[Messiahtosh]

From http://www.t3.co.uk/news/default.asp...ectio nid=753

Is it a flash-based iPod? Or is it the iPhone? Apple appears to be up to something that involves flash memory. According to a report on Bloomberg it's done a deal with Toshiba's memory division, and Toshiba will start supplying Apple with flash memory from January onwards. So what's the flash for? The most obvious explanation is the rumour that we reported on a couple of weeks ago, that Apple is planning to introduce a solid-state iPod. While Apple practically owns the hard drive-based sector of the personal digital audio market, there's still a large demand for cheaper flash-based players that Apple has yet to touch. A flash-based iPod would mean that Apple has an iPod for almost everyone. However... Could Apple be working on the much-rumoured iPhone? It's a rumour that refuses to go away and it's just surfaced again courtesy of a chap called Tony Ricciardi who runs a site called TreoMac. A Macintosh consultant, he tells a story of a recent encounter with a Motorola employee who claimed that a prototype Apple-branded phone has been doing the rounds within Motorola, and that iTunes and iPhoto functionality would factor into it. Apocryphal? Possibly. Exciting? Definitely, as long as it's taken with a small pinch of salt. One way or another we can expect to learn the truth come MacWorld.

I've been thinking about this too, considering the Apple/Motorola announcement earlier in the year; about the upcoming compatability with Mot phones next year.

Maybe Apple realizes that Phones are the next place to take music to. And if they are or arent, why not be there now, so that all bases are covered? That's probably what this is about, making sure they will end up where the market ends up.

I believe an iPod flash and an iPod phone could exist. One product for the low end, completing the iPod market. And the iPod phone for a new market, where phones and music devices merge, if people so desire it, why not offer it? In conjunction with MOT, sort of like the HP/Apple deal, it just might work.

[torifile]

An iPod phone? I dunno. It just doesn't seem like a logical extension to me. The iPod had always been about the music. Now it's got the photo thing, so I could be wrong. Personally, I still think the iPod photo is stupid. It muddies the waters a little. But since it is outside of Apple's MO, it shows they're listening to the market.

I suppose it's possible, esp. given the Mot. deal you mentioned. The timing would be right too, in terms of the announcement. We'll see...

[psmith2.0]

Originally Posted by torifile Personally, I still think the iPod photo is stupid. It muddies the waters a little.

Personally, I never looked at it that way at all. From the very first moment I saw it - when Jobs unveiled it at that Cupertino campus event - I thought "iPod...that's a pretty open-ended name...hmmm".

It's first, initial focus WAS music. But nowhere was it ever written that it was always going to be that. I think the iPod photo thing is great (I wanted it, imagined it and talked about it for at least two or so years). And Jobs' reasoning for it was dead-on: digital cameras are EVERYWHERE now, and it just makes sense. Think of the world business traveler, toting all his music AND all his family and friend photos with him, able to view them whenever. Plus, the TV-viewing option beats the hell out of a clunky, loud slide projector and setting up one of those screens (or thumbtacking a white sheet to a wall).



There ain't anything wrong with the iPod photo. For those who don't need it, just don't buy it. But I'll bet within 18 months, the entire iPod line (the full-size white models) will be color and have this capability...it's only going to get MORE popular, the photo capabilities! I don't see digital cameras suddenly NOT selling...or getting better and cheaper, you know?

Apple timed it perfectly, IMO.

With its notes, address book and other Apple features, it's already so much more than "just a music player". And all those third-party software (and hardware) products have made it everything from a bartending guide to a voice note taker!

If it had been called the iRock, iSong or whatever, all these other things would seem odd to me, or somehow "breaking the original purpose and intent". But, to me, "iPod" just sounded like "oh, they've got more planned for this little guy, I'll bet...why, a 'pod' can be anything!"



iPod is a great name, limiting it to NOTHING.

It might even give you a kiss in a couple of years.

[Kickaha]

iTMS ringtones, maybe?

[BuonRotto]

It would be amusing to see something like "the Motorola iPhone by Apple."

Gah, if you try to extrapolate what Apple could be doing by the flash memory info/rumor alone, the possibilities are almost endless. Neither iPod micro nor iPhone could be in the works, could be another animal altogether.

Still waiting for an iPet too....

[TednDi]

makes great sense to me. Moto now makes the smartphone with crappy windows software. If you could get an ives design, gsm phone, bluetooth, and the pda/ itunes/iphoto/ical/and addressbook all in one package and synching with decent battery life then you have a killer product. People switch phones every 2years or less that is a ton of devices all priced in the 200-800 range. You would then get a ton of switching bang for the buck and alot of mainstream adoption of the apple philosophy.

[DMBand0026]

A Moto/Apple phone would be wonderful. I've always liked Motorola's phones and getting the Apple touch would just make them that much better.

[psmith2.0]

How would this work, in terms of your service provider and so forth? Would everyone - Cingular, AT&T, Sprint, Verizon, etc. - all work with this? I don't understand these deeper, inner workings of such things...I'm but a simple cave man.

But seriously, is your service ever - in any way - tied in to your phone? I currently have a little Samsung flip phone (x427) with a nice, perfect-for-my-needs Cingular plan. IF this phone came to be, would I be able to just buy this phone, have Cingular input the number or "register" it in some way, and continue on as before?

At first, this rumor/talk held no appeal for me. But hell...they do everything else so nicely, that the idea of it kinda has a nice ring to it (uh...heehee).

Bluetooth, e-mail access, some tunes, etc. all on something that I'm carrying with me all the time anyway...

I can dig it.

Ooh...question: would there be a way to make it "wireless", in that simply walking into a Wi-fi enabled coffee bar or city park, I could open it up and simply retrieve any e-mail, without having to dial out, have it charge minutes, have to pay for any extra e-mail/media service, etc.

Just a tiny AirPort card in there somewhere, with my .Mac e-mail settings entered via Bluetooth or whatever. Anytime I'm in a wireless hotspot...BAM! E-mail...

Take a phone, an AirPort Card, an iPod photo, Mail/.Mac and put it all into a blender, slap some Ive coolness on it, sell it for a price I can actually afford, etc. and I believe I'd be there.

[applenut]

pscates,

I get confused too but I think they all use different formats. Well, its either CDMA or GSM. I think you can switch services between companies that support the format of your phone. So, Verizon and Sprint use CDMA and you can switch between them I believe but not T-Mobile who uses GSM.

At least that's my understanding.

I think a cell phone would be a bad idea. Doesn't seem like a market they could take over or even make good money out of. People get new phones when they can get them for cheap or free with a service plan it seems

[Messiahtosh]

It would not be Apple taking over the market of cell phones, it would be Apple & Motorola. With Motorola as their backer, they'd slide into the market really easily.

[psmith2.0]

Yeah, just a partnership...with Motorola handling the heavy-lifting of the phone/communications end, while Apple provided the software, interface, goodies and outward design and vibe.

An Apple shell, wrapped around a Motorola core, if you will.



And seriously...like digital cameras, cell phones are only getting more popular and widespread (the mere fact that I have one speaks volumes...trust me).

I'm not saying I think it'll be done, or that I'm even holding my breath or seriously desiring one. I'm just saying it could be done, and probably done pretty well, considering the two players involved. That's all.

I will go on record to say I don't think this rumor/talk amounts to much, however. Just something kinda neat to think about on a rainy day...

[SKMDC]

Edgar Bronfman (general bonehead, and new chairman of warner) says as much.
read about it here
Just remember that this is a guy who fucks up everything he touches.
King of mediocrity.

[futuretheory]

Not saying that a phone is where apple should be, but have you noticed that every phone out there really sucks? I'd love to see an Apple take. Maybe this is that Flash storage iPod we keep hearing about, only it's in a phone.

I can see the marketing now like the iMac, new motorola iPhone from the designers of the iPod.....

[Jim S.]

The $99 flash-based iPod to rake in the low-end market makes a lot of sense and seems likely. If Apple wanted to do a high-end phone, why would it use flash instead of a small hard drive? If it is intended to be a music player, PDA, photo viewer, etc. I would think it would need more storage space.

[Messiahtosh]

Well, hard drives are more likely to break in a drop, and lord knows the phones take a lot of nasty falls...in comparisson to my iPod anyway. I'm never worried when my phone drops though, it's pretty indestructable.

Anyway, like I said before too, Apple could do both at once. A low end flash-based iPod and the completely different market-iPod phone.

[torifile]

Originally Posted by Jim S. The $99 flash-based iPod to rake in the low-end market makes a lot of sense and seems likely. If Apple wanted to do a high-end phone, why would it use flash instead of a small hard drive? If it is intended to be a music player, PDA, photo viewer, etc. I would think it would need more storage space.

Flash is more sensible because it is MUCH smaller, more durable and provides better battery life. I don't necessarily buy it (the rumor, that is) but it does make a little sense.

[Frank777]

Originally Posted by pscates2.0 ...sell it for a price I can actually afford...

You set your hopes way too high. This is still Apple we're talking about.

[Mac+]

Well if this Apple/Mot iPod/phone rumour does eventuate into reality it will be enough to seriously tempt me to finally join the mobile (cellular) phone brigade.

... maybe Luca too?

[scratt]

When compared to Nokia and Sony the Motorola offerings to date have pretty much sucked as phones in terms of usability.

I moved from Motorola to Nokia as I found it's user interface and general strategy with it's UIs to be almost Applesque in terms of usability.

Motorola really needs a lift IMO in terms of it's phones.

I am not sure I believe this rumour. I mean if Motorola was bank rolling this in terms of the phone market and Apple is producing the UI wouldn't it be Motorola who were buying into the Flash technology and not Apple?

Perhaps Apple is buying into it for the solid state iPod and this in turn will enable them to port their UI to motorola phones... Does anyone know if motorola are buying into the same technology? Now that would be interesting...

If it is true it's great.
But if not I am still sure we will see something along the solid state iPod lines shortly...

[I Thrash Therefore I Am]

Actually, I used to think motorola had good designs but I agree the user interface was all wrong. This changed when a family member got the new (well not so new now) V600. Its beautiful. The screen is perfect, it has a speakerphone, the picture quality is seamless even when transferred to a computer (it actually SENT the photo at about 5"x5"), and it gets amazing reception and battery life. Of course their new smart phone (running windows, no wonder) just got pulled off shelves to be revised.

I like the new A630 as well, considering it has the flip open big screen and qwerty board.

I think an apple/motorola phone would be perfect. Plain and simple. Beautiful design, all in one capability(to an extent), great reception, amazing camera, synching with iCal and iLife. iTunesMS could even offer downloadable ringtones, screensavers, and java games. But of course by that time I'd hope the thing would atleast be able to have mp3 ringtones. I also hope it would be a flip or slider phone (or something like motos A630), or atleast something like it. I think the only real competition motorola has is sony ericsson, or higher end nokias (most of which never get released in the US). Actually, that pretty much goes with apple and sony laptops too.

My NEC 525 phone is still more expensive than most phones and its crap. The camera can't even take a reasonably good picture. At all. And since I'm now devoid of a digi cam, that camera has to last me a while. The phone also stalls a lot too, doesn't get that great of reception, is big, never tells me when I have a new voicemail, and messes up when I'm making calls a lot. </bitching and moaning>

I say if this does happen, it'll run at first about $300-400, considering thats what most high-end motorola's run at when just released. Then of course a few months later it'll be ~ $100 with a new plan.

Originally Posted by scratt When compared to Nokia and Sony the Motorola offerings to date have pretty much sucked as phones in terms of usability. I moved from Motorola to Nokia as I found it's user interface and general strategy with it's UIs to be almost Applesque in terms of usability. Motorola really needs a lift IMO in terms of it's phones. I am not sure I believe this rumour. I mean if Motorola was bank rolling this in terms of the phone market and Apple is producing the UI wouldn't it be Motorola who were buying into the Flash technology and not Apple? Perhaps Apple is buying into it for the solid state iPod and this in turn will enable them to port their UI to motorola phones... Does anyone know if motorola are buying into the same technology? Now that would be interesting... If it is true it's great. But if not I am still sure we will see something along the solid state iPod lines shortly...

[Brad]

Originally Posted by Jim S. The $99 flash-based iPod to rake in the low-end market makes a lot of sense and seems likely.

But when has Apple ever gone for the low-end market? Apple lives for profit margins, not gross revenue. An appeal like this to the low-end market would signify a major change in Apple's structure. I don't think it's there yet or will be any time soon.

Originally Posted by torifile Flash is more sensible because it is MUCH smaller

Are you sure? I thought the iPod's microdrive was essentially the same size as one of those little square flash cards...

[Jim S.]

Brad, you may enjoy this old interview with Steve Jobs. Please note his comments on Apple's market share in Part II. I think that he wants to own the digital music business and he understands the low-end is important.

http://www.geocities.com/franktau/interviewpart1.html

[Jim S.]

Impractical to put a hard drive in a phone?

http://www.samsung.com/PressCenter/P...907_0000069353

[Brad]

Originally Posted by Jim S. http://www.geocities.com/franktau/interviewpart1.html

Yikes. I don't have time to read all of that. Quick summary?

One BIG dose of irony for you, though: that interview was done while Steve Jobs was running NeXT. NeXT made some of the world's most expensive personal computers. And you say somewhere in there he's talking about wanting to appeal to low-end customers? Heheh.

[HOM]

Ahhhh, a thread I can get into.

First to clear up some stuff...

If the iPhone were to be released it would have to be a GSM phone. Being GSM would allow for maximum interoperability between carriers. In the US it would have to support the 850 & 1900 MHz bands while supporting the 900 & 1800 bands in the RoW. Now, which major mobile phone manufacturer is the only one that has moved almost exclusively to quad-band phones? That's right, Moto.

That being said, if you have an American GSM provider (Cingular/ATTW or T-Mobile) and the iPhone supports 850 (Cingular) and 1900 (T-Mobile) and assuming the iPhone is SIM unlocked you could use it with your existing account.

Second there are some major issues with an iPhone concept...

Namely, ringtones. If the iPhone supports iTMS songs as ringtones and syncs with iTunes as wells as an iPod does, no carrier is going to carry the phone. Ringtones are where the profits come from for these companies and they just don't want a device that is easier to get ringtones from a third party. They accept phones that transfer files via BT, IR, or USB but only because the amount of people that can actually use their phones for that is slim. iTunes integration = no carrier support. Which is not the end of the world, but it means that the iPhone is going to be ungodly expensive when if comes out.

Would it be a clamshell or candybar style phone? It seams that it could be an easy enough question, but there are major regional differences between style. America/Asia loves clamshells while Europe loves candybars. It's weird and it's a cultural thing, but it's something to keep in mind.

Similarly, will it be a dumb phone or a smart phone? A dumb phone would likely have the broadest market appeal, but it would turn off the hard core geeks that would make up the largest buying segment, at least initially.

Feh, I've spent the last 3 weeks trying to find the 'perfect' phone. It doesn't exist and and I doubt Apple could do it either.

[ashon3611]

what phone company wouldnt jump at the opportunity to support an iPhone? While the phone carrier might not make money off of downloading ringtones, it would make that up and more with the users using its on-line options using AIM and using video msging on the phone(iChat mobile?). A carrier could charge 10 bucks more month for this... Thats $120 more a year for the phone company. And over a year i wouldnt think the a typical cell phone user would download 40 ringtones.

Having a plug for headphone when your working out and possible having it beable to connect to an ipod to recieve songs from when your not at your computer would be awesome.

[BuonRotto]

What if you could download iTMS songs via their WAP browser -- the iTunes on Moto deal, somehow splitting what little profits there might be? Hm, kinda gets all tangled up, doesn't it?

[TednDi]

Why can't apple sell an unlocked gsm phone through the apple store and 3rd party distribution channels? The phone would work with all US gsm carriers and most of Europe. All the profits go to apple. A carrier will make more money on the data plan than they would with the ringtone. Considering that you would have to use a hefty data plan to download the tones and other ancillary data such as e-mail and ical updates, etc. Also, apple could give each carrier a piece of the itunes ringtone royalty like they do to the lablels and the artists now.

Makes sense to me. And would propel apple in the east asian markets and the european markets where cell phones are more of a cultural thing than in the US.

I would own both an ipod for all of my music and an iphone for the smart features, and the integration with ilife and some music to carry around.


If I were Steve. I would nip this napster ringtone thing in the bud with itms integration.

http://www.technewsworld.com/story/m...nes-38866.html

[Jim S.]

Here's a theory:

1. Apple ports iPhoto to Windows to support sales of iPod Photo and iPhone.
2. Apple's "digital hub" now includes wired and wireless phones.
3. iLife 2005 intros a new iApp similar to PhoneValet to manage calls.

http://www.parliant.com/

4. iSync keeps everything coordinated.
5. iPhone's white headphones includes a third wire which contains a small microphone with a clip that you can attach to your shirt or blouse.

Let's say you're walking around listening to music... suddenly the music fades away and the your phone says that "Bob Smith" is calling. You say "answer" and the phone connects you and you start talking with Bob Smith.

Ringtones would only be needed when you are not listening to music. Voice technology would make the device easy to use.

Just a thought...

[Messiahtosh]

I would much prefer a device like that, compared to using multiple devices, that are so closely ralated in size and technology...even function.