[alcimedes]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...30277175242198

It's really long. LIke an hour and a half. Don't sit down to watch it unless you have some time to watch it seriously

It's the income tax claim, but by *far* the most well put together one I've seen.

Directed by Aaron Russo.

This is the "Director's Final Cut" authorized version of Aaron ... all » Russo's documentary, America: Freedom To Fascism (AFTF). It is being uploaded to Google Video for the first time during the evening of October 19-20th, 2006. Aaron has listened to everyone's feedback - volunteers, students, lovers of freedom & liberty, young and old alike - and, true to his word, he is putting this up "for free" on Google Video knowing that the hour has come for Americans to either be awakened to restore the Republic or be swept aside by the dark global forces of fascism that seeks to enslave mankind. AFTF's main focus comes in a statement with six very simple words: SHUT DOWN THE FEDERAL RESERVE SYSTEM!! After viewing the movie, please be sure to visit http://www.freedomtofascism.com where you will soon be able to view a much higher quality "pay per view" Internet version of AFTF, buy the DVD and sign up as an affiliate to sell/distribute DVDs to others. We also urge everyone to be sure to sign up as volunteer, register for email alerts and tell your family, friends and neighbors about this groundbreaking movie.

[scratt]

OK. You are CRAZY for believing it!








EDIT - But seriously. I watched a few clips from it a while back, and was a little shocked to say the least.. I really look forward to watching the whole thing... It's kind of Columbine or 911 for accountants, isn't it?

The premise for not paying taxes reminds me of the 'Poll Tax' days in the UK. I avoided it for a while by buying shares in a Tin Mine and becoming a 'Tin Miner' by default. The government of the day were very quick to

a) Illegally bully people into beliving the loop hole was false..

b) Eventually closing the loophole and then chasing for back taxes for those who had not paid.



So I left the UK, for that, among other reasons..

[scratt]

When anyone comes accross a torrent or something please let me know.. I really want to watch this, and am not looking to pirate it, but don't want to have to leave it sitting in a browser on Google videos all day long, and then watch it that way...

[alcimedes]

If you have FireFox and the Video Downloader extension, you can just save it to your local computer and watch it when you want.

[scratt]

Cool! I didn't know you could do that.. Thanks.

[Kickaha]

I haven't seen it, but from the blurbs I'm reading so far?

Yeah, believe it. Sleep tight!

[Moogs]

WHAT

THE


FUCK.

(This is no Michael Moore deal here, look at the people they're interviewing, and how far back it goes. God are we all a bunch of sheep....)

[alcimedes]

Originally Posted by Moogs WHAT THE FUCK. (This is no Michael Moore deal here, look at the people they're interviewing, and how far back it goes. God are we all a bunch of sheep....)

That's what has me sitting here numb. This isn't the 9/11 conspiracy theory. These aren't crackpots. Every third person on this damn video is a Senator or a IRS agent (current or former), it's seriously disturbing me. It gets a little off message at the end, but only because the issues are all tied to tightly together.

This isn't your typical Documentary/Conspiracy theory movie, but the claims are more fantastic than the ones I didn't even begin to believe.

I'm putting this on my car the day it shows up.

[Paul]

you spelled fascism wrong

[alcimedes]

yeah, i suck at spelling tonight. thanks.

[709]

Originally Posted by alcimedes I'm putting this on my car the day it shows up.

You know, honestly I like your description tag even better: "Stop worrying about your Party, and start worrying about your Country."

That's really, really good.

[chucker]

Good lord, guys. Conspiracy theories, at AN?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_protester_arguments

[johnq]

Just for reference:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_pro...onal_arguments
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_pro...racy_arguments

By the way, typically my belief in a theory or opinion is inversely proportional to the amount of centered text, exclamation points, and font sizes above 18pt (or worse, a font tag like "<font size=7>") to be found on a given theory's webpage — the less instances of these, the more I am inclined to believe it. For example: http://www.apfn.org/apfn/secretoath.htm



Minus 5 points too for using Courier for that top-secret spy-vibe. LOL.

[alcimedes]

Just for you 709, it's available as well.

[Moogs]

Guys... I just watched it through the whole way. This Russo guy, he's not perfect. He may not be right on every point or he may himself have been misinformed on a point or two... but the totality of what we're seeing here with the Central Bankers as controllers theme, cannot be ignored. The evidence is right in front of our faces.

I'm so god-damned paranoid now I don't even want to sign up on his page; surely that's not "Secure" in any meaningful way. So it begs the question: how to do start to right things? I don't believe all politicians (or even bankers) are inherently evil, but I do believe a great many of them are inherently misguided and arrogant. So smart and successful all their lives, so many people patting them on the back... it's only natural when rising to a position of power, that they feel (and have always felt) they know better than the rest of us what's best. Some surely don't care and crave only control and wealth for their own sakes... some simply have been brainwashed themselves by the power they're given.

We need to do something. Maybe to start we send this information around and post it every place we can find. I already know which of my friends will dismiss it out of hand and tell me how many bad things would happen with no Fed. Initially, those aren't the friends we should try to convince. Convince the friends who don't vote down party lines, the ones who are a little suspicious in general, the ones who have friends in the media business.

I'd like to know where some of these God-damned Rockefeller quotes and others came from and why we never heard them before. I think the answer is, we're lazy. We're the second or third generation of Americans that prefers to watch passively and not read, to be told and not to find. We let this shit get to where it is.

How much further?

The other day I discovered the self-checkout lines in my grocery store, verified purchases with... a THUMB PRINT. An electronic thumb print reader. Does anyone here REALLY want their thumb print in a national database or creditor database somewhere? I sure as hell don't.

[alcimedes]

Yeah, the problem is that there's a lot of nutty mixed in with a lot of good points about our eroding civil rights and liberties. Makes for good watching.

[Majost]

Well, I haven't had a chance to get the whole way through the film yet, so I have no idea what they say about the Fed... sounds interesting though. WRT the illegitimacy of taxation, even though taxes do suck, I have no* problem paying them. Especially the income tax. Hell, get rid of some of the the others, and primarily keep the income tax.

It is the only tax that can truly be applied progressively, ensuring all citizens have a live-able take-home wage while still funding our gov't properly. If it would be levied accurately, there'd be no need for additionally taxing purchased goods and what not. The services our gov't provides, for the most part, are extremely valuable. I have no problem being required to give a portion of my money towards that.

*Alright, so I'm not entirely okay about *all* the taxes I pay. As a pacifist and conscientious objector to war, I wish I could ensure that none of my money is being used in war efforts, as proposed in the Religious Freedom Peace Tax Fund Act. Sure, I'll pay the same amount as required, but just humor me and tell me that my money has been diverted elsewhere, and balance the war coffers with the rest of the taxpayers. If 'too many' people did it, well, then I suppose that would be a strong referendum towards our government's use of money. But this is entirely off topic, and I'll shut up now.

[709]

Originally Posted by alcimedes Just for you 709, it's available as well.

And ordered. Cheers.

[Dave]

Originally Posted by 709 And ordered. Cheers.

It didn't work for me

[scratt]

The bottom line is nothing will ever change.. If this movement ever gains enough momentum and is not simply ignored, the laws will simply be changed for the sake of 'legislative clarity'. All the while you'll have to keep paying taxes.... before and after.

It's strange. I hate government, and I loathe the US government, but at the end of the day I am coming down on their side in this one.. The side of realism. With the right checks and balances tax is necesary... and arguing that it's not on a piece of paper somewhere when the entire country is built on the principal like a foundation piece is a bit futile.

The problem that needs to be addressed is what each government is spending *your* tax dollars on.

If it is Mercedes, hives of useless clipboard carrying bureaucrats, and wars in foreign parts then you have a problem.........

[Elysium]

Some good points, some bad, some well constructed, some sensationalist. Here's just some things that went through my mind while watching this movie.

• What is the law?

  Should we be able to receive an accounting of any law regarding taxation? Sure, we have the right. That answer is continually ambiguous is suspicious. Debunking of this conspiracy theory seems to continually rely on the US district court decisions. I like that Russo addressed this and stressed that the Supreme Court has issued an opposing stance. get some clarity on the books and I'll go with it.

• Federal Reserve

  I do believe that the government should be in absolute control of the issuance and regulation of currency, and not reliant on private corporations. To even get into politics there seems to be the need for massive monetary resources. And we wonder why there's corruption in politics?

• Income Tax

  Should income tax be done away with? I don't think so. However, it needs to be reformed to address the gulf of wealth disparity between the different classes. This money also needs to be used to benefit the people with things like health care and education not towards interest on the national debt.

• The National Security Debate

  Scare tactics abound on each side of the argument. "The terrorists are going to destroy us!" and "big brother is watching!" I think measures need to be taken, but let's not go overboard. My main issue is all of the new ID requirements, passport for travel (soon to be required) and the new ID cards. Anybody considered the profit to be made by the government off the fees for these things? The RFID implant thing is not ok in my book, not implanted in my body or into my goods.

• Political Polarity

  People tend to focus on the red/blue, us/them stance in our government. These are supposed to be elected officials with our best interests at heart. I just have this itching concern that as political candidates continue to come from a law/business oriented background there will be a skew in governmental policies towards those ends. I'd love a more diverse background guiding us; you know soldiers, scientists, teachers, doctors, etc. Government by the people, it's a rather nice concept.

Just some points, some that are probably grossly misinformed. I like that something like this comes out to make people think about the way the country is run and how it can impact their lives. I think that government accountability is a very good thing. Just don't go overboard with the comparisons to a totalitarian state just yet.

[709]

Originally Posted by Dave It didn't work for me

Worked just fine here. I just got my confirmation email as well.

[ThunderPoit]

you dick alci, its damn near 3 am now, im not gonna get any sleep

[Akumulator]

Yeah.. I was sharing this around a couple months ago when the 15 minute video was up. At that point, this Aaron Russo interview seemed to be a bit more in depth: http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...&q=aaron+russo

But, I have to say... I haven't yet watched this 1 1/2 hour version of the video. I'll watch it tomorrow.

[ThunderPoit]

good plan, otherwise, youll lose sleep from not watching the video and you lose sleep because it will scare the shit out of you better than hollywood could do in a million years

[Barto]

So you guys don't like paying taxes, eh? Good for you. Neither do I.

[hiltond]

I don't like it when a man's legal consul is told the Supreme Court is irrelevant and he is sentenced to 13 years in prison as a result of being forced to live with lower court rulings when a SC president exists. That is more upsetting then paying taxes.

And these voting computers, who thinks those are a good idea? Beer keeps winning all of my local elections.

The CFR and the Fed are both very scary. Pass the tinfoil please.

[Doxxic]

Usually, where people suspect conspiracies, there really are only mechanisms.

Conspiracy theories assume that there is a group of people in control, with specific intentions, but it's precisely the control and the intentions that are not there.

Tax malpractice, 9-11, Iraq; it's all caused by mechanisms to which individual people obey, who can do so because there's a weak core government with a lack of power, vision, intention and organization.

[AsLan^]

Originally Posted by chucker Good lord, guys. Conspiracy theories, at AN? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_protester_arguments

Originally Posted by johnq Just for reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_pro...onal_arguments http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_pro...racy_arguments By the way, typically my belief in a theory or opinion is inversely proportional to the amount of centered text, exclamation points, and font sizes above 18pt (or worse, a font tag like "<font size=7>") to be found on a given theory's webpage — the less instances of these, the more I am inclined to believe it. For example: http://www.apfn.org/apfn/secretoath.htm Minus 5 points too for using Courier for that top-secret spy-vibe. LOL.

I don't see anything in those wiki pages that refute this documetary or show me a law that requires me to pay an income tax.

In fact... here's a link to the Title 26 of the United States Code which is law. I can't find where it says I have to pay taxes.

[chucker]

Originally Posted by AsLan^ I don't see anything in those wiki pages that refute this documetary or show me a law that requires me to pay an income tax.

Try http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/America...dom_to_Fascism and its talk page.