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Apple in your den, pocket, etc...cell phone next?


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Apple in your den, pocket, etc...cell phone next?
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Kickaha
Likes his boobies blue.
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hell
 
2006-09-15, 16:08

Quote:
Originally Posted by pscates2.0 View Post
Regarding voice recognition: on numbers you've got programmed in, you could just say "Mom, work", "James, cell" or "Mariska, home"? And not even have to say the number? Because I don't know many of the more obscure numbers (cell, work, etc.) of many friends and family.

Just say the person's name, and which one of their numbers you wanted (home, work or cell)?
My phone does this now. You have to record your voice saying the entries you want, and then it compares your voice input against that list, but it works really well.

My other brain is hung like a horse too.
#IRC isn't old school.
Old school is being able to say 'finger me' with a straight face.
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BuonRotto
Not sayin', just sayin'
 
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2006-09-15, 17:34

Yeah, I have that feature on my phone right now too. I guess the irony after my suggestion is that I almost never use it, and I've only recorded my voice for a few numbers. So my point was that a new number, one you don't have as "James" or "pizza" is probably easier to say than type out anyway (I know when I have to call a new number, I usually look at the paper or screen it's on, say it aloud as I punch it into my keypad), but oddly enough, I don't really use it for my usual numbers.

I fear that 26 divisions of a circle would be hard to to navigate with my thumb though. Kickaha. I dunno. I imagine it could be frustrating to constantly move diagonally left and up, then a bit back, a bit up again, back... ok ...next number is...

The problem with that Chocolate phone is that you have four buttons on one "wheel" and if your finger is only slightly off, you could hit the up button instead of the left button ,as an example.

That example is not the same as a true scroll wheel, but it would definitely need to be tested. Sometimes, it does feel like Apple tests some UI stuff with about 10 people on the project team and then has a very public beta for version 1. That could sink an iPhone right then and there. Obviously, they didn't screw it up with the iPod, so there's plenty of proof to the contrary as well.
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Kickaha
Likes his boobies blue.
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hell
 
2006-09-15, 17:43

Agreed, it's just a concept at the moment, but it has a solid enough base in UI research to warrant discussion.

Seriously, our angular precision with our fingers is hellaciously better than our linear. No idea why. Oughtta take advantage of that, y'know?

And let's say that 26 *is* too many. What's the sweet spot? The 10 of the digits? 15? Do we shunt Q, Z, etc off to a subwheel-of-the-lesser-used? (ie, minimalist predictive input) Do we have the ring change according to the previous letter, but never exceed the max number of elements? (ie, true predictive input) All sorts of possibilities.

The question is... are any of these better than having a slide-out tiny QWERTY keyboard?

I see an advantage over the QWERTY because it's usable with one hand, for instance.

My other brain is hung like a horse too.
#IRC isn't old school.
Old school is being able to say 'finger me' with a straight face.
  quote
Kraetos
Lovable Bastard
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Boston-ish
 
2006-09-15, 18:53

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kraetos View Post
main point is that one of the iPhone's largest potential markets very much relies on a text entry system, and it would a pretty poor decision business-wise to omit one.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kickaha View Post
T,FTFY
No, I really meant numeric keypad. Changing the system in place because Apple thinks they came up with something better would be, quite frankly, foolish. The numeric keypad's efficiency & speed to size ratio can't be beat.

And a lot of you seem to be forgetting about predictive input (I noticed BuonRotto remembered it.) On my RAZR, which, is actually near the bottom of the UI barrel, if I hit 7 it comes up with an S FIRST, despite it being the last letter.

Predictive works about 90% of the time, but, its easy to correct when it fucks up, especially once you start to remember where it misses. For example, "on" and "no" are the same button combo (66) and I use both frequently. But, once you can touch type with a numpad, you realize when this mix up is going to occur and fix it quickly.

It's not perfect. At all. But its light years faster than a scroll wheel, and more to the point, chronic texters are already used to it.

And finally, SLIDER. If you don't like the numpad you NEVER have to see it. It just makes sense!

Sadly, being a technology pundit is truly never having to say you’re sorry. You can be wrong for years and never lose your job.—The Macalope

Last edited by Kraetos : 2006-09-15 at 19:04.
  quote
Banana
is the next Chiquita
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
 
2006-09-15, 19:13

Kickaha, you say there is already good use for predictive input? After I posted, I did some thinking about how it'd be done, but couldn't really decide on how it'd be set up without being too confusing. I can see arranging letters according to how they may sound (e.g. if you already have a c in, h would be on the top while l is on bottom, as ch- is more sharper than cl [I think?]), but got all garfunkled on myself. Would be interested in how they worked that out.
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Kraetos
Lovable Bastard
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Boston-ish
 
2006-09-15, 19:15

LG AX490

It's called fastap.

Interesting idea, but ugly. Just thought I would throw it out there, it seemed relevant to the thread.

(No, I am not advocating it, nor do I think Apple will use this in a million years.)

Sadly, being a technology pundit is truly never having to say you’re sorry. You can be wrong for years and never lose your job.—The Macalope
  quote
pscates2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2006-09-15, 21:05

Man, that's a lot of buttons!

If they give a design award for "Most Buttons on a Cell Phone", we're looking at the winner!
  quote
joveblue
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Melbourne
 
2006-09-15, 22:32

I find searching through lists with the clickwheel to be OK, but far from perfect. It's fine for the iPod because it's very simple and elegant design wise and it's pretty good. But it's not perfect. It lacks accuracy for quick selections. A numpad is not inherintly bad at this. Both in combination could possibly be quite effective. *scratches chin*

*looks at Wikipedia* You have to PAY to RECEIVE an SMS in the US!? Our phone networks make an absolute KILLING off text messages. They are very profitable as they only cost a couple of cents to send but kids will still go crazy at 20c a pop.

If we're going to slide out something for alphanumeric entry, maybe it should be like this:


5 columns of buttons instead of 3 (middle 3 have numbers), 2 letters per key so predictive text is a lot more accurate and non-predictive is a lot quicker. QWERTY format.

EDIT: Found a clearer image

Last edited by joveblue : 2006-09-16 at 00:27.
  quote
Kickaha
Likes his boobies blue.
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hell
 
2006-09-15, 23:56

Alright, that's the first keypad I've seen that makes a modicum of sense. It reduces the number of presses needed by quite a bit, uses a modified standard QWERTY layout for familiarity, but allows for a standard numeric layout in the middle.

How does it do with large lists?


My other brain is hung like a horse too.
#IRC isn't old school.
Old school is being able to say 'finger me' with a straight face.
  quote
joveblue
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Melbourne
 
2006-09-16, 00:42

I dunno, never actually seen one in real life...

Apparently that's a trackball. Sounds pretty awesome.
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Moonmonkey
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
 
2006-09-16, 03:57

Quote:
Originally Posted by joveblue View Post
Try typing out an SMS on a clickwheel... There is no way anyone* would want a phone without a keypad.

*most people
Exactly,

In Asia an Europe people use SMS as much if not more than voicecalls.
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Franz Josef
Passing by
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: London
 
2006-09-16, 04:45

Quote:
Originally Posted by pscates2.0 View Post
Regarding voice recognition: on numbers you've got programmed in, you could just say "Mom, work", "James, cell" or "Mariska, home"?
LOL, Mariska, home. Mr Mariska's gonna kick your ass 'scates!
  quote
pscates2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2006-09-16, 07:11

He's gotta catch me first.
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intlplby
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
 
2006-09-16, 08:44

how about a mighty mouse nipple in the phone.... basically a trackball, as someone said a few posts up... apple has already done it for a mouse.... all they have to do is increase the durability and make it so it doesn't get dirty... some sort of self cleaning mechanism
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BuonRotto
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2006-09-16, 11:45

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave Ulysses View Post
Nostalgia over function?
Wow, missed this. Please, for the love of all that is good and pure, do not use or derive any sentence related to "Form follows function." K? Thanks! Remember kids, every time someone says "form follows function," God kills a kitten.

Anyhoo, yes, Paul, you can say, "Mariska, hot tub" into the phone I have right now and it will dial a number I choose.

I think the answer is to reduce our alphabet. I mean, who needs "c" "g" "q" and "y"? There are probably a few others we can just dump all together, like the vowels, for instance. You can sort of get the sound right with only the consonants, right?
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Banana
is the next Chiquita
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
 
2006-09-16, 12:33

I dnt knw f y cn rlly gt rd f th vwls. T cld b prblmtc spcilly wth crtn wrds sch s b r b nd nt r nt fr xmpl.
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turtle
Lord of the Rant.
Formerly turtle2472
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Tidewater Virginia
 
2006-09-16, 12:47

Quote:
Originally Posted by Banana View Post
I dnt knw f y cn rlly gt rd f th vwls. T cld b prblmtc spcilly wth crtn wrds sch s b r b nd nt r nt fr xmpl.
What's really funny is I could almost read that before I realized the vowels were missing!
  quote
Banana
is the next Chiquita
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
 
2006-09-16, 13:20

bt dd y fgr t wht dffrnc btwn nt nd nt r b nd b? ls d y rlly thnk t s sy n yr ys?
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BuonRotto
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2006-09-18, 10:17

Damn, am I wrong then?
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pscates2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2006-09-18, 10:53

Sht th fck p.

Hey, it works!
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Banana
is the next Chiquita
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
 
2006-09-18, 11:01

t frst I rd t s sht, s n xcrtn, thn rlzd y mnt sht s n cls.
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Messiahtosh
Apple Historian
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2007-01-10, 20:25

Quote:
Originally Posted by pscates2.0 View Post
Yeah, true. They've probably got something super cool up their sleeve that looks like nothing else they have, or that we could expect or predict.
You are Steve Jobs.
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ice2ice
New Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
 
2007-01-29, 21:16

Quote:
Originally Posted by Messiahtosh View Post
Steve Jobs made a point to show the graphic which pointed out how Apple has become ubiquitous in our lives...except the only obvious thing missing would be a cell phone. I know this has been debated a lot, but the fact that Steve Jobs specifically pointed that all out, and PRE-announced the iTV, could possibly mean that MWSF will see the unveiling of more consumer electronic devices from Apple.
a friend expressed a odd theory - that the combination of apple-tv with 42" and 60" inch displays (TV) with integrated i-sight for the living room combined with the new ichat display share features extended to the iphone interacting... would be announced at super-bowl. i'm new to this forum, can you tell me where i could post this?

thank you.
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