[ja0912]

Now that Apple's digital audio ecosystem is more or less complete, I wonder what Apple's digital video ecosystem will look like. Microsoft's Media Center crap is slowly starting to catch on, so they need to make their entrance soon.

To quote the recent NYT article:

Mr. Jobs declines to discuss his product plans. He has been openly contemptuous of attempts to add video playback to hard-drive music players, as Microsoft has with its new design called Portable Media Center. And other Apple executives pointed out that the Media Center PC had not been a success in the market until recently, and that Apple tried to sell computers with TV tuners in them a few years ago, with disappointing results. Longtime Apple watchers say they recognize a pattern. In the past, they say, Mr. Jobs has often dismissed a market as irrelevant before introducing just such a product, with a great flourish. He then explains that he has solved the problems his lesser competitors couldn't. It worked stunningly well with music. And many expect that he will try again, with some products related to television.

Audio Ecosystem: iTunes, iTunesMusicStore, iPod, Airport Express(audio only), etc..

Video Ecosystem: ?

[applenut]

the mistake you make (not specifically you but you mentioned it) is Apple does not need to create equivalents to all the pieces for a new market. Video/TV/Movies would not require equivalent pieces to their audio strategy. They are completely different in how they are viewed, delivered, sorted, and reviewed.

I still don't see how Apple could could make a dent in consumer video. It's just not the type of market that can be taken over as Apple did with audio. People don't have the same desire to watch a movie over and over everywhere they go as they do a song. People who do watch movies on the road can just use their laptop. It'll work better than any portable device you can come up with and they already own one.

A movie store, while nice in theory, I just don't see working very well. The volume of sales is not the same. Files much larger. DVD burners less prominent.

The only thing I'd like to see in this area are:
1. An Apple hard drive based camcorder
2. An Apple set top box similar to the EyeHome by El Gato.

[Paul]

an Apple sponsored DVD ripping App would be nice as well...

but they would sooner move to x86...

[spiff]

I'd like to see a video input on Apple's video cards. Then they could release a new iApp for recording TV. Something to compete with the Windows Media Center.

[DMBand0026]

Originally Posted by spiff I'd like to see a video input on Apple's video cards. Then they could release a new iApp for recording TV. Something to compete with the Windows Media Center.

Ugh...someone would have an aneurism over that. Do you have any idea how many copyright laws that could potentially violate?


Edit: That reply was for practicality's sake, I agree though...I think a video input would be wonderful.

[Dave K.]

The thought of watching movies on an iPod is not very attractive. But, to watch small video clips from iMovie (or mpg, WMV, etc.) would be somewhat attractive.

I have short video clips of my 17 month old son and other wacky stuff that would work great on a video enabled iPod to share with family and friends.

[spiff]

Originally Posted by DMBand0026 Ugh...someone would have an aneurism over that. Do you have any idea how many copyright laws that could potentially violate? Edit: That reply was for practicality's sake, I agree though...I think a video input would be wonderful.

I don't know about the copyright thing. What about the media center PCs and the EyeTV. I was talking about something like that. I don't think there's anything against being able to record TV. I suppose you could record anything with a video out, though, like hooking up a DVD player to it but I don't think that would be a huge deal.

[ja0912]

I feel like any sort of TV recording would happen on a seperate device. I'm not sure I want my computer recording video while i work on it, and it would be impracticle for a whole group of people that just have laptops.

A video capable Airport Express would be a simple, logical next step. 802.15.3 (wireless firewire) capable products should be here any day, BUT I'm not sure it would have the range to transmit across a house.

The only thing that's clear is that Apple doesn't see people watching video on the small screen of their iPod, or at the uncomfortable location of their desk. So one would hope they would give us a means to watch it on big screen in a comfortable location.

ElGato has a couple solutions, but I feel that Apple could do it better.

[Killroy]

All I want for X-mas (or January/February) is a video app or solution that will allow smooth playback of all mpeg HD transport stream files (.ts). VLC is a good application but it is buggy and in the G5 the audio gets broken and you cannot output 5.1 DD audio. It works on the G4's but not on the G5's.

If Apple would only set up Quicktime to playback all HD mpeg files then I would bow to SJ every day after I wake.

[Koodari]

Originally Posted by ja0912 I feel like any sort of TV recording would happen on a seperate device. I'm not sure I want my computer recording video while i work on it, and it would be impracticle for a whole group of people that just have laptops. A video capable Airport Express would be a simple, logical next step. 802.15.3 (wireless firewire) capable products should be here any day, BUT I'm not sure it would have the range to transmit across a house.

Not too long ago, people said the same thing about playing MP3 music. It was too big a burden for the processors then (around 30%) and so some friends of mine had a separate computer for MP3/IM/IRC. Those things are also 'impractical' on laptops since you usually want speakers and a network cable. Incidentally, I have both attached to my PB right now, and an external display, so a Firewire/USB2 plugged TV product is hardly unreasonably difficult.

It makes sense to do video recording on a general purpose computer. Even if you think 'not yet', it's right upon us nonetheless.

I think a Airport Express type video delivery is the most likely way to go for Apple, too, but like AExp, it will be unidirectional, just for viewing. Not unlike what you can get now in the same price segment with a modified XBox. Recording ability will not be there. There's also the interesting question what they will support - just QT Player and DVD Player, or will it be possible for VLC/MPlayer folks to use the video output? I think it would make most sense to output the whole screen.

[Koodari]

Originally Posted by DMBand0026 Ugh...someone would have an aneurism over that. Do you have any idea how many copyright laws that could potentially violate? Edit: That reply was for practicality's sake, I agree though...I think a video input would be wonderful.

I also want a video input.

It sounds frightening a mere recording ability from an unspecified source would ever be against copyright law, since whatever is protected by copyright, you don't have to be recording that. I consider such a law unacceptable and would break it or go around it at every opportunity. Even if a company like Apple can't break the law, they can also go around it. If law is against the software but not the hardware, just put the hardware in there and provide the software only in countries where it's legal. Alternately, publish the necessary info for volunteers to make recording programs and plugins to existing programs. Then it's up to the user if they go and get programs that are illegal in their country.

[ja0912]

Originally Posted by Koodari Those things are also 'impractical' on laptops since you usually want speakers and a network cable. Incidentally, I have both attached to my PB right now, and an external display, so a Firewire/USB2 plugged TV product is hardly unreasonably difficult.

I was more reffering to built-in TV recording. If you close up your laptop and bring it to the office or a coffee shop or whatever, you are no longer able to let your computer automatically record stuff. And that's when you want it recording stuff the most; when you're not home.

So that leaves me to wonder if there are enough laptop-only people to make it a bad idea for only desktops to have this ability.

[Brad]

Originally Posted by Koodari I consider such a law unacceptable and would break it or go around it at every opportunity.

Laughable. People say the same thing to try to justify ripping DVDs or downloading music and videos using file sharing networks. That still doesn't make it any more legal.

I think the laws for assault and battery are unacceptable and infringing on my personal freedoms. So, I'm going to go beat the shit out of my neighbors the next time their mangy cat walks all over and leaves those filthy footprints on my clean car.

See how that sounds? These laws aren't to protect you; they are to protect the artists and actors and writers and directors and whomever owns the original content.

Sure, the theory behind Napster (the original) and Kazaa and Gnutella and mlNet and BitTorrent is perfectly fine. You don't see big names like Apple implementing them, though, do you? Of course not! Small companies and open source groups can get away with it because they have nothing to lose. Apple, as a multi billion dollar company, is in a completely different category and has to answer to a lot more people (read: legal issues).

[Kickaha]

Originally Posted by Koodari If law is against the software but not the hardware, just put the hardware in there and provide the software only in countries where it's legal. Alternately, publish the necessary info for volunteers to make recording programs and plugins to existing programs. Then it's up to the user if they go and get programs that are illegal in their country.

This would be blatantly flouting the law, and if INDUCE passes, it would be 100% illegal. INDUCE makes it illegal to provide a tool that *COULD* be used to break copyright. ie, VCRs, Xerox machines, etc etc etc

And as stupid as it sounds, it actually has a chance of passing in the US House and going to the Senate... where Sen Hatch (UT) has been pushing idiotic copyright law for a while now, with a frightening amount of success.

[FearlessLeader]

I wouldn't be surprised to see an Airport Express Photo ... but I would be surprised to see an Airport Express AV ...

[ja0912]

EDIT: I'm not sure why I've been fixating on 802.15.3, when it's not intended for such use. That's where further 802.11 standards will come into play. They should be coming soon too though.

[futuretheory]

We need a secure home server device. Small, quiet and cool which can sit in a living room (so, attractive too) and work as a music/video storage and Tivo-like device. This is the beginning of having a brain in the home linked to wireless devices throughout...perhaps even web-based X-10 control for lights, etc.

Might as well be apple.

[Moogs]

I don't agree. This is not in Apple's short-term interests and only potentially in their long-term interests, depending on how market forces play out. The whole digital merge thing was hyped by publications like Wired for years, saying that by now, we'd be knee deep in intelligent home entertainment devices that required no programming, would have fiber-optical bandwidth, blah blah blah. Sometimes we need to separate the pie-in-the-sky BS from reality.

MS found this out the hard way with WebTV and the similar crap they're trying (with little success) to re-brand today.

Apple's video solutions are content creation solutions, and that's the way it should stay IMO. They're not in the television / home entertainment business. I understand the lines are blurry sometimes (like with iPod) but as soon as you get into the realm of having the TV / stereo be the primary device related to your product or service, you've crossed the line IMO.

Apple should stay out of that market. They need to focus on their core business which is personal computing and delivery of multiple forms of media through their personal computers and iPod. IMO, their money, their efforts and their strategizing should all focus on

1. Pro hardware with appliance-like start up and reliability (and better build quality, not just fancy design).

2. Further developing OS X and marketing OS X to niches that will take the risk (small business, university labs of various stripes, first-time computer buyers ages 16-25, etc).

3. Further developing and integrating their pro media software platforms.

4. Gadgets like iPod, and any new vPods or whatever handheld goodies come next.

But living room media storage is not the way to go IMHO.

[Jim S.]

It's interesting how many nay-sayers there are. Isn't iTunes a home media server for music? Hasn't Apple developed hardware for just this purpose (i.e., Airport Express)? Isn't music a form of digital media? Hasn't iTunes helped get Apple back to the forefront? Regarding copyright issues, hasn't the VCR been used for recording TV for decades?

Take a look at your Best Buy and Circuit City ads... DVDs of TV reruns has exploded. It's pretty obvious to me that someone will be offering TV shows as downloads before long. Also take note of Apple's interest in H.264 in Tiger. I'm guessing that Apple would not want to create a Windows application for a TV download solution so the logical alternative is to create a set-top box that runs Tiger. Owning a Mac would not be required since they want to sell to the masses, not just Mac users.

[Miko]

All I was ever hoping for was Apple to release a SONY Location Free TV like device but I guess Apple will just have to perfect this idea like they do with everything else.

[Jim S.]

Miko, that's exactly where this would go but having a central media server would feed your TVs as well as wireless devices like the Sony examples. They would cost a lot less if they did not need internal components like hard drives. If people want a 12" version to take on a trip, I doubt that these devices could match up with laptops. But around the house? You bet!