[psmith2.0]

You didn't use that Tiger King dipshit (or anyone in his orbit) did you?

[kscherer]

No. different thing. And it was 16 years ago when it was ok to be cruel to animals.

[709]

Originally Posted by turtle While I'm looking forward to seeing new things from the Apple Silicon front, I'm really wanting a better Intel CPU in the mini. I know I know....

Maybe this is a question for a different thread, but how long does everyone expect Apple will keep some Intel kit in each bracket? I get it, there's still a whole lotta that doesn't play nice with the new chips, but if the future M*X absolutely trounces everything around by a not-small margin, when does Apple drop the 'competition'? Does it become something that can just emulate whatever OS in real time? Because fast?

[turtle]

I'd be shocked is there are any updates to it going forward really. They will let the Mac Pro languish like they have trying to get Apple Silicon enabled/optimized apps to justify the jump from Intel completely.

[psmith2.0]

I agree. I think they want to drag everyone to an all-Apple situation. They may even be willing to lose a few people along the way. Can’t imagine them keeping any Intel-based Macs around by this time next year.

The Intel-based notebooks may disappear next Monday.

PS - I base the above on nothing more than my hope/desire to see a streamlined, cleaned-up and non-confusing lineup.

Everyone’s had a solid year - longer, actually - to get their stuff running natively on AS. I know that’s an easier job for some outfits than others, but places like Adobe have shown, over and over, they’ll drag it out. And those may be some of the people Apple loses in the coming 6-12 months…but it won’t be Apple’s fault, really.

[chucker]

My guess is another year or so, yes. And only for select models, like one particular 16-inch config. Don’t be shocked if the 13-inch Intel is gone next week.

[kscherer]

I can't see Apple dragging these things along any longer than they have to, and they no longer have to. I suspect the Intel laptops get discontinued on Monday, and possibly the 27" iMac. If anything, the Mac mini hangs around, and that's it (aside from the Mac Pro, but that thing is dumb and no one cares).

[psmith2.0]

I almost think Apple is *this close* to ceding that market. Look what they've done - or, rather, haven't done - in that space for nearly a decade. A cylindrical flop that never got updated or re-priced, followed by the most expensive thing I've ever seen in my life. When the wheels for it cost more than an iPhone, you're doing something wrong.

They pretty much said "all of you in that usual $1,800-3,000 space we always served...keep your decades-old tower or maybe trick out a MacBook Pro or iMac. We really don't give a rip, to be completely honest. Because if you don't have $6,000+, keep moving...".

Lots of "professionals" exist in that $2,000-3,500 space...and Apple's really had nothing for them for quite some time.

I'm truly 50/50 on the pro tower thing at this point, it ever making a proper AS-based transition. I can easily see them saying "that's just not our thing anymore". And maybe the iMacs and MacBook Pros, going forward, can fill that role, properly BTO'd?

But a lot of folks will walk if that were to happen. But how much would 2021 Apple truly care, I wonder? They do have until spring (WWDC) of 2022 (the two-year timeline they announced at WWDC 2020), so there's still eight solid months of "anything could happen", I realize.

But I'll believe a new AS-based "OMG!!!" (and reasonably priced) pro tower from Apple when I see it. And it won't shock/surprise me one bit if I never do.

PS - I think nothing (other than the Mac Pro) Intel-based is offered after Monday. That's my prediction/guess. I don't suppose there's any chance that an AS-based Mac Pro tower gets unveiled Monday, in a surprise move? Using lots of whatever is powering the new MacBook Pros?

"There is just one more thing...we didn't think it was fair to just let the professional-level notebooks have all the fun and attention today."

*shrug*

But that would be a very big, unleaked surprise. Are they even capable of holding such a thing that close to their vest?

[kscherer]

No new Mac Pro. The architecture in that thing is too complicated, even with AS. It has to outperform the current thing, and either A) Apple has a monster M-thing ready, or B) Apple has figured out how to put lots of M1X things onto a single board, each bringing its own RAM—or something.

No, the Mac Pro is next year. Although it is possible that Apple may "unveil" it in a surprise move, with "coming next year", as they've done with both of the previous Mac Pro towers.

I don't think they're gonna give up that segment. I think they have a surprise in the works that will make everything before it seem silly.

And here's a thought for upgraders: What if Apple built SOC modules for upgrades? You buy a tower that has a single M1X on board, and it can be 16 or 32 gigabytes of RAM. But there are 4 SOC "slots" on the board, and you can add more M-thing SOCS at a later date? A SOC is $500 with 16GB, and $700 with 32GB. So, you want to "upgrade" and you add another SOC which also comes with its own RAM? The system is designed to recognize the additional SOC and goes out to get the necessary firmware updates that make it all work, and then you get a software tool to tell the computer how to use the SOC? I don't know. That seems like a dumb idea.

[psmith2.0]

Maybe something modular or that covers a wider range of needs and budgets too? Because they certainly did abandon that $2,000-3,000 crowd in recent years, so if they got some sort of pro tower back in that space again for the print/design/publishing crowd, and then the pricier offerings for the 3D/animators/video pros?

A shared design, but with different processors/graphics (and amount of them) being what one paid for, a 2-3 tier type of thing where you could get a very solid, fast and powerful thing for $2,500 (like all the G4/G5/cheese grater days) and then, for those truly needing it, the sky is the limit..."you wanna spec out a $5,000-10,000 workstation with everything completely maxed out, knock yourself out!"

I don't know. There just seems to be a slight gap between a tricked-out Mac mini and an entry-level Mac Pro. About $4,000+ worth of gap.

[psmith2.0]

I have to admit, I'm looking forward to this event. WWDC and the iPhone thing never really do anything for me, but this one, knowing there's some new, redesigned Macs coming and getting to learn about the next take on AS, has me quite amped in a way I typically don't get for these things anymore.

And I love that we're not having to wait until Tuesday. A nice Monday thing.

I bet there will be one cool, unexpected thing...whether it's something regarding the new MacBook Pros or a completely different product (Mac) completely, I think we'll see something cool that hasn't made it to the rumors yet. They sometimes still manage to keep some things under wraps, so I'm hoping we get a nice surprise Monday.

With all these shortages and all, I'm wondering what the ordering/availability story will be? "Announcing today, pre-orders on November 2, shipping by December 11", etc. Or will that be part of the surprise..."they're available today!" That would be nice after all this time. I know some people are sitting on go with this model.

[PB PM]

Here's to hoping for that larger screen iMac. I know my mother is dying to get a new machine, but they are set on getting a bigger screen machine, they currently have the 27" and don't want to go down to 24".

I highly doubt there will be any surprises, just updates to existing products that move them to M series chips.

[kscherer]

Oh, I suspect there are going to be at least two total redesigns, maybe three or even five. On the block:

13" MacBook Pro
16" MacBook Pro
27" iMac
Mac mini
Mac Pro

Any one or all five of those things could get hammered on Monday, and all are due for major redesign action.

FYI: Two laptops aren't going to use up 1.5 hours, so expect some AS talk, and something special.

[chucker]

They seem to be shooting for a ~60-minute format, though. (I think the last Mac event was something like 50?)

[kscherer]

Even so, how long can you talk about two laptops and a processor?

I suppose if they add some nobody-cares fluff about AppleTV+ and AirPods …

[chucker]

So I checked, and it was 47 minutes.

The Mac topic started at minute 5.

M1 chip: 18 minutes
Air: just 7 minutes (huh)
Mac mini: 5 minutes
Pro: 7 minutes

Then 5 minutes of wrap-up.

I imagine the M1X (I still hope it won't literally be a M1X, i.e. last year's technology but with more cores and maybe higher clock) won't be quite as exciting to talk about as the original M1, so fewer than 18 minutes.

But then, all three of those Macs were essentially their Intel equivalents with different internals. No redesign, no significant feature changes.

Contrast the iMac!

That event totaled 61 minutes. It introduced AirTags, a purple iPhone (which was then killed off again half a year later), and that's it. Wait, no.

The iMac segment starts 19 minutes in, and takes 19 minutes total.

The iPad Pro segment starts 38 minutes in, and takes 21 minutes (huh).

So, if the 14- and 16-inch MacBook Pro are a significant design change they won't be 5-7 minutes each like last year, but closer to 19-21 minutes in. Not each, but taken together.

Then, suppose the M1X intro is about half as long as the M1's; that's another 9 minutes. Then another 5 minutes each at the start and end for padding. Now we're at 39 minutes — which is only 8 minutes shorter than the M1 event. Which I think means we'll see one more product. Maybe AirPods? Maybe they'll pad the beginning more with additional TV+ stuff? And there's always the wildcard of showing some Monterey details; possibly even a previously unannounced feature for it.

TL;DR: I'm not sure they'll get away with just doing MBPs for Macs, but if they add AirPods, maybe.

[kscherer]

Dang, math much?

[psmith2.0]

That's almost like something I'd do!

I do wonder, with one year coming up, what happens to that first round of M1 stuff from November 2020? Do they just get a faster M1 in the coming months?

That's something that's yet to be made known, now this stuff is to be tiered and aimed over time.

Will there always be an M1 and it just gets faster under-the-hood speeds/specs for years to come? Or does it go to an M1x at some point, putting it on even ground with the upcoming pro notebooks?

How will the two lines - regular and professional - be presented/separated? Will it all just come down to timing, where 1-2 times a year, for a month or so, a bunch of Macs, whether they have the word "pro" in their name or not, share the same guts, based on when various models are updated?

Or will there be an obvious, distinct two-lane track with this, this and that Mac on one...and these, these and those Macs on the other? And it be really super obvious which one is designed for what type of user?

I'm really hoping that sort of thing is made known Monday. Just too much unknown/unclear now, for nearly a year now.

[chucker]

Originally Posted by kscherer Dang, math much?

I was curious!

Originally Posted by psmith2.0 That's almost like something I'd do! I do wonder, with one year coming up, what happens to that first round of M1 stuff from November 2020? Do they just get a faster M1 in the coming months?

I thought rumor has it that the new Air design is coming in spring, and that we won't see the M2 until then. (I'm also guessing they'll leave the M1 Air around for $200-300 off.)

Which leaves only the Mac mini and the low-end Pro, neither of which are that important.

That's something that's yet to be made known, now this stuff is to be tiered and aimed over time.

Originally Posted by psmith2.0 Will there always be an M1 and it just gets faster under-the-hood speeds/specs for years to come? Or does it go to an M1x at some point, putting it on even ground with the upcoming pro notebooks?

Nah. M1 just means "first generation of Mac processor". M1X means "same generation, but for higher-end Macs".

A newer Mac that currently has an M1 will get an M2, M3, M4. Below that, we might one day see the M2L or something.

And above that, we'll probably see the M1X, M2X, etc.

Originally Posted by psmith2.0 How will the two lines - regular and professional - be presented/separated? Will it all just come down to timing, where 1-2 times a year, for a month or so, a bunch of Macs, whether they have the word "pro" in their name or not, share the same guts, based on when various models are updated? Or will there be an obvious, distinct two-lane track with this, this and that Mac on one...and these, these and those Macs on the other? And it be really super obvious which one is designed for what type of user? I'm really hoping that sort of thing is made known Monday. Just too much unknown/unclear now, for nearly a year now.

I don't think they'll emphasize the CPU too much in that respect. They never really have.

[chucker]

A notch, you say?

🍿

[Frank777]

If they really put a notch in, then FaceID is coming to the MacBook Pro.

Because having to put up with a notch without that feature is stupid. So say we all.

----

Is it time yet to go on-the-record with our predictions, or do we have to be in the within-24-hours window?

[709]

Originally Posted by Frank777 So say we all.

So say we all.

[Frank777]

Just to be clear, I'm perfectly happy with TouchID on the portable line.

Regular readers will know that I'm very skeptical of the need for, and security of, always-on cameras,
and I wish that Apple would put a cover on the MacBook camera.

But if you're going to do a notch right at the top of every 'Book, at least have a good reason for it.

[psmith2.0]

I don’t believe this one bit. There will be a camera and all, of course. And perhaps sensors and other things. No way does it cross over into the existing display/menu area. Makes no sense.

[PB PM]

Agreed, there simply no reason to have a notch on the Macs.

[psmith2.0]

This is interesting.

In all our “M1x”, “M2”, etc. guessing, we never considered they’d just call it M1 Pro.

The two names, though. Hmmm.

Rumors said both machines would be same in performance. Can’t imagine Pro in 14” and Max in 16”, but maybe that’s what will happen. Or maybe both are M1 Pro but the Max is an even beefier variant that can be BTO’d for each model?

Tomorrow should be fun and interesting. I’ve cleared my schedule and I’ve got the Orville Reddenbacher on standby.

[BlueRabbit]

Wow, Macrumors.com is really getting into this notch rumor—4 articles and counting this morning! I still think it's unlikely though. Maybe they'll go zero-bezel, but Macbook is big enough that a quarter inch bezel with some cameras inside would barely be noticeable.

[PB PM]

It is Apple, so anything is possible, but it doesn't seem like a notch is something that needs to be done. Removing the top bezel doesn't add anything and takes away a good place to put your fingers when lifting the screen.

[chucker]

Well, MR in recent years loves to milk a story for what it’s worth.

That said, I’m not sure I’d particularly mind.

[psmith2.0]

Ah, on optimist!

Putting it here because of the timing, and for how much sillier (and desperate) his statements will likely sound in about 3-4 hours.

It is interesting he says all this while his company dumps on Apple/Macs pretty hard in those current ads/commercials.

Well, he’s hardly the first CEO to suffer from delusions and tone-deafness, I suppose.

Between the two, It seems like Apple has moved on. Intel is the one standing outside Apple HQ with a radio raised over their head, hoping Tim looks out the window and gets all teary-eyed.