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drewprops
Space Pirate
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Atlanta
 
2021-12-13, 13:26

There's been a recent flurry of articles about Apple being poised to bring their virtual reality visor/goggles to the market.

We've seen glimpses of their VR work with video games at various Apple events, and they've been lauded for their work on spatial audio, so it seems inevitable that we'll soon be faced with asking ourselves "why the heck would I put that thing on my face??"

I can anticipate all the old man reasons why you WOULDN'T want to use it.

What I'd like to know are some uses that you can envision that WOULD interest you, even in a limited way.

I would like to try virtual meetings with friends, to experience hearing them around me in a virtual space.

I've watched people play Minecraft with an Oculus headset, and his discomfort was hilarious.

Then of course there's all the pornography.

Anyhow, what are some practical uses you can imagine?


...

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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2021-12-13, 13:33

I think fitness/health will be one such use case. Makes sense with Apple’s research in that area. Sort of an Apple Fitness+ but more immersive.

See https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/g...orkout-partner, for example.
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psmith2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-12-13, 13:53

Walking around a museum, maybe? But even that is kinda already accomplished via just reading/looking at pics/watching video.

I don't know if headset-visiting the Louvre would really change my world in any way. I can already see everything that's there in other ways. But, while there, in real life, having the experience enhanced in some way?

But something like visiting the Pyramid ruins outside of Cairo? Or truly exotic, inaccessible/unreachable-by-most places? I think that sort of thing will be the true hook. At least, in my mind.

"Wanna see what it looks like at the top of Everest?" or "Imagine you can free-dive around the Titanic wreckage...let's go into this room and see what's there...". I could see that sort of thing having a strong appeal because who among us is ever going to visit the top of Everest or the bottom of the ocean?

But if a bunch of people want to use it to chase after Pokemon shit and iBang® Cardi B, then that's their deal.

I, personally, can't see me ever using it or finding a truly "OMG, I gotta have this!!!" (old man and all, you see), but for people like my niece and nephew who've grown up in a world of nothing but iOS, Amazon, social media, hyper-realistic gaming, mobile broadband, the world in their pocket 24/7, etc., they'll probably jump on it.

There's no way I'm walking around with that stuff on my head, no. I already have issues/concerns with folks living their entire lives via 4-6" screens (attending concerts and events and never once actually looking at the stage or playing field), and this sort of thing will only ramp that up and detach us all even further, I'm guessing). So aside from a couple of novel, "yeah, that's kinda cool...we done here?" scenarios, I can't really think of anything. Anything involving travel, I'd just rather do the real thing. I don't game, so all that angle is out. I already talk to and/or see any friends/relatives I want. Not once have I ever been on FaceTime and thought "I need more, and their voice needs to come from behind my head, like they're in the kitchen!"

I know there's that thing between AR and VR. VR, I have absolutely no interest in, no. AR, used in some clever, smart way (to enhance a museum experience in some way with extra info/animation or whatever), some may find that useful and appealing.

But it's just going to boil down to "which chick from The Bachelor can I see naked on my couch?", I'm guessing.

Some day when it all can get down to "normal eyewear" appearances, I think that's when it'll really go big. As long as wearing these stuff keeps/places one in the Terminal Virginity Zone because of how big and ridiculous they're probably going to look early on, I think most will be like "I'll wait...".

We're nothing if not vain.
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psmith2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-12-13, 13:56

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucker View Post
I think fitness/health will be one such use case. Makes sense with Apple’s research in that area. Sort of an Apple Fitness+ but more immersive.
Exactly.

"Running from this T-Rex ensures you get your workout/steps in today! Ready?"

Yeah, fitness stuff and making workouts a little more interesting/fun could certainly be a thing. I didn't think above that. And, yes...Apple is/has been all up in that stuff in recent years, so they've obviously got a grasp on that whole thing.
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psmith2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-12-13, 14:18

Okay, I can kinda think of something that might be cool. But I don't know how it could exist without recreating/re-filming the source material, most of which would be impossible.

Thinking about that Get Back documentary on Disney+.

What if you could be there, in the middle of all that? And "walk around" as the boys are sitting there playing? Or walking around that rooftop, standing next to George and then walking over to playfully hit Ringo's cymbal, and all from your POV. To be present at something historic - D-Day landing (yikes), Dealey Plaza on November 22 1963, etc.

Seeing classic movies (or TV shows) from a different vantage point, as you're able to "walk around" the set and see iconic scenes from different angles. To have that fourth wall "filled in" with reality, as you sit on the couch next to Jack and Chrissy and look out at the "wall" that was always our (the viewer's) vantage point? Or walk around the Enterprise bridge during that tribbles episode?

Stuff would have to be created from the ground up, I realize. But if they could ever do that...then this "old man" would probably buy one. I always wanted to visit Fantasy Island and ride in the backseat while Starsky & Hutch chased somebody!
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PB PM
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2021-12-13, 15:12

Anyone working in design, from computer hardware, fashion, landscape design, engineering projects would have great use for VR/AR. Being able see what something will look like in place before you even start would be very welcome.
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chucker
 
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2021-12-13, 15:19

As far as VR goes, I played with a Vive a few years ago. Setting it up still felt very beta (too many cables), but that’s solvable. The software ranged from interesting to gimmick. Google Earth in VR? Very neat. You’re standing on the planet and can zoom in with hand gestures. Then you’re walking street-level. Hard to explain. Very sci-fi. But ultimately just a silly tech demo.

Then there’s the game/fitness angle. Sort of Nintendo Wii but evolved. I know someone who exercises that way, and sure, why not.

But while the hardware keeps getting better almost as a law or nature, the software killer app hasn’t appeared. Not in the 90s when VR was first hyped, nor in the late 2010s when Oculus appeared.

MS HoloLens was also a huge letdown, IMHO.

Which raises the question: has Apple cracked it? Are they pursuing AR, VR, or both?
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psmith2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-12-13, 15:23

Well they haven’t “cracked” TV, IMO, despite Jobs’ statement to Isaacson a decade-plus ago.

So we’ll see.
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chucker
 
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2021-12-13, 16:01

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM View Post
Anyone working in design, from computer hardware, fashion, landscape design, engineering projects would have great use for VR/AR. Being able see what something will look like in place before you even start would be very welcome.
Possibly, but neither Google Glass Enterprise Edition nor HoloLens have exactly taken the industry world by storm so far.
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turtle
Lord of the Rant.
Formerly turtle2472
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Upstate South Carolina
 
2021-12-13, 16:18

I've been interested in VR from the beginning. I'm just not willing to build a massive rig to run one. As our devices become more powerful I can totally see Apple creating something that can run circles around the competition so you don't need major wiring and hardware to use VR.

That is about the time I'll finally jump in. I'm not going to wear a backpack with a computer in it just to be relatively cord free.

Louis L'Amour, “To make democracy work, we must be a notion of participants, not simply observers. One who does not vote has no right to complain.”
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psmith2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-12-13, 16:21

I hear these things are going to be pricey. There was an article on MacRumors last week and I got the impression that you could buy these or a nicely-equipped 14” MacBook Pro.

If that turns out to be so, that is not a mainstream, across-the-board, “for everyone” product. iPhones aside, it’s hard to have those kinds of things for more than $1,000. People will fork over $300-500 without much thought for something novel and that they don’t truly need. Beyond that, it takes some doing and something really special.

But, then again, putting it to ScarJo (pretend, of course) may be “really special” to a lot of dorks with more money than game.
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chucker
 
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2021-12-13, 18:03

I can't imagine them wanting to go much higher than $499. That's where the iPad started. It's already pricier than the Apple Watch (started at $349, unless you were Jony Ive ), despite being just about as niche.
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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2021-12-13, 18:23

I can come up with all kinds of uses for VR headsets, but none of them seem to make up a market large enough to make this a profitable market segment. I understand the desire in some markets, but sales are going to be light without everyday consumers onboard. Apple hasn't got enough game presence for that to be a thing; And the "walk around" market is small and niche.

Seriously, where is the "sell 10 million per year" market for this stuff? Unless they can be sold alongside a companion sex toy, I don't see much of a consumer market at all!

Outside of niche markets, VR/AR is just a curiosity.

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psmith2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-12-13, 18:36

Yeah. This and the car, I just can't get excited about.

This AR/VR stuff, aside from the goofy things I talk about above and a few other specific things mentioned here, just seems too limited-appeal to float a whole other product category. I know better than to bet against Apple, but I also can look around. The iPhone absolutely solved a problem/filled a need. This thing, in some broad, mainstream way? I don't see it. For all the reasons chucker and Ken lay out.

Not saying it couldn't ever be a thing, but I think, as I said above, when it comes out in a less stupid-looking, obvious form/design. Outside of a few niche cases - gaming, etc. - people just aren't going to walk around with big, goofy-looking stuff on their head.

We all laughed at that Google glass stuff. It's no cooler just because it has an Apple logo on it.

Beyond all that, what true need - not "want" - does it fill or address?

And this isn't me being "old man" (I was in on the iPhone from day one, the day it was announced, and was one of the first batch of people in Chattanooga to own one that following summer). This is just "what's it supposed to really do or be for?"

Last edited by psmith2.0 : 2021-12-13 at 19:29. Reason: Changed "bet on Apple" to "bet against Apple" :D
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drewprops
Space Pirate
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Atlanta
 
2021-12-13, 19:24

Don't forget the metaverse.

Imagine an Apple VR chat app to compete with Facebook's projected virtual reality MMPOC "holodecks". Facebook is the least likely to succeed in a hardware war and is likely to simply write code to provide a good experience for users.

Just dig back through Google Glass materials for all the suggested uses.

This afternoon I wanted to understand the weight of the device. I saw a projection of as much as 400 grams. A can of Coca-Cola is a LOT at 355mL. Try it yourself.

Apple surprised many of us by making AirPods a success, so I'm trying to see the big picture and consider the long future.

...
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psmith2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-12-13, 19:36

That's just it. I think it's a bit of a ways out. Smaller, sleeker, when more people in the world are born/brought up into this sort of stuff. It'll take my generation and older going away and for my 16-18 year old niece and nephew to be in their 30's and calling the shots, etc.

It's probably the future. I just don't think "the future" is 2023 or anyone soon thereafter.

It'll have to find That Thing that makes it all come together, make complete sense and a "well, of course...this is exactly what all the others were missing!" type of product. I don't think that's been hit on/figured out just yet. It might be a whole new era of gaming?

I guess, in all my old man-ness, there's part of me that just can't shake the feeling of "do we really need more people walking around, distracted from everything/everyone around then because their heads are shoved even farther up their iHole than they already have been for the past decade?"

That's probably the basis of any misgivings or "meh" on my part. I see what a truly great, transformative device has done to the world (the good and the not so). The ability to be super-distracted by something like this raises some big questions. The toothpaste is out on the tube on some of these fronts, so now we've got an entire planet full of people driving around (motorcycles included) screwing with their phones and not paying attention to the here-and-now, or the task at hand. Even more of that just kinda scares me a little because I know it'll be abused/misused. Human nature being what it is and all.

We will reach a point - and it may be long after I'm gone - where going to sit by a lake or just flying a kite in an open field will seems like the most "edgy", subversive thing imaginable. "I read somewhere they used to do this in the old days, back in the 1990's...". Spending a Saturday afternoon using nothing electronic/digital will be the 2051 equivalent of all the hipsters and their vinyl record collections.
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
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2021-12-13, 19:46

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucker View Post
Possibly, but neither Google Glass Enterprise Edition nor HoloLens have exactly taken the industry world by storm so far.
Nobodies really tried to do anything other than gaming seriously with VR, which is why it really never took off with earlier attempts.
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psmith2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-12-13, 20:05

I think the virtual tourism thing could be something, especially if the world just continues to get goofy and stay as it is (or worse) re: viruses and pandemics.

If you could sit on your couch and look around at the sights of Venice from your slowly-moving gondola, that's worth something. A safari in Africa (minus the "getting eaten" part). I'd like to visit Sweden and Norway someday. But in case I can't/don't...

I won't lie...one of the things I like to do is "drive" through known places via Google Street View. To do something like that, but have it be more immersive and "real" does have its appeal, especially if the world doesn't allow us to visit in real life because of How Things Are™. I'm not down on the idea, I just hope it would be used smartly and fools aren't out there on I-75 driving with this stuff strapped to their heads. And I know they're gonna.

But even those things above might be too limited appeal or "who cares", big picture, for it to ever make a splash.

Because if the world ever does get to normal in my lifetime, I truly want to get out and see more of it than I have thus far.
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chucker
 
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2021-12-13, 20:56

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM View Post
Nobodies really tried to do anything other than gaming seriously with VR, which is why it really never took off with earlier attempts.
I know for a fact that Microsoft did at one point try a lot more, and eventually let go of an entire team.

The killer app ain’t there yet.
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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2021-12-14, 12:25

Maybe the killer app is FaceTime?

3D VR teleconferencing with *gasp* Memojis?

Or maybe the thing has LiDar and all that and can 3D map a room full of humans because there's a new AppleTV that has cameras in it?

And then the porn industry went HEEEEEEEEEEEEYYYY!

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Frank777
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Toronto
 
2022-01-11, 21:30

I personally have little interest right now in the AR/VR craze.

But if Apple actually invents glasses that can adjust to different prescriptions - disrupting the Big Glasses Monopoly - the whole world will once again owe them a debt of gratitude.
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psmith2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2022-01-14, 11:27

Oh no.

Apple AR/VR Headset Potentially Delayed Until 2023 Amid Development Problems

Weird way of spelling "nobody gives a shit", or aren't all that eager to walk around with "Punch Me Now!" gear strapped to their head.

Being serious for a few seconds...

Quote:
The headset is said to be facing issues with overheating...
Seems like I've heard that somewhere before. Unfortunately, we can't blame it on the usual culprit insisting on making them too thin, seeing as how he's gone now.

Quote:
...as well as camera and software challenges.
Odd. I would've imagined those two things being the least of Apple's troubles. They do pretty well with both across various products these days. But I guess they're both being used in new, different ways too.

Quote:
As a result, Apple is now considering delaying the launch of the headset until late 2022 or 2023.
I bet we all manage to live.
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
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2022-01-14, 15:35

It could be delays due to parts manufacturers, rather than Apple’s development when it comes to cameras.

I don’t see any issue with AR, I would love to have a program that could overlay job sites and architecture designs. Untapped market.
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psmith2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2022-01-14, 15:51

Sure. But it'll be used primarily for low-rent dumb shit by the same people who currently use amazing, forward-looking tech for low-rent dumb shit. Let's try to be realistic here.
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Frank777
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Toronto
 
2022-01-14, 15:57

I think the idea that in a decade we'll give up the iPhone to walk around with headsets is weird.

Hey, anything's possible. But I'm in no rush to adopt this idea.

Still think it looks primarily like a consumption device for games and watching live events virtually, but I may lack imagination.
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psmith2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2022-01-14, 16:39

...and chasing little Japanese characters around, virtually banging your favorite TV star (Pat Sajak fans, your day is coming) and being misused/warped-beyond-all-recognition by the influencer/"like, rate my cameltoe in, like, total VR" crowd.

Again, all I ask is that we just be realistic here.
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
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2022-01-15, 00:12

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post
I think the idea that in a decade we'll give up the iPhone to walk around with headsets is weird.

Hey, anything's possible. But I'm in no rush to adopt this idea.

Still think it looks primarily like a consumption device for games and watching live events virtually, but I may lack imagination.
There really isn’t anything special about iPhones, they are just small computers. If there was a smaller device that was useful, and had a better interface I’d be game. At first I thought that might be where Apple would go with the watch, but has just become a thing for fitness freaks (sorry, it’s true) and people who use as a status symbol. Maybe someday it could be used to control an AR system, but battery life and CPU power isn’t there yet.
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