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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2022-07-13, 18:44

The expensive is in the appeals process, which can drag on for many years.

As Chucker stated, proper application of the law is essential. Added to absolute proof and the state can do away with the worst, most heinous criminals for a few dollars.

But, there is a lot of money to be made in harboring violent offenders in expensive prisons.

- AppleNova is the best Mac-users forum on the internet. We are smart, educated, capable, and helpful. We are also loaded with smart-alecks! :)
- Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. (Mat 5:9)
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turtle
Lord of the Rant.
Formerly turtle2472
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Upstate South Carolina
 
2022-07-14, 10:10

Quote:
Originally Posted by turtle View Post
No shit! I am pretty outraged by their lack of engaging in that event as these details are coming out. I don't know how much to believe isn't "knee jerk" reporting yet*, but if those cops literally stood by waiting they need to all be held accountable. I would have entered the building myself if I were on scene and I'm not a LEO.

* There seems to be a bunch of stuff given the raw nature of the event so some reports are still getting accuracy in their details.
This guy walks through the report and the video of the events of Robb Elementary School. He doesn't allow the audio from the internal video to play so you can't hear the shots nor the voices on the inside. He does walk through the failings of the police department(s) though. Seeing this and the report from ALERRT you really want to beat down some cops for their (now very) obvious failings.

In short, it is as horrible as we all though it would be. So damning for the LEOs on scene. Kids really could have been saved if the cops just did their job.

The video is long because he walks through almost step by step and it was an hour and ten minutes from the start of the school to the final assault.

Louis L'Amour, “To make democracy work, we must be a notion of participants, not simply observers. One who does not vote has no right to complain.”
MineCraft? mc.applenova.com | Visit us! | Maybe someday I'll proof read, until then deal with it.

Last edited by turtle : 2022-07-14 at 12:05.
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kieran
Tweeting @kierankelly
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
 
2022-07-14, 14:03

Seeing this video was so frustrating to me.

Texas officials fought so hard to keep this from being released under the bullshit of it being used by other people to plan other attacks. These officers did nothing that anyone could use.

I'm torn on the audio part though. As awful as it would be, this video should be released with the sound left in. People need to hear what this monster did and the repercussions. It baffles me how kids are murdered and people still dont' want to enable tougher gun laws.

I did see a press conference yesterday in which the parents were more mad at the people that released this video than they were with the lack of police action. I understand they're grieving, but having this video out there is for the benefit of everyone.
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turtle
Lord of the Rant.
Formerly turtle2472
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Upstate South Carolina
 
2022-07-14, 14:07

Oh, the one with audio is out there. Most don't need to hear the audio though. Heck, I'm fairly hardened and *I* don't want to hear the audio from that video. My imagination is good enough for me. For that reason I'm grateful the guy walking through the video doesn't include the audio from it.

Louis L'Amour, “To make democracy work, we must be a notion of participants, not simply observers. One who does not vote has no right to complain.”
MineCraft? mc.applenova.com | Visit us! | Maybe someday I'll proof read, until then deal with it.
  quote
709
¡Damned!
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Purgatory.
 
2022-07-14, 14:58

The Statesman, even after deciding to publish the video, still took the precaution of removing the sounds of children screaming. "We consider this too graphic."
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turtle
Lord of the Rant.
Formerly turtle2472
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Upstate South Carolina
 
2022-07-14, 15:13

Look, I'm gonna recommend you all not try to find it with audio. You can't un-hear it once you've heard it. There is no personal gain from hearing their legitimate screams and agony.

Louis L'Amour, “To make democracy work, we must be a notion of participants, not simply observers. One who does not vote has no right to complain.”
MineCraft? mc.applenova.com | Visit us! | Maybe someday I'll proof read, until then deal with it.
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Vancouver, BC
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2022-07-14, 17:59

This guy is right on the money, in his evaluation, given the current situation in the US. It's just sad that this keeps happening, over and over again.

I can point to a similar situation that happened here in BC at the end of June. Difference? Thankfully no children. In a small BC community two mid-20's males armed entered a bank to rob it, which they learned later was mostly done with the purpose of killing police officers. Thankfully only 6 officers were wounded before the tools were killed by officers.
https://globalnews.ca/news/8953593/s...g-bank-police/
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turtle
Lord of the Rant.
Formerly turtle2472
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Upstate South Carolina
 
2022-07-15, 14:23

Mike Glover came back yesterday after speaking with a "a federal supervisor with intimate knowledge of the situation". It is really even more damning to chief and his force.

Short version recap important items:
  • Bortac guy in plaid shirt and baseball cap never entered the room.
  • Both teachers survived long enough to be transported away from scene. One teacher died in the ambulance, the other in the ER.
  • Bortac officers that decided on their own to enter the classroom and end it were never told by anyone on scene that there were victims inside the classroom. They did not expect to see dead children.

Louis L'Amour, “To make democracy work, we must be a notion of participants, not simply observers. One who does not vote has no right to complain.”
MineCraft? mc.applenova.com | Visit us! | Maybe someday I'll proof read, until then deal with it.
  quote
Brad
Selfish Heathen
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
 
2022-07-21, 21:39

Y'all remember polio? The crippling disease that has been eliminated from most of the world thanks to vaccination campaings?

New York reports 1st US polio case in nearly a decade

Quote:
NEW YORK (AP) — An unvaccinated young adult from New York recently contracted polio, the first U.S. case in nearly a decade, health officials said Thursday.

Officials said the patient, who lives in Rockland County, had developed paralysis. The person developed symptoms a month ago and did not recently travel outside the country, county health officials said.

It appears the patient had a vaccine-derived strain of the virus, perhaps from someone who got live vaccine — available in other countries, but not the U.S. — and spread it, officials said.

The person is no longer deemed contagious, but investigators are trying to figure out how the infection occurred and whether other people were exposed to the virus.

Most Americans are vaccinated against polio, but this should serve as a wake-up call to the unvaccinated, said Jennifer Nuzzo, a Brown University pandemic researcher.

“This isn’t normal. We don’t want to see this,” Nuzzo said. “If you’re vaccinated, it’s not something you need to worry about. But if you haven’t gotten your kids vaccinated, it’s really important that you make sure they’re up to date.”

Health officials scheduled vaccination clinics in New York for Friday and Monday, and encouraged anyone who has not been vaccinated to get the shots.
A press conference (video posted to Facebook) with Rockland County health and government officials earlier today also confirmed that the patient "did present with weakness and paralysis" but they couldn't say any more presumably due to patient confidentiality.

Get vaccinated and vaccinate your kids, ffs.

The quality of this board depends on the quality of the posts. The only way to guarantee thoughtful, informative discussion is to write thoughtful, informative posts. AppleNova is not a real-time chat forum. You have time to compose messages and edit them before and after posting.
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turtle
Lord of the Rant.
Formerly turtle2472
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Upstate South Carolina
 
2022-07-22, 07:49

I read about that yesterday and meant to share it here. I actually know a couple that both were crippled by polio as children. Both in wheelchairs to this day.

Louis L'Amour, “To make democracy work, we must be a notion of participants, not simply observers. One who does not vote has no right to complain.”
MineCraft? mc.applenova.com | Visit us! | Maybe someday I'll proof read, until then deal with it.
  quote
Brad
Selfish Heathen
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Zone of Pain
 
2022-07-23, 15:50

Speaking of outbreaks…

WHO declares monkeypox an international emergency as child cases raise alarm [Updated] (ArsTechnica)

Quote:
Update 7/23/2022 11:00am ET: The World Health Organization on Saturday declared the multinational monkeypox outbreak a public health emergency of international concern (PHEIC), the agency's highest level of alert.



In addition to this development, the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention on Friday afternoon announced identifying the first two cases of monkeypox in children. One case was in a toddler who lives in California. The other was in an infant who is not a US resident, but was diagnosed in Washington, DC while the family was traveling. Both children are reported to be doing well. Unlike the child's case reported from the Netherlands and described below, the two child cases in the US appear to be explained by transmission from infected household members, who have links to transmission in the men-who-have-sex-with-men community.
WHO declares global health emergency over monkeypox outbreak (Reuters)

Quote:
Health experts welcomed the WHO's decision to issue the PHEIC declaration, which until now had only been applied to the coronavirus pandemic and ongoing efforts to eradicate polio.



So far this year, there have been more than 16,000 cases of monkeypox in more than 75 countries, and five deaths in Africa.



Cases of the viral disease have ballooned since the committee first met at the end of June, when there were only about 3,000 cases.
  quote
Elysium
Environmental Bloodhound
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Land of ice and snow
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2022-07-24, 17:21

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad View Post
Y'all remember polio? The crippling disease that has been eliminated from most of the world thanks to vaccination campaings?

New York reports 1st US polio case in nearly a decade



A press conference (video posted to Facebook) with Rockland County health and government officials earlier today also confirmed that the patient "did present with weakness and paralysis" but they couldn't say any more presumably due to patient confidentiality.

Get vaccinated and vaccinate your kids, ffs.
Rockland county (outside the Orthodox Jewish community) is a hot bed for the Jenny McCarthy vaccine denier suburban soccer mom movement. Not shocking that is where this story is coming out of.

Formerly known as cynical_rock
censeo tentatio victum
There is no snooze button on a cat.
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Frank777
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Toronto
 
2022-07-27, 15:55

Yeah, a Chinese-built garden in the middle of Washington D.C. sounds like a totally fine idea.
  quote
709
¡Damned!
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Purgatory.
 
2022-07-28, 08:18

Quote:
They noted that the pagoda had been planned for one of the highest points in Washington, D.C., just two miles from the Capitol, putting it in a prime position for espionage activities.

Chinese officials also wanted to ship in the materials to build the pagoda using diplomatic pouches, meaning U.S. Customs officials could not examine what was inside.
Nothing suspicious about that...
  quote
PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Vancouver, BC
Send a message via Skype™ to PB PM 
2022-07-28, 08:58

I say go for it, but only if they can build a similar garden right next to China’s important political centres. Given the recent tech news about low level UEFI hacks, it’s unlikely any of our data is safe anyway.
  quote
turtle
Lord of the Rant.
Formerly turtle2472
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Upstate South Carolina
 
2022-07-28, 09:15

I can't imagine how that could go poorly for us. The "diplomatic" security though... kinda telling don't you think?
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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2022-08-02, 16:38

** Arachnophobia News **

Utah man accused of causing wildfire by burning a spider

Man, this guy really hates him the spiders! I mean, I hate the little suckers, but I'm not sure I feel the need to burn the planet to the ground to get rid of them. I usually employee the tried and true "Stomp-Stomp-Stomp" method. It's always worked pretty well against all but the big, ugly ones, but we ain't got us none o' them in the Idaho.

- AppleNova is the best Mac-users forum on the internet. We are smart, educated, capable, and helpful. We are also loaded with smart-alecks! :)
- Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. (Mat 5:9)
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Anonymous Coward
Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2022-08-02, 18:29

A monkeypox overview: where it came from and how it spreads.

not from monkeys
dangerous implications if fanatical groups get hold certain information that I won't even mention
  quote
kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2022-08-11, 10:56

Speaking of Canada, if at first you don't succeed …

Quote:
Tim Stainton, director of the Canadian Institute for Inclusion and Citizenship at the University of British Columbia, described Canada’s law as “probably the biggest existential threat to disabled people since the Nazis’ program in Germany in the 1930s.”


Quote:
During his recent trip to Canada, Pope Francis blasted what he has labeled the culture of waste that considers elderly and disabled people disposable. “We need to learn how to listen to the pain” of the poor and most marginalized, Francis said, lamenting the “patients who, in place of affection, are administered death.”
I'm no catholic, but I have to agree with the Pope on this one.

I mean, who knew Hitler was so "progressive"?

- AppleNova is the best Mac-users forum on the internet. We are smart, educated, capable, and helpful. We are also loaded with smart-alecks! :)
- Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. (Mat 5:9)
  quote
Frank777
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Toronto
 
2022-08-11, 11:33

Quote:
Originally Posted by kscherer View Post
Speaking of Canada, if at first you don't succeed …
Yeah, it's not on the radar of most people, but the speed with which the Trudeau gov't has dived further and further into the euthanasia pit in a bid to save on public health care spending is truly sickening.
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Matsu
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2022-08-11, 12:53

That's a crazy distortion.
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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2022-08-11, 13:08

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post
Yeah, it's not on the radar of most people, but the speed with which the Trudeau gov't has dived further and further into the euthanasia pit in a bid to save on public health care spending is truly sickening.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matsu View Post
That's a crazy distortion.
I don't much care about the politics behind it. I just find it hilariously hypocritical that a government can offer both suicide prevention and suicide assistance in the same breath.

"Hey, don't kill yourself, but if you're really sure about it … here's a pill."

Quote:
Originally Posted by turtle View Post
Personally I think both extremes are wrong here, but the major far left and far right leaders have weaponized their extreme idiots.
It's party-politics. When your side is doing the destroying, they're the good guys. When the other side is doing it, they're the bad guys. "We're justified because reasons! The other side is not justified because also reasons!" You can also see the same fanaticism in sports: "My quarterback can rape and pillage, but he's on my team so I'll look the other way. But if your quarterback rapes and pillages, I'm going to stomp my feat because he's on your team — and your team sucks!"

- AppleNova is the best Mac-users forum on the internet. We are smart, educated, capable, and helpful. We are also loaded with smart-alecks! :)
- Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. (Mat 5:9)
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Vancouver, BC
Send a message via Skype™ to PB PM 
2022-08-11, 13:21

Assisted death in Canada isn’t being given out like candy at a candy store. Millions of seniors are not being snuffed out. First, the person in question has to either request it themselves, or have such requests in their will. The person must have a terminal illness or be otherwise in very poor health with no chance of improving for goodness sake! What that article was taking about, was not my understanding of how it worked. Should read more on it.

Not my cup of tea, and I wouldn’t push for it myself, but to deny that to people in extreme pain and suffering due to medical conditions, sounds cruel as well.
  quote
Frank777
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Toronto
 
2022-08-11, 21:46

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM View Post
Assisted death in Canada isn’t being given out like candy at a candy store. Millions of seniors are not being snuffed out.
No, not millions. Just over 31,000 since Trudeau took the country down this insane road in 2016.
And it's steadily increasing every year.

About 10k in 2021 alone, more than 3% of all Canadian deaths in 2021.

And that is before Canada really gets pounded by the coming economic storm.
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
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2022-08-12, 07:17

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post
No, not millions. Just over 31,000 since Trudeau took the country down this insane road in 2016.
And it's steadily increasing every year.

About 10k in 2021 alone, more than 3% of all Canadian deaths in 2021.

And that is before Canada really gets pounded by the coming economic storm.
Not surprising at all. If it hadn’t been the government, it would likely have been the Supreme Court anyway. Better for the government to get ahead of that than have a virtual free for all before legislators can draft proper laws.

Question is, of those 31k, how many were terminally I’ll patients who would have died anyway? I’ve not found a source (real data from a apolitical source) that gives numbers of that type, likely due to privacy laws.
  quote
Matsu
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2022-08-12, 07:47

It's not a trivial thing, but I don't believe assisted dying is driven by economic considerations, though I think there is a significant ideological divide there, and one, I will say, personally, which has me deeply conflicted. To reduce it to a partisan line about Trudeau is wrong, not for any affection for the current PM, it is wrong because this line of thinking obliterates what little capacity modern politics has for such a question at all.

Outside of politics, a problem with governments is that they are often too blunt an instrument to apply to a delicate topic. The best they can do is codify some generally held societal ideals, and their tools for understanding those and rationalizing decisions are limited. Immediately, my public policy mind wants more information, a demographic breakdown of age, wealth, marital status, family size, dependents, education, occupations, geography, length and type of illness just to start. This would help understand what's happening in those 3% of all deaths, but this alone still can't fully resolve the question...

Medically and ethically, I think that if there is to be a choice it already exists on a continuum of decisions about (both) how we treat people and how we respect their wishes. We already apply medical criteria to who gets any number of treatments, transplants, etc... Those in the unenviable position of deciding may from time to time apply their own emotional and psychological rationale in any given case. Theirs is to work in a grey area that no amount procedure can make fully black and white.

Maybe the best we can do is clear a space for such decisions to be made as a matter of conscience and devise some protections against bad faith motives, because I think as long as people must face dying, they will differ in how they choose to face it.

.........................................
  quote
Frank777
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Join Date: May 2004
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2022-08-12, 08:44

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matsu View Post
It's not a trivial thing, but I don't believe assisted dying is driven by economic considerations, though I think there is a significant ideological divide there, and one, I will say, personally, which has me deeply conflicted.
This isn't some right-wing campaign to demonize Trudeau (he does that all by himself.)

Here's the Associated Press just yesterday:

Quote:
Roger Foley, who has a degenerative brain disorder and is hospitalized in London, Ontario, was so alarmed by staffers mentioning euthanasia that he began secretly recording some of their conversations.

In one recording obtained by the AP, the hospital’s director of ethics told Foley that for him to remain in the hospital, it would cost “north of $1,500 a day.” Foley replied that mentioning fees felt like coercion and asked what plan there was for his long-term care.

“Roger, this is not my show,” the ethicist responded. “My piece of this was to talk to you, (to see) if you had an interest in assisted dying.”

Foley said he had never previously mentioned euthanasia. The hospital says there is no prohibition on staff raising the issue.

Catherine Frazee, a professor emerita at Toronto’s Ryerson University, said cases like Foley’s were likely just the tip of the iceberg.
  quote
Matsu
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2022-08-12, 08:59

You chose to lead with Trudeau in your prior post. I don't believe that problems with assisted dying legislation would be resolved simply by changing governments.

Cases like the one you describe are disturbing, which is why the conversation has to be a sober one.

.........................................
  quote
PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
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2022-08-12, 09:01

That is my one fear in the system, hospital admins using it to offload cash problems. That and have steps in place to prevent family members from making the choice (without legal documents saying they can).

I feel rather mixed about it, I understand why some people want it, and I understand the opposition as well. Both have good reasons.
  quote
Frank777
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Toronto
 
2022-08-12, 09:10

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matsu View Post
You chose to lead with Trudeau in your prior post. I don't believe that problems with assisted dying legislation would be resolved simply by changing governments.

Cases like the one you describe are disturbing, which is why the conversation has to be a sober one.
I doubt any other senior Canadian leader would have been so stupidly naive as to walk into office and immediately start legalizing marijuana and euthanasia "because it's 2015".

And whatever the reasons the advocates were calling for it, the simple fact is that the federal bureaucracy wanted the euthanasia policy to go ahead was because of its potential to free up money in health care. You can see it in the specific way the policy was implemented.

Read the full AP piece. This is a full-on generational scandal in the making. The residential schools program started out small too.
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