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What could a 25th Anniversary iMac look like?


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What could a 25th Anniversary iMac look like?
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kscherer
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Join Date: Aug 2004
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2023-09-06, 17:42

It's called "Defraggerbugger"
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PB PM
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2023-09-06, 23:24

Can we have an anniversary addition of these? I miss these... I mean they only happened at least once a day in Mac OS Classic. I know most of you are Mac OSX+ junkies, and never saw these.





Last edited by PB PM : 2023-09-06 at 23:35.
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chucker
 
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2023-09-07, 03:32

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kickaha View Post
A month ago, I had my stepfather ask where the hell Apple hid the disk defragger, so... yeah.

That was an interesting conversation. He simply could NOT believe that it was not necessary.
So, the short version is: yep, you're right. He's doing it as a cargo cult, not because it makes sense. Windows still has a defrag UI, but it's somewhat hidden, and it's mostly a mock at this point. Like, on SSDs, there's not much of a point. Given the wording, it might actually run TRIM instead. Even Microsoft seems to be thinking, "why do we have a UI for this at all any more?". And, of course, HFS+ had adaptive hot file clustering, essentially a "defrag frequently used files" mechanism.

But… APFS defaults to not having defragmentation on. Again, this doesn't really matter on SSDs, but the answer seems to be more complicated for HDDs.
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kscherer
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2023-09-07, 10:41

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM View Post
Can we have an anniversary addition of these? I miss these... I mean they only happened at least once a day in Mac OS Classic. I know most of you are Mac OSX+ junkies, and never saw these.






Oh, I remember those!
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Capella
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2023-09-12, 11:59

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM View Post
Can we have an anniversary addition of these? I miss these... I mean they only happened at least once a day in Mac OS Classic. I know most of you are Mac OSX+ junkies, and never saw these.




Whew, those are nostalgia!
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Kickaha
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2023-09-13, 20:08

Glancing over at my bookshelf with the OpenDoc books, I can smell the box StuffIT came in.
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kscherer
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2023-10-23, 12:42

It looks like the plot is thickening for a release event this year (Mon/Tue next week).

Some are saying yes, some are saying no. The new iMac (whatever it is) has been rumored for well over a year, and this might be the best guarded release secret Apple has had for years.

No one seems to know for sure.

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chucker
 
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2023-10-23, 12:58

Very confusing rumors.

I wonder if the answer is: they're not getting an M3 with the new process node. But they are getting a process upgrade. But since most Macs are already on the M2 generation, that would come down to "the iMac gets an upgrade to the M2, a year and a half after the M2 has come out". Which doesn't warrant an event.

So what if we are getting an M3, but it's based off the M2's process node. It would be less efficient, and might be too large to produce once you get into the high end (M3 Max, M3 Ultra), but it might be doable for the M3 and M3 Pro. And it would offer some new stuff: we'd be going from A15 to A17 cores, so the p-cores would be 27% faster assuming a similar clock increase to A15 to A17, or 7% faster even if the clock doesn't change at all compared to M2. The e-cores go way up, so battery life should improve, and the p-cores indirectly get faster because they get freed up more. The GPU would go up 21%, and it would add some new features such as basic raytracing support.

If they don't do that, the other option would be an Intel-like "refresh" where they stick to the current cores, but clock them a bit higher. I don't really think Apple is into that, though. They tend to design their hardware in tandem; suddenly generating more heat while leaving the chassis the same wouldn't work well (see late Intel MacBooks and iMacs, or most infamously, the 2013 Mac Pro), and I bet they don't want to redesign the iMac again after two and a half years.

So my money is currently on the first: they can't go "fully M3" because TSMC can't deliver for a while, but they can produce the same cores on the old process, perhaps run them at a slightly slower clock, and perhaps only offer lower-end models.
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Frank777
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2023-10-23, 13:25

This is the first fall Mac event in a decade where I really don't care.

My fully-outfitted 2017 is performing very nicely with Ventura. And amid world wars and looming economic catastrophes, there are more important things to worry about than a new Mac. YMMV.

It is weird they took this long to move the iMac to an M2 or pseudo-M3. If the rumoured 32-inch shows up next year with M3 and Thunderbolt 5, and things are going okay business-wise, I might bite.
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psmith2.0
Mr. Anderson
 
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2023-10-23, 13:49

The MacRumors article about this mentions next Monday or Tuesday (30th or 31st). Aren’t they cutting it close for the invites and stuff. Or do people even come to these things anymore, if they’re all done vide stylized, highly-produced videos?!

Man, they’re getting hosed on the new HQ. They finally get it built and nobody wants to come back to work after getting a year of “work from home in your underwear and eat fried chicken all day” fun that COVID brought.

And if they don’t go back to live media events, that underground, Steve Jobs thester(?) is just going unused.

Or woukd they do a half-in-half, video presentation streamed online, but still invite the Grubers and others to show up for hands on demos?

Buying a cross-country plane ticket, Philadelphia to Cupertino, six days out is gonna be some money!

If an event next week, and with some actual media on hand, is a thing, there will have to be an official invitation graphic soon. One we can all parse for clues.

“iBet you won’t want to miss this!”

Or

“That thing you thought would never happen, after two-plus years?, it’s happening!”

Or

“Say goodbye to M1, finally.”

If no M3, what the gel have they been doing all this time? Did they just realize the iMac lineup was neglected as hell and they’re just gonna toss the M2 into the exact same body/designs? Not being an iPhone or notebook, they probably hint give a rip. Look at the mini and Mac Pro.

Some new colors, maybe?

I think a muted, dusky, pastel version of the current ones might look nice. I’ve never been able to get down with these bold, Crayola hues ofvthe current 24” iMacs, although you only see that from the back. The chin, stand are already the lighter, paler version of the color. A return to rose gold would be nice. Only their prettiest color ever, and I wish I’d gotten my SE in that.
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Frank777
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2023-10-23, 13:54

If they don't have a larger-screen version to offer, I think they would just do a press release update.

Why would they need an in-person event to spec bump the iMac?
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drewprops
Space Pirate
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2023-10-23, 22:29

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kickaha View Post
Glancing over at my bookshelf with the OpenDoc books, I can smell the box StuffIT came in.
The poetry of this nostalgia bomb was not lost on me.

Also: I truly don't care about new Macs at this moment.

Good wishes to those who are!!! <3

...

Steve Jobs ate my cat's watermelon.
Captain Drew on Twitter
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chucker
 
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2023-10-24, 03:02

Quote:
Originally Posted by psmith2.0 View Post
The MacRumors article about this mentions next Monday or Tuesday (30th or 31st). Aren’t they cutting it close for the invites and stuff. Or do people even come to these things anymore, if they’re all done vide stylized, highly-produced videos?!
Some media events still come with invites for hands-on and off-the-record interviews, but some no longer do.

If it's mostly speed bump updates, I don't think they'll bother. It costs them more money having staff available, and it annoys press if they need to fly out over not much at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by psmith2.0 View Post
Man, they’re getting hosed on the new HQ. They finally get it built and nobody wants to come back to work after getting a year of “work from home in your underwear and eat fried chicken all day” fun that COVID brought.

And if they don’t go back to live media events, that underground, Steve Jobs thester(?) is just going unused.
Yeah, the Apple Park thing really took an odd turn with COVID.

Quote:
Originally Posted by psmith2.0 View Post
Or woukd they do a half-in-half, video presentation streamed online, but still invite the Grubers and others to show up for hands on demos?
They do this when they have a lot to show. Sometimes also on the east coast (Gruber sometimes needs to fly to Cali, but sometimes they invite him to a special house they have in NYC).
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psmith2.0
Mr. Anderson
 
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2023-10-24, 08:10

For all we know, Gruber’s been using one of these new iMacs for a few weeks, in secret, and his review/write-up hits the afternoon following the event. I think that’s happened before as well.

I’m not referencing Gruber because I’m such a huge fan, he’s just the only one of these Internet-based, Apple-centric media types I consistently know by name and who often makes a big thing of it (that little talk show type format he holds after WWDC keynotes, etc. He seems to be Apple’s go-to guy. I think they both benefit from their connection/relationship.
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Matsu
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2023-10-24, 08:58

I don't know what they'll do. I think a 27" iMac makes sense, because they have 27" standalone screens, and they can probably offer such an iMac at a price that makes it a comparative bargain compared to the 27" Studio Display. The display is very nearly a AIO computer anyway when you factor the A13, camera, speakers, I/O and power-supply/delivery. Rip and replace with an M series SOC and a SSD and you've got an iMac that probably doesn't cost too much more to make than their standalone display. Part of me has always believed that Apple's display and headless pricing have always been positioned to make the iMacs appear as comparative bargains.

That said, if Apple kept the 24" screen and made a "Surface-y" fusion of MacOS and touch capability, with a really slick stand-easel thingy, 24" would be more than enough. It's another thing where they already have most/all the parts - OS support, silicon, retina displays, Apple pencils... I could see it, chin becomes something of a wrist/forearm rest, some kind of folding, weighted stand/hinge just lets it hunker down and forward to a really low angle... A new app or two either home grown or for 3rd party partners...

.........................................
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709
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2023-10-24, 11:45

Spoookkyyy!!!

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Frank777
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2023-10-24, 11:49

Buying a Halloween-themed Mac seems like asking for 5 years of trouble.

But since 'Scary Fast' clearly references speed, we can rule out M2 or M2+ upgrades.

The M3 iMac is ready.
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kscherer
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2023-10-24, 11:53

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post
The M3 iMac is ready.
I would bet my marbles that M3 Pro is a certainty, and M3 Max is a 10% possibility in a 32" Pro model.

The iMac is about to fill a lot of holes!

- AppleNova is the best Mac-users forum on the internet. We are smart, educated, capable, and helpful. We are also loaded with smart-alecks! :)
- Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. (Mat 5:9)
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turtle
Lord of the Rant.
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2023-10-24, 12:48

Maybe it just means Finder will finally work right!
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chucker
 
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2023-10-24, 13:08

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matsu View Post
a price that makes it a comparative bargain compared to the 27" Studio Display.
Anything's a bargain compared to that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Matsu View Post
That said, if Apple kept the 24" screen and made a "Surface-y" fusion of MacOS and touch capability, with a really slick stand-easel thingy,
Well, Microsoft tried it, and their OS at least has some resemblance of touch support. Seems barely enough people buy it to warrant keeping it around in the line-up at all.

I don't see it. The easel form factor strikes me as 1990s' "wouldn't it be cool if we added X to a device" gadgetry. Apple's philosophy since the Ive era and beyond has been to remove mechanical complexity from hardware, not add to it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post
But since 'Scary Fast' clearly references speed, we can rule out M2 or M2+ upgrades.
It's wild how rumors have been all over the place. Maybe Apple has gotten better at placing honeypots.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post
The M3 iMac is ready.
Or, this isn't about the iMac at all, but MBPs. But that seems premature? Why update those just nine months later?
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709
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2023-10-24, 13:36

11" M3 MacBook Air or bust.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank777 View Post
Buying a Halloween-themed Mac seems like asking for 5 years of trouble.
Introduced on Devil's Night no less! 😈 Midnight Blue MBP confirmed?
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psmith2.0
Mr. Anderson
 
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2023-10-24, 14:26

MacRumors is saying M3-based Macbook pros are the focus of the event. Surely the iMac will get some sort of attention, after 2.5 years?!? Even if “only” M2 so you’ve got 24GB RAM (or anything higher than 16) options. If next weeks comes and goes and the iMac is left untouched, that’s Apple’s way of saying “it’s done, fellas…say goodbye and let it go. We killed the iPod and small, affordable phones…we’ll sure as shit take a rifle to the iMac. It had its place, it had its run. Everything has an end.”

With the AS stuff behaving better re: heat, battery life, etc., might they bring some of those smaller notebooks (11”-12”) where they’d run a bit better and not seem so “less-than” performance-wise? I loved that 12” MacBook, but it seemed to be a lot about, “you wanted small, but it ain’t gonna be the most capable notebook goin’…”.

But could it, now? Was it just a few years too early for its time?
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psmith2.0
Mr. Anderson
 
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2023-10-24, 15:05

"Scary fast", besides the obvious Halloween nod, would only make sense as a reference to speed/power, which goes right with the MacBook Pro lineup (over the MacBook Air, iMac and whatever else).

What about the Mac Studio? It's still on M1 so maybe it gets a tweak/update as well. It's been a while since its introduction. March 2022, 18+ months ago.

Or was it just a one-off, one-time novelty of some sort, to plug that hole before the Mac Pro migrated to AS?

I've noted refurbs for the original Mac Studio going for ~$1,550, and that's with the 10-core CPU, 24-core GPU, 32GB RAM(!) and 500GB SSD. That's not bad at all, especially if you already have a keyboard, mouse and a monitor you like. I've even given a bit of thought to it. I have access to a 24" display, mine for the asking, and then I'd just need to fork over for a modern Apple Magic Mouse/Keyboard (the recharging kind, so my days of constantly buying/keeping AA batteries around can finally end).

Lots of cool, good stuff out there, new and otherwise. A good time to be a Mac user.

And next week could be very cool/interesting. I'll have to set my trick-or-treating aside to read all the articles, specs, etc.

Now what's the story re: the M1 vs. M2 vs. M3. I've heard a lot of people kinda put down the M2, saying it wasn't truly a "next-gen" successor to the M1, for reasons I probably don't understand/recognize. Is the M3 what a lot of people were/are waiting on, bypassing the M2 altogether?
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PB PM
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2023-10-24, 15:06

The iMac is dead, long live the iMac!

Notebooks updated makes sense, they usually get the new guts first since they are the big sellers.
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psmith2.0
Mr. Anderson
 
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2023-10-24, 15:19

Oh, sure. And it's a notebook kinda world of late, so definitely makes sense. That means, come spring-ish, the MacBook Air will get the M3, along with whatever else by mid-summer. They usually roll them out to the lineup, at least with the M1 to M2 thing. I assume they'll do so on the M3.

Yeah, I'm truly starting to think - and accept - that the iMac may be going away. 25 good long years, symbolizing the company well before the iPod and iPhones came to do so. It'll be said, as someone who owned a few and always loved the lineup/idea. I owned all major iterations: the jellybean, the sunflower and the flat display on a stand, so I was always a fan of the model.

Oh well.
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chucker
 
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2023-10-24, 15:42

Quote:
Originally Posted by psmith2.0 View Post
“it’s done, fellas…say goodbye and let it go. We killed the iPod and small, affordable phones…we’ll sure as shit take a rifle to the iMac. It had its place, it had its run. Everything has an end.”
Well… twenty-five years is quite a lot for a computer line. Maybe it is indeed time to move on.

Quote:
Originally Posted by psmith2.0 View Post
With the AS stuff behaving better re: heat, battery life, etc., might they bring some of those smaller notebooks (11”-12”) where they’d run a bit better and not seem so “less-than” performance-wise? I loved that 12” MacBook, but it seemed to be a lot about, “you wanted small, but it ain’t gonna be the most capable notebook goin’…”.

But could it, now? Was it just a few years too early for its time?
Yes, it would work better with M3 (say) than with Intel's ill-fated Core M. Apple is better at the performance per watt game. But… I think they've resisted it because they'd have trouble positioning it next to the Air. For a start, isn't the "Air" supposed to be the light one? And second, people think smaller laptops should be cheaper. So then they'd have to make it $699, and that means they'd have to gimp it to justify it internally. Or they could make it the luxury option at $1699 or something, like the original Air used to be — not the cheapest, but the lightest. But who would buy that?

I think that was also the big problem with the 2015 MacBook. Was it supposed to eventually replace the Air? Because next to it, it's awkward, and by the time the Air eventually got a Retina Display, the 12-inch was just silly, and was quickly discontinued.

Quote:
Originally Posted by psmith2.0 View Post
What about the Mac Studio? It's still on M1
Nope. It's on M2 Max/Ultra.

Quote:
Originally Posted by psmith2.0 View Post
Now what's the story re: the M1 vs. M2 vs. M3. I've heard a lot of people kinda put down the M2, saying it wasn't truly a "next-gen" successor to the M1, for reasons I probably don't understand/recognize. Is the M3 what a lot of people were/are waiting on, bypassing the M2 altogether?
I think people are expecting too much from iterative improvements. Nothing will be quite as big as PowerPC to Intel was, or Intel to ARM has been. So no, M1 to M2 won't be a big leap. That's OK.

M2 to M3 will likely be a bigger jump, if all the stars are aligned: there's a new process node, meaning they have more thermal budget to spend, and they can skip an entire generation — the A17 is already out, and the M2 is based on the A15. So you get the benefits of two years, meaning, by my calculations, an improvement on p-cores of roughly 27-30%. Plus some other goodies like raytracing support on the GPU. Again, if everything goes right (for example, TSMC can deliver), this should be a pretty nice boost.
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psmith2.0
Mr. Anderson
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2023-10-24, 15:51

Ah, I see. Thanks. That's exactly the sort of stuff I didn't know.

I just read in all kinda of places that the M2 wasn't "all that". It obviously is, or it wouldn't be out there, being sold and used.

Haha. I forgot all about the Mac studio being upgraded.

See? I don't follow this stuff as I once did. I never would've made that mistake 10-12 years ago.

I'm about as up on/familiar with Apple's lineup as I am Dell's. I used to know specs/features/prices like the back of my hand, but that's been ages ago, back in the Steve days when the lineup with a little more streamlined and reined-in. I have to go to the website now to see what's available, how it's tiered/priced, etc. (especially the crazy, overlapping mess that is the notebook lineup).
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chucker
 
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2023-10-24, 15:56

Quote:
Originally Posted by psmith2.0 View Post
I'm about as up on/familiar with Apple's lineup as I am Dell's.
That's not nothing. Almost nobody understands Dell's line-up!
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kscherer
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2023-10-24, 17:27

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucker View Post
That's not nothing. Almost nobody understands Dell's line-up!
Dell has a lineup? I thought they just had a website with a bunch of pictures, buttons, and circular hyperlinks!

Alos, let's say the MacBook Pro does get an upgrade just 9 months later. Could that possibly hint to the idea that Apple is trying to get M-series silicon onto an annual release cycle?

- AppleNova is the best Mac-users forum on the internet. We are smart, educated, capable, and helpful. We are also loaded with smart-alecks! :)
- Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God. (Mat 5:9)
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chucker
 
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2023-10-24, 17:36

Quote:
Originally Posted by kscherer View Post
Alos, let's say the MacBook Pro does get an upgrade just 9 months later. Could that possibly hint to the idea that Apple is trying to get M-series silicon onto an annual release cycle?
Maybe, but the A*X never were. I figured they were shooting more for like 18 months.
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