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PB PM
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Join Date: Oct 2005
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2023-06-07, 08:39

I have a sinking feeling that Apple picked 24” as a compromise between the 21” and 27”. It simplifies logistics to have one model, and they can ship more units per container. The bigger screens have seen their last days, IMO. My sister has an M1 24”, seems like a good fit, given the resolution offered.
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chucker
 
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2023-06-07, 08:54

I'm not sure. It could be that they went up to 24 from the 21 in part because they can now make smaller bezels.
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PB PM
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2023-06-07, 09:02

Could be, but I cannot think of why, after almost three years, they haven’t offered a larger screen model, if there is going to be one. I suppose, in light of the new 15” Air, one could argue good things come to those that wait? Maybe they were waiting for that M2 pro they threw in the Mini for the big iMac? M3? I just don’t get the delay, if it’s as popular as people here seem to think it is, then it should have come first.
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Matsu
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Join Date: May 2004
 
2023-06-07, 09:22

10 years ago, when I was still involved in Academe, every lab had 27" silver iMacs. I know from old colleagues that -- as long as Intel macs were available -- that was still the case for all the new purchases in the creative depts. I don't know what they've been up to since COVID.

When I splurged for an iMac, I had all the traditional concerns about AIOs, but for the same reasons it works in a student lab, it works on my desk. Pretty damn bullet proof. Maximizes my work surface for the mushrooming nest of papers and food containers that accompany every project or deadline. Impervious to spills. Less wires/cables to route/kink/chew.

Yes, it was pricey for me, even then, but the refurb store offered a loaded machine at a good price. 10 years on, it's worked out to about $16/month total cost of ownership. Less than Netflix... or what Adobe wants to charge me to rent software past CS6. Tech issues have been zero, and while software support/compatibility may now start becoming a problem, to date it has not been, not from Apple's side of the equation at any rate, nor Adobe's for that matter (if I accept subscription fees and move off CS6, I can install Mohave or later, but I see no need right now, so the thing's got a few years left...)

Personally, I think they're close to offering a new 5K iMac, and the best evidence is Apple's own studio display. It seems to be about 80% of an iMac already: it has a screen, "premium" sound system, camera and mics, and Apple silicon built in already. It even has the right price ... Swap that A13 for an M2/3, add an SSD, keyboard and mouse, and in 2023/24 - post-COVID and supply chain labour and logistics issues that went with it - they could probably start at $1599, and knock the ASD 27" down to $1299 or so, and pick up right where they left off. Even if they started at $1999, there's a lot customers who will consider it a worthwhile option.

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Frank777
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Join Date: May 2004
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2023-06-07, 13:07

As much as I would prefer certain things to be more upgradable, the charge that the built-in display of the 27" is wasteful doesn't always make sense.

If your computer needs change over time, you may need to buy a new machine. But the resale value of the 27" tends to hold up. There's usually no problem reselling an iMac within 5 years of purchase. And a prosumer generally doesn't hold a monitor much longer than that anyway.




P.S. Yeah, I don't know anyone with the smaller iMac either. All 27" models. I've only seen an iMac Pro once, in an broadcast studio office.
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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
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2023-06-07, 13:43

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM View Post
if it’s as popular as people here seem to think it is, then it should have come first.
Since when has popularity stopped Apple from killing a product?

iPod? most popular music player ever and now dead, even though there is still demand for it.

AirPort? Incredibly popular amongst Mac users (I still use mine, and it's still easier to manage than anything currently on the market) and now dead, even though there is still demand for it.

Wireless KB with 10-key? That thing fell off for several years until demand finally brought it back with a giant and collective "duhhhh" from almost everyone.

Apple will kill very popular products either because Apple is obtuse, they have something else coming that's better (maybe), because the product doesn't make them enough money, or because subscriptions!

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psmith2.0
Mr. Anderson
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Tennessee
 
2023-06-07, 14:29

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB PM View Post
I have a sinking feeling that Apple picked 24” as a compromise between the 21” and 27”. It simplifies logistics to have one model, and they can ship more units per container. The bigger screens have seen their last days, IMO. My sister has an M1 24”, seems like a good fit, given the resolution offered.
I have no problem with that size, as it's 4" larger than what I had for years (and 11" more than what I'm using now). No cheesy jokes, please. Too easy.

I think the 24" iMac is snazzy as can be, and that's a good size. The handful of times I've messed with one at Best Buy, I've liked it. Screen is just fine, size/resolution wise for me.

I'm sure they did pick that nice middle ground between the 21.5" and 27". I've actually never wanted/been drawn to the 27". Every time I messed with one at the store, it just felt like it was going to eat me, or that I was sitting in the front row at the multiplex. I used a 20" aluminum/glass iMac for 11 years, so I just go used to/comfortable with that 20-21.5" sizing. 24" is about all I'd really want to go in my current space/desk setup (that has to factor in as well, and it's different with everyone).
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PB PM
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Join Date: Oct 2005
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2023-06-07, 14:44

Quote:
Originally Posted by kscherer View Post
Since when has popularity stopped Apple from killing a product?

iPod? most popular music player ever and now dead, even though there is still demand for it.

AirPort? Incredibly popular amongst Mac users (I still use mine, and it's still easier to manage than anything currently on the market) and now dead, even though there is still demand for it.

Wireless KB with 10-key? That thing fell off for several years until demand finally brought it back with a giant and collective "duhhhh" from almost everyone.

Apple will kill very popular products either because Apple is obtuse, they have something else coming that's better (maybe), because the product doesn't make them enough money, or because subscriptions!
Apple killed the iPod because nobody was buying them anymore (less than half a million sales globally at the end). Still a lot, but not to a now big company like Apple. Popularity comes and goes with time.

Airport died, because as good as it was Apple was not keeping it up to date enough. I get the feeling it was a Steve project, and with him gone nobody wanted to do anymore. I stopped using mine because they were getting very slow due to thermal throttling/poor cooling design. The real killer was good enough Wi-Fi from ISP modems.
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chucker
 
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2023-06-07, 15:16

Quote:
Originally Posted by kscherer View Post
Since when has popularity stopped Apple from killing a product?

iPod? most popular music player ever and now dead, even though there is still demand for it.
If anything, the iPod is an example of a product that lived on for many years despite basically being dead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kscherer View Post
AirPort? Incredibly popular amongst Mac users
Meaning what? Did 50% of them have one? Doubt it. 10%? Maybe. Probably less.
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Matsu
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Join Date: May 2004
 
2023-06-07, 15:17

It might be a sweet spot, 24"...

My office just refreshed our displays from 21 to 23" yesterday afternoon same 1080 resolution though it makes a surprising bit of difference, primarily in being able to lean back a bit, it would probably be nice enough for side by side doc review if it was higher resolution... Waiting on docking stations so I can run two external displays - which will solve that problem for me. But we do tend to get used to things: I remember feeling like a won the lottery the first time I got a 17" flat screen CRT!

As mentioned, one big benefit of the larger screen is in being able to sit farther back, which does help eye strain a lot, but it depends a bit on where you like to sit and the size of your desk - if you're sitting a little closer, too big can be a problem too.

I think they could do two sizes, 24" and 27/30 or something... I don't think they will experiment with non 16:9 ratios, but it wouldn't be completely nuts, and could be kinda interesting to try 21:9 in a desktop size. I know, I know, but hear me out...

A 27" screen at 16:9 is about 13" tall and 23.5" wide. A 13" tall screen at 21:9 would be about 34" diagonal and about 31.5" wide. Gives an extra width about the size of a letter size sheet? When I think about how I use dual screens, it's primarily three things. 1.)Side-by-side doc review, cut/past/edit/etc. 2.) Organize/select/cull images on one screen; edit on the other. 3.) Teams call on one screen; working doc on the other. (Sometimes) there's a fourth thing too: Netflix on one screen; work on the other... soooo... forgetting about the Netflix scenario, I could probably get rid of two screens with one really wide screen instead, and it would have the same height/eyeline as a 27" so the ergos would be OK too.

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Capella
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2023-06-07, 20:55

Quote:
Originally Posted by psmith2.0 View Post
I'm sure they did pick that nice middle ground between the 21.5" and 27". I've actually never wanted/been drawn to the 27". Every time I messed with one at the store, it just felt like it was going to eat me, or that I was sitting in the front row at the multiplex.
I'm with you here. I've inherited a 27" monitor from a roommate and it's Too Damn Big. I'd rather have 3 24"s, in a Vertical horizontal Vertical tie-fighter setup, then 2 24" verticals and a 27" horizontal.

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psmith2.0
Mr. Anderson
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Tennessee
 
2023-06-07, 21:21

I’d get on just great with a single 24” because I’m doing super well with a single 13” display the past several years.

But, yeah…those 27” iMacs just took up my whole field of view. I like to glance at the clock or just “go numb” and stare at the wall sometimes. The 27” was a hindrance to that. “Am I gonna have to physically pick up and set this sonofabitch on the floor every time I want to look beyond it?!? I can’t be doing that 5-10 times, or more, a day!”
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PB PM
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2023-06-08, 07:51

I use two 27” monitors. Not all the time mind you, but when needed the second one is nice to have. It all depends on desk space and what you are doing.

Alas we have taken this off the topic of the new Macs that did come, we already have a when is the new iMac coming thread.
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Kickaha
Likes his boobies blue.
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2023-06-08, 10:36

Same, and I'm looking at bumping up to dual 32" 4K monitors in addition to the MBP screen on a laptop mount.

MOAH PIXULS
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turtle
Lord of the Rant.
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Join Date: Mar 2005
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2023-06-08, 13:36

I work from home in IT and I use two 27" (1080p because I'm cheap) and my MBP 15" screen. Not to mention the two iPads sitting on my desk that do things too. We can add my phone to the mix too if we just want to add all the screens I can look at.

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psmith2.0
Mr. Anderson
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2023-09-22, 09:57

Forgive the necro-bump, but the following, like most everything I post, doesn't deserve its own, new thread.

I visited my local, nearby-isn Costco yesterday with my Mom. First time I've ever been. We also have a Sam's club in town. Exact same shit, exact same type of crowd/customers, mass confusion/clutter/lines and "hurry up and wait" aspect to everything once you step inside.

Never again.

However, to my shock, they sell Macs. They actually had a huge table with two M1, 24" iMacs (blue and silver) and then pretty much all the notebooks, including the 15" Air (which my local Best Buy doesn't even have on display). Entirely too big, but they, like Best Buy, have a Midnight M2 13" Air on display and it's really nice. The notch is nothing, as the menu items don't seem to even come near it like I thought they wound. But the keyboard and trackpad are really nice.

All this time I've just been believing my town had only one Mac reseller/outlet, Best Buy. This Costco has been there for at least a decade, and is much closer to my house than Best Buy, and I had no idea they carried Macs. They also had a nearby table of nothing but every iPad in existence. Pretty cool. Seemed to be all the stock, base models (8GB RAM, which I'd never buy), but it's neat that there's a second place in town for people. And it's just across the line, in Georgia, so I think the sales tax is a little less, which, if you're buying a $1,299+ item, could translate into some actual savings.

I was with mom yesterday so I didn't get to spend as much time using/messing with them. But I now have a membership card so I can always zip over on my own and check them out. The place struck me as a bit of an unhinged zoo, full of tiny old people pushing around carts loaded with 3-4x the amount of shit (two 55" flat screen TVs, 3-4 cases of Gatorade or bottled water, 3 gallon jugs of French's mustard, a boxed 11' blue foil(!) Christmas tree, stacks of jeans/sweaters, etc.) a normal, sane person should be trying to maneuver around in a crowd, so I know I'd never go there on a weekend, which I'm sure it's even crazier than yesterday. A random Monday or Tuesday afternoon seems like the wiser choice.

The whole place just kinda goes against my general stance/thinking (overbuying, overkill, waste, lines everywhere - to get in, to get your item, to check out, to leave the store, etc.) so it's highly likely I'll never return, membership card or not (Mom put me on her account). I'm just hoping this isn't a new place she can request me/send me to go to quickly "pick up some [fill in the blank]" for her, like I already do Food Lion, Walmart or Walgreens. There's no "quickly" anything at this shithole zoo, and regularly feeding a household of 12-18 people (which she isn't), I didn't see anything in the pricing that made it all that compelling. Unless you need that 3-4 gallon industrial squeeze jug of Heinz ketchup or Hellman's mayo, you're better off going to your regular grocery store and buying normal sizes.

It was all an eye opener, and it's everything I hate. If the joint caught fire and burned down, or got shut down by The Man for being ground zero of a new COVID outbreak, I'd totally live.

PS - That 15" Air is kinda weird/ugly, doing away with all charm and reason (smallness, lightness) someone would get an Air for. I don't see the point, other than a slightly larger screen, which may be enough for some folks, I suppose. I remember that white 14" iBook years ago, whose only difference over the 12" was two more inches of screen (but the same 1024x768 resolution, translating into no new, extra working space, just a bigger version of what you get on the 12" model. Surely the 15" M2 Air offers more resolution/working space over the 13" M2 Air (just checked, it does). Okay, that makes it a little more compelling/sensible, but it sure loses "cuteness" points. The 13" M2 Air, even without the tapered wedge design, is really slim/small and a great-looking notebook! Especially in Space Grey or Midnight (the only two colors I'd consider).

Last edited by psmith2.0 : 2023-09-22 at 10:12.
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Kickaha
Likes his boobies blue.
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2023-09-22, 13:02

Ufdaa, did you just equivocate Costco w/ Sam's Club?? Mah dude, just call macOS Windows next time. XD

Disclaimer: I live 10 minutes from the city of Kirkland. As in, the name of Costco's store brand. They started here in the Seattle area.

I have to jam my AirPods in my ears on noise cancellation in Costco, but the return policies are the bomb. I have gone out of my way to buy a large ticket item at Costco instead of elsewhere, just for that reason. (Prices are *generally* really good, but there are definite loss leaders, and definite profit makers. If you have a Costco Business Center nearby, check them out too, they cater to, well, businesses, with different stock and sometimes you can find a ridiculous deal there that isn't in the normal Costco stores, like 50% off a freezer for the garage, and 25% off the top of the line commercial 8 qt KitchenAid mixer.) Their gas tends to be the cheapest around this area as well.

Oh, and definitely pick your day and time to go. Avoid weekends, and afternoons. When they open (10am here) is good, you only have to run over a few octogenarians. And, in the pro tip dept, they will open their doors 15 min early if there are people standing there. And there are always people standing there. Gives you a few more minutes of personal space.

But yep, they usually have a pretty decent selection of Apple kit at a bit reduced prices. Like everything else, they don't bother advertising a lot, so if you've never set foot in one, you'd have no idea.

@kickaha@social.seattle.wa.us
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kieran
@kk@pennytucker.social
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
 
2023-09-22, 13:02

At this point, the Air name should be dropped and it should just be the MacBook and MacBook Pro.

The Air name made sense when it was introduced and for a while after, but now? Not so much.

That being said, I love my 13" MBA

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psmith2.0
Mr. Anderson
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Tennessee
 
2023-09-22, 14:30

I’ve thought/said this for years.

Currently they’re selling the Airs for $150 off. Not bad!
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