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Ely's eBay Dilemma (Moral issue)


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Ely's eBay Dilemma (Moral issue)
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Elysium
Environmental Bloodhound
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Land of ice and snow
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2009-12-05, 15:43

So, since Apple doesn't really offer a non AIO desktop computer that fits my needs I decided that I would build myself a Hackintosh with next year's tax refund and figured it would be cool to put it in a PowerMac G5 case.

I troll through eBay over the Thanksgiving weekend and stumble across a brand new shrink-wrapped case for $80 BIN with $20 shipping. On average, good used ones tend to go for $100-120 total. I figure what the hell and go ahead and get it. The seller stated that it wouldn't ship until Dec. 1st, so I pay the man and go on my merry way.

So it shows up this week on the 3rd. Everything is fine and I am well pleased. That is until this morning (5th) when I check my little used eBay email address and find two messages from the seller. The first is an explanation of how he's relatively new to eBay and didn't research the item properly (undervalued BIN price) and the shipping. Shipping came to $104 (UPS) (his values). So he asks for a $40 handout to help with the shipping.

But wait, there's a second email from Friday (4th) morning. Now it comes to light that he is a college student from VA, currently in Manhattan, selling this on behalf of a friend (profit split). Plus, he already shipped the package in good faith that we could work something out.

So, basically I can see this scenario played out as such:
- He takes it to the UPS store
- They package it in house in a frankenstein monstrosity of 2 boxes taped together filled with peanuts measuring a whopping 30"x25"x15" and 26 lbs.
- After packaging the item they give him the shipping cost. Which due to it's large package size has to go air, not ground, and because of the high volume to weight ratio it has a "shipping weight" of 60.3 lbs. Ultimately we get a resulting shipping + packaging charge of $104.
- He is already on the hook for the packaging, so he decides to ship it anyway and hopes that I will bail him out.

So, now the dilemma.
- The case is now in my possession with the agreed upon sale of $100.
- He is out $4 and the case because he got raped by UPS on shipping due to overzealous packaging (checked their rates, and it does check out). However, a smaller box of 22x22x12 with the same weight would have more than protected the item and would have been shipped ground for $18.
- He wants $40 to help defray his shipping costs and maintain some profit, after he already shipped the item on good faith without a response from me.
- I am not going to give someone $40 for his own stupidity.

The solutions:
- I just blithely ignore any requests for money, and contest any negative feedback that he leaves.
- I offer to return the item at his expense using the ground method above for a full refund plus shipping expenses ($120). So that he can attempt to resell the item at a higher profit to recoup the losses that he already incurred ($104 original shipping + $20 return shipping).
- Offer a middle ground refund of $20 (the moral high road approach).

Formerly known as cynical_rock
censeo tentatio victum
There is no snooze button on a cat.
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thegeriatric
geri to my friends
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Heaven
 
2009-12-05, 16:05

Hmm a difficult one, you could take the attitude, tough titty, his problem not yours, and do nothing. Or you could take pity on this stupid, but nice guy, and offer to bail him out a bit, so long as you feel you're still getting a good deal.

I used to be undecided.....But now I'm not so sure.
No trees were harmed in the sending of this message. However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
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PB PM
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Join Date: Oct 2005
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2009-12-05, 16:09

That's a tough call. In some ways it is the sellers fault for not checking into the shipping cost ahead of time. By the terms of eBay you are in the clear, the final selling price is a contract of sale, but still, I think the middle ground is the way to go.
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jdcfsu
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Florida
 
2009-12-05, 16:10

The transaction is complete so you really don't have to do anything, but offering him $20 or to ship back at his expense plus a refund are probably fair offers.
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torifile
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Join Date: May 2004
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2009-12-05, 16:12

I bought an LCD tv from Kraetos last year and he had the exact same dilemma - shipping it was crazy expensive. He asked and I agreed to split the cost. $40 seems reasonable given that you got a good deal and he shipped it promptly despite the cost. Even at $140 it was a good deal.

Conisider it Karma for violating Apple's EULA.
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curiousuburb
Antimatter Man
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: that interweb thing
 
2009-12-05, 16:53

Uh... maybe I'm missing the exchange rate on the math involved.

Sale price agreed $80 + $20 shipping.
26 lbs shipping weight... but just as if genius packs it with rocks instead of styrofoam, or UPS miscalculates in metric or hexadecimal, it somehow comes to 60.3 lbs "shipping weight" via air.
His shipping cost = $104 air (rather than $18 ground if he'd been smarter)
You think this means he's out $4 rather than $86 when sale and shipping are totted up

Solution:
Split the difference and give him $20... and split the cost of some math books for all involved.
Better yet, send him $10 in his original box and tell him it was $40... but it cost you $30 more than expected to ship his refund because the box was too big/heavy.

All those who believe in telekinesis, raise my hand.

Last edited by curiousuburb : 2009-12-05 at 17:07. Reason: more smileys
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PKIDelirium
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
 
2009-12-05, 17:39

I would follow eBay policy, which is the seller must honor the terms of the sale. If they take a bath due to not properly researching shipping, that's their problem.
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Brad
Selfish Heathen
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
 
2009-12-05, 17:41

Quote:
Originally Posted by PKIDelirium View Post
I would follow eBay policy, which is the seller must honor the terms of the sale. If they take a bath due to not properly researching shipping, that's their problem.
Seconded.
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psmith2.0
Mr. Vieira
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Tennessee
 
2009-12-05, 19:27

Totally on the fence here. On the surface, and at first twitch, I'm with PKIDelirium and Brad above. But I also like to be a nice, accommodating guy and not a "part of the problem" a-hole meanie to strangers (unless they're that way to me first, of course).

It's Christmas time, he's a student and he's new to all this. Meet him halfway, but advise him to pay closer attention next time (because most people out there would tell him to "get stuffed" and he'd really be up a creek if he was dealing with anyone but a swell guy like you). Be one of the good guys out there, helping someone out a bit from their own inexperience and ignorance, where nothing was done with malice or shady intentions (I assume).

It's the way to be, in general. IMO. YMMV.

And, yeah...torifile makes a good (and funny) point. Call it karma for the Hackintosh thing.

If I'm in your situation, I'd do the middle-ground $20 thing. Just because. But only because of the circumstances above (and because you caught me on a good day).

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Satchmo
can't read sarcasm.
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Toronto, Canada
 
2009-12-05, 20:35

Hmm...how do you know he's indeed a student?
Also check his feedback rating even though he's relatively new to eBay.

I don't wan't to sound harsh, but this could serve as a lesson learned in the real world. You'll be sure he won't make the same mistake next time.
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Partial
Stallion
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Milwaukee
 
2009-12-05, 20:42

Ask for prove that he is a student. Student ID pic should be adequate. Can you reasonably afford to pay a little more? If you can, then maybe help the kid out. I personally would have told UPS to screw off and figured out a better way, but I'm not said guy.

It's the holidays. If you are comfortable spending 20 bucks more on the case it might help him out some.

...and calling/e-mailing/texting ex-girlfriends on the off-chance they'll invite you over for some "old time's sake" no-strings couch gymnastics...
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Elysium
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2009-12-05, 21:23

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdcfsu View Post
The transaction is complete so you really don't have to do anything, but offering him $20 or to ship back at his expense plus a refund are probably fair offers.
Those are the offers I presented to him, let's see what options he takes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by torifile View Post
I bought an LCD tv from Kraetos last year and he had the exact same dilemma - shipping it was crazy expensive. He asked and I agreed to split the cost. $40 seems reasonable given that you got a good deal and he shipped it promptly despite the cost. Even at $140 it was a good deal.

Conisider it Karma for violating Apple's EULA.
Very true, but the problem is he went ahead and shipped the item without waiting on an answer from me. So rather than the two of us working this out ahead of time and reaching a reasonable alternative like cancelling the sale or working on more reasonable shipping, he went ahead and shipped it.

And I do have Karma. She just happens to live with me as a 3 year old Bengal and Domestic tiger mix. And she is the most adorable, spiteful, conniving, sweetheart that I could have ever asked for. No joke I have a cat, it's named Karma, and it is basically bipolar.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Curiousuburb View Post
Uh... maybe I'm missing the exchange rate on the math involved.

Sale price agreed $80 + $20 shipping.
26 lbs shipping weight... but just as if genius packs it with rocks instead of styrofoam, or UPS miscalculates in metric or hexadecimal, it somehow comes to 60.3 lbs "shipping weight" via air.
His shipping cost = $104 air (rather than $18 ground if he'd been smarter)
You think this means he's out $4 rather than $86 when sale and shipping are totted up
The item weighed 26 pounds, but because it had such a massive size to weight ratio (like a garbage bag of packing peanuts) UPS ships it using the dimesional weight calculation instead = volume of package (cu. in.) / 194. In this case (via my measurements): 30*25*15 / 194 = 58. So rather than cost being based on 26 pounds, it is now considered 58 pounds.


I should have just sent him a bill:

Myself: -$100 for awesome new computer case.
You: +$100 from sale, -104 for blatant shipping idiocy, Net loss of $4 for a valuable lesson learned in knowing how much your crap is worth and how much it would likely cost to get there.

Formerly known as cynical_rock
censeo tentatio victum
There is no snooze button on a cat.
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joveblue
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Melbourne
 
2009-12-06, 00:41

I'd perhaps work out what the reasonable shipping price should have been, including packaging, and send him the difference between that and the $20 you've already paid. So if it's $18 for the shipping, work out what the packaging would be and subtract $2.
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