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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2019-05-23, 12:03

Don't know if any of you guys caught it, but Apple quietly updated MacBook Pro's yesterday. So, the 2019 TouchBar models look like this:

13" Touchbar:

Switched from 2.3GHz 8th-gen 4-core i5 to 2.4GHz 8th-gen 4-core i5
3rd-gen butterfly keyboard updated with new switch materials for increased reliabilty

15" Touchbar:

Base model switched from 2.3GHz 8th-gen 6-core i7 to 2.6GHz 9th-gen 6-core i7
3rd-gen butterfly keyboard updated with new switch materials for increased reliabilty

Premium model switched from 2.6GHz 8th-gen 6-core i7 to 2.3GHZ 9th-gen 8-core i9
3rd-gen butterfly keyboard updated with new switch materials for increased reliability

All other specs appear to be the same.

Also, Apple has extended the keyboard repair program to include all butterfly keyboard models, including the just released 2019 models.

Of note: These models are all firmware-locked to Mac OS 10.14, so if you have to run an older OS you won't want one.

Since November 2016, I have tried to live my life without politics or football, and it has been the most peaceful time of my life.

Last edited by kscherer : 2019-05-23 at 13:25.
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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: near Bremen, Germany
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2019-05-23, 14:27

I'm really torn on these.

On the one hand, another nice speed bump, and it looks like thermals have actually improved.

OTOH, even leaving aside all the… questionable choices with the 2016 design (from lack of whimsy like the glowing Apple logo through nickel-and-diming like the power brick having fewer built-in features all the way to usability hurdles like lack of ports), there's the big honking keyboard issue. Yet another keyboard revision increasingly feels like “for real this time pinky swear”.

(Also, why isn't there a Touch Bar 2 with a Taptic Engine? I don't get this. Seems such an obvious improvement where Apple could shine. Let the user feel those UI controls.)

And, really, my 2013 is still… good enough? (Barely?) I now have another 2013 with a better CPU and a dedicated GPU laying around, not to mention <400 battery cycles instead of >1,400, so…

(Twice the RAM, though! And a much faster SSD. And… other improvements. Hrm.)
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kscherer
The Ban Hammer
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Boyzeee
 
2019-05-23, 15:47

Yeah, we have a service department, and that keyboard issue is being overblown by the media (it exists, just not as bad as claimed). Sorry, I know that's not what people want to hear, and I know some of you have seen the issue, but the number of those things coming back for repair is significantly smaller than the number of new systems going out. Also, the vast majority of that small number are resolved with a blast of air, and most of those are crumbs dropped there by filthy eaters. When air does not work, removal of the key almost always exposes a larger hunk of dried-in ketchup. And then, when that fails, the keyboard gets replaced at no charge. That one is actually faulty. And the number is less than the failure rate of previous generation keyboards.

As for the typing feedback, that is purely subjective.

Wish I could complain, but I see/hear the complaints in person, rather than on a message board, and the complaints are very few and far between, and almost always yield a food-borne cause.

As regards the ports, yeah, Apple dumped every legacy port, and the only one I am sad to see go away is MagSafe, which is definitely a curious omission. But, Apple is always reaching for the future, and the only way to get there is to let go of the past. Otherwise, accessory manufacturers will not follow and customers are left with fewer choices, rather than more. There are now significantly more options for Mac peripheral connection than have ever existed in the past, and that is a good thing.

TouchBar 2 (for lack of a better term) is not a thing and I doubt it ever will be. I am convinced the next full redesign will replace the keyboard with a haptics-driven touch screen. The keyboard and its resident crumb traps will be gone forever. And there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth!

Anyway, it's a very grand update. That 8-core i9 is within CPU-performance spitting distance of an iMac Pro, and is more powerful than any Mac Pro tower. "Apple does not care about Pro's" is laughable at this point.

Since November 2016, I have tried to live my life without politics or football, and it has been the most peaceful time of my life.

Last edited by kscherer : 2019-05-23 at 18:53. Reason: Clarification
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chucker
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: near Bremen, Germany
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2019-05-25, 15:17

Quote:
Originally Posted by kscherer View Post
Also, the vast majority of that small number are resolved with a blast of air, and most of those are crumbs dropped there by filthy eaters. When air does not work, removal of the key almost always exposes a larger hunk of dried-in ketchup. [..] the complaints are very few and far between, and almost always yield a food-borne cause.
This sounds a bit you're-holding-it-wrong to me. I've been on Apple laptops since the 2002 white iBook, which are two and a half distinct keyboards: the iBook one, the PowerBook G4 Aluminum-inherited early MacBook Pro one, and the unibody MacBook Pro one. All three had scissor switches; the last one changed the key type to chiclet. None of them like food, but they rarely had major problems with my eating habits, and when they did, the fix was reasonably simple.

That's not what I'm hearing for the butterfly keyboards.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kscherer View Post
Anyway, it's a very grand update. That 8-core i9 is within CPU-performance spitting distance of an iMac Pro, and is more powerful than any Mac Pro tower. "Apple does not care about Pro's" is laughable at this point.
It'll be interesting to see what a Cascade Lake-W iMac Pro looks like. Probably more cores. And, just like the current iMac Pro, almost nobody should need to buy one.

As for performance similarities, it should be noted that more portability typically means less reliability and thermal headroom. An iPhone may come close to MacBook Pro performance in benchmarks, but won't be able to sustain that beyond ten-ish minutes. A MacBook Pro will sustain it for an hour or two. An iMac Pro? Many hours.
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Dr. Bobsky
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: A town that Germany forgot.
 
2019-05-25, 16:30

The butterfly keyboards suck monkey dick.

Crumbs are a death knell. Fixes involving forced air and careful removal of keycap *do* sometimes work, but mostly what works is just continual use and wearing down the detritus that is causing the issue.

The problems I have with the keyboard are more general: it's occasionally loud as the spacebar shutters with every keystroke giving any amount of typing a tinny sound and it seems to reverberate when the speakers hit certain frequencies yielding a distracting buzzing.

The entire build has this empty shell feel...
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