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Intel iBook in Jan...?


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Intel iBook in Jan...?
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scratt
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2005-11-17, 07:20

Wasn't someone predicting this in another thread..

Think Secret think it's true...

http://www.thinksecret.com/news/0511intelibook.html
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ShadowOfGed
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2005-11-17, 08:32

Well here's the good news: we've had the prediction of pretty much every Mac model going Intel by MWSF '06, except for the PowerMac. Mac mini, PowerBook, iBook, iMac---you name it, it's been predicted. How's that good? Well somebody has to be right!

On the other hand, since they've all been predicted, it's hard to put too much stock into any one of the rumors...

So will it be the iBook? I was hoping for PowerBooks... :smokey:

Apparently I call the cops when I see people litter.
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Dr. Macenstein
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2005-11-17, 08:35

Intel Shuffles maybe?
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ShadowOfGed
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2005-11-17, 08:39

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Macenstein
Intel Shuffles maybe?
Uh, what?

Though an Apple product, those aren't Mac products...
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Grip
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2005-11-17, 09:12

If this turns out to be true, it is puzzling at the very least. An iBook that outperforms a PowerBook?
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kukito
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2005-11-17, 09:15

The speculation about future consumer Intel Macs has mostly focused on the Yonah processors, but Apple could very well use current 90 nm Pentium-M, which will drop in price once Yonah is released, for the iBook or the Mini. Also, the 65 nm Presler Pentium-D consumes less power than the current one, so it (or the Cedar Mill P4) could conceivably be used on an iMac. Intel already sells small micro and pico BTX motherboards that support these chips. I'm sure the cooling solution used on the current iMac could be adapted to Presler/Cedar Mill.

I will buy an iBook, and possibly a Mini, as soon as they come out. I don't care about Rosetta since I will be installing Windows on a small partition to run the software I currently use. Rosetta is important for current MacUsers, but not so much for switchers.
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BenP
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2005-11-17, 09:32

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowOfGed
Well here's the good news: we've had the prediction of pretty much every Mac model going Intel by MWSF '06, except for the PowerMac. Mac mini, PowerBook, iBook, iMac---you name it, it's been predicted. How's that good? Well somebody has to be right!
Do they? I'm still skeptical that any Intel machine will be released at MWSF.
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pscates2.0
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2005-11-17, 09:45

Well, I can buy this WAY easier than I can Intel PowerBooks or iMacs in January. No way the iMac is going to get THREE updates in eight months.



And, for the very reasons stated in the ThinkSecret article, an iBook before a PowerBook makes sense. Not to say an Intel PowerBook couldn't come out a few months later. But the PowerBook was just updated.

Although, as someone above says, how tricked-out and packing can the iBook get as long as the PowerBook is at its G4-based "ceiling"?

Hard to imagine Apple selling a 2.0GHz iBook for $1099 or so, with PowerBooks nowhere near that and going for twice as much.



I hope this doesn't point to the idea of Apple intentionally crippling any spiffy new Yonah-based iBook, just so it doesn't "out-do" their PowerBooks...I think we've all had about enough of Apple doing that.

But since their Intel machines obviously aren't going to come out in one simultaneous bang, I wonder about that.

Apple is probably thinking less "pro vs. consumer", and more "G5 vs. G4"...the G5 stuff can probably hold its own against Yonah, and so maybe the towers and the iMac will be among the last products to go Intel, with the iBook, Mac mini and PowerBook going first, in whatever order makes sense.

Perception-wise, the PowerBook SHOULD go first, and get the fastest, dual-core thing they can pack in there. Make it a true no-compromise butt-kicker. Then that would give the iBook room to step up quite a bit too, and perform more like today's PowerBook.

As long as the PowerBook is sitting at a 1.67GHz G4, I don't see the iBook getting a 1.8-2.0GHz dual-core Yonah. Something might happen to both. Maybe MWSF will be a big laptop fest?

Then again, it might just be about iLife 06, new shuffles (in black, of course) and five new dancing silhouette commercials...I can see that, just as easily.

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halo1982
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2005-11-17, 09:45

If they announce an Intel iBook, I'm certainly selling my currently two month old July 2005 white iBook...sure I'll be out probably $400 for the one I want, but my god, this thing is S-L-O-W. Also I (sadly) still need a Windows box for a few things, and dual booting would be nice, or even running VMWare or VirtualPC (since the Yonah supports Intel's Virtualisation it should be pretty speedy). I hope major apps are available soon, but I can't see Photoshop running a whole lot slower than it already does on my iBook (1.33Ghz/1GB RAM 12")
Also the Inquirer is showing that the slowest single and dual core Yonah will debut at 1.66GHz, with a 1.5GHz low voltage dual coming out as well (doubtful for iBook...the low voltage Yonahs are for subnotebooks and usually carry a nice price premium). So if Apple comes out with an intelBook, it's going to be the same clock speed as the fastest G4 PowerBook...hrm. I'd be pretty pissed if I just bought a PowerBook =P http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=27770
Edit: slashdotted, yet again

Last edited by halo1982 : 2005-11-17 at 10:22.
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Elysium
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2005-11-17, 11:39

Finally, news.... well sorta. There is no reason why the iBook can't get a single core Yonah or even a Pentium M. All Apple has to do is clock things just right to keep it even with the current G4 in the iBook (as to not overshadow the powerbook). Why the iBook?- it's been stagnant for so long and the Apple apps (which is the majority of what consumers use) should already be x86 native. Why not the PowerBook?- pro-level software isn't available yet, nor is likely by Q1 2006 (calendar , not fiscal).

Likeliest scenarios for Intel machines (in my eyes):
  • iBook and *improved, beefed up* Mac mini- MWSF '06
  • Powerbook- WWDC '06 (announced- shipping Sept-Oct)
  • iMac- MWSF '07
  • PowerMac- WWDC '07


Quote:
Originally Posted by scratt
Wasn't someone predicting this in another thread..
Since June...

Formerly known as cynical_rock
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Banana
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2005-11-17, 11:52

I'm on a Dell because Apple couldn't offer me a decent powerbook for my needs. (and I have some stupid Windows only software to boot).

A intel iBook seems to me a bit counterintuitive. I can understand how iBooks are being stuck by Powerbook's ceiling, but still... what's wrong with updating them both?

I can't help but feel that Apple is becoming like Hollywood..

"Intel X-Mac.... coming to your local threatre soon...."
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pscates2.0
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2005-11-17, 12:05

Quote:
Originally Posted by cynical_rock
Likeliest scenarios for Intel machines (in my eyes):
  • iBook and *improved, beefed up* Mac mini- MWSF '06
  • Powerbook- WWDC '06 (announced- shipping Sept-Oct)
  • iMac- MWSF '07
  • PowerMac- WWDC '07
I'll buy that! Sounds halfway reasonable, even. Maybe the PowerBooks (having just been updated, after all) will indeed wait for Merom, and be a dual-core, 64-bit release. Seems more "PowerBook-y" to pack that...major bragging rights (FWIW): dual-core and 64-bit, plus whatever other goodies Apple packs in (HD, iSights, Mighty Mouse-inspired trackpad, new design, etc.).

In the meantime, the neglected (as of late) iBook can get a redesigned widescreen, thinner case, a nice Yonah, more Tiger-friendly graphics, 5400rpm hard drives, etc. and be quite the little performers we all knew they could be.

When/if the PowerBooks finally went big with Merom, the iBooks could then step up nicely in clockspeed (or even go dual-core on their Rev. B, in the latter half of 2006) because the PowerBooks would finally break past 1.67GHz, and wind up with some true muscle. No longer would the iBook have to be so cruelly hobbled to avoid stepping on the PowerBook's toes. They could BOTH be legit, no-compromise buttkickers, with the PowerBooks simply being of the Extra Special Buttkicker Extreme™ variety.



It does make sense for the more consumer stuff to take that road first (iBook and mini), just because of the third-party pro software concerns. Any word on how Adobe and the others are doing with that transition on their end? Or is that something that would be kept tightly under wraps?


Last edited by pscates2.0 : 2005-11-17 at 12:11.
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Dorian Gray
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2005-11-17, 13:18

My thoughts are that Apple will continue on its current path of reducing price and emphasising compact packaging. So I imagine if an Intel iBook appears in January it will be priced well under $1,000 and be rather bare-featured. The current iBook is loaded with features, many of which cheap (and even not-so-cheap) Windows-based laptops eliminate to reduce costs. For example, my girlfriend's very expensive Dell laptop doesn't have a built-in microphone, a must for Skype. Apple shouldn't try to compete with $500 laptops because that would necessarily mean giving up the Apple traits of small size and quality materials, but a $750 iBook would attract a lot of people who would baulk at spending $1,000 on a laptop. Such people do not care about what processor their computer has or whether it has a FireWire port. They care about price and what the thing looks like compared to others sitting in the shop window. So a true entry-level iBook could sacrifice a lot of features to target this market.

Intel's Pentium M, while a great processor, is also very expensive. With Freescale's inexpensive G4 Apple can't buy a high-performance processor for love or money. That will change with the Pentium. Intel specifies a price of $702/chip for 1000 top-of-the-range Centrino processors. Obviously that chip won't be chosen for a $700 laptop, but neither will the cheapest Centrino at $267. So I think there is a real chance Apple's first Intel system will be based on the crap Celeron M processor.
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Elysium
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2005-11-17, 13:20

Quote:
Originally Posted by pscates2.0
In the meantime, the neglected (as of late) iBook can get a redesigned widescreen, thinner case, a nice Yonah, more Tiger-friendly graphics, 5400rpm hard drives, etc. and be quite the little performers we all knew they could be.
I'd buy one of those in a heartbeat, especially if it goes black.
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Dorian Gray
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2005-11-17, 13:23

Well, one thing we can be certain about is that the first Intel iBook will definitely not have a Yonah processor. The processor alone would tie up half the cost of the laptop.
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Baron Munchausen
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2005-11-17, 14:12

I can see why the iBook would go first, then the Powerbook kicks in second a few months later.

The first Intel Mac is going to be a big big PR entree - no point making it a trick high end device so all the numb-nut ignoramuses can again slap Apple for being expensive fashion items. Make it a broad based low cost butt-kicker. Make it EFI. Powerbook sales will be down anyhow as people await. Once the apps are in window, the PB can get the Intel treatment, dual cores, 64 bit and all the rest.
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halo1982
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2005-11-17, 14:23

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorian Gray
Well, one thing we can be certain about is that the first Intel iBook will definitely not have a Yonah processor. The processor alone would tie up half the cost of the laptop.
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=27770
Anyone know how much Apple pays for the 7447As in the books?
$210 for the cheapest single core Yonah...thats about standard for what Intel charges for its latest processors. And keep in mind thats in quantities of 1000, so Apple gets a heavily discounted rate. With everyone else coming out with Yonah notebooks around $1000, I don't see why Apple can't. Also, OSx86 needs SSE3 (unless they implement a SSE3->SSE2 emulator such as in the hacked version, but I doubt that because they're really pushing SSE3), something the current PentiumMs (Dothan) does not supply.
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PB PM
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2005-11-17, 17:28

Quote:
Originally Posted by kukito

I will buy an iBook, and possibly a Mini, as soon as they come out. I don't care about Rosetta since I will be installing Windows on a small partition to run the software I currently use. Rosetta is important for current MacUsers, but not so much for switchers.
There is no way to know if you can even install Windows, so you might want to hold your horses for just a sec. Just because its an Intel Chip it does not mean that Windows will be installable on the machine.
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Robo
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2005-11-17, 17:45

I still don't buy it. I don't see the recent lame Powerbook "upgrade" as any indication that we won't see new Powerbooks at MWSF - I know Apple wouldn't want the Powerbook to be stuck at the same clock speed for over a year. (Look at the Mac mini...it got a small upgrade at the end of July, and a larger, unofficial one at the end of September.)

I can see Intel Powerbooks and iBooks unveiled at the same time, sure. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see MWSF being a "big laptop fest." But the iBook can't even get a minor upgrade to a faster G4 without stepping on the toes of the Powerbook. There's no way it can go to a next-generation Intel architecture without besting the Powerbook performance-wise.

and i guess i've known it all along / the truth is, you have to be soft to be strong
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Reid
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2005-11-17, 17:58

I believe this iBook rumor a lot more easily than the iMac / PowerBook one. With that, I can't help wondering if AI is getting last month's announcements mixed up with their Intel rumors. The only way I'd buy that is if we knew that the new iMacs with PCI-Express architecture have some sort of daughtercard that would allow them to simply swap out the PowerPC for an Intel processor... could that be a possibility?

cynical_rock: Are you sure you want a black iBook? People complain enough about their $200 nanos getting scratched up; can you imagine the outcry over an $800 laptop?
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gjas15
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2005-11-17, 17:59

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM
There is no way to know if you can even install Windows, so you might want to hold your horses for just a sec. Just because its an Intel Chip it does not mean that Windows will be installable on the machine.

I would be surprised if it isnt possible. Even IF Apple crippled it in some way to keep it from running windows like: proprietary system controller, security chip, boot roms, etc. Some enterprising windows hacker will write drivers, copy rom code, or bypass said security chip. It may be unsupported by Apple; maybe even heavily discouraged, but someone in the windows universe wanting to run windows on Apple hardware will find a way to make it work.
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PB PM
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2005-11-17, 18:04

If people want to hack their machines in such a way I guess not, but if its not supported, who is going to take the time to make an app to switch between the OSs without sperate boot drives?
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Doxxic
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2005-11-17, 18:05

Because of the way ThinkSecret brings the news, I believe the rumor.

If the Intel iBook isn't too buggy and if there is at least some virtualization which allows me to buy Windows XP running on it (and play some games i'd love to play), I'm sold.
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Robo
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2005-11-17, 18:13

I do agree that ThinkSecret seemed very confident in the validity of their report.

I agree that Apple might introduce a sub-$1,000 notebook - the line-up seems ripe for an "iBook mini" (not smaller than 12", the current iBooks would just grow). I do think Apple knows they need something cheaper than $999.

and i guess i've known it all along / the truth is, you have to be soft to be strong
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arnoct
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2005-11-17, 18:15

I've just started saving up for an iBook and hopefully by the time I have enough money (january or february) this'll be a reality. I'm going to hold off until we have x86 macs so I can have the best of both worlds--the reliability of OSX and the support of Windows XP.
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PB PM
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2005-11-17, 18:32

I still don't see why everyone thinks Windows will run on the new machines. Personally I hope it doesn't change from the way it is now. If you want a PC get one, if you want a Mac, get one.
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chucker
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2005-11-17, 18:34

Hmm, nice. This makes me original prediction post more believable, doesn't it now.
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kukito
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2005-11-17, 19:15

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM
There is no way to know if you can even install Windows, so you might want to hold your horses for just a sec. Just because its an Intel Chip it does not mean that Windows will be installable on the machine.
If I can't install Windows then I won't buy it.
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PB PM
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2005-11-17, 19:45

Then why buy a Mac at all? If you want Windows get a higher speed machine for about the same price as the mini / ibook. It makes no sense to get Mac hardware if you want Windows.
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Elysium
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2005-11-17, 20:20

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reid
cynical_rock: Are you sure you want a black iBook? People complain enough about their $200 nanos getting scratched up; can you imagine the outcry over an $800 laptop?
Of course I would shamelessly baby the thing and keep it well protected during travel. But the scratches would typically be...... well... on the bottom. Not exactly a highly viewed and impressionistic part of a computer...

Of course I have already made my opinion felt on the nano scratching issues, so I need not go into it again...

Formerly known as cynical_rock
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