[chucker]

System Settings needs some work, but there’s an improvement or two in there. I don’t think “feels a lot like the iOS app” is necessarily bad.

[kscherer]

Originally Posted by chucker System Settings needs some work, but there’s an improvement or two in there. I don’t think “feels a lot like the iOS app” is necessarily bad.

Nor do I. It's very well organized, but gonna take some time to get used to.

[709]

Originally Posted by chucker I don’t think “feels a lot like the iOS app” is necessarily bad.

I don't either, and overall I like the looks of the UI changes since Big Sur. Still, as a person that doesn't really run macOS betas the new Settings took me off guard somewhat. I'll adapt.

[kscherer]

I think there will be a period of, "What the hell is this?" followed by the realization that, "Oh, I know what this is."

[turtle]

My MBP is vintage now so no macOS 13 for me.

I'll have to check out Mrs T's MBP (M1) and see what it looks like. I ran the upgrade for her and Safari opened after it rebooted so we are good. (Did she need MBP, no but it is what she wanted.)

[Matsu]

Hi folks. My kids are after iPads. Their birthdays are coming. Since COVID their school has made increasing use of Google classroom. At school they use a combination of iPads and Chromebooks. At home they use their laptops - a couple of budget windows affairs. They message their friends, game, youtube, and do some work. My oldest is into drawing, my youngest is mostly into Roblox with his friends.

I'm trying to thing what's enough iPad to take them comfortably into highschool 4 and 5 years away, maybe with an Apple Pencil and 3rd party keyboard case down the line...

Regular iPad A14, or M1 iPad Air?

[kscherer]

Take it for what it's worth, but I've been selling iPads since 2010.

iPad 10 256GB, Apple Pencil 1st-gen, and whatever keyboard suits you. That will be more than sufficient.

Get ProCreate if they're feeling artsy.

No need for an iPad Air unless they're pushing into post-production.

[709]

iPad Air all the way if you're looking to hang onto these for the next 5 years. The regular iPad only supports the Gen-1 pencil, weirdly enough, so that's a mark against that model for drawing. Of course there's the beloved mini in the middle of those 2 models, but the external keyboard options aren't great.

[edit]: Beaten by Ken with his wrong opinion.

[PB PM]

Agreed, go mid-range for longer term use. Support for non-M series iPads might be short lived now.

[kscherer]

Originally Posted by PB PM Support for non-M series iPads might be short lived now.

Originally Posted by 709 iPad Air all the way if you're looking to hang onto these for the next 5 years.

California law requires support for electronic devices for a minimum of five years, so I wouldn't worry too much about A-series iPads vs. M1's in terms of longevity. Otherwise, 709's love for the iPad mini would face the same fate.

[PB PM]

Originally Posted by kscherer California law requires support for electronic devices for a minimum of five years, so I wouldn't worry too much about A-series iPads vs. M1's in terms of longevity. Otherwise, 709's love for the iPad mini would face the same fate.

Getting updates and running well are two different things. I’ve kept all my iPads for 5-6 years, by the end it gets rough on the entry level stuff.

[Matsu]

9-to-5mac reviewed a 3rd party Magic Keyboard for iPad Air that they rated pretty well, and at $99 is a nice savings over either the magic keyboard of keyboard folio, along with a $35 pencil that seemed to do very well (except the eraser function not as seamless as Apple). They only work with the Air, but that sort of sets them up pretty nicely to at $135 vs $500 or more for Apple's accessory pack.

I wonder if there's a recommended 3rd party keyboard pencil set for the A14 iPad that would really get the price for a whole package down...

[Matsu]

I ended up overspending a tad - got the kids 256GB iPad Airs - probably wouldn't have spent it on my own device, but the peace of mind of not having them bicker over our iPads is worth the money. At least until they move on to the next thing to fight about...

[turtle]

Heh. I'm to the point I make my kids buy their own.

Not just because I'm cheap, but because they are taking better care of them now that they pay for them. We gave them our hand-me-downs as we upgraded ours.

I was actually just looking at what iPad I would be able to run Stage Manager on to place two iPhone apps side by side. It seems this is only available for iPad Pro and Airs. Well, I can buy a Mac mini for the same price as the Air and display more than two apps. Of course, the mini doesn't include a multi-touch screen or battery for portability.

[PB PM]

Originally Posted by turtle I was actually just looking at what iPad I would be able to run Stage Manager on to place two iPhone apps side by side. It seems this is only available for iPad Pro and Airs. Well, I can buy a Mac mini for the same price as the Air and display more than two apps. Of course, the mini doesn't include a multi-touch screen or battery for portability.

Cannot beat that mobile factor of the iPad. I stopped using a notebook after getting my first iPad in 2012, still don’t miss them either. Mini has its own set of up and downsides, just like the limitations of the iPad, but some can be overcome if you get external keyboards and such for the latter.

[Matsu]

We still use a first gen iPad Air (128GB) since it holds the bulk of the Mrs's music collection and is paired to her iPhone/contacts, so it tends to be the family facetime console, but it's not so good for e-commerce/updates anymore. I've also got a 2021 iPad I picked up for her hospital stay (I guess that's a 9th gen iPad?) which the kids would fight over :LOL:

We procrastinate constantly about cleaning up our family storage/libraries and retiring the old (2013) iPad Air. Maybe there's a good use for it as a Sonos remote or home automation hub or something? The battery on it has been quite remarkable after 10 years, it's still going strong...

I could totally move to an iPad for my personal writing. The kid's iPads will be a good occasion to test out iOS's feasibility for my photo projects, which have become personal rather than commercial. Might also be a good time to test if it plays nicely with our corporate Office365 remote work portal/s...

[turtle]

The home hub idea is kinda what I have in mind too with an iPad actually. I would have to test out one before I was willing to buy it and have to return it if it didn't workout for me.

I almost went with Control4 for my home automation but couldn't deal with the requirement for an authorized installer to make ANY changes in my system. I'm not willing to give up my control for Control4. However, they have touch panels that allow anyone in the home to walk up and control it:


So I'm thinking I'll get an iPad and a wall mount for it and there you go! Get something like from this company (that I know nothing about they were just the first hit on search that looked like what I'm after) and set up guided access so the touch screen works and the apps you set are always loaded.

[Frank777]

How did Lenovo beat Apple in the race for a more readable tablet?

[kscherer]

How did Lenovo beat Apple to yet another check-box filling virus incubator?

Easy.

Just mass produce a thing with no use for people who don’t know any better.

[drewprops]

:I don't recall any of Apple's devices being first to market with new display technology in quite some time.

Hasn't Apple long relied on display manufacturers for these parts?

...

[chucker]

Originally Posted by Frank777 How did Lenovo beat Apple in the race for a more readable tablet?

"the hardware-level low blue light feature"

So it's useless at accurate color reproduction. Literally the first screenshot at https://www.apple.com/ipad/ is Final Cut Pro, which this tablet would be bad for.

Interesting approach, but hardly general-purpose.

"the Lenovo Xiaoxin also lets parents exercise appropriate control over the tablet’s Wi-Fi and Bluetooth connectivity options"

Ah yes, lest the kids catch the gay.

Originally Posted by drewprops :I don't recall any of Apple's devices being first to market with new display technology in quite some time.

How many other devices are there with mini-LED?

Originally Posted by drewprops Hasn't Apple long relied on display manufacturers for these parts? ...

They've been doing their own R&D on micro-LED, so they might be first to ship that for the masses. Or they might simply be able to have someone manufacture it with very favorable terms.

[Frank777]

Eyestrain is a big problem with tablets used for READING (I don't need a iPad for FCP. No one does.)

Education is a huge market that will be revolutionized further by tablets that do not cause eyestrain after long periods of reading.

Given that they seem to have achieved this via a nano-etching process, I would have pegged Apple to have come up with it first.

[chucker]

Originally Posted by Frank777 Eyestrain is a big problem with tablets used for READING

No doubt, but iPads are positioned as general-purpose computing devices, not e-readers.

Originally Posted by Frank777 (I don't need a iPad for FCP. No one does.)

Be that as it may, it's clearly a key part of Apple's current strategy.

Originally Posted by Frank777 Education is a huge market that will be revolutionized further by tablets that do not cause eyestrain after long periods of reading.

Education?

It's one thing to hypothesize that blue light is bad for reading in the evening, as it causes hormonal imbalance that makes falling asleep hard. That may be the case, though the science on it is still contentious.

It's a whole other thing to argue that this should be the case during school hours. On the contrary, if anything, that's an argument for even more blue light.

[chucker]

The whole thing also sounds like voodoo to me. They call it an "LCD paper display", so it's presumably not e-paper at all, but rather a traditional TFT with LED backlighting. At which point… that "hardware-level low blue light feature"? Is that a fancy way of saying "it's an RGB LED, but we put fewer blue LEDs in"?

[Frank777]

Originally Posted by chucker On the contrary, if anything, that's an argument for even more blue light.

LCDs throw light back at your eyes, which causes eyestrain after use.

ePaper generally works more like the printed page. The page is backlit, and there's no hard shafts of light constantly directed at your retinas.

The blue light thing is a separate problem.

[Matsu]

I think we're looking for subtle advantages against a much larger behavioural shift that has been amplified by successive waves of technology. Decades ago urbanization and the built environment made it so we look out into the distance far less. We just spend a lot of time indoors, looking at things up close, under artificial lighting... All of those can be bad on their own, and the combination is even worse... The move to office work further exposed large populations to hours a day of reading - something only a cloistered few would have been doing centuries prior. Since the 80's the paper has turned increasingly to screen time, and with personal devices, again further shrunk the viewing distances to mere inches from the face.

I'm obliged to stare at screens for 7-8 hours daily, not including all the time I spend doing so of my own volition. I'll take any and all advances in lighting and screen technology, but they probably don't come close to negating the behavioural causes of eye strain.

[drewprops]

You know, we do get attached to the technology that we know - so must so that we may be unable to imagine that technology in another form.

I would LOVE to work in front of a display that had incredible resolution with none of the reflectivity issues or eye strain.

...