User Name
Password

Register Members List Calendar Search FAQ Posting Guidelines
Car Talk
Page 2 of 48 Previous 1 [2] 3 4 5 6  Next Last Thread Tools
Robo
Formerly Roboman, still
awesome
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Portland, OR
 
2009-12-03, 02:05

My BFF Tay just bought a 2010, which naturally means I have to one-up her with a 2011. Unfortunately, I'm less than employed. But my "if I get The Deal" car is currently a toss-up between a Volvo C30, a Honda CR-Z, and a Fiat 500, though naturally I'd have to actually drive the latter two to be sure.

and i guess i've known it all along / the truth is, you have to be soft to be strong
  quote
Xaqtly
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2009-12-03, 02:08

Quote:
Originally Posted by joveblue View Post
I'd probably choose a small lightweight car, as long as the acceleration was decent enough to take up from lights and get up hills easily and so forth. I prefer something smaller anyway: they're sportier and easy to manoeuvre. My worst nightmare would be a big-arse 4x4 or something. My dream car at the moment would probably be something like a BMW 1 series.

If I needed the extra space for a family or something, I'd probably go with a hybrid. although I'd research it a bit more first.

Diesel doesn't really appeal to me. Although the milage is better, the carbon emissions aren't a huge amount better (I don't think?) and the exhaust is also dirtier. Also, I'm not sure on this one either, but don't they have worse acceleration?
The current diesels are pretty good on running clean. It's a lot better than it used to be, these days. Diesels don't usually have a lot of horsepower but they usually have massive, disproportional amounts of torque. And torque is what gets you up hills without having to downshift, so I like that aspect of diesels. I would say that most turbo diesels do have much better acceleration than small engined high MPG gas cars while maintaining better MPG at the same time. The Jetta TDi gets 42 MPG with 140 HP and 236 lb-ft of torque. That's better in every way than a car like the XB which has less power and worse gas mileage. It's probably worth noting that the XB is also cheaper, but that's all it really has going for it, IMO.

The BMW 128 costs a lot more, almost $30k for the base model, only gets 28 MPG at best, but does have more HP than the Jetta TDi for example. But this is what I meant by compromise; A car like the Jetta TDi is a good car to drive, it handles well and it accelerates well enough while getting fairly stellar mileage. I would only be looking at a 1 series if MPG weren't a concern at all.
  quote
Noel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Chicago
 
2009-12-03, 09:32

I adore my green 2004 Mazda 3. The pics below are from a Google search.



  quote
Quagmire
meh
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2009-12-03, 09:41

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xaqtly View Post
The current diesels are pretty good on running clean. It's a lot better than it used to be, these days. Diesels don't usually have a lot of horsepower but they usually have massive, disproportional amounts of torque. And torque is what gets you up hills without having to downshift, so I like that aspect of diesels. I would say that most turbo diesels do have much better acceleration than small engined high MPG gas cars while maintaining better MPG at the same time. The Jetta TDi gets 42 MPG with 140 HP and 236 lb-ft of torque. That's better in every way than a car like the XB which has less power and worse gas mileage. It's probably worth noting that the XB is also cheaper, but that's all it really has going for it, IMO.
While diesels have a lot more torque especially in the low end of the RPM's, diesels do take longer to rev up then gasoline engines. Take the 335i vs 335d. 335i is a gas engine producing 300 HP and 300 lb. ft of torque at 1500 RPM. The 335d produces 265 HP and 435 lb. ft of torque at 1750 RPM from its diesel inline 6. While down 35 HP, it has a 135 lb. ft of torque advantage. Though performance of the 335i is 0-60 in 4.8 seconds while the 335d is 0-60 in 5.9 seconds.

giggity
  quote
Maciej
M AH - ch ain saw
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2009-12-03, 10:50

Yeah, a 135i was my dream car at the moment but it was just unrealistic as a daily driver - especially in the winter if Wisconsin. Ahh well, we can all dream.
  quote
Luca
ಠ_ರೃ
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Minnesota
 
2009-12-03, 11:04

These were taken a while ago, when I first bought my car. It's got over 22k miles on it already, after 17 months. Only problems I've had so far were a broken center brake light (which was replaced for free) and I had an irreparable puncture in one of my tires. Since all my tires were low on tread anyway, I decided to replace them all with snow tires. And finally, today, it's begun snowing!



  quote
Quagmire
meh
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2009-12-03, 11:15

Talking about the Fit, how about the new US spec Ford Fiesta? While they ruined the sedan with the 3 bar grill, the hatch still retains it's Euro look mostly. Expected to hit 40 MPG HWY. Plus, it can escape from a Corvette in a mall and be used as a beach assault vehicle if you want to go invading a country like Britain or Japan. Can any sub-compact do that?


giggity
  quote
kretara
Cynical Old Bastard
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: The Hot, Hazey, Humid South
Send a message via AIM to kretara Send a message via Yahoo to kretara  
2009-12-03, 11:36

I'm something of a car whore.
This is what I have had in 25 years of driving.

At 16 I started out with a 1978 Honda Accord CVCC that looked just like this one:


After my college roommate totaled the Accord I got a black 1980 Audi 4000s similar to this one:


After a little less than a year of Audi ownership the timing belt broke and so did the engine.
My Grandparents let me USE a 1977 Ford Pinto that looked like this:


After a few weeks of driving a pinto (and of total embarrassment) I bought my first new car...a black 1986 Mazda 323. It had one option: A/C and looked like this:


I then bought my second new car: a 1990 Honda CRX DX that looked just like this:

God!! Do I miss this car.

In 1995 I sold the CRX when I moved to Boston and I bought a 1990 Audi 100 in metallic green. It looked like this:


While driving on the interstate, the truck in front of me deposited a cooler on the road and I ran over it causing damage to the engine and transmission.
So, I bought a white 1996 VW Jetta:


After a few years I went back to school and needed to get rid of a car payment so I sold the Jetta and bought a dark blue 1991 Audi 100s (see pic of Audi 100 above). I REALLY love VW's and Audi's.

After getting out of school (again) I got a blue 1996 Honda Accord LX coupe. I frigging hated this car. It was loud, unreliable and just a total let down to drive.


I got a great deal on a dark blue 1999 Ford Crown Victoria LX so I got rid of the hated Accord and bought my first American car.


After moving back to Little Rock I really wanted a truck in a bad way so I sold the CV and bought a 2wd 1991 Dodge Ram Charger with a, um, highly modified engine in it. It required premium gas and on a good day got 9 mpg, but what a blast to drive. This is a pic of my real truck, no google pics for it.


Finally, the combination of increasing gas prices, another kid on the way and looking forward to paying for private school and daycare forced me to sell the truck (I really did not like spending > $100 per week to fill up) and buy this horrible GM POS called a 1996 Buick LeSabre.

This car has really made me despise all things GM. Unreliable, poor fit and finish, poor everything.

Ever since getting married my wife has gotten the nice (and new) cars and I get to drive old and cheap cars. Maybe someday I'll get to have a nice car again.

You're looking at eons of repression getting purged. If only they'd let us jerk off.

Beware the man of one book. ~ Saint Thomas Aquinas

Last edited by kretara : 2009-12-04 at 09:06.
  quote
Luca
ಠ_ರೃ
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Minnesota
 
2009-12-03, 11:42

If the Fiesta had been available in the US last year, I would have bought it. Unfortunately it was not, and I needed a car right away (the car I was using was borrowed and my brother needed it).

But I'm still happy with the Fit. I'm excited to find out how well it handles once I put summer tires on it this spring!
  quote
Xaqtly
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2009-12-03, 12:08

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quagmire View Post
While diesels have a lot more torque especially in the low end of the RPM's, diesels do take longer to rev up then gasoline engines. Take the 335i vs 335d. 335i is a gas engine producing 300 HP and 300 lb. ft of torque at 1500 RPM. The 335d produces 265 HP and 435 lb. ft of torque at 1750 RPM from its diesel inline 6. While down 35 HP, it has a 135 lb. ft of torque advantage. Though performance of the 335i is 0-60 in 4.8 seconds while the 335d is 0-60 in 5.9 seconds.
Right. Well there's a number of factors in play there; Horsepower gets better 0-60 times, not torque, and diesels always have longer gearing to compensate for the much shorter rev range. The good thing is that the higher torque compensates for the longer gearing in day to day driving, it just doesn't really do anything for 0-60 times. Additionally, the 335d weighs over 300 lbs. more than the 335i.

But diesels really aren't suited for nor are intended to be performance cars. The 335d gets 36 mpg highway, which for a car of that size/class is pretty damn good. And since that would really be the only reason you would get a 335d over a 335i, performance shouldn't be an issue for most people. Like the Jetta TDi, 140 HP isn't a lot but 236 lb-ft. of torque will get the job done no matter where you go. And I think that's a good compromise for getting 42 MPG. And it should probably be said that both the 335i and d are pretty expensive. in the $40-50k range.

When I was in high school I had a friend who had a diesel Rabbit. That thing was so small and light, he could go for weeks without refilling it. He figured once that he was getting over 50 MPG on average. It was not a fast car but it was fun to drive and 50 MPG was pretty ridiculous.
  quote
Xaqtly
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2009-12-03, 12:10

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quagmire View Post
Plus, it can escape from a Corvette in a mall and be used as a beach assault vehicle if you want to go invading a country like Britain or Japan. Can any sub-compact do that?
THAT was AWESOME. And I love how they framed it in the context of a "proper car review" because some old guy was complaining about how they review cars.
  quote
GSpotter
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: A small town near Wolfsburg, Germany
 
2009-12-03, 12:50

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xaqtly View Post
But diesels really aren't suited for nor are intended to be performance cars.
That's right in general, but Audi is thinking about a diesel version of the R8. Google for "Audi R8 V12 TDI" ... . I think this would qualify as performance car.

My photos @ flickr
The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. -- Benjamin Franklin
  quote
Xaqtly
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2009-12-03, 13:06

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luca View Post
These were taken a while ago, when I first bought my car. It's got over 22k miles on it already, after 17 months.
My gf just bought a 2009 Fit Sport a few months ago. She's really digging it, and my dog fits really well in the hatch space behind the back seat. Her only complaint so far is that while it's plenty zippy around town and at lower speeds, once you're on the freeway the engine doesn't quite have the cojones to do things like cruise uphill without downshifting (at 80mph or so) or pass people efficiently. But, she's been averaging mid 30s MPG which is one of the reasons she wanted it so she's fine with that.

I think it's a nice car in most respects. It handles surprisingly well for a cheap car and the interior is pretty nice. The iPod connector in the glove box is nice too.
  quote
Robo
Formerly Roboman, still
awesome
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Portland, OR
 
2009-12-03, 13:12

Keep in mind that Luca has the previous generation (2007-2008) Fit, which is smaller and lighter, IIRC.

Oh, and the Fiesta will be priced from $13,320 ($13,995 after destination). That's the sedan, though - ew! - the hatchback starts at $15,120 plus destination.

and i guess i've known it all along / the truth is, you have to be soft to be strong
  quote
Luca
ಠ_ರೃ
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Minnesota
 
2009-12-03, 13:45

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboman View Post
Keep in mind that Luca has the previous generation (2007-2008) Fit, which is smaller and lighter, IIRC.
I just looked it up. The '09 Sport automatic is 2604 lbs whereas my '08 Base manual weighs 2432 lbs, which is 172 lbs less. The '09 does have 8 more horsepower than the '08, but if it's an auto then there will be some power loss as well.

I'll admit, though, that it is not very fast once you get to the higher speeds. I mean, what do you expect from a car with 109 hp? Still, it handles well and the VTEC gives it reasonable acceleration early on. I think Car and Driver actually got faster 0-60 times with the less-powerful '08 model than they did with the '09.
  quote
Robo
Formerly Roboman, still
awesome
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Portland, OR
 
2009-12-03, 14:05

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luca View Post
I think Car and Driver actually got faster 0-60 times with the less-powerful '08 model than they did with the '09.
That's what I was trying to allude to. I know a lot of people who think that the first-gen was better, performance-wise. But I still like them both.

People who reserve a Fiesta apparently get the "SYNC and Sound" package for free -- premium sound and Ford SYNC, though apparently no "real" navigation is available on the Fiesta. With companies like Nissan and Suzuki either including navs standard or charging only $400 for them, that's not super-competitive, but maybe it's something to add for 2012.

and i guess i've known it all along / the truth is, you have to be soft to be strong
  quote
joveblue
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Melbourne
 
2009-12-03, 17:22

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xaqtly View Post
The BMW 128 costs a lot more, almost $30k for the base model, only gets 28 MPG at best, but does have more HP than the Jetta TDi for example. But this is what I meant by compromise; A car like the Jetta TDi is a good car to drive, it handles well and it accelerates well enough while getting fairly stellar mileage. I would only be looking at a 1 series if MPG weren't a concern at all.
It just occurred to me that the BMW 1 getting good environmental ratings is a diesel model, the 118d, at 4.5L/100km or 52mpg, which isn't bad at all. Whoops! So there you go, small light diesel for me!
  quote
Xaqtly
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2009-12-03, 18:48

Quote:
Originally Posted by joveblue View Post
It just occurred to me that the BMW 1 getting good environmental ratings is a diesel model, the 118d, at 4.5L/100km or 52mpg, which isn't bad at all. Whoops! So there you go, small light diesel for me!
Ah yeah, I was only looking in the US market. Just about every other nation in the world has more choice in diesel cars than we do in the US. I was happy to find that my Legacy is sold in the UK as a turbo diesel too, only 150 HP but 260 lb-ft of torque. Great MPG though, 44 combined and 51 "extra urban mpg" whatever that means. Top Gear did a segment where they had to drive 750 miles on a single tank of gas while racing each other to try to get there first. James May chose the Legacy turbo diesel, and a number of times he was averaging over 50 MPG. They didn't show if he ran out of gas or not but I think he was within 30 miles or so of finishing, so he at least made it well over 700 miles on a single tank.

I'm not sure why diesel isn't embraced like hybrids are in the US... probably the misconception that they all run dirty or something.
  quote
Banana
is the next Chiquita
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
 
2009-12-03, 18:59

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xaqtly View Post
I'm not sure why diesel isn't embraced like hybrids are in the US... probably the misconception that they all run dirty or something.
I would totally get a diesel myself, because it's most practical all around. Diesel-electric hybrid, as Kickaha described, is also good. I'm just surprised nobody thunk of it sooner considering that is what the locomotives has been doing for decades. (What? You think they have a big ole' transmission strapped on the engine car? )

Anyway, what I heard (and keep in mind that hearsay is awful piece of evidence...) was that they found it more profitable to sell high-sulfur diesel to US and because of that, it kinds of killed the market for diesel cars.
  quote
Kickaha
Likes his boobies blue.
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hell
 
2009-12-03, 19:56

Serial hybrid, let the generator run on gas, diesel, biodiesel, leaves, peanut oil, hydrogen fuel cell, reconstituted stripper sweat, it doesn't matter. Migrate from fuel needs to fuel needs, main technology and system remains the same, only the generator needs to be swapped out.

My other brain is hung like a horse too.
#IRC isn't old school.
Old school is being able to say 'finger me' with a straight face.

Last edited by Kickaha : 2009-12-03 at 23:01. Reason: Nothing to see here...
  quote
Robo
Formerly Roboman, still
awesome
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Portland, OR
 
2009-12-03, 20:08

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kickaha View Post
Parallel hybrid, let the generator run on gas, diesel, biodiesel, leaves, peanut oil, hydrogen fuel cell, reconstituted stripper sweat, it doesn't matter. Migrate from fuel needs to fuel needs, main technology and system remains the same, only the generator needs to be swapped out.
And many people could get by on just the battery for their day-to-day needs, renting a generator for trips.
  quote
Kickaha
Likes his boobies blue.
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hell
 
2009-12-03, 20:21

While true, I think most people would feel much more secure knowing that *if* they start to run the battery low, then can pull into any gas station and keep going. I know for me that's a huge factor.

Recharge at home for most daily driving, use fuel as a backup or for long trips.

My other brain is hung like a horse too.
#IRC isn't old school.
Old school is being able to say 'finger me' with a straight face.
  quote
Chinney
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Ottawa, ON
 
2009-12-03, 21:41

Quote:
Originally Posted by kretara View Post
...a black 1996 Mazda 323. It had one option: A/C and looked like this:
Typo. You mean 1986, of course. My wife had that when we first started dating, except in pale blue.

After we were married, she was living in Montreal and I was still in Ottawa much of the time, driving back and forth. After the GLC broke down in 1993 in -30C very early one morning on that Montreal-Ottawa highway (and I had to hike 30 minutes over a snowy field to use a phone at a pig farm), we decided we needed something newer, so we bought a used 1991 Ford Taurus (file photo):



We drove that car into the ground - with a new transmission and some rust repairs we were able to get over 300,000 km out of it. That old Vulcan engine never needed to be touched. We replaced it with a silver 2000 Taurus (file photo), our first new car:



We also put a lot of kms on that, with no real problems. Again, that engine was almost like a sealed unit; never need anything but the occasional oil change. We replaced it with our current car, a 2008 Subaru Legacy Wagon (again, file photo):



None of these cars are all that exciting, but I've never been that much of a car fan. Cars are mostly a get from A to Z proposition for me.

When there's an eel in the lake that's as long as a snake that's a moray.

Last edited by Chinney : 2009-12-03 at 21:55.
  quote
Quagmire
meh
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2009-12-03, 22:35

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kickaha View Post
Parallel hybrid, let the generator run on gas, diesel, biodiesel, leaves, peanut oil, hydrogen fuel cell, reconstituted stripper sweat, it doesn't matter. Migrate from fuel needs to fuel needs, main technology and system remains the same, only the generator needs to be swapped out.
If you're talking about the Volt's hybrid system, then you got it mixed up.

Prius= Parallel

Volt= Series hybrid.
  quote
Kickaha
Likes his boobies blue.
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hell
 
2009-12-03, 23:01

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quagmire View Post
If you're talking about the Volt's hybrid system, then you got it mixed up.

Prius= Parallel

Volt= Series hybrid.
I... I have no idea what you mean. *D'oh*

(I got it right the first time!)
  quote
joveblue
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Melbourne
 
2009-12-06, 01:01

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kickaha View Post
While true, I think most people would feel much more secure knowing that *if* they start to run the battery low, then can pull into any gas station and keep going. I know for me that's a huge factor.
I saw something recently where the "gas station" was a battery swap station. Drive in, swap your depleted battery over for a full one. Can't find it now, but could be a good solution.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xaqtly View Post
Ah yeah, I was only looking in the US market.
My fault, I was the one saying I wasn't interested in diesel.
  quote
Kickaha
Likes his boobies blue.
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hell
 
2009-12-06, 11:19

Quote:
Originally Posted by joveblue View Post
I saw something recently where the "gas station" was a battery swap station. Drive in, swap your depleted battery over for a full one. Can't find it now, but could be a good solution.
It theoretically could, but consider a couple of things...

Until there's a battery swap center on every corner there's now a gas station... you have to carefully plan your routes and nearness to a swap center. That's going to reduce adoption rate, which reduces incentive to create swap stations, which... you see the problem.

Secondly, gas is gas is gas. Battery technologies have vastly different discharge profiles. Each car would have to know about each kind of battery technology and know how to best take advantage of it.

Third, battery formats. Consider how many kinds of batteries there are for just cell phones... can you imagine a swap station having to have a couple of every kind of battery out there for every possible model that might pull in? Oy.

Finally, you'd have to design the car around a quickly removable battery. They're big (.5mx.5mx2m), they're heavy (600-800kg), and from a vehicle design perspective, best buried deep in the car's center of gravity, under a bit of armor for crash safety. And those are the *forty mile* batteries! How are you going to just swap one of these things out in a few minutes? Heck, again, look at the cell phone. A non-user-replaceable battery in the iPhone means it's thinner, simpler, and a better functional design. Adding quick swapability adds weight, size, and distracts from creating a *car* instead of a battery holder on wheels.

I just don't see it being practical.

My other brain is hung like a horse too.
#IRC isn't old school.
Old school is being able to say 'finger me' with a straight face.
  quote
Chinney
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Ottawa, ON
 
2009-12-06, 11:49

Battery swap technology is a central part of the approach of the Better Place company which is among the world leaders in the practical implementation of electric cars. I suspect that this is what joveblue was remembering. Getting it to work quickly and well is indeed very much part of their plans. It is yet to be seen, of course, whether Better Place, or others, can make this a reliable and paying proposition.

General link:

http://www.betterplace.com/

Charging/Swapping link:

http://www.betterplace.com/solution/charging/

When there's an eel in the lake that's as long as a snake that's a moray.

Last edited by Chinney : 2009-12-06 at 17:08.
  quote
Kickaha
Likes his boobies blue.
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hell
 
2009-12-06, 12:56

I think the idea is fine, but is this company really going to get GM, Toyota, Ford, BMW, Honda, Kia, Volkswagon, and every other car manufacturer to use *their* system?

I don't see it.

Charging is universal, like gas. Swapping isn't.

My other brain is hung like a horse too.
#IRC isn't old school.
Old school is being able to say 'finger me' with a straight face.
  quote
thegelding
feeling my oats
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: there are nice people here...that makes me happy
Send a message via AIM to thegelding  
2009-12-06, 13:10

we are a two vehicle family....my wife has a car (a camry), i have 2 scooters and 2 bikes....i do fine day to day without a car of my own

if i get a car in the next couple of years (coming up on 50 soon enough and probably could use a "covered" ride for winter and such) it will be an all electric...

fuck gas, fuck oil, fuck internal combustion engines...

electric will be good for daily commuting, and we have the dino car for the rare long trips (plus she will be changing out the camry in a couple of years for a hybrid)

the range is short now, but fine for my usage...and i see battery tech going like computer chip tech...in 5 years it will be double....5 years double again...
by 2020 you will be able to go 400 miles on a single charge...and will have fast charging stations across the country...

so gas cars will go the way of beta tapes (and vhs tapes too)


gas cars have had a surprisingly long run, but i imagine my grand kids won't ever own a gas car and my great grand kids won't even know what a gas car was except if they happen to see mystery science theater 10,000 doing a rip on zoolander...and then they will be horrified that people actually put flammable, explosive fluid into a large tank in their car...


g

crazy is not a rare human condition

everything is food if you chew hard enough
  quote
Posting Rules Navigation
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Page 2 of 48 Previous 1 [2] 3 4 5 6  Next Last

Post Reply

Forum Jump
Thread Tools
Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
3G talk time BlueApple Apple Products 4 2009-04-14 15:23
Let's Talk Stimulus ezkcdude AppleOutsider 180 2009-02-16 15:54
Let's talk... hot sauces Wrao AppleOutsider 19 2006-12-03 10:53
OS 7.5.3 not able to talk to OS X.3.7 boris Genius Bar 4 2005-01-27 14:12


« Previous Thread | Next Thread »

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 17:55.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2019, AppleNova