gets file transfers working...which will probably be 88 years, I'll be completely happy.

[Luca]

The file transfers is kind of what did it for me with Proteus. Another aspect is the management of groups. iChat's handling of groups leaves a lot to be desired, but at least it doesn't mess with what you've set up in another AIM client (for example, the official AOL Instant Messenger one, assuming you'd ever let that turd touch your computer). I find groups very useful and Adium does a horrible job with them. In fact, Adium shouldn't even try to handle groups, because it messes them up. I'll open Adium, and 2/3 of my contacts will be in one group, and 2/3 will be in another... it allows contacts to be in multiple groups, and you can't move contacts from one group to another. Overall the group handling is just extremely buggy in Adium. Works perfectly in Proteus.

Proteus may not be as tiny and compact as Adium, but it's very nicely polished and feels like a complete piece of software rather than the thrown-together jumble that Adium seems like sometime. Certain components of Adium are extremely nice, like the customization of the buddy list. But others are so woefully lacking in basic features or even basic, sound design principles that it makes me think Adium's developers have spent 99% of their time making transparent buddy lists and 1% working on new features and bug fixes.

[NaMo4184]

Originally Posted by ast3r3x I just looked quickly, but I can't say I like proteus' interface better than adium. It's drawer for contacts take up too much space for me, and would only be better in the rare occasion that I'm talking to more than 6 or so people at a time. I also didn't see a way to customize the buddy list, but maybe I'm wrong. I like adium's small footprint and look. Once it gets file transfers working...which will probably be 88 years, I'll be completely happy.

The next release will have file transfer support. I am 100% sure. But its having problems sending files router to router. I think they said they want an elegant solution for it.

[ast3r3x]

Originally Posted by Luca The file transfers is kind of what did it for me with Proteus. Another aspect is the management of groups. iChat's handling of groups leaves a lot to be desired, but at least it doesn't mess with what you've set up in another AIM client (for example, the official AOL Instant Messenger one, assuming you'd ever let that turd touch your computer). I find groups very useful and Adium does a horrible job with them. In fact, Adium shouldn't even try to handle groups, because it messes them up. I'll open Adium, and 2/3 of my contacts will be in one group, and 2/3 will be in another... it allows contacts to be in multiple groups, and you can't move contacts from one group to another. Overall the group handling is just extremely buggy in Adium. Works perfectly in Proteus. Proteus may not be as tiny and compact as Adium, but it's very nicely polished and feels like a complete piece of software rather than the thrown-together jumble that Adium seems like sometime. Certain components of Adium are extremely nice, like the customization of the buddy list. But others are so woefully lacking in basic features or even basic, sound design principles that it makes me think Adium's developers have spent 99% of their time making transparent buddy lists and 1% working on new features and bug fixes.

Might want to check your police work there. Not only do I find Adium's group handling working almost perfect, changing users is very easy. I can drag a user from one group to the other, control where it is positioned.

I really don't think Adium's UI is thrown together, look how windows interact when you drag a tab away from the main window, or putting them back. I'd say it's because it isn't the standard apple UI for tabs that you say that.

Originally Posted by NaMo4184 The next release will have file transfer support. I am 100% sure. But its having problems sending files router to router. I think they said they want an elegant solution for it.

I thought file transfers worked normally, but from behind a router it didn't work. I mean working perfectly from any internet location is what I need.

Edit: Biggest problem I have with adium's contact list management is that after you talk to a new person, it's only next time you sign on that they are on the recent buddies group.

[chucker]

Originally Posted by Luca Hey, all you Adium users... try Proteus. It's like way better. $15 shareware, but worth it. If anything, it gets you nearly fully functional file transfer - you're unfortunately not able to send folders, but you can send any individual file. There's a little transfer window that pops up and shows you how fast it's going. Really nifty. Adium's file transfer is not only unreliable, but the interface for using the feature is terrible and a result of negligence on the part of the developers, not from lack of the right file transfer technology.

Hey Luca, you Proteus user... try Adium. It's like way better. Unfortunately GPL, but worth it. If anything, it gets you the exact same instant messaging framework (Libgaim) - for free. The "little transfer window that pops up" is there in the 0.8 beta versions. Really nifty. Proteus's file transfer not only uses the exact same backend (Libgaim), but also doesn't do any sort of magic to make it better.

:P

[Luca]

I decided to split this off since I wanted to continue discussing AIM clients without getting more off topic. I apologize for pulling the first one off topic in the first place.

Anyway, here's a simple description of how Adium messes up groups:

- I open Proteus, create a couple groups (Buddies, AppleNova, and Family)
- I put the appropriate contacts in each group. All the guys from AN on my buddy list are in the AppleNova group, my family members are in the Family group, and the rest stay in the default "Buddies" group.
- I quit Proteus and open Adium. Upon launch, I notice that only one group is displayed - the AppleNova group. The rest don't show up. Weird...
- I tell Adium to display offline contacts. My contact list grows to accommodate all the extra entries.
- All but three of my contacts are in the "AppleNova" group. The other three are in the "Buddies" group. The "Family" group is gone, and there are two groups for my Yahoo! contacts (even though I hardly use Y! and have never created any groups for it... hell, I only know two people who use it).

Why did one of my groups disappear? Why did almost all of my buddies get moved to the AppleNova group? Luckily if I quit Adium and start Proteus, it sees all my groups just fine without messing with them. I just have to be careful not to try and change any of my groups using Adium, because it completely messes them up if I do.

This combined with the asinine file transfer handling (it automatically switches focus to a highlighted text field without warning, so I usually overwrite file names accidentally) makes me see Adium as... kind of retarded. I'm not sure how easy or hard it is to make groups work properly, but it shouldn't take more than a couple minutes for someone to add a dialog box asking if you'd like to accept a file transfer before shoving the rename dialog in your face. That's not a case of limited technology, it's just poor design.

[Wrao]

I like iChat.

[ast3r3x]

Not sure of your problem with the groups, I haven't had problems, but I didn't make my groups with proteus, so maybe that is what is messing it up.

I also don't really see the point in asking if you want to accept a file transfer and then a dialog box. If you want to accept it, you chose where you want to save it, and then the name and hit save, if not, cancel and the file transfer is canceled. Why would you want to accept twice? I can see the want for two dialogs, but I don't think it's necessary.

Come on, don't blame over writing file names on Adium. Someone is sending you (somehow by chance) a file named the same thing, and you are hitting save...not Adium's fault.

If I had your trouble with groups I wouldn't use Adium either, but I've never had any similar problems, so it's all cool for me

[Brad]

Originally Posted by Luca Anyway, here's a simple description of how Adium messes up groups: [snip] Why did one of my groups disappear?

That sounds more like it's Proteus messing up your groups, not Adium. Ever think about that? Maybe Proteus is only keeping some group settings in its local preferences and not properly syncing with the real AIM servers. Open the official AIM client and look at your buddy list. Are the buddies arranged like they are in Adium or Proteus? That will answer the question about which is wrong and which is right.

This combined with the asinine file transfer handling

Fixed in 0.8 and, yes, the old way was very poor design.

[ast3r3x]

.8?! I guess I should upgrade from .76.

Isn't .77 the newest?

[Luca]

I just checked with AOL Instant Messenger (sm) (wtf is "(sm)" anyway?). The groups are exactly as I arranged them with Proteus. Adium is the one at fault, as I suspected. There's some other evidence that Adium is having problems... I got several errors when trying to move buddies from one group to another using Adium a little while back (before I learned my lesson). Besides, Adium doesn't even have full group functionnality anyway, so that seems to imply that the feature hasn't really been worked on. You can't create groups with Adium.

I looked at the Adium's forums, and it seems a few others have also had group problems. I think I noticed some of them saying that they were unable to move offline buddies between groups.

[Brad]

SM is service mark. It's basically a trademark for services.

That's odd about the groups. I've never seen that before. FWIW, group creation is in 0.8 too.

Originally Posted by ast3r3x .8?! I guess I should upgrade from .76.

It's in beta.

[Paul]

Why do they always hide their betas!?
It is NOT 1.0 software yet. It is ALL beta quality software, why make it a separate page to get the latest builds?!

[Brad]

Well, that depends on your definition of beta.

Traditionally, you have a roadmap of features for each version and release software when you've tested and triaged bugs to a certain level of satisfaction for each step. The official releases fit this description perfectly. Beta releases are such that there are outstanding bugs both known and unknown and where planned features may be incomplete or broken.

By the way, do you consider Camino to be "beta" software? Its version is still only at 0.8.2, but what does that really matter?

[Paul]

wow, .80 is really cool.
Too bad it didn't import my appearance preferences, but it wasn't that big of a deal to get it similar...

[rasmits]

I'm with Luca. I used to use Adium because I was so sick of the "omgz wheres ur displaie pics?". Someone told me to use Proteus and it seems a lot more professional and solid. Simple things like changing your display picture are a lot easier with Proteus and it's a whole lot more attractive, in my opinion, then any of the amature skins you can find for Adium.

I'm not going to reiterate any of Luca's arguements, I'm just going to say that I agree with all of them. I also am not able to move contacts between groups, and Adium completely messed up my group names.

[ast3r3x]

PEBKACs all the way





jk of course, for all we know you sit on a stool

[Luca]

Adium 0.8 beta doesn't fix the group problems.

[Purgatory]

If something doesn't work for you, then it's understandable that you'd switch from Adium. But you have to keep in mind that it's still beta software, and to compare it to a much more mature application, like Proteus (version 4.5 is right over the horizon) doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Personally, I love Adium's compact nature, the features, and I don't have issues like, say, you, Luca, have (ie issues with buddy list, file transfer*), so Adium's cool with me.

* I mean that I rarely use this feature..

[Phoenix]

Ok what the heck does PEBKAC mean? Sorry have no idea about this one.

[Luca]

Problem Exists Between Keyboard And Chair.

But ast3r3x is joking of course .

Ain't that right ast3r3x???? *waves mod stick*

[ast3r3x]

I'm not talking until I speak to my attorney...or you stop brandishing that stick like a mad man.