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Wow. Why I hate people.
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alcimedes
I shot the sherrif.
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2006-03-27, 02:16

This thread here shows the absolute pain IT folks have to go through at their jobs.

This series of e-mails shows just how little people can know while still insisting that they're right.

Read it and laugh, or cry. And if you have any stories along these lines, please feel free to share.

Google is your frenemy.
Caveat Emptor - Latin for tough titty
I tend to interpret things in the way that's most hilarious to me
  quote
Brad
Selfish Heathen
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
 
2006-03-27, 02:23

Good lord. That is depressing.
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turbulentfurball
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2006-03-27, 05:37

A couple of years back:

Mother: 'Bryan! You left the computer on all night!'

Me: 'No, mum, I didn't'

Mother: 'Yes, you did. Look at all those flashing lights'

Me: 'That's the modem. The computer isn't on'

Mother: 'So have you been downloading things all night?'

Me: 'No, the computer would have to be on for that'

Mother: 'Are you lying to me?!?!'
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chucker
 
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2006-03-27, 06:37

Deary, deary me.

And it sounds so depressingly familiar.
  quote
Eugene
careful with axes
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hillsborough, CA
 
2006-03-27, 06:38

"I feel sorry for your city.

"We hope you are happy with it, since we produced it for free and you are
able to use it without paying us ... and are even threatening to have us
arrested for providing to you free of charge"

??

An unprofessional response from a self-absorbed egghead. It wouldn't have changed the next series of replies from the city official, but it never hurts to CYA.
  quote
Ebby
Subdued and Medicated
 
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2006-03-27, 07:09

Quote:
Originally Posted by turbulentfurball
Mother: 'Yes, you did. Look at all those flashing lights'
Ooh! almost the very same thing here. Except we have a cable modem and when the lights started to blink like crazy, my dad thought someone was hacking out network because our one "internet computer" didn't have a Internet browser open. He was frantically shutting it down and almost pulled the plug it took so long!

^^ One more quality post from the desk of Ebby. ^^
SSBA | SmockBogger | SporkNET
  quote
trevo
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
 
2006-03-27, 08:12

I love these stories.

I still can't believe how calm the developer was! I would of started sending flaming emails by the end of all that or even blocked him.
  quote
chucker
 
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2006-03-27, 08:17

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eugene
An unprofessional response from a self-absorbed egghead.
Agreed, but wasn't it deserved?
  quote
ast3r3x
25 chars of wasted space.
 
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2006-03-27, 08:20

Yes I agree that CentOS isn't very good at support if that is how they respons/act. I know that you're dealing with idiots, but at no point is tech support allowed to get pissy.

Also for having time to respond as you do with emails, they have a lot of grammar mistakes. I think it's very unprofessional. One example…
Quote:
I am asking you as nicely as I possible can to explain what the problem is.
Now I didn't look, or do any research to see if CentOS is based in an english speaking country, but mistakes like that are something that would definitely pop out at you if you just read over your email before you sent it.
  quote
euain
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: UK
 
2006-03-27, 08:37

Quote:
Originally Posted by ast3r3x
Yes I agree that CentOS isn't very good at support if that is how they respons/act. I know that you're dealing with idiots, but at no point is tech support allowed to get pissy.

Also for having time to respond as you do with emails, they have a lot of grammar mistakes. I think it's very unprofessional. One example…
(not that I'll manage any better below I'm sure!)

I think it is worth noting that this isn't a support call. It seems to be more a series ignorant and hostile threats and accusations from some idiot to which CentOS have responded in a very helpful way. CentOS seem to have spent a lot of time actually getting to the bottom of the problem. It should really have been the job of the council's IT department not CentOS.

[EDIT]: corrected my own typo

Last edited by euain : 2006-03-27 at 09:46.
  quote
oldmacfan
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Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Mile 1
 
2006-03-27, 09:14

Quote:
Originally Posted by ast3r3x
Yes I agree that CentOS isn't very good at support if that is how they respons/act. I know that you're dealing with idiots, but at no point is tech support allowed to get pissy.

Also for having time to respond as you do with emails, they have a lot of grammar mistakes. I think it's very unprofessional. One example…

Quote:
I am asking you as nicely as I possible can to explain what the problem is.
Now I didn't look, or do any research to see if CentOS is based in an english speaking country, but mistakes like that are something that would definitely pop out at you if you just read over your email before you sent it.
So what are you nit-picking about in this sentence? I am not an English major, but I did notice some key stroke errors in the overall discussion.

I have now read the sentence 10 times and I still can't see the issue that should be seen "if you just read over your email before you sent it." I live in an English speaking country.

"English" should be capitalized it is a proper noun last I checked.

Mile 1
  quote
chucker
 
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2006-03-27, 09:18

The mistake is the use of an adjective instead an adverb:

Quote:
I am asking you as nicely as I possible can to explain what the problem is.
Quote:
I am asking you as nicely as I possibly can to explain what the problem is.
In addition, the sentence is a lot easier to understand with commas added:

Quote:
I am asking you as nicely as I possibly can to explain what the problem is.
Quote:
I am asking you, as nicely as I possibly can, to explain what the problem is.
  quote
murbot
Hoonigan
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Canada
 
2006-03-27, 09:27

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldmacfan
I have now read the sentence 10 times and I still can't see the issue that should be seen "if you just read over your email before you sent it." I live in an English speaking country.
How could you have possible read it 10 times and missed that!

Must be the eye patch, matey.
  quote
Moogs
Hates the Infotainment
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: NSA Archives
 
2006-03-27, 09:39

The developer went above and beyond IMHO. It's not his responsibility to be this guy's end user support team when the ISP / IHP fucks something up, but after repeated threats and acts of general retardation against him, he went ahead and acted as a support person anyway.

Way more than I would've done.

Jerry's an asshole IMO. Anyone who claims they're "computer literate" with 20+ years of "computer engineering" experience and can't figure out the concept of a server OS, even as it is repeatedly explained to him? Dumbass hick.

I went ahead and sent the link to the town newspaper anyway, since the developer was too nice to do it.

...into the light of a dark black night.
  quote
oldmacfan
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Mile 1
 
2006-03-27, 09:49

Quote:
Originally Posted by murbot
How could you have possible read it 10 times and missed that!

Must be the eye patch, matey.
I am dyslexic.

There are times when I read a sentence and I read the intention of the author and can not see the error per say. My mind was believing that the "e" was a "y" even though I see the e; because that was the intention of the author. It is a pain in the @$$ on occasion and I have learned to accept it. Some days it is an absolute struggle, other times I don't notice it at all, and sometimes it just happens, like today.



"Yar", says the Pirate Captain.

Mile 1
  quote
alcimedes
I shot the sherrif.
 
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2006-03-27, 09:51

Crap, link just got /.'ed. Hope someone saved the text. I accidently closed the window with it in it.
  quote
Luca
ಠ_ರೃ
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Minnesota
 
2006-03-27, 09:54

The link doesn't work.
  quote
ast3r3x
25 chars of wasted space.
 
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2006-03-27, 09:57

Yeah, I knew people would nit-pick my post, but it's not really a concern of mine making mistakes on a forum board, however when sending a business related email, I think everyone should be much more careful.

I am not saying the tech support didn't do a good job of solving the problem, like others have said, beyond the call of duty for sure. However, the way they dealt with it wasn't very friendly.

They guy was an idiot, he was rude, but I feel as tech support, there is no reason to be rude back under any circumstances. At most, just politely tell them that they won't be receiving any further support because of the demeanor.
  quote
oldmacfan
Veteran Member
 
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Location: Mile 1
 
2006-03-27, 10:02

Quote:
Originally Posted by ast3r3x
Yeah, I knew people would nit-pick my post, but it's not really a concern of mine making mistakes on a forum board, however when sending a business related email, I think everyone should be much more careful.

I am not saying the tech support didn't do a good job of solving the problem, like others have said, beyond the call of duty for sure. However, the way they dealt with it wasn't very friendly.

They guy was an idiot, he was rude, but I feel as tech support, there is no reason to be rude back under any circumstances. At most, just politely tell them that they won't be receiving any further support because of the demeanor.
I was not aware that CentOS provided tech support, nor was any tech support asked for.
  quote
Brad
Selfish Heathen
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
 
2006-03-27, 10:09

Works fine here, but I'll post a copy anyway:

Quote:
Background: This a default test page that shows up after an install of CentOS. It is slightly different between the 3 centos versions ... here is an example:

http://mirror.centos.org/mirrorscripts/noindex_new.html

Now, the rest of this story is true ... hard to believe, but true none the less. I will just post the raw e-mails (email addresses removed) and let you see a day in the life of the CentOS Team

Thu, 23 Mar 2006 00:52:58 +0000 (Wed, 18:52 CST)
Jerry A. Taylor submitted the following Information:
Email xxxxxxx
Company City of Tuttle
Location Oklahoma
Comments

Who gave you permission to invade my website and block me and anyone else from accessing it???
Please remove your software immediately before I report it to government officials!!
I am the City Manager of Tuttle, Oklahoma.

-----------------------------------------------

From: Johnny Hughes
To: Jerry A. Taylor
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2006 18:59:18 -0600

I feel sorry for your city.

CentOS is an operating system. It is probably installed on the computer
that runs your website.

We hope you are happy with it, since we produced it for free and you are
able to use it without paying us ... and are even threatening to have us
arrested for providing to you free of charge.

Please contact someone who does IT for you and show them the page so
that they can configure your apache webserver correctly.

Thanks,
Johnny Hughes,
CentOS 4 Lead Developer

-----------------------------------------------

From: Jerry A. Taylor
To: CentOS Web Site
Subject: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 18:58:31 +0000 (12:58 CST)

Jerry A. Taylor submitted the following Information:
Email xxxxx
Company City of Tuttle
Location Oklahoma
Comments

Get this web site off my home page!!!!!
It is blocking access to my website!!!!~!

-----------------------------------------------

From: Johnny Hughes
To: Jerry A. Taylor
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 13:45:37 -0600

It is not a website ... it is the operating system.

I would be glad to help you configure your webserver.

Do you own the machine that your web site is on, or is it at a hosting
provider.

If it is at a provider, they need to properly configure their webserver.

If it is on your machine, your apache needs to be properly configured.

I am assuming that you are seeing a page that looks like this:

http://centos.hughesjr.com/testing/noindex_new.html

If so, it tells you exactly what needs to be done to fix the problem.
If your server is at a provider location, they should be able to fix it
if you tell them about the issue.

We didn't DO ANYTHING ... that is what the default apache setup looks
like if you are running our operating system (CentOS). So how your
configuration file has been replaced by the default one ... that is not
something that we can do, it is something that might have been done by
the administrator of the machine.

IF you are not sending these e-mails via the CentOS.org homepage, please
reply to this e-mail so that I will know that.

Thanks,
Johnny Hughes
CentOS-4 Lead Developer

-----------------------------------------------

From: Jerry.Taylor
To: Johnny Hughes
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 13:54:24 -0600

I do not want this software!!!! This is the City of Tuttle, Oklahoma. Get rid of this software!!!!!
Second notice!

-----------------------------------------------

From: Jerry.Taylor
To: Johnny Hughes
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 13:58:23 -0600

Johnny,
Unless this software is removed I will file a complaint with the FBI.

-----------------------------------------------

From: Johnny Hughes
To: Jerry.Taylor
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 14:18:06 -0600

Jerry,

I/We didn't install any software ... I am trying to tell you that.

I am asking you as nicely as I possible can to explain what the problem is.

I have tried to explain to you what CentOS is.

It is an operating system ... a version of linux.

It does not install itself ... it requires someone to install it.

If you will not let me help you, or at least talk to someone who knows
what Linux is, then you will look like an idiot.

Your choice.

Thanks,
Johnny Hughes

-----------------------------------------------

From: Johnny Hughes
To: Jerry.Taylor
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 14:46:40 -0600

Mr. Taylor,

My name is Johnny Hughes, I am a software engineer and I am a developer
of CentOS. I live in Corpus Christi, Texas.

I have been published in several magazines ... here is my latest
article:

http://www.linux-magazine.com/issue/65

http://www.linux-magazine.com/issue/65/CentOS_4.2.pdf


CentOS is a legitimate operating system ... that is what it is. It is
like Microsoft Windows, RedHat Linux, or Apple OSX ... It is not
possible that it was installed without operator action. I have no idea
what you think has happened, nor what has given you the idea that the
CentOS Project is involved in any way.

CentOS is not spyware, it is not spam. It does not take over websites.

If you will not let me help you, find someone you know who is computer
literate and has heard of Linux to look at your problem. I am trying
very, very hard to save you from great embarrassment.

You may certainly call the FBI if you want. I may call some law
enforcement agency or attorney myself if you don't stop throwing around
accusations and stop threatening me without just cause.

Please, for the love of God, either let me help you or talk to a
computer administrator who can help you with your problem.

Thank You,
Johnny Hughes
CentOS-4 Lead Developer

-----------------------------------------------

From: Jerry.Taylor
To: Johnny Hughes
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 15:15:17 -0600

I have four computers located at City Hall. All of these computers display
the same CentOS page when attempting to bring up Tuttle-ok.gov. Now if your
software is not causing this problem, how does it happen??? No one outside
this building has complained about this problem. This is a block of public
access to a city's website. Remove your software within the next 12 hours or
an official complaint to the FBI is being filed!

Third correspondence to this location.

-----------------------------------------------

From: Jerry.Taylor
To: Johnny Hughes
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 15:50:33 -0600

Johnny,
This a message to notify you that your webpage has blocked an "Official"
website that is used to provide public information regarding City Council
meetings including notifying the public of the agendas. Failure to provide
the agendas on the City's website is a violation of the open records act of
Oklahoma. You claim no responsibility but the city did not subscribe to your
software and the city did not authorize you to display it when the city's
website is selected.

You have officially been notified and given an opportunity to correct the
situation without legal intervention. The rest is up to you!
Jerry

-----------------------------------------------

From: Johnny Hughes
To: Jerry.Taylor
Cc: mayor of Tuttle
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 18:34:18 -0600

Mr. Taylor

Stop with the FBI already. If CentOS is on the computers, it was
installed there by someone who controls the computer.

Who installed the operating system on those computers? Who is the
administrator of the computers and have you contacted them?

If the operating system that is installed on the computers is CentOS,
then it was installed by the administrator if the computer.

Are you not understanding what I am writing?

Please talk to the person who controls the computers ... or give me a
name and an e-mail address and I will talk to them.

If someone who is computer literate doesn't take care of this situation
I will be forced to send these ridiculous e-mails to your local media.
I'm sure they will be able to understand what I am trying to tell you.

Please, I have asked you at least 3 times to have your administrator,
the person who installed the operating system on those computers, to
look at them.

Thank you,
Johnny Hughes

-----------------------------------------------

From: Johnny Hughes
To: Jerry.Taylor
Cc: mayor of Tuttle
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 18:38:46 -0600

We don't display anything ... you have yet to even tell me the name of
the webserver in question.

I am very tired of your threats when you have yet to even show me what
your problem is.

You obviously do not understand what I am trying to tell you, is there
no one on the city council or in your building who understands what an
operating system is.

If you would like me to help the administrator of the computers in
question, I would be happy to. However, we did not install anything,
anywhere.

-----------------------------------------------

From: Jerry.Taylor
To: Johnny Hughes
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 18:58:24 -0600

Johnny,
I have contacted the City's network administrator wnd he has done nothing to
install your CentOS software. I have contacted our Internet provider and
they know nothing about your software. I am computer literate! I have 22
years in computer systems engineering and operation. Now, can you tell me
how to remove "your software" that you acknowledge you provided free of
charge? I consider this "hacking". I have no fear of the media, in fact I
welcome this publicity.
Just correct this problem and leave this system alone in the future.

Jerry

-----------------------------------------------

From: Johnny Hughes
To: Jerry.Taylor
Cc: mayor of Tuttle
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 19:08:05 -0600

Mr. Taylor,
Even though I have repeatedly asked you to contact your service provider
or your network administrator, you have persisted to instead harass me.
I have repeatedly offered to help you fix your issue, if you would just
provide me with information. You have chosen neither provide me with
information or contact your hosting provider ... so I decided to see if
I could find some of the information myself.

I found the website that you are having problems with by looking at
http://www.Tuttle-OK.gov/ and I saw an e-mail address of
cityoftuttle.org ... so I went to www.cityoftuttle.org and I see the
problem.

As I tried to explain to you before, that page is displayed when the
webserver in question is not properly configured.

The IP address that is returned from a name lookup of
www.cityoftuttle.org is 65.77.67.7. That is the IP address of your
server.

Doing more research, I have found that the site in question is hosted by
Vidia Communications. If you look at this page

http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/...w.vidiacom.com

you will plainly see that Vidia Communications uses CentOS as the
operating system for their server.

So, though I have told you again and again that you need to contact your
service provider and tell them of your problem, you obviously would
rather threaten me and my group.

Now, for the last time ... contact your web server provider, Vidia
Communications, and tell them that they have a misconfiguration on the
server that they are hosting your website on.

While you are at it, why don't you ask Vidia Communications why it is
that they choose CentOS to host your webserver on.

So you see Mr. Taylor, you ARE using my free operating system to run
your website, you are doing so by choice, it is a configuration error by
the person who choose to install the software and if you would have done
what I asked you to your website would have been up by now.

Let me conclude by saying that it is very hard for me NOT to send this
e-mail and all the other correspondence between you and I to
http://www.tuttletimes.com/

I will not do so, even though I really do want to.

Thank you,
Johnny Hughes

-----------------------------------------------

From: Johnny Hughes
To: Jerry.Taylor
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2006 19:20:11 -0600

Mr. Taylor,

If there are other servers besides the one I already found ... If you
provide me the names, I'll be happy to tell you who the provider is for
them as well.

Johnny Hughes

-----------------------------------------------

From: Jerry.Taylor
To: Johnny Hughes
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2006 11:36:42 -0600

Johnny,
The problem has been resolved by VIDIA who used to host the City website.
They still provide cable service but do not host the website. The
explanation was that they had a crash and during the rebuild they
reinstalled the software that affected our website.

I am sorry that we had to go through the process and accusations to get the
problem resolved. It could have been resolved a lot quicker if the initial
correspondence with you provided the helpful information that was
transmitted in the last messages. My initial contact with VIDIA disallowed
any knowledge of creating the problem.

Jerry

-----------------------------------------------

From: Johnny Hughes
To: Jerry.Taylor
Subject: Re: www.centos.org - Contact Us Form
Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2006 11:49:15 -0600

Jerry,

I asked time and again for the name of the web server administrator or
the website so that I could help you.

I did the extra research on my own to figure it out for myself when I
was not provided any of that information by you.

I also tried very hard to convince you that the problem had to be caused
on the web server and that CentOS could not possibly be installed by
accident or in anyway take over a website.

You will notice that in my first and second e-mails, I spell out exactly
how to fix the problem and who should be contacted.

Any administrator should have been able to use nslookup, dig and whois
to figure out the problem, which had absolutely nothing to do with
CentOS.

I am glad that you got the problem fixed.

Thanks,
Johnny Hughes
-----------------------------------------------


OK ... so there it is ... in it's entirety. I can't even make this kind of stuff up.

Another day in the life of a Linux Distro
Also of interest:
Oklahoma city threatens to call FBI over 'renegade' Linux maker
Council selects new city manager (Taylor)
City Manager Jerry A. Taylor

The quality of this board depends on the quality of the posts. The only way to guarantee thoughtful, informative discussion is to write thoughtful, informative posts. AppleNova is not a real-time chat forum. You have time to compose messages and edit them before and after posting.
  quote
sunrain
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Portlandia
 
2006-03-27, 10:13

The Register posted an article about all of this. One of the better written articles I've read of theirs lately. Funny, at least.
  quote
709
¡Damned!
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Purgatory
 
2006-03-27, 10:18

Removed excessive quoting. -alcimedes
  quote
Brad
Selfish Heathen
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
 
2006-03-27, 10:18

Beat ya' both.
  quote
chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2006-03-27, 10:22

You guys are so slow compared to the Braxcellence it's not even funny.
  quote
709
¡Damned!
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Purgatory
 
2006-03-27, 10:24

I'm SO SLOW. OMG IT HURTS.
  quote
chucker
 
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2006-03-27, 10:24

You gotta love the fact that the guy has a major grammar mistake in his very first sentence of his introductory page.

You also gotta love Comic Sans.
  quote
Banana
is the next Chiquita
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
 
2006-03-27, 10:30

This is sort of stuff that make me think there should be a competency test prerequisite for any public service jobs. Old China got it right...
  quote
sunrain
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Portlandia
 
2006-03-27, 10:37

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad
Beat ya' both.
Bloody liar. You modified your post after/as I had finished posting mine.

Damn admin powers.
  quote
Majost
monkey with a tiny cymbal
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Lost
 
2006-03-27, 11:33

From their Website: "The City of Tuttle: The Place Where People Grow — Friendly!"

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Windowsrookie
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2006-03-27, 11:50

WOW. he is a complete idiot. I am 15 years old and I could have easily fixed the problem in less than a hour.
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