[stevegong]

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english...ent_351569.htm

I don't know what to say. Was this even on the news in the US?

[Eugene]

There's only ONE story being covered by US news outlets right now, and this isn't it.

[Barto]

Got an independent link? (That is, not state owned/controlled media like chinadaily).

[FFL]

It seems the officer is facing charges.
http://www.theithacajournal.com/news...ws/907059.html
Search Google News for "chinese niagara" to see more US media coverage.

[stevegong]

I wonder why I couldn't find it on CNN, since it seems like a serious incident.

update: I just saw an interview with her on the news. she seemd to be in a lot of pain. I feel pretty bad for her.

[InactionMan]

Her lawyers is only going to sue for $5 million??? Dude should add a couple of zeroes to that.

[ast3r3x]

Originally Posted by InactionMan Her lawyers is only going to sue for $5 million??? Dude should add a couple of zeroes to that.

Probably could. But funny you should say that, I was just thinking how that is a ridiculous amount. Suing for unnecessary amounts should be illegal.

Ok, yeah you were beaten because you look strikingly similar to a known drug smuggler. Medical bills + missed time + small fee for whatever, does not equal $5million dollars! Confusion of identities probably shouldn't have happened, but the gene pool is pretty strong in china, so while not acceptable, it's understandable. <snip>uncalled for comment</snip>. I don't condone that at all, and she should be reimbursed...but $5million is not right.

Sad part is she will probably get that or close to that

[staph]

Originally Posted by ast3r3x Probably could. But funny you should say that, I was just thinking how that is a ridiculous amount. Suing for unnecessary amounts should be illegal. Ok, yeah you were beaten because you look strikingly similar to a known drug smuggler. Medical bills + missed time + small fee for whatever, does not equal $5million dollars! Confusion of identities probably shouldn't have happened, but the gene pool is pretty strong in china, so while not acceptable, it's understandable. <snip>uncalled for comment</snip>. I don't condone that at all, and she should be reimbursed...but $5million is not right. Sad part is she will probably get that or close to that

Actually, the calculus would be more like:

"Normal" damages=

medical expenses +
loss of income/earning capacity (probably several weeks off work, but including some calculation of the possibility of long-term consequences from such an horrific attack (e.g. brain damage, mental or emotional problems, etc.) +
loss of amenity (if any of the damage to her eyes/teeth/whatever is permanent, debilitating, and affects her lifestyle) +
pain and suffering (not much, but it'll be in there)

Damages for the assault/battery=

whatever the court thinks a proper amount to account for the seriousness of the violation of her personal integrity. Damages for this kind of tort aren't wholly referable to the damage/loss suffered by the person.

Damages for unlawful imprisonment =

dunno. Nothing to sniff at though.

Punitive damages =

Potentially a lot, especially if the court think that the GBH was partly caused by a flawed system of training and/or supervision of the DHS operatives.

I'm not sure about $5M — but the payout should be substantial.

[SKMDC]

jeez, even if she had marijuana pouring out of every orifice she would still have a large lawsuit.

[staph]

Originally Posted by superkaratemonkeydeathcar jeez, even if she had marijuana pouring out of every orifice she would still have a large lawsuit.

Yeah, I think the take-home lesson should be that police really shouldn't beat the fsck out of suspects… it's not very civilised.

Not to mention people who happen to be standing around whom they don't like the look of.

Suing for unnecessary amounts should be illegal.

Depends on the definition of unnecessary. Sometimes the only thing that can force the powerful elites into line is a massive hit to their checkbook.

[ast3r3x]

Originally Posted by Adam Depends on the definition of unnecessary. Sometimes the only thing that can force the powerful elites into line is a massive hit to their checkbook.

Who high up ordered this to be done. Was stupid choice by a person or persons. I don't think it's taught anywhere to beat people you think might be smuggling drugs. For all you know, maybe the drug smuggler was considered armed and dangerous. You don't know.

I'm not sticking up for this guy, it was a horrible thing to do.

[BarracksSi]

That wasn't a whole lot of beating -- it's how you stop someone that's running away.

Now, true, she didn't speak English, but the officer burst outside looking for three female suspects, and she happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time.

It's just an ugly scene. I don't want to be the one wearing the judge's robe.

[staph]

Originally Posted by BarracksSi That wasn't a whole lot of beating -- it's how you stop someone that's running away.

Beating the head of an unarmed assailant against the ground? Kicking them in the head?

This is not standard police practice… at least not where I come from (well, maybe the NSW police…)

ast3r3x: bear in mind that it's much more likely that the government will be sued than this guy; he'll go to gaol, and the government will be forced to pay for the civil action (as his employer, they're liable for the actions he takes while doing his job).

I don't think anyone is saying that the government would order someone to do such a thing (hmm, CIA assassination prior to the mid-70s?), or that the training says "pick an unarmed shonky looking person and kick the s**t out of them", but rather that these guys may not have been properly trained in how to properly subdue unarmed "attackers" (and hence went a little overboard), or may have had their attitudes skewed throughout their training (by, I don't know, repeated association of terrorists with foreigners, and repeated assertions of their lack of rights, accompanied by little emphasis on the rights of those being arrested). I'm not saying that this is actually the case. It's certainly what I would attempt to argue in court, however.

[stevegong]

Well, I wonder what your attitudes would be if what happened was an american woman who got beaten like this in China.

I'm quite certain you wouldn't just sue for 5 million...


Ast3r3x, what's that you were talking about with the gene pools? I'm not sure I understand.

[SKMDC]

Originally Posted by BarracksSi That wasn't a whole lot of beating -- it's how you stop someone that's running away. Now, true, she didn't speak English, but the officer burst outside looking for three female suspects, and she happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. It's just an ugly scene. I don't want to be the one wearing the judge's robe.

that wasn't a whole lot of beating? as if there is an minimum or a maximum amount that you can beat an unarmed (and innocent) woman?

are you sick or just thick?
i'm sorry but that comment just creeps me out.

[MacUsers]

Originally Posted by stevegong Well, I wonder what your attitudes would be if what happened was an american woman who got beaten like this in China. I'm quite certain you wouldn't just sue for 5 million... Ast3r3x, what's that you were talking about with the gene pools? I'm not sure I understand.

Sure then it would actually be on the news but don't start your little racial things again Steve... this has nothing to do with the lady being chinese. At least.. I hope not.

[Luca]

My god Steve, you just can't stop can you? Would you quit trying to make racial divides where there aren't any?

[dviant]

Hell were can I go to take a beating and get $5 mil? I'm up for it!

[Mr Beardsley]

Originally Posted by dviant Hell were can I go to take a beating and get $5 mil? I'm up for it!

No kidding. I'll take two for 10!

[murbot]

Originally Posted by Luca My god Steve, you just can't stop can you? Would you quit trying to make racial divides where there aren't any?

That's like asking me why I keep selling my Macs. We...just...can't...help it.

[stevegong]

Originally Posted by Luca My god Steve, you just can't stop can you? Would you quit trying to make racial divides where there aren't any?

Well, I just think that some of the people here saying it's not a big deal won't think the same if it happened to an American lady.

When I was in Europe during 911, there was a collective minute of silence we held. I was in USA during the Madrid bombings, and most of the people didn't even know it happened, and many who did just shrugged it off as not being a big deal, because more people died in WTC.

I'm not trying to make racial divides, nor start a fight, but I can't help but be annoyed at some people who shrug this incident off as not a big deal, and I know these same people would be very pissed if the same thing happened to an American woman.

I'm upset about this incident, but I'm not really that angry like many people in China are. This incident isn't going to make me hate America, because it was just a couple of idiot police officers. The reason I made this thread was that I hadn't heard of this news being discussed anywhere else other than China, so I wanted more people to know it happened. That's all.

[SteveC]

Originally Posted by BarracksSi That wasn't a whole lot of beating -- it's how you stop someone that's running away. Now, true, she didn't speak English, but the officer burst outside looking for three female suspects, and she happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. It's just an ugly scene. I don't want to be the one wearing the judge's robe.

So we paid this guy to "guard" the border, and now we have to pay the person he beat up, too?

Why not just open the borders? The guards obviously do nothing useful, and now the court is wasting its time too. Do we really expect criminals and terrorists to stop and fill out forms stating their intentions?

Basically, it is illegal for the government to beat up innocent people. But why did we hire guards to harass regular people in the first place? It's like hiring a painter to watch paint dry. America is full of "professionals" who do nothing. :smokey:

How do I get a job in the Department of Homeland Security Blankets?

[Luca]

Look, steve, I actually understand how you feel here. No, I wouldn't consider myself a racist (even if you'd like to paint me one along with all other Americans).

The problem is how you talk about these things. Yeah, it's true that the Madrid bombings got far less coverage than 9/11. It's also true that there would probably be a lot more news coverage and public outrage if an American women was beaten up by Chinese officials for no reason. But you're making it seem as though media coverage = public opinion. Like if they don't cover the Madrid bombings, then all Americans are automatically ignorant that they happened, and any who actually did hear about it don't care.

I was shocked by the Madrid bombings. They didn't hit as close to home as 9/11, but it was still a tragic event. Same goes for the Chinese lady. I really don't like how you make so many broad assumptions about people's opinions.

But I have to leave now... I'll see how this goes.

[DaveGee]

Originally Posted by stevegong I'm upset about this incident, but I'm not really that angry like many people in China are. This incident isn't going to make me hate America, because it was just a couple of idiot police officers. The reason I made this thread was that I hadn't heard of this news being discussed anywhere else other than China, so I wanted more people to know it happened. That's all.

Give me a freakin break... I feel NO MORE UPSET about a woman from China getting this kind of treatment then I would for ANY INNOCENT HUMAN-BEING getting this kind of treatment.

(While some might hate me for saying this but a if this happened to a GUILTY drug dealer I wouldn't even think twice about it. I fully admit to having prejudice feeling against the scum of the earth - drug dealers - pedophiles - rapists - killers - you know, the dregs of society)

Steve (or anyone) can you please explain to me why the person being chinese has anything to do with it. Maybe it's you Steve who is prejudice and feel simply because the person was Chinese the story was MORE important?

The action was unjust PERIOD. A mistake yes but a BAD one - the world's an imperfect place - bad things happen to good people EVERYWHERE. God willing, the responsible person or persons will be punished with the proper punishment. End of story. My best wishes goes out to the woman and wish her a speedy recovery. She didn't deserve what happened to her and she SHOULD sue for damages - more power to her.

Finally, you've got a lot of nerve making it seem like the U.S. doesn't care. This is a big place with TONS of news happening EVERYWHERE and while you might be upset that this didn't make the nation news circuit you'll have to get over it. Lots of TRAGIC stories don't make the CNN - 16 year old inner city (even suburban or rural) girls killing their babies and dumping then into the trash can like yesterdays news. Middle school aged kids having oral sex parties after school. Terrible hazing rituals in HS that cause the DEATH of young kids. etc etc etc...

What makes this story any more news worth?

This 'dog pile on the U.S.' has to stop - it's getting very old.

Dave

[stevegong]

Originally Posted by Luca Look, steve, I actually understand how you feel here. No, I wouldn't consider myself a racist (even if you'd like to paint me one along with all other Americans). The problem is how you talk about these things. Yeah, it's true that the Madrid bombings got far less coverage than 9/11. It's also true that there would probably be a lot more news coverage and public outrage if an American women was beaten up by Chinese officials for no reason. But you're making it seem as though media coverage = public opinion. Like if they don't cover the Madrid bombings, then all Americans are automatically ignorant that they happened, and any who actually did hear about it don't care. I was shocked by the Madrid bombings. They didn't hit as close to home as 9/11, but it was still a tragic event. Same goes for the Chinese lady. I really don't like how you make so many broad assumptions about people's opinions. But I have to leave now... I'll see how this goes.

Yeah, I agree, I shouldn't make broad assumptions about opinions, and it's probably just because I go to school in Virginia (a bit of a broad assumption in itself )

I just suddenly got angered more when I remembered that one poster back at .com who said the Madrid bombing was no big deal and shouldn't get as much attention. But of course, I shouldn't have continued to write in a pissed mood.

[stevegong]

Dave, no, the Chinese woman is not more than any American woman so I wasn't speaking in prejudice, rather the feeling I got that some americans are a bit self centered, and pay little attention to the outside world.

[DaveGee]

Originally Posted by stevegong Dave, no, the Chinese woman is not more than any American woman so I wasn't speaking in prejudice, rather the feeling I got that some americans are a bit self centered, and pay little attention to the outside world.

Sorry for being harsh before (I tend to fly off the handle from time to time - knowing your faults is 1/2 the battle I'm told) Anyway, I'm afraid to say this but far too many PEOPLE (not just Americans) pay little attention to the world just a few blocks away from where they live... But that's a whole other story.

Dave

[Luca]

Originally Posted by stevegong Yeah, I agree, I shouldn't make broad assumptions about opinions, and it's probably just because I go to school in Virginia (a bit of a broad assumption in itself ) I just suddenly got angered more when I remembered that one poster back at .com who said the Madrid bombing was no big deal and shouldn't get as much attention. But of course, I shouldn't have continued to write in a pissed mood.

Yeah, but maybe you could eventually move towards NOT getting angry and making rude assumptions about Americans? You can apologize now but you'll just repeat your behavior in a week anyway. You pulled this same lame stunt last week.

Thanks for apologizing, but I'm afraid it doesn't really mean anything to me anymore.

[stevegong]

Originally Posted by Luca Yeah, but maybe you could eventually move towards NOT getting angry and making rude assumptions about Americans? .

I'm trying...but hey, come on, it's getting a lot better isn't it?