[*Joe*]

I was reading the Ketchup thread and was wondering, how come in the USA you have this High Fructose Corn Syrup in EVERYTHING? Our Ketchup has sugar in, our coke has sugar in etc...
I work in a supermarket and we often get American customers asking for corn syrup to which most of my staff reply "what's that". But you simply can't buy it in the UK, I have never seen it anywhere, I know my company doesn't stock it and we are the 3rd biggest food retailer in the UK.

I have seen it in the USA, so basically the question is, why is it in everything in the USA? Why has it not caught on in Europe? What recipes do you use it for (except pecan pie), and what can you substitute it for?

[GladToBeHere]

What is the source of your sugar? In the US and other places, it may be from sugar cane or sugar beets. But because the US produces so much corn, sugars can be extracted from that, too.

It's not anything diabolical.

[spotcatbug]

Originally Posted by GladToBeHere It's not anything diabolical.

Actually, it is diabolical.

From Wikipedia (although there are many other references, if you Google):

The preference for high-fructose corn syrup over cane sugar among the vast majority of American food and beverage manufacturers is largely due to U.S. import quotas and tariffs on sugar. These tariffs significantly increase the domestic U.S. price for sugar, forcing Americans to pay more than twice the world price for sugar, thus making high-fructose corn syrup an attractive substitute in U.S. markets. For instance, soft drink makers like Coca-Cola use sugar in other nations, but use high-fructose corn syrup in their U.S. products. Large corporations, such as Archer Daniels Midland, lobby for the continuation of these subsidies.[16] Since local and federal laws often put a limit on how much money one particular lobbyist can contribute,[17] ADM's contributions are often given by numerous smaller entities under the authority of ADM. This is commonly called bundling political contributions.

[alcimedes]

Yeah, high fructose corn syrup is a giant screw of the US market, and it's much worse for you than sugar.

[chucker]

Originally Posted by alcimedes Yeah, high fructose corn syrup is a giant screw of the US market, and it's much worse for you than sugar.

That's unproven, though not unlikely. What's clear is that the low cost of HFCS indirectly encourages consumers to eat more of it, due to the related far lower cost of food and beverages that contain it.

Which, of course, is one of the reasons the US has such an alarming and ever-worsening obesity problem.

[GladToBeHere]

The heavy use may be diabolical, but it's just a product. If people would stop eating out of boxes, this wouldn't matter.

[ronmexico]

Its great for dentists

[billybobsky]

Originally Posted by GladToBeHere The heavy use may be diabolical, but it's just a product. If people would stop eating out of boxes, this wouldn't matter.

Actually, no.

People and corporations don't fundamentally act against economic logic -- if it is cheaper they WILL buy it and you can substitute cheaper for easier, consumes less time, etc...

The government heavily subsidizes corn to the detriment of other crops and this subsidy allows for the proliferation of corn syrup and other corn products into other secondary food products.

[Wrao]

I'm more or less anti-corn. But, it is in nearly everything.

[alcimedes]

If you wanted to avoid high fructose corn syrup you'd need to exclude about 80% to 90% of the food on the market that has any kind of additional sweetening.

HFCS is in everything practically.

As for whether or not it's worse or better for you than sugar, my opinion is based off of (as of yet) unpublished research at the University where I worked.

It might not pan out in the long run, but from everything the scientist was seeing it was terrible for you compared to cane sugar. (something about how the body tried to processes it or break it down, I forget at this point.)

[Banana]

In a nutshell: We're eating HCFS because our past and current administrations won't admit defeat to Fidel Castro. :/ Gotta love politics. (Of course this is an oversimplification, as I have no doubt that corn farmers will see to it that subsidies continue to come their way, Castro or no Castro.

That said, I find it scary that HCFS is in everything. This is effectively a monopoly and is ultimately bad for consumers, speaking strictly from economical view of point.

Edit: Didn't we have a thread about HCFS already before? Joe may be interested to read them up...

[Wrao]

Originally Posted by alcimedes It might not pan out in the long run, but from everything the scientist was seeing it was terrible for you compared to cane sugar. (something about how the body tried to processes it or break it down, I forget at this point.)

This is the generally accepted 'truth', but the research is admittedly incomplete in many cases. Although honestly, it would not surprise me one bit if research has been purposefully squelched or put down by the corn industry.

Corn is basically not easily digested by us at all. There is a reason why corn passes through your stool unimpressed by the digestive process. Corn is primarily simple carbohydrates with very low vitamin and mineral content, particularly in its mass produced GMO affected varieties. AT BEST, corn should not be a staple of our diets, but in actuality, corn and corn byproducts are in basically all of our foods.

[drewprops]

It was interesting to hear John McCain tell Iowans that he didn't believe in artificial economic influences on the market, and that he doesn't support ethanol subsidies. It's widely accepted that his stance on corn subsidies cost him a shot as a potential front-runner in those caucuses, but then I think you're likely to agree that caucuses are fundamentally f'ed up sideshows anyway~

Oh, and it sounds like Wrong Robot needs to be posting some results to the poo log...

!!
Anybody got a link to a site that shows you how to live with reduced HFCS intake?
!!

.

[Banana]

Wrao, so the claim of corn being one of most nutritious vegetable is bulk? I recall something claiming corn to have more vitamins and minerals packed in small volume than other vegetable.

[Windswept]

Originally Posted by alcimedes As for whether or not it's worse or better for you than sugar, my opinion is based off of (as of yet) unpublished research at the University where I worked. It might not pan out in the long run, but from everything the scientist was seeing it was terrible for you compared to cane sugar. (something about how the body tried to processes it or break it down, I forget at this point.)

Hmm. This is very interesting. I'd like to know more.

When I'm in the waffle-eating mode, my absolute favorite syrup is Karo Syrup, with the green label. It's thick, and not runny like other pancake type syrups.

Originally Posted by Wrao There is a reason why corn passes through your stool unimpressed by the digestive process.

To alcimedes and Wrao:

Surely corn on the cob is at least good for the fiber it provides, yes?

I seldom feel guilty when I'm eating a fresh fruit or vegetable.

And, as far as *any* item made with high fructose corn syrup, to me the *key* should be that the item is "processed" to begin with.

Processed foods in general should be avoided. So if a person chooses to dine on processed foods, high fructose corn syrup is probably the least of their worries.

[Wrao]

Originally Posted by Banana Wrao, so the claim of corn being one of most nutritious vegetable is bulk? I recall something claiming corn to have more vitamins and minerals packed in small volume than other vegetable.

It does have relatively high levels of some of the B vitamins, and some decent potassium and magnesium, and I think iron as well. But that's about it, which is not taking into account the cheap ass corn that you are likely to be getting at a store.

The Corn industry is very big business, and they have a vested interest in keeping people thinking that corn is, at the least, healthful and nutritious. One of the biggest problems with research in nutritional science is that a lot of the money comes from the companies that stand to lose something from results and research that could hurt them. A lot of resources are put into influencing whatever studies do exist, or otherwise suppressing those that don't exist.

Soy is a similar situation. Soy is generally, pretty worthless, ultra cheap ground cover crop that was never originally intended for human consumption. But it has been re-imaged and packaged as a health food. There is a reason why nearly every major product is able to quickly say "NOW WITH SOY!" and change their package color to some green hue and try and pretend they are suddenly more healthful... because it's cheaper than piss, worthless crud that we probably should not be eating, at the very least, not in such high amounts.

[Windswept]

Originally Posted by Wrao It does have relatively high levels of some of the B vitamins, and some decent potassium and magnesium, and I think iron as well.

Sounds pretty good to me.

[Wrao]

Originally Posted by Windswept Sounds pretty good to me.

I don't see how

Relatively high != high, and alongside all the other negatives that corn possesses, it simply doesn't make sense to eat so much of it. Especially when the vast majority of corn is exceptionally cheap and pathetic variants of the original plant(read: the nutrient content is likely to be less what 'they' say it is)

[709]

There's a documentary making the rounds right now called King Corn (trailer here). Looks interesting.

[Windswept]

Originally Posted by Wrao I don't see how Relatively high != high, and alongside all the other negatives that corn possesses, it simply doesn't make sense to eat so much of it. Especially when the vast majority of corn is exceptionally cheap and pathetic variants of the original plant(read: the nutrient content is likely to be less what 'they' say it is)

Well, I buy my fresh vegetables at a natural/organic foods market.

[k squared]

The Omnivore's Dilemma by Michael Pollan is a good resource as well.

I've tried to cut as much HFCS out of my diet as possible -- and lost about 10 pounds in the process -- but it's in virtually everything.

[Windswept]

Originally Posted by k squared The Omnivore's Dilemma by Michael Pollan is a good resource as well. I've tried to cut as much HFCS out of my diet as possible -- and lost about 10 pounds in the process -- but it's in virtually everything.

I almost never drink pop, especially when it's extra-carbonated out of a can. I've never been a fan of carbonation, so I avoid soft drinks and mostly drink water. I guess that eliminates a fair amount of hfcs, yes?

[Wrao]

Originally Posted by Windswept Well, I buy my fresh vegetables at a natural/organic foods market.

Still doesn't change the fact that corn is unexceptional as far as nutrition goes.

[Wrao]

Originally Posted by 709 There's a documentary making the rounds right now called King Corn (trailer here). Looks interesting.

Sigh... Unfortunately all these hip documentaries are really good at doing is polarizing the issue and getting people angry at each other. But... at least it's being addressed... I guess.

[Chinney]

Originally Posted by Windswept Hmm. This is very interesting. I'd like to know more. When I'm in the waffle-eating mode, my absolute favorite syrup is Karo Syrup, with the green label. It's thick, and not runny like other pancake type syrups.

Why not splurge on some maple syrup?

Actually, I am not sure if "splurge" is the word, as it is actually pretty cheap, at least around here. There is a bit of a glut in the market right now. I imagine that it is much more expensive though, if not unavailable, in many parts of the U.S.

It is good though. Corn syrup cannot compare.

[Bryson]

Coca-Cola with Cane Sugar tastes lots better than Coke with HFCS. Miles better. Go to Mexico now and get some. In a glass bottle.

And no feeling superior in Europe: You have Coke with Beet Sugar - not quite as good as the cane stuff.

[Ryan]

Originally Posted by Bryson Coca-Cola with Cane Sugar tastes lots better than Coke with HFCS. Miles better. Go to Mexico now and get some. In a glass bottle.

No need to go to Mexico even. My local supermarket imports it directly, and I imagine others do the same. I can buy it right off the shelf.

Of course, half the stuff they sell in that store only has directions in Spanish, so who know's if it's even on the up-and-up.

[hiltond]

A very timely discussion; for me a least. My doctor instructed me upon being discharged the other day to cut as much of the HFCS from my diet as possible. I've spent today getting rid of food stuff and shopping for replacements.

Surprising keepers:

• Chocolate - Lindt
• Newman's Own Red Grape Juice (although i has a list of ingredients I wasn't entirely comfortable with)

Surprising tossers:

• Soy Sauce (???)
• Peanut Butter (Althought Kirkland Signature Organic has only two listed ingredients and was kept - dry roasted organic peanuts and salt)
• WEGMANS BREAD CRUMBS???????????????????????????????

[DMBand0026]

HFCS is much worse for the human body than sugar is simply because HFCS is a highly processed form of something else. Yes, sugar is processed as well, but not nearly to the point that HFCS is.

HFCS is like taking sugar and jamming more sugar in it. Corn syrup is already sweet in its natural form but than they take more fructose (a simple sugar) and process more of it in there.

Long story short, HFCS is metabolized differently by the human body than sugar. HFCS causes enormous spikes in blood sugar that the body has difficulty controlling. Furthermore, after the spike in blood sugar, it tends to drop very quickly so as soon as your body starts to compensate for the abnormally high levels of blood sugar, the excess blood sugar is gone. This leads to higher levels of obesity and diabetes. Bad for the body.

HFCS is far worse than the body than sugar. Avoid it if possible, look for all natural foods, check ingredient labels. You'd be surprised what you're putting in your body.

[ironlung]

Ever since I have gone on the 'healthy' path, I have tried avoiding HFCS. Being a scientist, I have been reviewing the current research literature on HFCS. Although I would still like to be skeptical, there does not seem to be any noticeable negative consequences of using HFCS (pubmed). I am still going to avoid it though.