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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2021-06-14, 11:01

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucker View Post
… because the current one is a bit overpowered for what I presume is the target audience.
It's crazy to think that Apple's first-generation processor is "a bit overpowered".

You silly goof!
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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2021-06-14, 11:14

Quote:
Originally Posted by kscherer View Post
It's crazy to think that Apple's first-generation processor is "a bit overpowered".

You silly goof!
I mean, but it is. Especially on the iPad Pro, but IMHO also on most other M1 Macs. Heck, Federighi said they "overshot". That's probably a bit PR hyperbole, but also perhaps a bit true.

(It's also arguably the 9th generation; the Apple A6 was the first design of their own.)
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pscates2.0
Mr. Katan
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-06-14, 11:37

I've noticed that a lot of YouTubers are posting their follow-up, "I've had it for two weeks now..." 24" iMac updates. Most seem to be positive and happy, so that's good.

Apparently that low-end $1,299 model, in addition to half the ports, also has half the fans...just one. The two videos I saw about it ran tests and there's a slight lag (stuff getting warmer sooner?), but most folks probably wouldn't notice. That was never pointed out or noted in any of the unveiling info or even the specs at Apple's site.

I'd just drop the extra $200 and get the extra ports, both fans, all the graphics cores and a few more color options. That $1,299 model has its place, but I'd feel better with the $1,499 version (well, $1,699 by the time I bumped the RAM to 16GB). That $1,299 model just doesn't strike me as having the "legs" the others might (and for someone who keeps their Macs as long as I do, that is a valid issue; if it means another year or two of good use/performance, that matters to me). I do go long stretches between purchases, but I also never "cheap out" and go bargain basement (to where I have to upgrade/replace every 2-3 years because it was under-spec'd/barebones to start with). I rarely get the low-end, entry-level model (of anything...except for iPhones).

Last edited by pscates2.0 : 2021-06-14 at 11:47.
  quote
kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2021-06-14, 11:40

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucker View Post
I mean, but it is. Especially on the iPad Pro, but IMHO also on most other M1 Macs. Heck, Federighi said they "overshot". That's probably a bit PR hyperbole, but also perhaps a bit true.

(It's also arguably the 9th generation; the Apple A6 was the first design of their own.)
Yes, technically. BUT! It is still the first-generation in a Mac. And, yes, they "overshot". It's fast as hell, which leaves me quite hopeful for #2!

Quote:
Originally Posted by pscates2.0 View Post
also has half the fans...just one.
Is there a tear-down or something on that? Seriously, I need to know.

Edit: I just checked with service, and yep! Single fan on the 2-port model, dual fan on the 4-port. Keep that in mind, folks! If you have long-duration workflows, then opt for the 4-port model.

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pscates2.0
Mr. Katan
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-06-14, 11:50

Yep, that was news to me. They aren't going out of their way to point it out. While I was never considering that model anyway, this kinda clinches it. It just feels crippled/less than, and I know me...that would eat at me, 12-18 months from now if I felt anything was slow or otherwise lacking.

I need to find that video that pointed it out. It was a young guy with short, dark hair (I know that really narrows it down). There were two that I saw over the weekend, actually. I'll try to find, and post the link here.

EDIT: Here's the first one I saw. Scrub to about the 3:40 mark.

Last edited by pscates2.0 : 2021-06-14 at 12:01.
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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2021-06-14, 13:40

Yeah, ATP mentioned this as well.

I’m not sure it’s entirely a cost-cutting measure; it might also overall be quieter if that’s a more typical workflow for you.
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
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2021-06-14, 14:15

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucker View Post
I don't think they will.

I wouldn't be surprised if they skip one refresh and go straight from M1 to M3, though, because the current one is a bit overpowered for what I presume is the target audience.
Power wise sure. Won’t stop Apple though, it is much easier to keep everything on the same line from a production standpoint. Not to mention Apple ties many features for Mac OS/iOS to the coprocessors. That could limit how many people can get the new wiz bang stuff.
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Frank777
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Toronto
 
2021-06-14, 16:11

'Slantgate' has arrived, right on cue.
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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2021-06-14, 16:35

Slantgate?

I cannot wait for the media to start shoveling that term around.

A reasonable editor would slam the door shut, though.

And then "Crookedgate" would be substituted.

FYI, the iMac photographed in the MacRumors article is not square on the table, which will skew the appearance of any "crookedness". The photographer is standing neither square to the wall nor the table. My computer here can be arranged on the desk so as to make it appear crooked. Thus, take out a tape measure and measure the distance from each corner to the desktop rather than relying on subpar photography skills.

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Last edited by kscherer : 2021-06-14 at 16:50.
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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2021-06-15, 01:54

Tired: crooked media
Wired: crooked iMac
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pscates2.0
Mr. Katan
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-06-15, 12:05

It's always something.

At least it's not on upside-down.
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PB PM
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2021-06-15, 14:35

All your gates are belong to us!
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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2021-06-15, 15:28

  quote
kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2021-06-18, 12:12

Alright, I'm calling it slant-gate, because that sounds fun!

Today, I noticed that our orange floor model seemed lopsided. Being me—and taking my own advice—I grabbed a tape measure and what do you know?! The orange floor model is off by a full 1/8th of an inch, with the right side 3 3/8 inch off the desk, and the left side 3 1/2 off the desk.

So, I measured the rest of them. The pink model is pretty much spot-on. But, the green is off 1/16 inch in the opposite direction, and my yellow model is off by 3/32. The blue and green are in lazy-susans, so I didn't measure them. But, that still means three of our 6 display models are slanted.

Then, for giggles, we measured the Intel machines and guess what? All of them are off too!

In other words, it appears to be a long-running problem that has always existed, but we have only just noticed. Anyway, there is something to the story, but my money is on it only being reported as a new problem, rather than a problem that has existed since day 1 of the upright iMacs that no one ever noticed.

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Last edited by kscherer : 2021-06-18 at 15:43.
  quote
Frank777
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Toronto
 
2021-06-18, 16:17

Quote:
Originally Posted by kscherer View Post
Alright, I'm calling it slant-gate, because that sounds fun!
I want royalties.
  quote
pscates2.0
Mr. Katan
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-06-19, 07:56

It's weird such a thing can happen, noticeable or not. I assume these things are put together with robots (or at least the pieces, holes, mounting areas, stands, etc. are measured/cut by robots). So is it an input error by the person running these machines? Wrong data entered on this initial run a few months ago? For there to be a wide range of off-ness is interesting.

I honestly don't think I'd grouse/squawk over 1/32", or even 1/16" (I'm not a finish/trim carpenter or fine woodworker, so I've always been able to live with those tolerances for any outdoor structure projects - sheds, fencing, decks, etc. - and basic "can't see it from my house" framing). But, at $1,499+, a noticeable, weird slant of 1/8" or more would just bother be. If they can't get that part right, then I can be bought...maybe knock $200 off (to offset the cost of upgrading to the 16GB RAM that should already be on a $1,500+ machine in 2021) and we'll meet halfway...they can give me an imperfect iMac, but don't bend me over on the BTO RAM. I'll put a business card or two under the base to level it out, unseen, and everyone moves on with their life.
  quote
turtle
Lord of the Rant.
Formerly turtle2472
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Upstate South Carolina
 
2021-06-19, 12:40

Get a VESA mount version and not worry about it.
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Vancouver, BC
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2021-06-19, 14:23

Quote:
Originally Posted by pscates2.0 View Post
It's weird such a thing can happen, noticeable or not. I assume these things are put together with robots (or at least the pieces, holes, mounting areas, stands, etc. are measured/cut by robots). So is it an input error by the person running these machines? Wrong data entered on this initial run a few months ago? For there to be a wide range of off-ness is interesting.

I honestly don't think I'd grouse/squawk over 1/32", or even 1/16" (I'm not a finish/trim carpenter or fine woodworker, so I've always been able to live with those tolerances for any outdoor structure projects - sheds, fencing, decks, etc. - and basic "can't see it from my house" framing). But, at $1,499+, a noticeable, weird slant of 1/8" or more would just bother be. If they can't get that part right, then I can be bought...maybe knock $200 off (to offset the cost of upgrading to the 16GB RAM that should already be on a $1,500+ machine in 2021) and we'll meet halfway...they can give me an imperfect iMac, but don't bend me over on the BTO RAM. I'll put a business card or two under the base to level it out, unseen, and everyone moves on with their life.
Those kinds of little bits off a likely within tolerances for this kind of semi-automated manufacturing. As kscherer points out this is not a new thing, Intel Macs had the same issue, it's just that nobody noticed.
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Frank777
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Join Date: May 2004
Location: Toronto
 
2021-06-21, 22:58

The more I think about it, I want a return to the Duo concept. The current Mac/iOS ecosystem demands it.

I want to walk into an Apple Store, and leave with one large iMac-sized box. Inside, there's a large screen, and a 16" MacBook Pro.

I have the portable for on-the-go computing. I detach the screen from the laptop, and now have an iPad for media consumption. I take the keyboard portion and plug it into the large screen module, and now I have a powerful desktop.

MacBook, iPad and iMac in one box. With one purchase.

Maybe the laptop/iPad portion could be upgradable every 18-24 months by subscription.
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turtle
Lord of the Rant.
Formerly turtle2472
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Upstate South Carolina
 
2021-08-03, 09:11

You can finally buy the keyboard without the iMac now. Still only works with M1 Macs, but if you have a Mini or "dock" a MacBook it could be handy.

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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2021-08-03, 13:33

But not in all colors. Bummer.
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pscates2.0
Mr. Katan
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-08-03, 13:42

And $179 for the big one.

I kinda wondered, back when these things were announced, if they’d do the standalone ones in colors (then proceeded to do the math and realizing what a manufacturing/shipping/stocking PITA that would be). Sounds like they opted to just make it easy and stick with the neutral, goes-with-anything silver…dashing the hopes of anyone looking to do the mix-and-match thing…green keyboard, purple mouse, yellow trackpad, pink iMac.

Probably for the best.
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
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2021-08-03, 19:17

$179 for a $50 membrane keyboard with a thumb scanner. Yup, those are mechanical keyboard prices right there. Save your money folks and get a good keyboard, that's all I can say.
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kieran
Tweeting @kierankelly
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: New York City
 
2021-08-03, 20:44

I was curious if they would do the colors separately as well, but that seems like a ridiculous number of parts to keep on hand for not much benefit.
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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2021-08-04, 11:19

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM View Post
$179 for a $50 membrane keyboard with a thumb scanner. Yup, those are mechanical keyboard prices right there. Save your money folks and get a good keyboard, that's all I can say.
My M1 iMac came with the 10-key, and I use this thing everyday—and *LOVE* it! (Bold, italics, starry things for effect )

Quote:
Originally Posted by kieran View Post
I was curious if they would do the colors separately as well, but that seems like a ridiculous number of parts to keep on hand for not much benefit.
I would have hated that, but it's also going to be a downright PITA when a customer's pink keyboard goes south after the warranty is up. Ain't got no replacement, kiddo! Here's a silver one to screw up your chi. Deal with it.

- AppleNova is the best Mac-users forum on the internet. We are smart, educated, capable, and helpful. We are also loaded with smart-alecks! :)
- Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. (Mat 5:9)
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pscates2.0
Mr. Katan
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-08-18, 20:40

The M1 24" iMacs are now available as refurbs (for the U.S. anyway) at the online Apple Store

Nice!

These things were announced on April 20, so they're hitting refurb just two days shy of four months. But they actually didn't start hitting the street until mid-late May, so that's even more impressive/happy news...right at three months from initial appearance/availability to refurb status!

I think I predicted earlier in this thread that we'd probably see refurbs at some point in September, but I overshot it by a month. I always just count on it taking 4-5 months for them to start appearing, but sometimes they show up a bit sooner/quicker.

For reference, you can get a silver M1 iMac with the upgraded 16GB RAM, 8-core graphics, the four total ports and Magic Keyboard with Touch ID for $1,439. This model/specs, new, is $1,699. That's $260 off for a machine that's still currently available as a "flagship" machine, less then four months old (and three months on the streets).

That's pretty cool, no matter how you slice it.

I see about 13 models in various configurations and colors (silver, blue, pink, green) currently available, ranging from $1,099 (the 8GB RAM, 7-core, two-port model that goes for $1,299 new) up to $1,779 (1TB SSD, 16GB RAM, etc.).

That didn't take long at all.

For those of you not familiar with/aware of the Apple certified refurb offerings, give them a good look. You can save some serious $$$ on some great, current-generation Macs. From Apple's site:

Quote:
What goes into a refurbished Mac:
- All refurbished Mac models are backed by a one-year warranty, have free delivery and returns, and also include:
- Full functional testing, genuine Apple part replacements (if necessary), and a thorough cleaning
- The original Operating System or a more recent version
- All refurbished devices are repackaged in a brand new box with all accessories and cables
And AppleCare can be purchases for these as well, just as with a new Mac. I believe AppleCare on these M1 iMacs is $169.

Unless you're just adamant about buying brand new (why, with all the above in place?), these are the smart way to go. Helps knock a bit of that "Apple tax" off and put some of these things - with upgraded RAM, etc.) within reach of more folks.

Look at it this way: that $260 savings covers the $200 8GB > 16GB upgrade, and leaves you $60 to buy any needed dongle/cable, and you'll still have some $$ in your pocket. If Apple is going to continue charging $200 for 8GB RAM, then buy your iMac this way and get ahead of that curve a little.

Last edited by pscates2.0 : 2021-08-18 at 20:57.
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Frank777
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Toronto
 
2021-08-18, 20:53

Yes, they're on the Canadian Refurb store as well.

A lot of them seem to have a 256GB SSD. This is where the no-more-upgrades thing is going to hurt.
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pscates2.0
Mr. Katan
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-08-18, 21:01

Yeah, I know that's low for a lot of folks (512GB is a minimum for many), but for those of us who don't have/create a ton of stuff, 256GB is just sweet.

For context (for me): I owned an iMac with a 320GB hard drive for 11+ years and I never had more than about 115GB used on it (and that was when I was using iMovie a bit). I currently have a 256GB 13" MacBook Pro and am currently using 107GB, with plenty of open space.

I'm always more concerned about the RAM (minimum of 16GB, going forward) than storage, so I'm happy to see quite a few of that 16/256 configuration.

That silver $1,439 model is so tempting... Now that I know I can get that configuration/color I'd want for under $1,500, that's very doable and definitely points me in a possible direction. Still wanna see how these new 14" models shake out, but I know, new, they're gonna be $1,799+, so...
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PB PM
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2021-08-18, 21:40

The biggest downside to the 256GB isn’t so much the space, as the much lower endurance of small SSDs. Then again someone who doesn’t turn over all the storage space is highly unlikely to hit the endurance limit, so it could be okay. Of course even if you don’t fill the drive often, Mac OS is very generous with virtual memory use, so someone who opts for 8GB of RAM could be in for a world of hurt.
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pscates2.0
Mr. Katan
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2021-08-18, 22:01

At this point, 2021 and beyond, no way I’d go less than 16GB RAM. I don’t see me springing for 32GB anytime soon - not at Apple’s prices - but 16GB is twice what I’ve ever had.

I miss the days of going to Crucial or other sites, looking up what you needed and ordering it. I’ve put RAM in so many 1999-2011ish Macs - friends, family, co-workers, myself - it’s not even funny. I got good and fast, had a little screwdriver kit just for the job (to open any Mac), and even did 5-6 hard drives too.

Now everything’s welded shut. I get to live the rest of my life like a…sorry, I was channeling Goodfellas.
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