[evilswan]

what a difference 6 months makes,

just look at me back then...

http://forums.applenova.com/showthread.php?t=14582

...so excited to be entering the mac world.

Opened the lid today - nothing! Battery can't be flat already? Nope, battery lights are on.

Wait a minute, it's not running off mains either...

Into the apple shop, genius bar, few tests later and it's officially dead. Needs a new battery (?) and a new circuit board (not sure which one).

15 working days before i get it back.

They told me quicker if i'd bought ProCare, which I resent buying a little - it's less than 12 months old, it's the law that they have to fix it - why be so gruding about it?

Only working for 6 months doesn't sound too good to me. *sigh* Back to my dusty vaio.

miss swan.x

[drewprops]

Poor baby! Tell Uncle Drew all about it....
But, Laptops and Extended Warranties go together like David Hasselhoff and Bad Videos. I'd never buy another Mac without AppleCare, it's just too good of an investment.

[turtle]

Agreed. However I don't even have AppleCare on my MB yet, but I know I can wait. I guess I shouldn't though.

Miss Swan, maybe once you get it back you can sell it off and get a new MBP?

Sucks about loosing you PB for a while though.

[evilswan]

Originally Posted by turtle2472 Miss Swan, maybe once you get it back you can sell it off and get a new MBP?

i was actually thinking of selling it and buying the macbook with the superdrive. it's 5 times faster than my powerbook g4 and has all the same stuff, airport, firewire, etc.

i know the screen is smaller than my 15" PB, but it looks like a good deal to me.

[evilswan]

um... so it's still not been fixed. called the store and they said:

"looks like DC & Sound boards are hard to come by"

so when i asked when it would be fixed they said they didn't know.

that's it.. just more waiting. is apple normally this bad? it's in warranty, it's the law that they have to fix or replace it, why are they being so difficult?

next stop: trading standards!

[turtle]

Might be time to for you to make some noise about the status and what's taking so long. I wouldn't be rude, but certainly forceful about getting this resolved.

[evilswan]

Originally Posted by turtle2472 Might be time to for you to make some noise about the status and what's taking so long. I wouldn't be rude, but certainly forceful about getting this resolved.

you're right.. i should do. i don't really know what to say. they just say they can't get the part.

[turtle]

Originally Posted by evilswan you're right.. i should do. i don't really know what to say. they just say they can't get the part.

I would start something like this:
I understand you are having trouble getting the part, however that isn't my issue here. See I'm out a laptop right now and having to make due without even a realistic ETR on this PB. This needs to be rectified. My experience with Apple has never been this shoddy and it is time that Apple corrected this situation. If the part isn't available then a like-kind swap is in order.

If the tech guy you're talking with balks at this, ask the speak with his/her supervisor. Apple doesn't get #1 in customer support for no reason, make them earn it in your case. Be direct, but never directing your frustrations at the person who is helping you on the phone.

Let us know how it works out.

[evilswan]

Originally Posted by turtle2472 I would start something like this: I understand you are having trouble getting the part, however that isn't my issue here. See I'm out a laptop right now and having to make due without even a realistic ETR on this PB. This needs to be rectified. My experience with Apple has never been this shoddy and it is time that Apple corrected this situation. If the part isn't available then a like-kind swap is in order. If the tech guy you're talking with balks at this, ask the speak with his/her supervisor. Apple doesn't get #1 in customer support for no reason, make them earn it in your case. Be direct, but never directing your frustrations at the person who is helping you on the phone. Let us know how it works out.

ok.. first of all, thank you so much for the tips.

i called apple, the store never answer their phone so i went through to apple service. they said that i should call the store. i explained that the store never answer their phone. the call centre guy put me on hold for about 5 minutes while tried the store, he came back to me and told me that he had also not been able to get them to answer. he said he would raise this as an escalation to apple customer relations. he said that i should call the store back tomorrow and they should answer the phone.

he also said that if they can't fix it within 28 days (halfway there already at 14 days) they would replace my powerbook with an equivalent new laptop.

will this actually happen? will apple store ever answer the phone!? i will call back tomorrow, and let you know what happens.

[FFL]

In my experience, you press '5" at the voice prompt to get a live person when calling an Apple Store.

Apparently they just let it ring and ring at this store?

I'd pursue the escalation to Customer Relations, if I were you - they have The Power to cut through the usual procedures and approve a replacement for you.

[evilswan]

Originally Posted by FFL In my experience, you press '5" at the voice prompt to get a live person when calling an Apple Store. Apparently they just let it ring and ring at this store? I'd pursue the escalation to Customer Relations, if I were you - they have The Power to cut through the usual procedures and approve a replacement for you.

yeah that's exactly right, i press 5 and it rings until it cuts off. i have tried on upwards of 20 occasions over the past 2 weeks and got through exactly ONCE.

i might try to call uk customer relations tomorrow, anyone know a good direct number?

[Dorian Gray]

Originally Posted by evilswan anyone know a good direct number?

Apple, like so many companies these days, have jumped on the 0870 bandwagon, which is immensely annoying. Anyway, the very useful Say No To 0870 website has some proper numbers for Apple if you search for "Apple".

Good luck.

[Kickaha]

Ernh? What's an 0870 number, like a reverse 800 number?

[evilswan]

Originally Posted by Kickaha Ernh? What's an 0870 number, like a reverse 800 number?

it's a low cost number. most companies here use them to mask enormous call centres, so they've become a byword for soul-destroying frustration.

[Kickaha]

Right, I figured that much, but low cost for *whom*? In the US, we have 800 (and 888 and 887) numbers that are used for the same purpose, but they're toll-free for the customer, the company picks up the bill.

[evilswan]

Originally Posted by Kickaha Right, I figured that much, but low cost for *whom*? In the US, we have 800 (and 888 and 887) numbers that are used for the same purpose, but they're toll-free for the customer, the company picks up the bill.

yeah, we have "0800" here which is free, but companies get a kick back from the telecoms operator if they use an 0870 or 0845 number.. so guess which one they use?

if you want a quote for insurance or a sales type call, they're all 0800. but once you actually want to use the companies or get help, you're picking up the tab (and the company in question are taking a cut) on the 0870.

so while shitty apple have me on hold, waiting to explain why they haven't fixed their defective product, they are charging me for it.

capitalism! pffft!

[Kickaha]

So an 0870 # is a lower-than-normal cost for the customer, but not free.

And the incentive for the company is that they get *paid* by the telecom to use them?

I thought your telecom was state-owned there?

[turtle]

I would say you shouldn't bother calling them. See if it passes the 14 day mark, then you get a new MBP. Sounds like a good deal to me.

[evilswan]

Originally Posted by Kickaha So an 0870 # is a lower-than-normal cost for the customer, but not free. And the incentive for the company is that they get *paid* by the telecom to use them? I thought your telecom was state-owned there?

Yeah that's right, so say the 0870 is 10p per minute to the dialler, the company might get 1p or 3p per min back from the provider. Everybody wins. Except the customer.

It used to be state owned, but it hasn't been for a long time.

There are now lots of competing telecoms companies but British Telecom (www.bt.com) still own the copper wires to houses. through some complicated anti-monopoly regulation from the communications watchdog over the last few years, that too is now allowed to be used by rival providers.

Hopefully the next decade will see some serious competition as voip and other new stuff becomes more widespread. Incidentally, my customer service woes with apple are nothing compared to BT, who, in this girl's humble opinion, have to be the worst company i have ever dealt with.

[evilswan]

Originally Posted by turtle2472 I would say you shouldn't bother calling them. See if it passes the 14 day mark, then you get a new MBP. Sounds like a good deal to me.

me too!

i wonder though, if that was just said to get me off the line? if it's true, i'm happy.

[Dorian Gray]

Originally Posted by Kickaha So an 0870 # is a lower-than-normal cost for the customer, but not free.

In practice, 0870 numbers cost much more for the customer to use. If everyone were paying standard charges for telephone calls, calling 0870 numbers would be [slightly] cheaper than geographic numbers. But of course hardly anyone pays standard charges to call landlines anymore. All the landline operators including BT have packages which give free, very low cost, or bundled free minutes for calling geographic numbers (landlines). These packages very rarely include 0870 numbers. Instead, 0870 numbers are charged at a fixed rate per minute, typically up to 10 p/min.

Also, a lot of 0870 numbers are used by customer service departments, and one typically wants to call these numbers whenever it suits, which often means calling from a mobile phone (young people increasingly don't even own a landline). No mobile phone company that I know of includes 0870 numbers in their "free" minute bundles, instead charging exorbitant rates of at least 10 p/min. Orange used to have some packages which included 0870 numbers, but they've dropped those and now charge 10 p/min. Waiting for half an hour thus costs £3.00 (nearly 6 dollars!).

And yes, the company owning the 0870 number gets paid to receive calls by the telecom operator. This eliminates a great part of the incentive to deliver rapid customer service and reduce queue times.

Originally Posted by Kickaha I thought your telecom was state-owned there?

No such luck. British Telecom was privatised over 20 years ago and today the UK has the most aggressively free market and competitive telecom industry in the EU (and contrary to popular belief, one of the EU's main goals is to increase competition, so that statement isn't meaningless). However, ignorance in the market is ABSOLUTELY STUNNING and the renamed BT continues to attract a majority of customers despite having by far the highest costs and arguably the worst service (a bit like the old dinosaurs in the US telecom market?). BT (which shouldn't have been allowed to use that confusing name in my opinion) now sells services based on the good reputation the state-owned British Telecom had. In other words, we'll have to wait for the entire middle-aged middle-classes to die off before companies will compete on their merits. As for me, you couldn't pay me to use BT. Slow broadband with tiny usage caps for twice the price of 8-meg unlimited broadband from the competition? Er, what's the catch?

[Kickaha]

Originally Posted by Dorian Gray In practice, 0870 numbers cost much more for the customer to use. If everyone were paying standard charges for telephone calls, calling 0870 numbers would be [slightly] cheaper than geographic numbers. But of course hardly anyone pays standard charges to call landlines anymore. All the landline operators including BT have packages which give free, very low cost, or bundled free minutes for calling geographic numbers (landlines). These packages very rarely include 0870 numbers. Instead, 0870 numbers are charged at a fixed rate per minute, typically up to 10 p/min.

Oy criminy. And, of course, this is a call you're paying for being *on hold* for quite some time... nice.

Also, a lot of 0870 numbers are used by customer service departments, and one typically wants to call these numbers whenever it suits, which often means calling from a mobile phone (young people increasingly don't even own a landline). No mobile phone company that I know of includes 0870 numbers in their "free" minute bundles, instead charging exorbitant rates of at least 10 p/min. Orange used to have some packages which included 0870 numbers, but they've dropped those and now charge 10 p/min. Waiting for half an hour thus costs £3.00 (nearly 6 dollars!). And yes, the company owning the 0870 number gets paid to receive calls by the telecom operator. This eliminates a great part of the incentive to deliver rapid customer service and reduce queue times.

Nice racket there. Apparently the only recourse is bitching to the companies. Lovely.

No such luck. British Telecom was privatised over 20 years ago and today the UK has the most aggressively free market and competitive telecom industry in the EU (and contrary to popular belief, one of the EU's main goals is to increase competition, so that statement isn't meaningless). However, ignorance in the market is ABSOLUTELY STUNNING and the renamed BT continues to attract a majority of customers despite having by far the highest costs and arguably the worst service (a bit like the old dinosaurs in the US telecom market?). BT (which shouldn't have been allowed to use that confusing name in my opinion) now sells services based on the good reputation the state-owned British Telecom had. In other words, we'll have to wait for the entire middle-aged middle-classes to die off before companies will compete on their merits. As for me, you couldn't pay me to use BT. Slow broadband with tiny usage caps for twice the price of 8-meg unlimited broadband from the competition? Er, what's the catch?

Yup, sounds quite a bit like the post-Ma Bell era, where AT&T was the brand name of recognition. FWIW, it eventually settled out here.

And then they started merging... Do you have the geographical monopolies we have here for most wired services, such as phone, cable, electricity, etc? It's just started opening up a bit in the past few years...

[evilswan]

Originally Posted by FFL I'd pursue the escalation to Customer Relations, if I were you - they have The Power to cut through the usual procedures and approve a replacement for you.

UPDATE!

OK, called customer relations today.

I explained my problem to the nice man and he said that he would order the part and have it shipped to the store within the next 3 days which *should* speed up the repair.

I'm happy that there seems to be some progress, but seriously... WHY!? why did it take me calling 3 or 4 different departments to get them to order a part that the store said was unavailable and haven't been able to get in 2 weeks? what is going on with apple?

i'm going to wait until i get my PB back and use it to write a complaint letter to apple.. maybe i should even address it to steve at cupertino?

[evilswan]

UPDATE: Another week has passed, no phonecall from apple, no part being ordered, no fixed powerbook.

I called the store who, to be fair this time, actually called me back (1st time in 3 weeks) saying they EXPECTED the part to be in soon but still couldn't say when.

Called customer relations to ask for a replacement machine as Apple were now breaking the law. Said they would call me back on Monday.

I feel like crying... this is the worst customer service i've had. I'm being totally honest when i say this: it's tainted the whole mac experience for me now. I know i can never feel the same way about my mac, the apple store, etc. They operate with such smugness and arrogance, it disgusts me.

[turtle]

Thanks for the update.

The situation does suck, and I can certainly see how it would put a negative light on Apple. Try looking to the positive though, you'll likely get the new system out of it.

[thegeriatric]

Originally Posted by evilswan my customer service woes with apple are nothing compared to BT, who, in this girl's humble opinion, have to be the worst company i have ever dealt with.

I would have agreed with you about BT. But as the saying goes *you ain't seen nothing yet* not untill you try dealing with Telefonica (Spains Version of BT) they make BT seem like angels in comparison.

Good luck with the Apple problem. I have always found Apple Uk Excellent to deal with.

Fingers crossed for you.