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2010 World Cup Thread
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Moogs
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2009-07-08, 15:46

Well might as well start talking about it now... when it's in the news.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/8140433.stm

Major strike by the construction workers, who make basically $300 a month. Now, I don't know what the cost of living in a South African city is, but I'm pretty sure it can't be had for $300 a month. These poor bastards are scrambling for a 13% raise... so $39 more a month, basically. Even that is enough to make your head spin. I think it would be great, honestly if the Cup were delayed to bring attention to these kinds of labor abuses. I'm sure working in the blazing S. African heat, digging and pouring concrete 12 hours a day, is worth more than $339 a month. Christ.

...into the light of a dark black night.
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Robo
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2009-07-08, 16:11

The fans will hate me for this but I think the Cup should be delayed, personally, both to call attention to the labor abuses and so that it's not in the same year as either Olympics. Then Expo (World's Fair) could settle into the remaining "free" years, and they'd never have to compete for attention - there'd be one Big Deal each year.

Delaying the games would basically kill South Africa's chances for the 2020 Olympics, though. I'd say right now they're practically a shoe-in, if the World Cup is a success.
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RowdyScot
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2009-07-08, 16:54

Delaying it is an option, but I don't think it gets in the way of the Winter Olympics by any means. I'd prefer moving it if necessary (maybe to the US? A game would have to be in our only large soccer-only stadium in Columbus, so maybe I could go to one!). Moving it to the UK would be the easiest option, however, seeing as the stadiums are already in existence, and can easily handle it.

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Robo
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2009-07-08, 17:44

Quote:
Originally Posted by RowdyScot View Post
Delaying it is an option, but I don't think it gets in the way of the Winter Olympics by any means.
Perhaps not, but keep in mind that there's now two Olympics taking place in each Olympic year - the regular Olympics and the Youth Olympics. The 2010 Summer Youth Olympics takes place only a month after the World Cup. I think both events could use the extra chronological space.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RowdyScot
I'd prefer moving it if necessary (maybe to the US? A game would have to be in our only large soccer-only stadium in Columbus, so maybe I could go to one!).
It's a nice thought but the US got the World Cup only fifteen years ago, so it's definitely not our "turn" yet, especially given that we're not a huge soccer/football nation (even if the 1994 Cup was the best-attended in history). I'm not sure the public support would be there to host the World Cup on such short notice, amid a recession - and it could derail the US Olympic bid.

I think a delay is unlikely and a relocation even moreso, but we'll see how this pans out.
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Moogs
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2009-07-08, 17:49

Honestly the Youth Olympics should not even be a consideration in this discussion. That's small potatoes compared to the real Olympics, World Cup, etc. There are not big TV deals or merchandising concerns or any of that stuff that host cities are concerned about with the Youth Olympics. Most people don't even know what it is or that it exists.

As for the delay I think you guys misunderstand. It's not about delaying and moving to another place and year. It's about delaying in the same place and year. Just getting some egg on the face of S. African government and those who are responsible for ignoring some pretty horrible living conditions that still persist including a huge kidnapping and child slavery / prostitution problem.

...into the light of a dark black night.
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Robo
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2009-07-08, 17:58

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moogs View Post
Honestly the Youth Olympics should not even be a consideration in this discussion. That's small potatoes compared to the real Olympics, World Cup, etc. There are not big TV deals or merchandising concerns or any of that stuff that host cities are concerned about with the Youth Olympics. Most people don't even know what it is or that it exists.
Well, it doesn't exist, yet. The 2010 Youth Olympics are the first, so it's probably too soon to tell how "big" they'll become. I agree that they won't ever be as big a deal as the "real" Olympics or the World Cup, but they still represent additional crowding in the multinational sport event space. It used to be that (summer) World Cups were paired only with Winter Olympics, but that's not longer the case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moogs
As for the delay I think you guys misunderstand. It's not about delaying and moving to another place and year. It's about delaying in the same place and year. Just getting some egg on the face of S. African government and those who are responsible for ignoring some pretty horrible living conditions that still persist including a huge kidnapping and child slavery / prostitution problem.
Oh, I realize a delay into 2011 is beyond farfetched (and would enrage basically everyone). But I don't think it would be a horrible thing, long-term.

2010: Winter Olympics (and Summer Youth Olympics)
2011: World Cup
2012: Summer Olympics (and Winter Youth Olympics)
2013: Expo

Rinse, repeat.
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Maciej
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2009-07-08, 21:35

Having it on odd years would just be so... odd. Just from what I'm use to and have come to expect. I don't care much for moving them, that could screw up the other large soccer tournaments too. Like the UEFA cup. You have to remember that within the sport itself everything is spaced out appropriately. Because many qualifying matches revolve around league schedules it takes a bit of time to get everyone qualified and ready. Moving everything around would be a headache, but not impossible.

I just don't find the argument for moving it compelling enough. It doesn't interfear with the winter olympics. It's not like atheletes have to be in two places at once.

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Robo
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2009-07-08, 21:45

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maciej View Post
Having it on odd years would just be so... odd. Just from what I'm use to and have come to expect.
Yeah, it would take some getting used to, just because of inertia. That's why I don't think anybody would just decide, "hey, from now on lets have it in odd years," because it's not like it's that big of a deal either way. But if it had to happen because of a delay or something it wouldn't be a bad move, after the initial shock wore off.

But short-term, any major delay would piss the hell out of virtually everybody.
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lightning_bug
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2009-07-08, 21:56

Quote:
Originally Posted by RowdyScot View Post
Delaying it is an option, but I don't think it gets in the way of the Winter Olympics by any means. I'd prefer moving it if necessary (maybe to the US? A game would have to be in our only large soccer-only stadium in Columbus, so maybe I could go to one!). Moving it to the UK would be the easiest option, however, seeing as the stadiums are already in existence, and can easily handle it.
Hate to say it, but Columbus Crew Stadium is much too small to host a WC event - Ohio Stadium or Cleveland Browns Stadium would be the two Ohio options, if there were any.

If they had to move the 2010 WC, there are two countries that could take it on a moment's notice: England and the US. England hasn't hosted since 1966 and are heavy favorites to win the 2018 WC when it comes to a vote later this year or in 2010. Rumor has it that the US will make a run for 2018 or 2022, and they have to be considered heavy favorites to win that when the time comes, as it will have been over 20 years since they hosted it by then.

Having said that, they won't move the 2010 WC - delay is the only acceptable outcome at this point in time. They've invested too much in infrastructure (even if they aren't done yet), and since 2010 is Africa's first chance to host the WC, FIFA will give (and has given) the South African delegation every opportunity to finish construction and prepare for the madness that will descend on them in mid-2010. There will be headaches throughout the WC involving travel, crowd control, you name it...but it will go on, and it will go on in South Africa.

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Last edited by lightning_bug : 2009-07-08 at 22:11.
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evan
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2009-07-09, 09:22

c'monnnnnn Houston! Astrodome, Reliant Stadium, and wherever the hell the Dynamo play! minute maid park might be able to be converted too.
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