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Bryson
Rocket Surgeon
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Whitby
 
2019-12-10, 12:11

It's available to buy, folks.

Bullet points:
  • At first if you clicked on the link it took you to the Trashcan MP page. That's a hell of a bait and switch.
  • The rackmount version is not yet available.
  • Wheels are $400
  • Afterburner is $2000. (Surprisingly reasonable, IMO.)
  • You can configure $25,000 worth of RAM.
  • You can configure it North of $50k if you click all of the big boy boxes.
  • That $50k is sans monitors. So add a couple of the nice ones, you're at $65k.
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pscates2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2019-12-10, 12:52

Hey, stocking stuffers! I can finish my shopping today!

Interesting that they've not put anything about it on their main home page. I know it's not a mainstream, "regular person" product, but they usually devote a little bit on their homepage to new, or "now available" items, if only for 3-4 days. But they know their target demographic knows where to go to get it, so it's not like iPod socks or something.

I hope this proves to be a popular machine for those who need it. How long has that cylindrical thing been around? Six years? That comment from Phil on stage back then hasn't aged well...you "innovated" yourself right into a bit of an underwhelming failure with no legs/headroom that didn't sell worth a rip, so...

Maybe they'll shut up this go-around and let the machine/performance speak for itself.

$52,748 when I max out all the available hardware options.

As with phones, notebooks, watches, etc. do you think they loaned one of these things to the usual writers/reviewers? Does Gruber have one of these on his desk? I would imagine it loads Safari pages really fast!
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Bryson
Rocket Surgeon
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Whitby
 
2019-12-10, 14:35

I don't know that Gruber is the target market.

Marco Arment, on the other hand.... (and they gave him a demo 16" MBP, so he's on "the list")

In all seriousness, though: I can't imagine many individuals buying these, but for work, I specify and design AV systems for theatres, and 6-10k is reasonable for a medium to low-end lighting or audio controller. Adding one of these for audio or video playback purposes would be entirely uncontroversial. Looking forward to the rack-mount one showing up, that's more our speed.
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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: near Bremen, Germany
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2019-12-10, 14:50

Quote:
Originally Posted by pscates2.0 View Post
As with phones, notebooks, watches, etc. do you think they loaned one of these things to the usual writers/reviewers? Does Gruber have one of these on his desk? I would imagine it loads Safari pages really fast!
MKBHD got one. He rendered video on it almost five times as fast as on the 16-inch MBP.

Maybe they gave Marco Armenia or John Siracusa one?
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pscates2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2019-12-10, 14:57

Probably. Expect Siracusa’s 120,000-word review sometime next week, chapters 1-17.

PS - That’s not a slam...back when I was into this stuff a bit more, I always enjoyed his OS X write-ups at Ars Technica(?). I learned more from him than any other individual or website, all those years!

EDIT: First impressions, discussion, etc. from “tech” YouTubers.

Last edited by pscates2.0 : 2019-12-10 at 23:38.
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pscates2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2019-12-10, 15:17

One young woman bought the Mac, two displays and two of the stands. The unboxing alone is taking about 25 minutes. Very large, built in handles, etc. As if usually the case, the packaging from Apple is nicer/more “designed” than the finished product from some other companies. This may have been one of the final cluster of things Ive worked on? I guess we’ll know in a year or two.
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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: near Bremen, Germany
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2019-12-10, 16:02

One thing that's unusual is that they're already preannouncing a spec bump.

Not just the "coming soon" $500 more rack mount variant, but also:

Quote:
Coming soon:
Radeon Pro W5700X with 16GB of GDDR6 memory
Two Radeon Pro W5700X with 16GB of GDDR6 memory each

Coming soon:
8TB SSD storage
It makes sense because the Mac Pro as introduced today ships with the previous-generation Vega AMD graphics and up to 4 TB SSD, whereas 16-inch MacBook Pro already offers Navi graphics and up to 8 TB SSD.

I wouldn't be surprised if "soon" means February-ish, and:
  • that day, they just upgrade all graphics options as mentioned above, at the same pricing as before;
  • likewise, they just double each SSD option. That means it'll go from 512 to 8 rather than 256 to 4, and it also means it will no longer start at 256 (which is dumb);
  • aaaaaand maybe they'll also upgrade the iMac Pro that day. The iMac Pro could now get Xeon W-2200 chips, could also use nicer graphics, and of course the various additions to RAM and SSD.

(Wildcard: the Mac Pro now comes with a new silver/black keyboard/trackpad/mouse color scheme. Will they move the iMac Pro to this? Will they eventually get rid of one of these three colors, or will they eventually offer the Magic * in all three variants?)
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pscates2.0
Mr. Farmiga
 
Join Date: May 2004
 
2019-12-10, 16:14

I saw those "coming soon" options as well...a first. They never let those cats out of the bag like that. I wonder if it'll hurt sales? People thinking "hell, I've waited this long, what's another few months..."?

Interesting. I wonder why they'd do that, knowing it may encourage further fence-sitting/waiting?

Last edited by pscates2.0 : 2019-12-10 at 23:39.
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709
¡Damned!
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Purgatory
 
2019-12-10, 16:19

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucker View Post
(Wildcard: the Mac Pro now comes with a new silver/black keyboard/trackpad/mouse color scheme. Will they move the iMac Pro to this? Will they eventually get rid of one of these three colors, or will they eventually offer the Magic * in all three variants?)
Wow, good eye on that.
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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: near Bremen, Germany
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2019-12-10, 16:56

Quote:
Originally Posted by 709 View Post
Wow, good eye on that.
I can’t take the credit. MKBHD talked about it. And the order page makes it clear that these are (currently) exclusive to a new MP order.
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surjones
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: In the hands of Apple.
 
2019-12-10, 23:56

Pricing Aside - I edit 4K video/Drone/And some Premade Animation graphics. - Currently I have. 5K Late 2015 iMac, it's slooooing my down. Will the new 16 " MBP be able to do a better job, or should I keep my already placed order for the 12 Core Mac Pro and then have to buy a monitor as well - I do a lot of Photography as well - so it would be nice not have to travel with this sucker. but I travel with the iMac now. soooo help a brotha out!
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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2019-12-11, 06:17

Quote:
Originally Posted by pscates2.0 View Post
I saw those "coming soon" options as well...a first. They never let those cats out of the bag like that. I wonder if it'll hurt sales? People thinking "hell, I've waited this long, what's another few months..."?

Interesting. I wonder why they'd do that, knowing it may encourage further fence-sitting/waiting?
It's unusual of them to do, and does theoretically risk the Osborne effect, but in practice, I don't think so.

Some people will be content with the current Mac Pro line-up. They've waited for years, and now get an extremely powerful (and pricey) machine. Others will wait another few months* for better (and I'm guessing cheaper) BTO options. This does mean Apple will miss out on some revenue for the December quarter, sure. But it'll be an extremely small slice (0.1%, if even that), and of that slice, most people will eventually buy in the next quarter. In the meantime, Apple won't run out of money (unlike Osborne), and those people are also unlikely to not buy the Mac Pro altogether because of the pre-announced options.

So it's unusual, yeah, but the risk is rather small.

*) Siracusa asks:

Quote:
If anyone at Apple knows when the “coming soon” Radeon Pro W5700X GPU option will be available for purchase on the Mac Pro, please let me know. Will it be before the December 31 cutoff on the Apple Card 6% cash back deal? (Twitter DM or email my last name at Gmail.)
Surely if they could ship these new options before December 31, they would've just offered them on the 10th and not bothered with the original revision.

I don't expect these options to appear before mid-January at the earliest.
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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2019-12-11, 11:08

Quote:
Originally Posted by surjones View Post
Pricing Aside - I edit 4K video/Drone/And some Premade Animation graphics. - Currently I have. 5K Late 2015 iMac, it's slooooing my down. Will the new 16 " MBP be able to do a better job, or should I keep my already placed order for the 12 Core Mac Pro and then have to buy a monitor as well - I do a lot of Photography as well - so it would be nice not have to travel with this sucker. but I travel with the iMac now. soooo help a brotha out!
The 16" MBP is quite a lot faster than your 2015 iMac in every way. Storage, RAM, CPU, GPU, bus. Literally everything is better (except maybe screen size) and obviously the portability factor should be considered. Current testing seems to indicate the new Mac Pro is about twice as fast as the MBP, which is saying more about the laptop than the desktop! If I were you—and I were traveling—I'd opt for the laptop w/32GB RAM and a good portable SSD. That Mac Pro is gonna be heavy. In fact, it's going to be a lot heavier than your iMac, especially considering you have to lug around a display as well.

Boise State! … Boise State! … Boise State!
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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2019-12-11, 12:25

Quote:
Originally Posted by surjones View Post
Currently I have. 5K Late 2015 iMac, it's slooooing my down.
How much RAM? Fusion Drive, or SSD?
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surjones
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: In the hands of Apple.
 
2019-12-11, 21:18

thanks for the feedback! I'm gonna keep the Mac Pro 12 Core - I actually found someone who needed money locally and picked up a MacBook Pro i9 6 Core with 32gb RAM, and 52gb SSD for $2300.
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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2019-12-20, 10:29

I don't think drive performance is going to be much of an issue with these new Mac Pro's. I mean, sheesh!

If you buy a new Mac Pro, don't bother upgrading the internal storage from Apple. Just buy smoking-hot and inexpensive PCIe cards!

Boise State! … Boise State! … Boise State!
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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
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2019-12-20, 11:08

That's a nice product.

Such a shame Intel doesn't have PCIe 4 ready, or it could be way faster, yet!
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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2019-12-20, 12:08

Is PCIe the bottleneck? I suppose it depends on the number of lanes. PCI 3 can run at 1GB/lane, so a 16 lane slot could handle 16GB/s, theoretically. I think the limit on OWC's product is the number of SSD's on the board more so than PCI (the card uses 4 SSD's to deliver 6GB/s, so I suspect that is really the max number of SSD's). It appears that OWC is using an 8 lane card, but multiple cards can be pared together in RAID for even faster performance (12GB/s x 2 cards—yikes).

Maybe?

Either way, 6GB/s is approaching RAM speeds from not very long ago.

Update: Actually, OWC is using a x4 slot, so that's weird that they are getting 6GB/s.

Boise State! … Boise State! … Boise State!

Last edited by kscherer : 2019-12-20 at 12:22.
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Dr. Bobsky
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: UK's most densely packed city. It's not London...
 
2019-12-27, 17:11

Yeah... Intel has lost the race with AMD on this (and other) fronts. I think they've misplaced their research investments too far forward, failed, and have had little to bank on when 'things-that-should-have-worked' didn't. Next year's processor releases will be telling as AMD is primed for doubling core counts on the same architecture and Intel is groaning with age. This has left AMD with more space to incorporate improved throughput technology.

It would be interesting if Apple can get out of the apparent exclusivity contract with Intel to provide more consistent, perhaps back and forth, upgrades on their pro-hardware.
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PB PM
Sneaky Punk
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Vancouver, BC
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2019-12-27, 18:06

Intel has moved its focus from the home/small business space, to mobile, AI compute servers, their upcoming dedicated GPUs are the big new development in this space. While the failure to move from 14nm to 10nm the last few years has hurt them, what really got them was shifting resources elsewhere, along side the performance loss from firmware/hardware problems in their CPUs, spectator/meltdown and so on. It's only the next generation chips that will finally deal with these on a hardware level.

Is Intel losing the desktop CPU market now? Yes. Do they care? Not sure, it is a quickly shrinking market. What I don't get is the lack of focus on improving in the high end sever space, but I suppose the compute focused GPU's are supposed to kick AMD Radeon in the pants and finished what Nvidia started years ago. I suspect Intel's real focus is moving to compete with CUDA and Nvidia's AI servers, which will have a big impact in the future.
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